Matches weekend 6th September

[Ezeikial]

Fair enough.

Is he(James) barred from OP as per SGBWA's post a few days ago?Only asking cos i swore i seen him in the OP press box last night ;)

Whoosh

He will be delighted that you actual attached some credibility to his wind-up

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Hand of god at Oriel????

Looking at the video you'd be hard pressed to find a more blatant hand ball, understandable the ref missed it though as he was blocked by Kelly's body, assistant needs to help him out there though.

As for Rovers, there's not many things better than a last minute winner in the cup. What was Walsh (Galway 5) playing at after the equaliser? Embarrassing carry on from him.

[Ezeikial]

Looking at the video you'd be hard pressed to find a more blatant hand ball, understandable the ref missed it though as he was blocked by Kelly's body, assistant needs to help him out there though.



A blatant hand ball?

Yet neither the ref nor the assistant see it?

While the video footage is not conclusive, there is no obvious sign of hand ball that I can see, although there are appeals from two of the 6 Cork players in the 6 yard box

https://twitter.com/DundalkFC/status/1170112873261088768

Maybe there are still photos that show clearly how Georgie Kelly connected for the goal.

[ToberonaTornado]

Whoosh

He will be delighted that you actual attached some credibility to his wind-up

OK :eek:
I've had a wee smoke,pass no remarks.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

A blatant hand ball?

Yet neither the ref nor the assistant see it?

While the video footage is not conclusive, there is no obvious sign of hand ball that I can see, although there are appeals from two of the 6 Cork players in the 6 yard box

https://twitter.com/DundalkFC/status/1170112873261088768

Maybe there are still photos that show clearly how Georgie Kelly connected for the goal.

When you don't have lillywhite tinted glasses on its clear as day a handball.

[ToberonaTornado]

When you don't have lillywhite tinted glasses on its clear as day a handball.

Provide some f ing evidence to back up your claims or stfu.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Provide some f ing evidence to back up your claims or stfu.

Careful now or Nesta will call you unnecessarily aggressive for using naughty words ��

[Ezeikial]

When you don't have lillywhite tinted glasses on its clear as day a handball.

I'm not particularly bothered one way or the other, as the goal was given and Dundalk deservedly won; the 3 points work towards setting up the possibility of winning the title against Shams on 23 Sept

It's more a curiosity to explore if there was any evidence of a hand ball - the video is certainly not "clear as day" or "blatent" as you claim

[joey B]

Sligo into the semi finals,18 goals in 3 FAI cup games!!

[RathfarnhamHoop]

I'm not particularly bothered one way or the other, as the goal was given and Dundalk deservedly won; the 3 points work towards setting up the possibility of winning the title against Shams on 23 Sept

It's more a curiosity to explore if there was any evidence of a hand ball - the video is certainly not "clear as day" or "blatent" as you claim

Look at when the ball changes directions, unless Georgie Kelly has a 3ft long neck there's no way its a header.
When you watch the video you can clearly see a boot between the ball and the camera when the ball changes direction, when you consider this with the pictures on here https://inpho.ie/assignment/hakwm6v0jTP1NMNFxWWO_A..a?ts=Ccca_aW6P_3VEg2XNhbdf g..a you can clearly see that the only part of Kelly's body anywhere near being past the boot is his hand (you can see the boot shadow on his arm and this would have been case by the town/shed floodlight so its fairly accurate and if anything the boot is actually closer to the hand than the shadow shows, the photo is actually after contact with the ball and the other photos show Kelly has a greater momentum towards the goal than the defender so his head was even further from the contact when it occured) meaning that the only part of him that could have connected with the ball to put it into the net is his fist.

