France V Republic of Ireland - Sunday, 26 June 2016 - Euro 2016 Round of 16

[DeLorean]

I thought it was more that Murphy got too far ahead of the ball.

He actually made the perfect run for what should have been a tap in. He really should have been celebrating his first international goal but was substituted instead. It was really poor by McClean after great work to get inside the dreadful Rami.

[Supreme feet]

I actually think that the 2012 team would of won today's game.

I know you're on the wind-up, but there's actually something badly wrong with you if you think that.

Trap's team in 2012 was designed to lose games. He was found out in that tournament, it was awful, gutless and tactically appalling compared to this time around. It was a lesson on how not to play in an international tournament. In your imaginary scenario, France would have toyed with Whelan and Andrews for the whole game and had the win sown up long before half-time.

We can actually be proud of this Irish team, how competitive we were against more fancied opposition, and the football we played at times.

[the doc]

I know you're on the wind-up, but there's actually something badly wrong with you if you think that.

Trap's team in 2012 was designed to lose games. He was found out in that tournament, it was awful, gutless and tactically appalling compared to this time around. It was a lesson on how not to play in an international tournament. In your imaginary scenario, France would have toyed with Whelan and Andrews for the whole game and had the win sown up long before half-time.

We can actually be proud of this Irish team, how competitive we were against more fancied opposition, and the football we played at times.

I'm not on a wind up, I truly believe Traps team would of won that game.

Just my opinion, you may disagree that's fine.

By the way how many caps do you have?

[SkStu]

How would they have won it so? What would the key have been? Seriously?

Just a reminder - we lost 3-1 to Croatia; 4-0 to Spain and 2-0 to Italy in 2012.

So how would we have beaten France under Trap? Please indulge the forum.

[Eminence Grise]

Not a time for post-mortems, but some feelings bubble up to the surface…

Proud. Of each and every man in the squad. I was a s**t footballer, but I lived out my childhood dreams alongside players like these.

Disappointed. It feels weird to be disappointed over what might have been instead of what was. Especially against a team with the talent France has.

Thrilled. Some of our play was a joy. We can play long if we need to, but we’ve learned we don’t always need to. If you were a neutral, today was a good game of football. How often do you get to say that about us?

Hopeful. Randolph, Brady, Hendrick, McCarthy, Coleman, Westwood, Clarke, Duffy. OK, so the last two had poor moments, but there are three more campaigns at least in each of those players – and they’ll learn from this big game experience.

Relief. Knowing we can go head to toe with the big boys. Not giving a toss about reputations. Playing our way because other teams don’t like it. Welcome back that old ‘eff-you, but we can play too’ attitude – we’ve missed you. The players missed you.

Roll on Russia. Our campaign has started.

[tetsujin1979]

I'm not on a wind up, I truly believe Traps team would of won that game.

Just my opinion, you may disagree that's fine.

By the way how many caps do you have?you have 24 hours to provide a detailed tactical break down of how the 2012 team would beat that French side, or I'm giving you a week's suspension on principle alone
This is not a threat.

[Eminence Grise]

By the way how many caps do you have?

If you add us all up, probably as many as you have in the last two seasons.

[tricky_colour]

That corner we never go - criminal.

[tricky_colour]

Germany going home next.

[NeverFeltBetter]

This tournament, following that qualification campaign, has been the final nail in the coffin of Trap's reputation. I now truly believe he was one of the worst things to ever happen to Irish football, a man who who went out of his way to limit a team capable of more, and I've decided that's the very last time I'm ever going to mention that fraud on here.

Tough game today, very tough. You could see how tired they were after 70 or so minutes, and I agree with Stu that ET would have seen Ireland ship a lot of goals, so maybe, in a bizarre kind of way, it was just as well it ended at 2-1. One great half where Ireland were very much worth their lead, and plenty of chances/half chances to score more. But five awful minutes at the back and just no way to rectify it.

Randolph, solid, one great save and plenty of shots straight at him. Maybe could have got to the second goal? Has made his case fr more first team football at club level.

Coleman, decent enough, probably has the best endurance of any back. Duffy was fine, but caught badly by Greizmann's pace for the red card. He had to take him down, and stopped probably a certain goal, but should have done better beforehand. Both Duffy and Keogh at fault for the second, and Keogh just faded so badly as the game went on. That partnership needs more gametime. Ward had a good game overall, probably the best defender of the second half.

