Republic of Ireland V Greece - Friday, 13th October 2023 - Euro 2024 Qualifier

[backstothewall]

how so? has he been sacked at half time? we've let the boil fester to the point it's now gangrenous.


It doesn't matter. This is obviously over.

[Insidetherock]

What does Josh Cullen do?

Honestly.. he adds nothing

[zero]

What does Josh Cullen do?

Honestly.. he adds nothing

I think he's completely lost faith in SK and is just trying to keep himself out of trouble / conserve energy and stay injury free.

[brine3]

Show me a successful international team out there in 2023 playing Charlton hoofball.

Just because Stephen Kenny is clueless it doesn't mean that we have to go back to the 1980s.

[Trequartista20]

Take Ferguson off. He's been struggling for fitness and deserves better than this s**tshow.

[brine3]

Take Ferguson off. He's been struggling for fitness and deserves better than this s**tshow.

Yep. Save him for the future.

[backstothewall]

Show me a successful international team out there in 2023 playing Charlton hoofball.

Show me any team out there playing Charlton hoofball.

That's the point in many ways. Do modern defenders have any idea how to defend against it?

What's absolutely certain is that this doesn't work.

Edit: And FWIW, Charltonism was much more than long balls. It was an aggressive abrasive approach to everything we did. It was team spirit fostered over a few pints rather than spending the evenings sitting in video sessions being told Georgi Hagi wasn't half bad. It was players putting their body on the line for the cause. We really did inflict our game on the opposition, in every way.

It was everything we lack.

[Fixer82]

Mick McCarthy’s second era not looking so bad now is it?

[SkStu]

Steaming pile of sh!t.

[Insidetherock]

Show me a successful international team out there in 2023 playing Charlton hoofball.

Just because Stephen Kenny is clueless it doesn't mean that we have to go back to the 1980s.

Maybe that's the point.. maybe we need to do something all the rest aren't doing

[pineapple stu]

Injury time announcement roundly booed.

I think people want this over now

Expect more boos at full-time

[SkStu]

Injury time announcement roundly booed.

I think people want this over now

Expect more books at full-time

They were probably booing at (just) the 5 mins to be fair given some of the play acting they’ve (the Greeks ;)) been doing…

[Calcio Jack]

Kenny at the end looked like a bewildered inmate from Shutter Island lost in his own head

[Insidetherock]

In all Kennys time.. we beat 1 team ranked ahead of us.. Scotland

That's the head and tail of it

Luxembourg (after losing to them)
Gibralter
Armenia

Who else..

[SkStu]

Three points from 18. A Gibraltar win. F*ck sake.

[Nesta99]

Doherty should be shot.
Theres isnt a single remotely decent midfielder eligible for Ireland it seems, or am I forgetting someone who hasn't played for Ireland yet,cos the one's who have are woejus.

But but Jack Byrne?

[backstothewall]

He should go before Gibraltar. The risk of a real national humiliation is too great.

[SkStu]

Be interesting to go back to threads at the beginning of the campaign… four from Greece is achievable…miss. A point or three against Netherlands…miss. Something against France…miss.

This is the worst it’s ever been, performance wise, under Kenny. A shambles. And getting worse year over year, as Whelan pointed out.

I gave him way too much grace in the first couple of years and it was completely stupid. I hope he does the honourable thing and resigns instead of clinging on until November.

Absolute boll0x.

[ontheotherhand]

That was utterly scutterus.

Matt Doherty was supposedly a footballer at one point? I'm delighted his header was saved because he didn't deserve a goal.

[tetsujin1979]

1712920476014490041

[pineapple stu]

In all Kennys time.. we beat 1 team ranked ahead of us.. Scotland

That's the head and tail of it

Luxembourg (after losing to them)
Gibralter
Armenia

Who else..
Azerbaijan
Andorra (a friendly)

I think that's about it

Tonight was as bad as some of those early defeats but against a better team, so we lost by more

Our squad is seem awful and too many players aren't where we thought they'd be three years ago.