[Ezeikial]

Look at when the ball changes directions, unless Georgie Kelly has a 3ft long neck there's no way its a header.
When you watch the video you can clearly see a boot between the ball and the camera when the ball changes direction, when you consider this with the pictures on here https://inpho.ie/assignment/hakwm6v0jTP1NMNFxWWO_A..a?ts=Ccca_aW6P_3VEg2XNhbdf g..a you can clearly see that the only part of Kelly's body anywhere near being past the boot is his hand (you can see the boot shadow on his arm and this would have been case by the town/shed floodlight so its fairly accurate and if anything the boot is actually closer to the hand than the shadow shows, the photo is actually after contact with the ball and the other photos show Kelly has a greater momentum towards the goal than the defender so his head was even further from the contact when it occured) meaning that the only part of him that could have connected with the ball to put it into the net is his fist.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Clear as mud

[RathfarnhamHoop]

Thanks for clearing that up.

Clear as mud

Yeah forgot there's no place for logic round here. If the boot was between the camera and ball at contact, and the only part of the attackers body past the boot was his fist, he must have made contact with his.... Head... Of course...

[Ezeikial]

Yeah forgot there's no place for logic round here. If the boot was between the camera and ball at contact, and the only part of the attackers body past the boot was his fist, he must have made contact with his.... Head... Of course...

I have a pain in my side from the laughing, but I'll play along for one more twist. Just a few more questions

1) Who owns the boot?

2) Is it his left fist or right fist that makes contact?

3) Will you provide expert evidence at the appeal hearing?

[White Horse]

I can understand the desperation being felt by Rovers fans. They've made great strides but are still 10 points off.

[Nesta99]

Careful now or Nesta will call you unnecessarily aggressive for using naughty words ��

Good to see you can reply to a post without losing the head. First mention of a handball for the goal was here. Certainly wasnt questioned elsewhere but maybe we are just lucky!

As for the logic - 'hard pressed to find a more blatant handball'?? - you missed the old classics of the Thierry Henry debacle or Maradona infamous moment?

"A boot between camera and ball, boot shadow on his arm...body anywhere near being past the boot is his hand...the boot is actually closer to the hand than the shadow shows...photo is actually after contact with the ball... other photos show Kelly has a greater momentum towards the goal than the defender" ?? Go and lie down RH as your head must hurt after that piece of forensic analysis!

TT I'm not so naive as to get sucked in that easily. I am simply surprised that fans are entertaining the notion that VP could or should be replaced by anyone never mind Nicky Barnby. If a first season probably winning the league, in a cup final, still favourites for the FAI Cup, a €1.2mil European pay day, more records likely to be bested and some people still conidering the possibility of VP being replaced well its pure daft!

[Nesta99]

I have a pain in my side from the laughing, but I'll play along for one more twist. Just a few more questions

1) Who owns the boot?

2) Is it his left fist or right fist that makes contact?

3) Will you provide expert evidence at the appeal hearing?

Next thing we will have a penalty from the Referees' Dundalk FC Supporters Society for a shadow of a boot at the box!! ;)

[RathfarnhamHoop]

You know it really is too easy to get the ultra defensive side of Dundalk fans out, almost takes the fun out of it. Add in a tiny bit of logic too and their poor wee heads just explode. Must be hard being that insecure about your club.

Keep on hooping lads

[Nesta99]

You know it really is too easy to get the ultra defensive side of Dundalk fans out, almost takes the fun out of it. Add in a tiny bit of logic too and their poor wee heads just explode. Must be hard being that insecure about your club.

Keep on hooping lads

Now you really are dealing in irony RH, Lucky Club!!

[Ezeikial]

You know it really is too easy to get the ultra defensive side of Dundalk fans out, almost takes the fun out of it. Add in a tiny bit of logic too and their poor wee heads just explode. Must be hard being that insecure about your club.

Keep on hooping lads

My own level of insecurity has now reach unhealthy levels - I'm really anxious that your unique forensic analysis skills could also end up ruling some of the other 62 league goals scored this season.

Is there a time limit on 3rd party goal appeals to the FAI?

[marinobohs]

Maybe the ball was just NEAR his hand 😁

[Crosshead]

To be fair, the video Dundalk put out Twitter shows it was a clear hand ball, even Gartland posted a not-too-subtle tweet about it too. Funnily enough given we expected to lose anyway, it's probably Shamrock Rovers fans who have more to be angry about over it.