Brady, strong effort again, great penalty, made himself useful. Hendrick less so, another brainless yellow and tired quickly. McCarthy has struggled through most of the tournament, and has to be singled out for the first French goal, would Whelan have done better? McClean, his energy and commitment are obvious benefits, but France were able to isolate him whenever he got forward, and the crosses he did get off were poor.

Murphy, not up to all that much throughout the game one moment in the second when he could have taken a shot on but fatally hesitated, which drove me mad. Long, he ran and ran and got fouled off the pitch throughout, but maybe should have done a bit better.

Hoolahan wasn't capable of making an impact. O'Shea steadied the ship at the back, but that was all he was capable of doing. Walters didn't get up to much.

I won't say I'm not disappointed. The fitness levels were lacking and Ireland have proven themselves incapable of a steady, confident performance through a whole 90 minutes, bar the Italy game. France weren't great. We could have won that game. We could have beaten France.

But we didn't disgrace ourselves. We fought hard and we prevented a total collapse as happened against Belgium. We made the host nation look desperate and sloppy in large stretches, and I'll be stunned if France win this tournament. I think this is a successful tournament, and I have renewed hope for the coming WC qualification campaign.

[SkStu]

That corner we never go - criminal.

Oh yeah man. That was just terrible. Fair enough if the ref missed it (how though - it was a massive deflection) but what about that idiot behind the net? That was a huge turning point given they scored during the next passage of play. He made a huge - albeit easy - call giving us the penalty but he gave us little else. He missed three or four calls that should have gone our way that led to deciding moments. Standard of refereeing has been generally very poor all tournament actually.

[Stuttgart88]

Not a time for post-mortems, but some feelings bubble up to the surface…

Proud. Of each and every man in the squad. I was a s**t footballer, but I lived out my childhood dreams alongside players like these.

Disappointed. It feels weird to be disappointed over what might have been instead of what was. Especially against a team with the talent France has.

Thrilled. Some of our play was a joy. We can play long if we need to, but we’ve learned we don’t always need to. If you were a neutral, today was a good game of football. How often do you get to say that about us?

Hopeful. Randolph, Brady, Hendrick, McCarthy, Coleman, Westwood, Clarke, Duffy. OK, so the last two had poor moments, but there are three more campaigns at least in each of those players – and they’ll learn from this big game experience.

Relief. Knowing we can go head to toe with the big boys. Not giving a toss about reputations. Playing our way because other teams don’t like it. Welcome back that old ‘eff-you, but we can play too’ attitude – we’ve missed you. The players missed you.

Roll on Russia. Our campaign has started.this is pretty much how I feel too. I'm chuffed too that the whole country is proud. Seamus Coleman said there's a great bond between the team and fans. He's right and it really helps that the core of the team speak with Irish accents. I don't want an outraged Danny coming straight back but I think it's something that resonated among rugby supporters. The bond was broken during the Kerr / Trap years but it's back now. Nobody gives a hoot that Coleman and Brady earn bucket loads of money.

We have some good guys coming through and I think management and players learnt a lot.

Just on other stuff:

I was really pleased with Randolph. His positioning and handling was good in the first half. He was beaten by two good finishes and the header was superb. Peoples worst predictions didn't come through.

As for predicting Duffy's culpability, he's a Championship defender on his 3rd or 4th cap up against Champions League strikers. Some context needed.

I predicted we wouldn't win Euro 2016.

[NeverFeltBetter]

The difference between how the country viewed the team after their exit in 2012 to now is absolutely gigantic, and thank God for that. Obviously the bandwagon will tail off and the LOI won't see much benefit, but it's been nice to see Ireland get behind their team and believe again.

[Stuttgart88]

I loved the Patrice Evra interview on ITV. Irish great team, great players, great fans. Full of respect. Then asked about playing England and he said who says it'll be England.

Something like that anyway!