But still. That's end of an era stuff tonight. Can't be any question but that we cut our losses next month

[zero]

Azerbaijan
Armenia
Andorra (a friendly)

I think that's about it

Tonight was as bad as some of those early defeats but against a better team, so we lost by more

Our squad is seem awful and too many players aren't where we thought they'd be three years ago.

But still. That's end of an era stuff tonight. Can't be any question but that we cut our losses next month

i don't see why we should wait. put him on gardening leave tonight.

[pineapple stu]

Three points from 18. A Gibraltar win. F*ck sake.
In the olden days teams like Gibraltar weren't in qualifying

Our worst group records are 0 from 4 games, or 1 from 6 (twice)

That was 64, 70 and 72

Yes Holland and France was a tough draw. But we've had tough draws before. 0 from 6 games (assuming we lose to Holland, and does anyone think we won't?) is record-breaking bad stuff

[pineapple stu]

i don't see why we should wait. put him on gardening leave tonight.
Yeah, there's an argument for it.

Would we have a successor by next month?

[zero]

Yeah, there's an argument for it.

Would we have a successor by next month?

I'd let Coleman take over for the last couple while we look around, unless Eustace for example is interested.

[Nesta99]

Show me any team out there playing Charlton hoofball.

That's the point in many ways. Do modern defenders have any idea how to defend against it?

What's absolutely certain is that this doesn't work.

Edit: And FWIW, Charltonism was much more than long balls. It was an aggressive abrasive approach to everything we did. It was team spirit fostered over a few pints rather than spending the evenings sitting in video sessions being told Georgi Hagi wasn't half bad. It was players putting their body on the line for the cause. We really did inflict our game on the opposition, in every way.

It was everything we lack.

It is a shame that that era is derided tactically, (maybe by '94 that side could have evolved better) but Charlton was doing POMO long before people came up with a better name for playing long ball and to strengths. Mentioning POMO there is a manager, currently not working, age for a last job and in internationlal football, will be scorned at but Sam Allerdyce it would not be a surprise to see someone of his profile in the job, and ye know what he is pragmatic enough to mix it up and cobble together something inbetween SK silky football philosophy and O'neill ball.

[backstothewall]

Yeah, there's an argument for it.

Would we have a successor by next month?

The timing of things and the FAI's inability to pay compensation for someone in contract elsewhere points to it being Chris Hughton taking over at the start of Feb.

Could Seamus Coleman hold the fort in the meantime?

[Crosby87]

Dreary stuff.
Anyone else to managed Ireland

[brine3]

The timing of things and the FAI's inability to pay compensation for someone in contract elsewhere points to it being Chris Hughton taking over at the start of Feb.

Could Seamus Coleman hold the fort in the meantime?

Hughton managing Ghana.

[Fixer82]

Dreary stuff.
Anyone else to managed Ireland

I think I could have a crack at it

[SkStu]

I think I could have a crack at it

Dark days indeed

[brine3]

The main thing Charlton had was a bit of personality. Wasn't the biggest fan of his football but he was an inspiring man.

[Fixer82]

The main thing Charlton had was a bit of personality. Wasn't the biggest fan of his football but he was an inspiring man.

Exactly!
Same as McCarthy. And O’Neill
Players like them and would run through walls for them.
I’m not sure Kenny would inspire me to finish my dinner.
Also, they bang on about the system and how they can switch systems etc but we’re never really sure of who’s going to be playing.
It’s not a settled squad.
Duffy was out in the cold for a while and tonight he was captain.
Robinson hasn’t played in a long time after being our saviour for a few games two years ago.
The only sure starters seem to be Cullen, Bazunu, Collins, Ferguson and Ogbene. After that it’s a bit of a lottery

[Calcio Jack]

The main thing Charlton had was a bit of personality. Wasn't the biggest fan of his football but he was an inspiring man.