[Nesta99]

Maybe the ball was just NEAR the shadow of his hand 

More like it! Handball or not, not even Cork fans have made a fuss. Havent heard Fenn complain either. Nothing in media reports - Dundalk conspiracy to be handed the title. Though I do think Perth mentioned something about match scheduling to try and derail us??

Should have read the post just above before posing again lol

[Ezeikial]

Funnily enough given we expected to lose anyway, it's probably Shamrock Rovers fans who have more to be angry about over it.

I suppose if the gap was 8 points instead of 10 it would give the more optimistic Rovers fans some glimmer of hope for the last 6 games.

[Nesta99]

I'm still not calling it until the League Trophy is firmly presented!!

[sullanefc]

More like it! Handball or not, not even Cork fans have made a fuss. Havent heard Fenn complain either. Nothing in media reports - Dundalk conspiracy to be handed the title. Though I do think Perth mentioned something about match scheduling to try and derail us??

Should have read the post just above before posing again lol

City fans have "made a fuss" on our own forum but probably haven't here because it would only draw out the usual guff from dalk fans as can be seen from the posts above.

[Nesta99]

There hasnt been a fuss made, one post even quesstions why there hasnt been more made of it. As for guff, it has been directed at the spurious methodology of RH's analysis of why it was handball.

The video footage from one angle looks like it came off an elbow in to the net and not the head. Whether it matters of not it still looked likely to be bundled over the line. Clumsey finish by Kelly rather than a deliberate keeper like punch of the ball. That's how the dice rolls sometimes, you need luck along the way to be in with a shout of winning titles!

[sbgawa]

I suppose if the gap was 8 points instead of 10 it would give the more optimistic Rovers fans some glimmer of hope for the last 6 games.

A good indicator of how much the league is over is I FORGOT u were playing, combination of age and indifference at this stage :)

How can the fai not know when the cup draw is on ?

[White Horse]

I have watched the goal back on video several times. Not to try and spot whether Georgie struck the ball with his head or his arm, but to marvel at the pass from McEleney to Gannon. Class.

[Kingswood Rover]

I suppose if the gap was 8 points instead of 10 it would give the more optimistic Rovers fans some glimmer of hope for the last 6 games.
Finishing within 10 and 2nd is progress and we remain on target, semi of the cup as a bonus, fans are happy with the season so far.

[Ezeikial]

Finishing within 10 and 2nd is progress and we remain on target, semi of the cup as a bonus, fans are happy with the season so far.

There is no doubt that Rovers have made progress this season and will probably end up with more points than they achieved in any recent season. However finishing 2nd is probably as much got to do with Cork's implosion (Rovers current average of 2.13 points per match is respectable, but would have put them in 3rd place behind Dundalk and Cork at the end of last season).

If the cup run finishes at the semi-final stages, while that would match the cup outcome in 2017, I can't see much satisfaction with only getting past Finn Harps, Drogheda and Galway.

Perhaps most Rovers fans are likely to be satisfied with meeting the modest expectations of finishing within 10 points; maybe that could be just a reflection of the poor achievement level of recent seasons?

It's also likely to require a draw or better in Oriel Park on 23 Sept - are you confident Rovers can achieve this?

[placid casual]

You don't understand Rovers levels of happiness or unhappiness so don't embarrass yourself even further by trying your usual wum horse$hit. Just enjoy your teams time in the sun. We have good reason to believe it may be coming to an end .

[Ezeikial]

You don't understand Rovers levels of happiness or unhappiness so don't embarrass yourself even further by trying your usual wum horse$hit. Just enjoy your teams time in the sun. We have good reason to believe it may be coming to an end .

I was taking Kingswood Rovers assertions at face value - but you are right I don't understand how Rovers fans can be happy with the levels of mediocrity from Rovers in recent years.

Would you be happy if Rovers finish 10 points adrift in the league and a cup sem-final exit?

