Republic of Ireland V Scotland - Saturday, 11 June 2022 - 2022/23 UEFA Nations League

[Trequartista20]

I too am especially pleased for Obafemi and Parrott. Even quite recently they were being written off by many, and they now look arguably our most exciting and effective attacking players.

[SkStu]

I too am especially pleased for Obafemi and Parrott. Even quite recently they were being written off by many, and they now look arguably our most exciting and effective attacking players.

Apart from Paul O’Shea who writes off all our young players as a rule, who’s been writing who off?

There were questions around Obafemi and his lifestyle and commitment put forth by his manager at Southampton and it’s widely recognized how crucial his move to Swansea was in getting his career back on the right track.

Similarly with Parrott, he himself talked about how this season he made a choice to put his head down and focus on hard work and application in every game.

If there were some writing these players off (not me fwiw), it wasn’t based on nothingness.

[Insidetherock]

Let's not have the excuses for the win now. This wasn't a B or C team like has been used as a caveat for previous good results. Scotland were poor because they were out played.

Absolutely.

We're in the B group, because this is the level we're at. Ukraine were the team that should be in the A group, and came down last time (after being in a serious group to be honest), so they are the best team in the group.. simple as that

We're on a par with Scotland and Armenia.. and gave Scotland a tonking today. We could probably have won in Yerevan too had we managed to get an early goal.. but if's buts maybe's.. no point

Beat Yervevan in Dublin in September and I think a draw in either of the other two games, could get us second in the group.

That now has to be the absolute minimum target, because that has huge play off implications..

At least twelve of the A path are going to qualify directly.. meaning 7/8 of the Group B teams will get a run at the play offs if they don't qualify directly (top four automatically entitled to play off.. but most likely 2-3 of them will qualify directly.. plus if less than 4 of the A group teams don't, that play off path will be filled with B teams)

[Insidetherock]

Apart from Paul O’Shea who writes off all our young players as a rule, who’s been writing who off?

There were questions around Obafemi and his lifestyle and commitment put forth by his manager at Southampton and it’s widely recognized how crucial his move to Swansea was in getting his career back on the right track.

Similarly with Parrott, he himself talked about how this season he made a choice to put his head down and focus on hard work and application in every game.

If there were some writing these players off (not me fwiw), it wasn’t based on nothingness.

The writing off young players has been absolutely ridiculous on here and other forums to be honest. Writing off Parrott and Obafemi.. and they 20 yrs of age. Even Aaron Connolly.. maybe the lad is a bit of an eejit, but I'd love to see him find a bit of cop on and fulfil his potential.. he looked a cracker when he first emerged.

Players will come and go, but give the younger ones a chance to at least show what they have.

I think that maybe the biggest loser today.. was Chedozie Ogbene. He's had a few decent games on the wing but he's no central striker.. not by a long shot. If Parrott and Obafemi are available for up front, and Doherty at RWB.. where does Ogbene fit in?

Another good season at Swansea for Obafemi... maybe get Parrott into a League 1 team for a year.. someone in the PL must surely think of giving Collins another look.. we should be hoping a few more get more game time.. Idah, Obomidele, etc.. things might finally be looking up

[pineapple stu]

The writing off young players has been absolutely ridiculous on here and other forums to be honest.
Ah it's not though. Nobody's been writing players off. They've maybe said they're not at the level some view them as. That's a completely different thing though

[Trequartista20]

Let's not have the excuses for the win now. This wasn't a B or C team like has been used as a caveat for previous good results. Scotland were poor because they were out played.

Ireland were full value for their win, there's no contesting that, and the players and management deserve full credit for that. But Scotland were really poor today and if I were the Scotland management I'd be questioning the application and commitment of a few of my players.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Best performance under Kenny by some distance. Yes, Scotland were bad, but we played a big part in that, in always being in their faces.

If ever there was a game that showed the importance of a goal at the right time, this was it. Time and time again we've started brightly only for the attacking intensity to fizzle out after about 20 or 25 minutes when we don't see any reward. Today we did see the reward, and it gave us the momentum to keep at it.