Charlton was blessed with the best ever squad of Irish players .,.. but instead of using them correctly played a percentage game that granted brought us some success but failed to bring us to the level we could have achieved … and that’s not a hindsight view but one expressed by many at the time…. Anyone old enough to have suffered through our draws against Egypt 1990 or Norway 1994 will know what I mean

[SkStu]

I’m not sure Kenny would inspire me to finish my dinner.

“Lookit ehmmm… look…. You have some ehmmm carrots there and, look, they’re orange and all so ehmmm just pick up your spoon nosorryimean fork and sure look they’re good carrots and that”

[backstothewall]

It is a shame that that era is derided tactically, (maybe by '94 that side could have evolved better) but Charlton was doing POMO long before people came up with a better name for playing long ball and to strengths. Mentioning POMO there is a manager, currently not working, age for a last job and in internationlal football, will be scorned at but Sam Allerdyce it would not be a surprise to see someone of his profile in the job, and ye know what he is pragmatic enough to mix it up and cobble together something inbetween SK silky football philosophy and O'neill ball.

I never saw O'Neill in those terms. He was direct for sure, but I never saw him as quite being from the same school of thought as the like of Jack, Graham Taylor or Egil Olsen.

I think Allardyce would look at us in the same terms he looked at Leeds and WBA. They were obviously nothing more than pay-days to him. And maybe more importantly I think the players anf fans would see him in those terms, here for another payday.

The guy I would have loved to have had the job at some point was another ex-england manager: Roy Hodgson. He was a rare example of a cultured Englishman who went abroad and challenged himself in different cultures. I think he would have gone down well with the Irish public. The timing was never right for that unfortunately and it's rather beginning to look like they will carry him out of Palace in a box.

I honestly don't know who it should be. I suggested Coleman as a caretaker but if he was brought in as permanaent player-manager I wouldn't object. If nothing else he's a leader and he has the respect of everyone in Irish football. Could have said all that about Stan though.


Hughton managing Ghana.

Yes, but the African Cup of Nations is in Jan. Presumably he would be available after that.

[Nesta99]

Be interesting to go back to threads at the beginning of the campaign… four from Greece is achievable…miss. A point or three against Netherlands…miss. Something against France…miss.

This is the worst it’s ever been, performance wise, under Kenny. A shambles. And getting worse year over year, as Whelan pointed out.

I gave him way too much grace in the first couple of years and it was completely stupid. I hope he does the honourable thing and resigns instead of clinging on until November.

Absolute boll0x.

Dont agree it was stupid, i still think that early one there was the genesis of a new team being built and in a different mould from picking the highest ranked players in terms of their club football and sending them out to play up and under. It plateaued quickly, circumstances had us hope that corner is turned and things click. Nieve but I think something that needed to be tried. I think we are losing sight that the decline in the Irish international side has been predicted for a long time due to manner in which the FAI ran the game and that neglect of domestic football including grassroots would come home to roost, that we couldnt forever rely on England and Scotland clubs to develop our players when English and Scottish players were struggling to get game time with the impact of cheaper and developed players from Europe etc. English football got their act together with developing technically better players, we have years ahead of picking up cast offs with a few exceptions. We could get lucky and have a generation of players come through at the same time, it happens, but usually its well coached players complimented with that rare natural talent. The granny rule can be a sticking plaster again but there are no top class gems like an Aldridge or Townsend knocking about and when one like Declan Rice does crop up well...

Another manager will improve from where we are now but we're still going to struggle to break in to higher seedings in a consistant manner for the forseeable. Kenny offered a glimmer of hope of a long term plan. We are likely back to a short term punt, he a horrible team and eek out some memorable occasional results. What will help is the expansion of competitions by UEFA and FIFA, relegation in Nations League and getting play-offs among lower ranks. No matter what its going to be a long slog imo. Even with a new ethos at the FAI it will take time and major financial investment to get anywhere near the levels of similar sized countries never mind the levels expected by a fickle sporting public.