[El-Pietro]

I expect the footage on Soccer Republic will be higher quality and show much more clearly the obvious handball. Theres no question he punched it in. I didn't see the game but it sounds like it was a backs to the wall effort and Dundalk were by far the better team. If I was in their position I'd probably be delighted to steal a win that way, though maybe there should be some concern that they struggled to break down such a poor team,

Overall a lot of positives for us to take out of the night, both in our own performance which appears to have been miles better than the games against Sligo and Waterford, and in Harps throwing away a lead. Fenn has two weeks to prepare for Harps which is inexplicably our most important game of the season. Draw or win and we are most likely safe.

[Nesta99]

I had a quick look at the highlights 1st Dundlk V Cork game in Oriel this season and from that game there was no indication that things were going to get so bad for Cork. The game on Friday wasnt a whole lot different really bar the few spells that Cork got at us 1st game. In terms of a doggedness and workrate Cork were back close to a minimum expectation. Undoubtedly there were plenty of reasons to put in a shift but it does emphasise issues in the Cork dressingroom and how Caulfield just seemed to lose the edge that comes with a seige mentality. Cork sat deep Friday, which isnt unusual, but they defended like it was a make or break night. Purely on stats Dundlk deserved the win - would have been nice for it to be comprehensive and controversy free. Where were that Cork side all season though - change of keeper seems like a masterstroke. The annoyance of Fenn in the way goals were conceded last weeks was pure criticism, probably of those who were coaching before, but he must have had the entire squad back to basics and not cough up easy chances in defence. It was credible performance even if we had another dose of luck with the goal though one would have arrived later!!

The schedule is pure attritional, managing league and 2 cup compettions with a spin around Europe, injuries from day one as well is a real testament to the manager and players - manager had his own pressures to deal with too! With injuries we cant rotate massively tomorrow, not that we'd want 11 form players out to keep in the cup hunt in a tricky fixture.

[mcgonigle]

[QUOTE=El-Pietro;2015902]I expect the footage on Soccer Republic will be higher quality and show much more clearly the obvious handball. Theres no question he punched it in. I didn't see the game but it sounds like it was a backs to the wall effort and Dundalk were by far the better team. If I was in their position I'd probably be delighted to steal a win that way, though maybe there should be some concern that they struggled to break down such a poor team,
/QUOTE]

No concern at all, with the schedule we have it's incredible that we just keep winning and comfortably. The 1-0 and controversy about the winner make the game sound close, it really wasn't.

Fenn has a big job on his hands and it will be interesting to see if he can back up his claim of playing more attractive football. You could be forgiven for thinking Caulfield was back in the dugout on Friday, cork worked hard, defended deep and wasted time at every opportunity. Can see why Cork fans would be pleased with the performance given recent showings but surely that won't suffice for long?

[Real ale Madrid]

[

Fenn has a big job on his hands and it will be interesting to see if he can back up his claim of playing more attractive football. You could be forgiven for thinking Caulfield was back in the dugout on Friday, cork worked hard, defended deep and wasted time at every opportunity. Can see why Cork fans would be pleased with the performance given recent showings but surely that won't suffice for long?

I wouldn't agree with that at all. I thought we played great in the first half. I actually thought we edged it on general play in the fist half ( Sorry First half ) - the gulf in class told in the hand though ( Sorry in the END ).

[Kingswood Rover]

Can we achieve a draw or better in oriel i think both of us would agree Rovers are capable of that. As for not getting much satisfaction from getting to a cup semi final i am sure it would be equal to yourself given a similar relatively easy path. I called finishing within ten points as good progress from the first few weeks of the campaign even when we were out in front. Now next season we need to be challenging right till the end. Progress cannot only be measured in points, crowds are up as is the quality of football on view each week and there is a sense of progression within the club this season that has by and large kept one of the most critical supports in the country happy. So still a lot to play for, oh yea and did i tell ya we beat Bohs

[Nah Nah Nah Nah]

Looked a clear handball for Dundalk goal

Greene should have gotten a red card as well I thought

[mcgonigle]

I wouldn't agree with that at all. I thought we played great in the first half. I actually thought we edged it on general play in the fist half ( Sorry First half ) - the gulf in class told in the hand though ( Sorry in the END ).