Pretty much everything went well today apart from suicidal passing out from the back which could easily have cost us a goal, and did cost us a Duffy suspension (which I don't see as a good thing). I thought the Obafemi pass + Parrott header combination was the superb, especially from Obafemi who saw it and had played it within an instant.

And, even though it would be easy to imagine the players losing faith in Kenny after recent matches, they certainly didn't show any evidence of that tonight.

I like Duffy but he is very replaceable wont say he is a liability because he is an attacking threat, but Lenihan and Egan can play the libero position better for me,

[pineapple stu]

Anyway, that was very enjoyable. The challenge now is to make it not be another Luxembourg/Azerbaijan dead-end. But let's enjoy the win for now.

Biggest disappointments for me were Obafemi and Kelleher tbh.

Is Obafemi available for Wednesday? Not good to see him come off injured with his record.

And would have liked to have seen Kelleher have something to do bar claim one cross.

Thought Robinson did nothing when he came on to suggest he's worth his place back either

[Bielsa´s irish]

The writing off young players has been absolutely ridiculous on here and other forums to be honest. Writing off Parrott and Obafemi.. and they 20 yrs of age. Even Aaron Connolly.. maybe the lad is a bit of an eejit, but I'd love to see him find a bit of cop on and fulfil his potential.. he looked a cracker when he first emerged.

Players will come and go, but give the younger ones a chance to at least show what they have.



I think that maybe the biggest loser today.. was Chedozie Ogbene. He's had a few decent games on the wing but he's no central striker.. not by a long shot. If Parrott and Obafemi are available for up front, and Doherty at RWB.. where does Ogbene fit in?

Another good season at Swansea for Ogbene... maybe get Parrott into a League 1 team for a year.. someone in the PL must surely think of giving Collins another look.. we should be hoping a few more get more game time.. Idah, Obomidele, etc.. things might finally be looking up

For me Robinson was as much a loser today, I thought Obafemi was in before Robinson, Robinson commited a schoolboy foul that if you look it could be easily a red, he seemed stressed,

We looked better with Knight in the hole like in first place, dont know why he changed the team to 3-4-3 it almost nullifies our attacking place

[liamoo11]

I too am especially pleased for Obafemi and Parrott. Even quite recently they were being written off by many, and they now look arguably our most exciting and effective attacking players.

I think given the attacking players we have the 2 centrally up top works for us. I think if you put Robinson or connolly as one of the 2 with partott or idah or obafemi then they look better than in a 3. Obviously ogbene not in any way suited to a 2 but he is not international level in a 3 either. Hogan and Keane just options when we have injuries and that's fair enough and they definitely both need to play in a 2 centrally. Hopefully pretty soon ferguson will be making the step up to the senior squad as a genuine 9 who to be fair I think would be most suited of all our strikers in a 3 .

The future for ogbene and ebosele for us should be as high fullback options which amazing is where ogbene has actually played most of his football for rotherham and where I would be pretty confident any side who take him this summer will see him play.

Super handling from kelleher on crosses and his punch tonight. Lovely distribution, the changing feet to pass at times when he needs to is class. Sweeps really well and was smart enough to go long when needed and he knew technically some of the players he was going to short pass to just weren't up to it (no disgrace in that not everyone can play at Liverpool levels)

The lack of a replacement for Cullen obviously serious issue and no obvious short term solution unless Coventry makes a serious breakthrough in August somewhere.

Molumby really seemed to be trying to control his energy biting into tackles but not headlessly as we have seen before. Needs to be braver on tge ball on the half turn but hopefully confidence will come. Hendrick far better technically than him but unless or until he is playing regularly it's hard for him to put in that level of aggression around the pitch for a full game. But to be fair to Hendrick if he was in the 3 with knight today I think he would have looked better as well than been so isolated in a 2 when we play the 3 uptop luke ukraine and Armenia games.knight really our best option as that advanced player in a midfield 3

Collins all class most likely as the central centre half with omobamidele rt centre half and hopefully o shea gets back to that level as left centre half in time.

[Trequartista20]

Apart from Paul O’Shea who writes off all our young players as a rule, who’s been writing who off?