[Jovial Rambler]

Crapattoni almost set Irish football back 30years. The two things us fans have, are hope and belief. Crap took away the belief, not just from the fans but from the players also. He almost destroyed our hope. But, we're Irish. Our hope can never be destroyed, even by such an imposter. When u see our team beat Germany and Bosnia and Italy, and give a PROUD passionate performance against the tournament favourites on their own patch, it makes u feel that this manager is doing things right, he is inspiring the players, he is asking them to take the game to the opponent, he is giving the correct tactical advice, he is trusting in youth!
It looks good for the future, it gives us HOPE & BELIEF! Gone is the straight jacket, gone is the impotence, gone is the inferiority complex! You may be a troll, and I may have bitten. But there isn't one genuine poster on here who can argue that we have not progressed immensely, that we have not performed unrecognisably from Crap.
We have good players, we have a manager who will give our good young players a chance, who will allow them to play and compete. And as seen today and in the tournament, and in the qualifying campaign, we can play, we can compete, WE CAN WIN!!!!!
2012 was a disaster because of one man.....2016 has made me proud again because of every man...

[shakermaker1982]

Echo the sentiments from all above. Immensely proud of the team today. I thought we were magnificent in the first half. We've got a formation that suits us and we also play football.

I thought the ref was very hard on us today. Not giving us a corner when Ward hit that shot....criminal.

Defensive mistakes cost us in the end but the players were shattered. I'm amazed they started the game the way they did.

Did Keogh get pushed by that overrated Arsenal striker for the 2nd?

Agree with PO'S about Ward tucking in too much. He has come on leaps and bounds in the last 24 months at LB but he needs to work on that.

[Olé Olé]

Very hard to sum up how I feel about the match until I digest it properly. But I can definitely say I'm really proud to say I support that team.

But, so many positives coming from the tournament that were on show today. If we can get a settled back four and find a young forward then we'll have a great chance in the qualifiers. It's so brilliant to watch Robbie Brady drive forward with purpose and aggression in the middle of the park. Hendrick was on the back foot today somewhat but I thought he still did well and offers so much going forward in the future. That pair are hugely positive for us. Alan Browne, Callum O'Dowda and Jack Byrne will hopefully press for inclusion in the squad immediately and maybe Darragh Lenihan, Conor Hourihane, Josh Cullen and Brandon Miele can push on with them.

At the back, John Egan, Greg Cunningham and Tommie Hoban seem to have the best chance of making an impression. Duffy will learn from his mistake coming across to Giroud that time. That might have gone unpunished at Championship level but Giroud's nod was beautiful and Griezmann saw the space coming a mile away. Two CL level players will punish that. Can't criticize him too much.

Randolph was immense today. He made some great saves and made some more look easy. I really hope he's not warming the bench for West Ham this season. Not from an international perspective, because he's done well for us as their number 2, but from his own perspective.

[shakermaker1982]

Michael Cox of Zonal Marking tweeting after the game.

Ireland were poor at this tournament. Technically and physically inadequate, very fortunate to face half-arsed Italy in final group game.

What did he tweet after 2012??

[Comic Book Guy]

Proud of the teams efforts today but gutted to lose as I felt there was at least another goal in the game for us against a porous French defence, that said they upped the tempo big time in the 2nd half but if they win the tournament with that defence I'll be very surprised.
Pleased to see that the likes of Jeff Hendrick has come of age. Shocking call to give a goal kick for Ward's effort second half, wtf are those fools doing behind the goal?
Much more optimistic going into the WC qualifiers.

[Stuttgart88]

Is Brandon Miele the pick of the bunch at home?

[tetsujin1979]

Michael Cox of Zonal Marking tweeting after the game.

Ireland were poor at this tournament. Technically and physically inadequate, very fortunate to face half-arsed Italy in final group game.

What did he tweet after 2012??He's getting slaughtered for those comments

[Stuttgart88]

I was expecting Tets to come on and say his bus to the pub was an hour late.

[tetsujin1979]

I was expecting Tets to come on and say his bus to the pub was an hour late.

Local pub is a two minute walk away. With my recent luck, I'm surprised I didn't fracture an ankle on the way.

[osarusan]

Disappointed to lose any game, but not overly disappointed with the tournament in general - we got out of our group and gave the hosts a battle and a scare. With our limited resources, it's nothing to be ashamed of.

We had a poor performance against Belgium, which would otherwise been the abiding memory of the tournament, but we followed it up with a performance against Italy that was full of pride, heart, and no little ability, and then had nothing to be ashamed of against France, who eventually made their quality count.

We could look at individual errors and performances, but I don't think it's always necessary when you go out to a team that is just better than you.