Well we'll agree to disagree. Didn't think you were on top at any point. At least you showed some fight, something to build on

[oriel]

Still cannot see for certain the contact on G Kelly’s goal v Cork, unless there was a behind the goal camera (there wasn’t), I don’t see how anyone can be certain it was via a hand. It seems the appeal by Dan Casey and later on his twitter is the main driver on this.

I’ve watched it about 5 times, and I would honestly call this out if I had seen it for certain, I can’t so its inconclusive.

On the match itself, Cork definitely looked a better side in the first half, but second half they were happy to defend in blanket numbers, still like the look of that young keeper, he had a great game.

[RathfarnhamHoop]

For anyone that's struggling here's the moment of impact with the ball, look how far away his head is from the ball. Laughable that anyone would try claim it was anything but a handball.
https://foot.ie/attachment.php?attachmentid=2807&stc=1

[ArFella]

It was definitely handball, Brian Gartland even gave a subtle nod to it in a tweet for god sake, don't understand why any Dundalk fan would care though, we won the game :D:D:D Fair enough for Cork fans to have a moan about it but most would probably accept that they were second best for large parts of the game. Huge fortnight upcoming now with the League Cup final on Saturday, and Waterford/Shams double header next weekend to potentially win the league! Add in the FAI cup semi-final draw which is due to take place at some point too, probably at 3:27am on Raidió na Gaeltachta. Obviously goes without saying but I'd love to see this side complete a treble especially for Vinnie as he's had some amount detractors this season waiting in gleeful hope for him to fail. Mon the town!!!

[oriel]

For anyone that's struggling here's the moment of impact with the ball, look how far away his head is from the ball. Laughable that anyone would try claim it was anything but a handball.
https://foot.ie/attachment.php?attachmentid=2807&stc=1

Oh dear !!!!!!!!!!!

[seand]

Laughable is right RH. We've all seen the nonsense of taking stills out of context, just one example being the 'proof' posted on here of Chris Shields eye gouged one of the Cork lads at one of the cup finals. At least that came from a hi-res photo. It's not even clear where Kelly's head is in the still it's so fuzzy. The Cork keeper appears to have no arms incidentally, which may have been a factor. Anyway, the still appears to show that Kelly's getting to the ball way ahead of the Cork defender which was how I saw it at the time, so why would he bother handling. Again I say it 'appears' that Kelly is well ahead of the defender, but the still proves nothing.

From where I was standing, twice as close to the incident as the camera, there was no suggestion of handball and I don't remember any protest from the Corkies at the time, but unquestionably I wasn't looking for it. I can see why some people might think it looks like handball from one distant angle, but its far from conclusive. It is interesting to see that the consensus on here is that it was probably handball though, it had never crossed my mind, live in HD.

Regardless, I'm not trying to convince anyone of my version of the truth, my point is that the video and this fuzzy screengrab are about as far from conclusive as you can get.

[Ezeikial]

Look at when the ball changes directions, unless Georgie Kelly has a 3ft long neck there's no way its a header.
When you watch the video you can clearly see a boot between the ball and the camera when the ball changes direction, when you consider this with the pictures on here https://inpho.ie/assignment/hakwm6v0jTP1NMNFxWWO_A..a?ts=Ccca_aW6P_3VEg2XNhbdf g..a you can clearly see that the only part of Kelly's body anywhere near being past the boot is his hand (you can see the boot shadow on his arm and this would have been case by the town/shed floodlight so its fairly accurate and if anything the boot is actually closer to the hand than the shadow shows, the photo is actually after contact with the ball and the other photos show Kelly has a greater momentum towards the goal than the defender so his head was even further from the contact when it occured) meaning that the only part of him that could have connected with the ball to put it into the net is his fist.


For anyone that's struggling here's the moment of impact with the ball, look how far away his head is from the ball. Laughable that anyone would try claim it was anything but a handball.
https://foot.ie/attachment.php?attachmentid=2807&stc=1

Is there any chance you use a pointer tool to mark on the photo "the boot shadow on his arm" that you previously mentioned?

It would also be helpful if you could establish forensically if G Kelly has in fact got a 3 foot neck.

Have you lodged the appeal yet?