There were questions around Obafemi and his lifestyle and commitment put forth by his manager at Southampton and it’s widely recognized how crucial his move to Swansea was in getting his career back on the right track.

Similarly with Parrott, he himself talked about how this season he made a choice to put his head down and focus on hard work and application in every game.

If there were some writing these players off (not me fwiw), it wasn’t based on nothingness.

Obafemi, in particular, got a fair bit of criticism with his ability, application, professionalism and his even loyalty being continually called into question. The same with Parrott, who has been praised for his work ethic and professionalism wherever he's been been yet has been labelled as someone with a poor attitude by some.

Aaron Connolly is being given a particularly difficult time at the moment, with some of criticism he's receiving over the top and rather personal - see the YBIG thread for confirmation.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Ireland were full value for their win, there's no contesting that, and the players and management deserve full credit for that. But Scotland were really poor today and if I were the Scotland management I'd be questioning the application and commitment of a few of my players.

fully agreed, Ireland got lucky today by a fluke goal with the knees, and then Parrott and Obafemi magic, the best asset in first half tactically was Knight with a free role, that then changed and Ireland went flat again and soo predictable, he need a 10 and today Kenny played number 9s Obafemi and Hogan and Parrott too

[D24Saint]

That was some day out in the Aviva. It’s hard to believe that performance. What a belter by Obfemi

[Bielsa´s irish]

That was some day out in the Aviva. It’s hard to believe that performance. What a belter by Obfemi


Stephen Kenny " We went into this game after having real setbacks this week, we did concede a couple of chances and Scotland didn’t take them first and then we took ours"

[centre mid]

Had we scored early in Yerevan or on Wednesday we probably have 9 points.

[Bottle of Tonic]

Delighted with the win and the goals, what's rare is wonderful. The other night I had turned on management. Did he just stumble on the right line up today? The evidence would suggest so as we've played so many wrong teams under SK.

McClean a vital component today injecting energy and danger down his side. All credit to him considering he has been benched but still turns up at his age ready to contribute when called.

Is it another false dawn? Its a brilliant win long overdue but so many questions remain. Ukraine on Tuesday will fill in a little bit more.

You would think Ogbene, Robinson and Hendrick need to be benched from now on. Plenty of opportunities but not the necessary qualities.

[Razors left peg]

I said after the Ukraine game that I thought Kenny wasn't the man, mainly because of his lack of correct changes during the Ukraine and Armenia games.

IF the lessons that were learned from that continue like they did today then I was premature in turning on him and I'll be over the moon to be wrong... let's see what Tuesday brings. More of today and we are in business

[geysir]

That Coach Kenny is a diamond in the rough :) Though Scotland were cr,ap as well as nothing going right for them. It’s incredible considering our bad form that 46,000 turned up and created a great atmosphere. After that you’d almost think the good times were here to stay. I hope they are.

[SkStu]

Obafemi, in particular, got a fair bit of criticism with his ability, application, professionalism and his even loyalty being continually called into question. The same with Parrott, who has been praised for his work ethic and professionalism wherever he's been been yet has been labelled as someone with a poor attitude by some.

Aaron Connolly is being given a particularly difficult time at the moment, with some of criticism he's receiving over the top and rather personal - see the YBIG thread for confirmation.

I’m not denying they received criticism at all, just that most of it was based on public comments by their managers and, in Parrotts case, his own words. It wasn’t baseless and I think it’s fair game to ask questions about whether they’d fulfil their potential or go the way too many before them have gone.

I’ve visited YBIG twice in my life (last time probably 5-6 years ago!) so can’t comment really about what it’s like there. It was so toxic so it wouldn’t surprise me at all if it were as bad as you say. I find here to be, for the most part, way better discussion.

[pineapple stu]

Worth noting it's now three countries left without a Nations League win - the North, Iceland and San Marino

[SkStu]

fully agreed, Ireland got lucky today by a fluke goal with the knees, and then Parrott and Obafemi magic, the best asset in first half tactically was Knight with a free role, that then changed and Ireland went flat again and soo predictable, he need a 10 and today Kenny played number 9s Obafemi and Hogan and Parrott too

There’s a few posts on a few threads now where you’ve been touting the “lucky” line. I don’t think that’s the prevailing narrative after todays performance. It was just good. There were some hairy moments but that’s any game.