[ger121]

Michael Cox of Zonal Marking tweeting after the game.

Ireland were poor at this tournament. Technically and physically inadequate, very fortunate to face half-arsed Italy in final group game.

What did he tweet after 2012??

Saw that on Twitter. Just as well Football isn't played on spreadsheets, we'd never even get on the plane to France.

[pineapple stu]

I dunno. I think he has a point.

We were lucky to face Italy when we did. To be honest, I was surprised how poor Italy were - had expected the reserves to be well up for the match, but they weren't really.

When Belgium and France upped their game, we really had no answers.

I think the point about the excision of the Trap era is entirely valid. There was more spirit and belief in the Italy and France games than I've seen in years. That's hugely positive from our point of view. But it won't factor into yer man's view.

But it's been a poor tournament overall, and I don't think we've particularly lit it up. It can be argued that, objectively, we've got room for improvement.

[NeverFeltBetter]

No doubt there's room for improvement, especially in longevity during a match, central defence and getting more striking options. But single tweet a poor medium for critique though, and not surprising to see hackles raised by "poor" and "inadequate" comments. Russia were poor. Ukraine were poor. Ireland did fine.

[the doc]

Crapattoni almost set Irish football back 30years. The two things us fans have, are hope and belief. Crap took away the belief, not just from the fans but from the players also. He almost destroyed our hope. But, we're Irish. Our hope can never be destroyed, even by such an imposter. When u see our team beat Germany and Bosnia and Italy, and give a PROUD passionate performance against the tournament favourites on their own patch, it makes u feel that this manager is doing things right, he is inspiring the players, he is asking them to take the game to the opponent, he is giving the correct tactical advice, he is trusting in youth!
It looks good for the future, it gives us HOPE & BELIEF! Gone is the straight jacket, gone is the impotence, gone is the inferiority complex! You may be a troll, and I may have bitten. But there isn't one genuine poster on here who can argue that we have not progressed immensely, that we have not performed unrecognisably from Crap.
We have good players, we have a manager who will give our good young players a chance, who will allow them to play and compete. And as seen today and in the tournament, and in the qualifying campaign, we can play, we can compete, WE CAN WIN!!!!!
2012 was a disaster because of one man.....2016 has made me proud again because of every man...

Mr Trapattoni deserves more respect than that.

He took over an Irish squad that was in disarray and turned them into an organised and efficient team.

We were just a hand away from the WC, we battered them in Paris with Robbie and Damo going close.
Sadly we were also playing against Platinni, Blatter and Steve Wonder as Ref.

We then qualified for the Euros, how many games did we go prior to that without defeat?

We then ended up losing to both the finalists and a good Croatia side.

We were also carrying injuries to Shay, Josh and Richie to name but a few.

Gio and Marcos preparations and Anslysis were top class.

The 2016 team and squad are inferior to the 2012 team.

But because they got a win against an Italian reserve side, you all think we did well.

The 2016, squad can't play 90 mins and they tire after an hour.

They are also poor defensively Clark, Keogh and Duffa are all over the place, and are poor footballers.

As a team we are poor defensively and in attack.

We are also tactically inferior as MoN isn't in the same class as Gio in that department

Let's not forget we wouldn't of qualified had the tournament not been increased to allow more sides in it.

Fact!

[pineapple stu]

I think he acknowledged Ireland did as well as the group of players would have suggested.

Agree you can't condense a whole tournament analysis into 140 characters, so no point getting het up about the tweet. I think that site does decent-length analyses which might flesh out the views and be more worth reading.

But it was a big improvement on recent years. And the challenge now is to keep improving.

[elroy]

Can't help but think this was an opportunity missed. We were so good in the first half and I've never heard the rte panel so positive. A mixture of French changes, tiredness and errors did for us.

I would've loved us to get to 0-1 at 65/70 mins. Bring on likes of Wes and mcgeady to assist us counteract. Even if we managed to settle at 1-1.

Plenty to digest from the tournament. So proud of the players, no doubt the team have grown with huge positives from likes of Hendrick and Brady. Changing of the guard now and we will lose some incredible servants but there is a reasonably good base to build on.

I am also delighted to see the Irish team again capture the nation like nothing else can. It's great for the kids who would not remember the likes of 88/90/94/02. This tournament gave them moments of inspiration.