[Real ale Madrid]

Laughable is right RH. We've all seen the nonsense of taking stills out of context, just one example being the 'proof' posted on here of Chris Shields eye gouged one of the Cork lads at one of the cup finals. At least that came from a hi-res photo. It's not even clear where Kelly's head is in the still it's so fuzzy. The Cork keeper appears to have no arms incidentally, which may have been a factor. Anyway, the still appears to show that Kelly's getting to the ball way ahead of the Cork defender which was how I saw it at the time, so why would he bother handling. Again I say it 'appears' that Kelly is well ahead of the defender, but the still proves nothing.

From where I was standing, twice as close to the incident as the camera, there was no suggestion of handball and I don't remember any protest from the Corkies at the time, but unquestionably I wasn't looking for it. I can see why some people might think it looks like handball from one distant angle, but its far from conclusive. It is interesting to see that the consensus on here is that it was probably handball though, it had never crossed my mind, live in HD.

Regardless, I'm not trying to convince anyone of my version of the truth, my point is that the video and this fuzzy screengrab are about as far from conclusive as you can get.

Casey was appealing for handball instantly - technically he is not a Corkie though I suppose but a....Dubie?

[Ezeikial]

Casey was appealing for handball instantly - technically he is not a Corkie though I suppose but a....Dubie?

It's a Dub thing to appeal - Sean Gannon clearly the first one with his hands up appealing before the ball even crossed the line. Practicing the infamous dark arts it seems

https://inpho.ie/cache/inpho/81/a1/bc/508727dc0de0b1ebc8109019329f2c2b4d6c9e44b8/INPHO_01600382.jpg

[sbgawa]

Fair enough.
Have to admit i never heard\read that rumour and JR is a good source for DFC info.

Is he(James) barred from OP as per SGBWA's post a few days ago?Only asking cos i swore i seen him in the OP press box last night ;)

I see James rogers confirming he was banned from cork match without intervention from his union and Noel Mooney plus dfc players Told not to talk to him, I don't get it tbh it's not like he was saying anything t hat wasn't fair comment.
Trying to silence the press never works just makes journo t he story

[RathfarnhamHoop]

We've all seen the nonsense of taking stills out of context
The context is its the moment of impact


At least that came from a hi-res photo
You can thank Dundalk for the lack of hi-res since they cant be bothered to get a 1080p camera at the game.


It's not even clear where Kelly's head is in the still it's so fuzzy.
Below the "s" in the "www.lumpersbar.ie"


The Cork keeper appears to have no arms incidentally, which may have been a factor.
One is below the "e" in the first "fyffes" the other is below the second "f"


Anyway, the still appears to show that Kelly's getting to the ball way ahead of the Cork defender which was how I saw it at the time, so why would he bother handling.
I've already posted links to images that show Kelly is well behind Casey after contact with the ball never mind as it happens


Again I say it 'appears' that Kelly is well ahead of the defender, but the still proves nothing.
Yeah well something that's wrong does prove nothing, you're correct there.


I don't remember any protest from the Corkies at the time
Three of them immediately appeal. They just know not to waste their breath because the ref is never going to change his mind and a lino standing in front of the shed with the whole Dundalk team beside him isn't going to pipe up.


It is interesting to see that the consensus on here is that it was probably handball though, it had never crossed my mind, live in HD.
Of course it didn't you had your lillywhite tinted glasses on

[dundalkfc10]

The context is its the moment of impact


You can thank Dundalk for the lack of hi-res since they cant be bothered to get a 1080p camera at the game.


Below the "s" in the "www.lumpersbar.ie"


One is below the "e" in the first "fyffes" the other is below the second "f"


I've already posted links to images that show Kelly is well behind Casey after contact with the ball never mind as it happens


Yeah well something that's wrong does prove nothing, you're correct there.


Three of them immediately appeal. They just know not to waste their breath because the ref is never going to change his mind and a lino standing in front of the shed with the whole Dundalk team beside him isn't going to pipe up.


Of course it didn't you had your lillywhite tinted glasses on

Are you on drugs?