[NeverFeltBetter]

Excellent performance. It doesn't redeem Kenny in my eyes, but it has to be said. Brilliant all over the pitch, some well worked goals, clean sheet, everything just seemed to come together in a way it frequently doesn't for Kenny. Hopefully we don't turn around and get thumped in Poland.

[Razors left peg]

There’s a few posts on a few threads now where you’ve been touting the “lucky” line. I don’t think that’s the prevailing narrative after todays performance. It was just good. There were some hairy moments but that’s any game.

Lost in translation... in the Argentina slang of the area Mr Biesla is from lucky means fantastically brilliant. The goals today were reminiscent of Cillian Sheridan at his peak. Shane Duffy is widely known as El Matador in this same region for his incredible ability to sucker the forwards in with what they think is a bad pass

[Eirambler]

Hard to make head or tail of that to be honest.

Obviously a great win, and the younger players being the top performers made it even better. Obafemi, Parrott, Knight and Molumby all outstanding. A real coming of age moment for the four of them.

But make no mistake, that wasn't a Kenny style performance at all. We had less possession and fewer passes than Scotland. We played with aggression and tenacity instead of trying to pass the ball through them, as we have tried (and failed) to do against everyone else. A real back to the future performance that was great to see, haven't seen one of those since 2017.

So what the hell happened? Has Kenny changed his approach? Did the players take things into their own hands and just decide to play a different way? Did the game being a local derby bring it about? I honestly don't know, but something was totally different today.

More importantly, is this going to be a welcome change of style going forward or will we revert to type in Poland? That's probably the most important question.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Excellent performance. It doesn't redeem Kenny in my eyes, but it has to be said. Brilliant all over the pitch, some well worked goals, clean sheet, everything just seemed to come together in a way it frequently doesn't for Kenny. Hopefully we don't turn around and get thumped in Poland.

Agree he got out of the gaol today because of some magic from Parrott and Oba, but ditto this he made some good decisions in formation i have to be fair on Kenny, played a much needed 3-4-1-2 .

Duffy looked very nervous today, maybe playing three games in one week took its toll on him , since his bad decisions I counted 3, the last one he had a yellow that could have been a red, tbh.

The next manager will get better results, Kenny is doing the Toshack hard work-

[Bielsa´s irish]

Hard to make head or tail of that to be honest.

Obviously a great win, and the younger players being the top performers made it even better. Obafemi, Parrott, Knight and Molumby all outstanding. A real coming of age moment for the four of them.

But make no mistake, that wasn't a Kenny style performance at all. We had less possession and fewer passes than Scotland. We played with aggression and tenacity instead of trying to pass the ball through them, as we have tried (and failed) to do against everyone else. A real back to the future performance that was great to see, haven't seen one of those since 2017.

So what the hell happened? Has Kenny changed his approach? Did the players take things into their own hands and just decide to play a different way? Did the game being a local derby bring it about? I honestly don't know, but something was totally different today.

More importantly, is this going to be a welcome change of style going forward or will we revert to type in Poland? That's probably the most important question.

Yeah I sensed the same, what is worrying was after Oba left the pitch, we had only two chances both from McClean actions, it was like a rugby match then all pushing and coming and going, we looked clever at the back, Duffy seemed very nervous vs Scotland dont know why?

[passinginterest]

That was a joy in fairness. It’s on premier sport one now for anyone else who was there and wants to watch it back.

Parrot, Obafemi and Knight worked so well together. Collins was superb, cut out some of the silly errors from other games. Kelleher was very solid. In fairness to Browne, a lot of doubt about him before but he was really solid, he might not have given as much width but he really helped Molumby and Cullen.

The players were clearly hugely motivated, which was great to see. The local derby element obviously didn’t hurt. The crowd really got behind the team and I though it was nice to let them take the applause after the game after a long hard season.

Will be interesting to see how they go without Duffy. He was probably due a rest anyway, but now we have to look at other options. His attacking threat will be missed but his jitteryness on the ball not so much.