[Crosby87]

You know, we can't get a top male manager but we could probably hire whoever is the worlds top female manager.

Would certainly be different.

[Fixer82]

We need a manager who makes us hard to beat again.
We’ve always prided ourselves on being a difficult team but we’re relatively easy to beat now

[backstothewall]

Charlton was blessed with the best ever squad of Irish players .,.. but instead of using them correctly played a percentage game that granted brought us some success but failed to bring us to the level we could have achieved … and that’s not a hindsight view but one expressed by many at the time…. Anyone old enough to have suffered through our draws against Egypt 1990 or Norway 1994 will know what I mean

"Some success"

It brought us a World Cup Quarter final, which we lost by an odd goal due to a goalkeeping error. He brought us 2 other major tournaments (at a time when qualifying for the Euros was even tougher than qualifying for the World Cup). He brought us a victory against any country you choose to mention (apart from Spain. They always seemed to turn us over).

For a country with a population of less than 4 million at the time, that's a hell of a lot more than "some success".

But if there is a group of players to play that way with, it's this lot. Their a long long way from the quality of that team, who you quite rightly say were the best ever squad of Irish players.

We have the makings of a solid defence with the right organisation. We have a decent young forward who is mobile and is capable of bullying opposition defenders. We have no midfielders worth mentioning. So rather than hoping they can play their way through superior opposition midfields, why not just kick it over all their heads and have the midfielders role being to help the defence and support the forwards?


We need a manager who makes us hard to beat again.
We’ve always prided ourselves on being a difficult team but we’re relatively easy to beat now

That's the biggest problem. We're far too easy to play against. Particularly at home.

[pineapple stu]

It’s not a settled squad.
Duffy was out in the cold for a while and tonight he was captain.
Robinson hasn’t played in a long time after being our saviour for a few games two years ago.
The only sure starters seem to be Cullen, Bazunu, Collins, Ferguson and Ogbene. After that it’s a bit of a lottery
Egan, O'Shea and Molumby have been fairly regular starters when fit I think?

Edit - hadn't seen O'Shea and Molumby on the bench today

[dynamo kerry]

I think I could have a crack at it

This made me laugh. Thank you

[Fixer82]

This made me laugh. Thank you
Couldn’t do much worse
:)

[dynamo kerry]

I'm having a gin in ranelagh recovering..

[Nesta99]

"Some success"

It brought us a World Cup Quarter final, which we lost by an odd goal due to a goalkeeping error. He brought us 2 other major tournaments (at a time when qualifying for the Euros was even tougher than qualifying for the World Cup). He brought us a victory against any country you choose to mention (apart from Spain. They always seemed to turn us over).

For a country with a population of less than 4 million at the time, that's a hell of a lot more than "some success".

But if there is a group of players to play that way with, it's this lot. Their a long long way from the quality of that team, who you quite rightly say were the best ever squad of Irish players.

We have the makings of a solid defence with the right organisation. We have a decent young forward who is mobile and is capable of bullying opposition defenders. We have no midfielders worth mentioning. So rather than hoping they can play their way through superior opposition midfields, why not just kick it over all their heads and have the midfielders role being to help the defence and support the forwards?



That's the biggest problem. We're far too easy to play against. Particularly at home.

Funnily enough beating Spain in '89 is probably one of my favourite early memories of watching RoI

[Fixer82]

We would’ve beaten them in Seville too if the ref hadn’t wrongly given Aldridge offside

[backstothewall]

My first memory of playing Spain is them coming to Lansdowne Road in the qualifiers for 94 and thumping us 3-0

[pineapple stu]

3-1

The one being hugely important as we ended up qualifying on goals scored, being level on points and goal difference with Denmark

[backstothewall]

3-1

The one being hugely important as we ended up qualifying on goals scored, being level on points and goal difference with Denmark

Quite right. Battered us all the same

[seanfhear]

I thought Liam Scales looked a bit raw, but at the same time showed that there is plenty of potential there ~ Probably the only plus point from the game for me.