[jbyrne]

I dunno. I think he has a point.

We were lucky to face Italy when we did. To be honest, I was surprised how poor Italy were - had expected the reserves to be well up for the match, but they weren't really.

When Belgium and France upped their game, we really had no answers.


we just love making excuses for the opposition when we take big scalps. on paper i wonder how many of our players would get into italys "reserves" that was full of juve, psg, roma and milan players. i thought we were excellent against italy, for an hr today and an hr against sweden. i doubt conte would tolerate a team of his, whatever the circumstances, to not be up for it.

would love to see how we would have fared in the 2nd half with a 7 day break rather than the 3 days we had since wed match. we were superb for the first 50 min but visibly tired badly from there which clearly helped france up their game.

very proud of our lads today. we just have to admire the spirit and no little skill we showed this tournament

[pineapple stu]

In fairness, we were even saying on here that we were luck to get Italy when we did. There was the counter argument put across that their resreves would have played to impress, but either they didn't, or they couldn't.

I just don't see that we need to automatically reject objective criticism of the team just because we want to focus on how Euro 2016 has gone a long way towards getting us over the past few years.

[Eminence Grise]

Mr Trapattoni deserves more respect than that.

...

Fact!

Fuct!

That's how Trapattoni left us. A withered husk of a team with its confidence shot to pieces, told for 60-odd games that they were no good and playing in a formation last effective when balls had laces on the outside.

[elroy]

Having watched the highlights again. No doubt France really lifted it in the second half with de griesmann move to the centre being crucial.

Tiredness was def a big factor. Hendrick looked for wrecked for example. Also the space govrn to Sagna for the cross that led to the goal, wasn't happening in first half. I think both goals are attributable to poor management by the centre halves.

[SwanVsDalton]

I just don't see that we need to automatically reject objective criticism of the team just because we want to focus on how Euro 2016 has gone a long way towards getting us over the past few years.

I don't think anyone here is doing that, in fairness. That tweet was just ridiculously harsh. He's usually much better than banal observation plus hefty does of snark. Our performances deserved better too.

[tricky_colour]

I think the small Irish ticket allocation played a part, seemed like Irish fans were out numbered by about 10-1,
I think that was detremantal to us in a number of ways, not least that we failed to get a corner, that would never
have happened to France.

I was going to look at the incident on my recording (on my PC) but unfortunately it has a problem leaving only
the last 10 mins, however I am recording the replay.

When the French scored it looked like the whole stadium was French, well I suppose technically it is as they built it,
but you know what I mean..

[SwanVsDalton]

I think the small Irish ticket allocation played a part, seemed like Irish fans were out numbered by about 10-1...

Seemed 10-1 cause it was 10-1 (or thereabouts).

[tricky_colour]

Seemed 10-1 cause it was 10-1 (or thereabouts).

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3658944/Republic-Ireland-ticket-allocation-scandalous-according-striker-Shane-Long-assistant-boss-Roy-Keane-slams-unfair-split-16-clash-France.html



Republic of Ireland ticket allocation 'scandalous' according to striker Shane Long as assistant boss Roy Keane slams 'unfair' split for last-16 clash with France

Republic of Ireland play host nation France in Euro 2016 knockout stage
Ireland only allocated 4,500 tickets inside 59,000-seat stadium in Lyon
Striker Shane Long and assistant manager Roy Keane criticised split
There is rising concern that touts will charge more than £1,000 for tickets




Just over 13-1, that really is not fair. 3-1 would be bad enough.

[tetsujin1979]

whatever about the allocation, there were reports of about 9,000 Irish fans in the stadium

[Charlie Darwin]

Is Brandon Miele the pick of the bunch at home?
Daryl Horgan is. Miele hasn't pushed on quite as much as I'd have expected him to - he's massively talented but he has too many anonymous games. He's still young enough to turn it around and make it though.

[DannyInvincible]

Terribly disappointed with the result given the dream first-half, but so very, very proud of the players. Every last one of them can go home with their heads held high. They've re-captured the hearts of the nation and the buzz truly is back. They gave their all and they were absolutely drained by the end of it. France had a week of rest; we had three days. It showed. Unfortunately, we unravelled when France began exerting more pressure in the second.


this is pretty much how I feel too. I'm chuffed too that the whole country is proud. Seamus Coleman said there's a great bond between the team and fans. He's right and it really helps that the core of the team speak with Irish accents. I don't want an outraged Danny coming straight back but I think it's something that resonated among rugby supporters. The bond was broken during the Kerr / Trap years but it's back now. Nobody gives a hoot that Coleman and Brady earn bucket loads of money.