Still need at least a draw in Ukraine to build some momentum. Hopefully Obafemi is ok. His goal and assist were, dare I say it, world class. He really seems to have turned a corner in his career as has Parrot. Delighted for the players and the management team. But the hard work is only beginning now. They can’t set back from this again.

[Trequartista20]

Parrott becomes our youngest goalscorer in a competitive match since Stephen Ireland in 2006 in our biggest home win over a higher-ranked side since the 3-0 win over the North in 1989.

[joey B]

It'll be intresting to see if Steve Clarke is still in charge in September,pretty mad how bad they where with alot of players playing at a higher level than ours....

[tetsujin1979]

Parrott becomes our youngest goalscorer in a competitive match since Stephen Ireland in 2006 in our biggest home win over a higher-ranked side since the 3-0 win over the North in 1989.
Rankings weren't introduced until 1993?

[Predator]

Duffy looked very nervous today..Only a few posts ago you said Duffy was "overconfident". Was he "overconfident" or was he "nervous"?

[Bielsa´s irish]

It'll be intresting to see if Steve Clarke is still in charge in September,pretty mad how bad they where with alot of players playing at a higher level than ours....


well but it doesnt mean anything, it is just on paper, we won a WC in 86 with Diego, of course, and Real Madrid's Valdano, but we had mostly unknown player in the starting eleven Brown, Cucciufo, Ruggeri very young, Pumpido, Enrique, Giusti, Burruchaga, Olarticoechea. Away from Argentina, All whites almost beat Italy and Slovakia in WC 2010, the team you play club football is not so relevant at international football, today England full of stars almost loses vs a second string Italy with mostly unknown players from rare teams, I watched the game, Italy should have taken one or two of those chances , England is awful !!!

[Bielsa´s irish]

Only a few posts ago you said Duffy was "overconfident". Was he "overconfident" or was he "nervous"?

He looked overconfident in first half, then made those two turnovers , and in 2nd half he looked very nervous maybe because of those two

[lofty9]

Looked like a Stephen Kenny LOI team to me. I'm going back to his Derry City days when possession football wasnt the fad, aggressive, counter attacking and clinical.

[Trequartista20]

Rankings weren't introduced until 1993?

Good point. Daniel McDonnell's stat, I guess he means higher seeded.

[pineapple stu]

Rankings weren't introduced until 1993?
You sir are technically correct.

The best kind of correct!

[TheBoss]

Good point. Daniel McDonnell's stat, I guess he means higher seeded.

Considering Ireland qualified for Euro 88 and were in Pot 4, and Northern Ireland didn't in Pot 3, kind of shows how messed up the system was back then.

Many Pot 3 teams qualified for that World Cup. So, not sure how those seedings were organised as no ranking system was in place.

But since the introduction of rankings, Saturday's match would be the first time that Ireland beat a higher ranking side in competitive match by 3 goals.

[tommy_c12000]

Im sticking with:

Travers
Ebosele, Collins, Duffy, O’Shea, McClean
Cullen, Molumby,
Parrott, Obafemi, Knight

That team will beat Scotland if selected.

Kenny getting close to his strongest team. Amazing what happens when he starts selecting his team better. Concerning that he is getting so long getting there. Need O’Shea for Duffy, Ebosele for Browne and he’s almost there. McClean was pretty poor today, Manning is not of international standard and Stevens is off form, we are caught here until next window. It’s nice to see the youngsters coming through with playing reasonable football.

[Eirambler]

Considering Ireland qualified for Euro 88 and were in Pot 4, and Northern Ireland didn't in Pot 3, kind of shows how messed up the system was back then.

Many Pot 3 teams qualified for that World Cup. So, not sure how those seedings were organised as no ranking system was in place.

But since the introduction of rankings, Saturday's match would be the first time that Ireland beat a higher ranking side in competitive match by 3 goals.

May have been linked to previous World Cup performance - NI were at Mexico 86 and we had a poor qualifying campaign for that tournament.

But NI were heading into long term decline by the 1990 qualifiers, so the seedings were a bit kind to them to be honest. We got a really kind draw for Italia 90 qualification actually, Hungary were a declining force at that point also.

[Bielsa´s irish]

Kenny getting close to his strongest team. Amazing what happens when he starts selecting his team better. Concerning that he is getting so long getting there. Need O’Shea for Duffy, Ebosele for Browne and he’s almost there. McClean was pretty poor today, Manning is not of international standard and Stevens is off form, we are caught here until next window. It’s nice to see the youngsters coming through with playing reasonable football.

I thought McClean was very good, Manning is more of a midfielder, what about BAGAN?

[tommy_c12000]

Bagan looks very good, was good for Cardiff too. Might be too early/risky, later this year if he consistently starts with his club.

[Eirambler]

Bagan and Adaramola look like the future at left wing back, assuming they stay with us (both are eligible for two other countries). But I'd say we're a year or two away from them being ready to step up. So we just have to hope the older lads can plug the gap for now.

[tetsujin1979]

Bagan's already changed his eligibility once, can he change again?

[elatedscum]

McClean was pretty poor today,

Thought McClean was excellent today. He put in about 8 good deliveries and 2 bad ones. He provided a constant out ball, won his 50-50s, was good defensively and going forward. Felt it was a huge huge improvement on Enda in the last two games.

James has flaws, we all know them, but I really thought it was an impressive performance

As for the position going forward, wouldn’t be surprised if one of McNamara, Bagan or Adaramola break into the squad over the next year or so. Doesn’t feel like Stevens has much life left in his legs - hope I’m wrong cause he was a very good player when Sheffield United first got promoted but looks like he’s a little cooked. I know McNamara is mostly a right back but he’s done well on the left as well when I’ve seen him there - and he’s probably closest to the senior squad.

Bagan is always a solid 7/10 for the 21s. Has never had a bad game for them but doesn’t look like he’s gonna waltz straight up a level either. Adaramola was impressive in his debut for the 21s, to the extent that I’d consider starting him ahead of Bagan going forward. So logically could easily see him stepping up ahead of Bagan as well. Either way, good problems to have…

[Bielsa´s irish]

Bagan looks very good, was good for Cardiff too. Might be too early/risky, later this year if he consistently starts with his club.

really good, tremendous talent, plus he scored a few andy brehme kind of goals, that are amazing, for me is the next fellow to bring into the puzzle

[Insidetherock]

Said it a year ago.. we'd loads of games to bring new players in.. finish second in this group and we're nailed on for at least a play off spot.. with another 8-10 qualifying games to come.. uf we can qualify all those young uns will be two years further down the line by Germany 24

[John83]

It was a big game for Obafemi and Parrott obviously, but Molumby also did better than I expected, at a time when we were desperately short of options in centre mid. Here's hoping this isn't another lone swallow; it's been a long winter.

Is Obafemi out for Ukraine? There's a serious selection question there so: we went toothless again the second he came off yesterday.

[Razors left peg]

Is Obafemi out for Ukraine? There's a serious selection question there so: we went toothless again the second he came off yesterday.

Did we? Hogan looked like he had number 4 if the FAI paid for goal line technology. Thought he actually did pretty well when he came on and I don't rate him at all.

We obviously attacked less as game went on but I thought that was due to circumstances.

Obviously I hope Obafemi is fit for Tuesday, he was brilliant

[Diggs246]

If kennys remit is to confuse us
Congratulations job done!
World class yesterday after two turds the week before. I just don't get it
My guess is obefemi will be out on Tuesday, which is a real pity. Himself and mulomby were the real difference
While Scotland weren't great yesterday. Its a far better Scotland team then we usually get.
Jason knight might technically be a league one player, but technically he belongs in the Premier league!

[Eirambler]

Bagan's already changed his eligibility once, can he change again?

Yes, he only played a non-competitive game for Scotland Under 16s, so was never formally with them. This meant he didn't have to use his switch when he went with Ireland. So he could switch to England or Scotland in future until such time as we give him a competitive senior cap.

However, as Scotland are absolutely loaded in his position and he's probably not on England's radar at all, it seems unlikely. If Adaramola broke through at Crystal Palace he could be more of a concern though as he moved to England quite young I think.