Heh, no outrage from me. I see you're point. Naturally, I feel a greater affinity with players like Coleman, McClean and Duffy as I'm from the north-west myself. That's kind of instinctive, I guess; identifying with players closer to home or whatever. However, our 1990 and 1994 teams were made up mostly of players born outside of Ireland, yet they were exceptionally popular. Also, Walters is a very popular player currently yet is Merseyside-born. If players show passion, heart, effort and endeavour and/or get results, that's what really connects with fans, I would say. The 2012 performances were just anaemic and uninspiring, in total contrast to this time round.

[Stuttgart88]

In fairness, we were even saying on here that we were luck to get Italy when we did. There was the counter argument put across that their resreves would have played to impress, but either they didn't, or they couldn't.

I just don't see that we need to automatically reject objective criticism of the team just because we want to focus on how Euro 2016 has gone a long way towards getting us over the past few years.Overall I think it's obvious we're a level below the top notch teams but can compete well with most others. We do have technical shortcomings and ball retention is a problem, especially when good quality opposition presses us. In among that though, we do have some good technical players and of all the non-elite nations I think few have a player anything like Robbie Brady, for example. As usual, I think Ireland were a curate's egg, good in parts. I think the reaction to yer man's tweets was a bit OTT but not recognising the emotional impact of the team and performances would be churlish in the extreme.

[pineapple stu]

I think that's pretty much spot-on.

[Stuttgart88]

I think that's pretty much spot-on.Not to mention the contrast with the last tournament.

Ian Herbert of the Independent wrote this:

The prospect of a miracle was quite beautiful for the hour it lasted because it was built on creativity, intelligence and technical excellence, not just workmanlike determination from the Republic of Ireland.

[Stuttgart88]

One last point on Duffy. It was a clear balls up between the two CBs for the Giroud knock-down and I'd say Duffy was almost wholly culpable. I'm not going all Paul, but I did say that the only change I would make would be to restore O'Shea. This was because I felt his experience would be invaluable against seasoned French forwards. However, I have to say that Duffy saved a certain goal in the first half with his glancing header away from Giroud, following a sumptuous cross. I'm not sure our other CBs could have got that touch.

I also think it's obvious that Whelan's presence would have avoided each goal :)

[Lionel Ritchie]

we wouldn't of qualified



Okay. I just can't let this slide for three posts in a row. Indeed, when it's happening three posts in a row I'm being neither pedantic nor OT. Wouldn't HAVE. Not of. HAVE.

As for your substantives -you're on glue.

[geysir]

One last point on Duffy. It was a clear balls up between the two CBs for the Giroud knock-down and I'd say Duffy was almost wholly culpable. I'm not going all Paul, but I did say that the only change I would make would be to restore O'Shea. This was because I felt his experience would be invaluable against seasoned French forwards. However, I have to say that Duffy saved a certain goal in the first half with his glancing header away from Giroud, following a sumptuous cross. I'm not sure our other CBs could have got that touch.

I also think it's obvious that Whelan's presence would have avoided each goal :)
No joke but it might well have been a good idea to replace McCarthy with Whelan a few minutes after the restart as he was the first to show the signs of total exhaustion.
The first goal was also french brilliance who all of a sudden upped the tempo against a team that had been under the cosh and visibly flagging 10 minutes.
Murphy missed another header, Duffy and Coleman both bundled off the ball, a McCarthy lunge, an acre of free space on the right for the cross
CHs frozen on the spot. When every player along the route for that first French goal made an error i think we can safely say the team (and not any one individual) did not defend.

[davidatrb]

Michael Cox of Zonal Marking tweeting after the game.

Ireland were poor at this tournament. Technically and physically inadequate, very fortunate to face half-arsed Italy in final group game.

What did he tweet after 2012??

Looking at the teams that made (are likely to make the last 8) I don't think Ireland have much of a claim to be among them. So, that ranks us outside the top 8.

Of the teams knocked out in our round I think that N. Ireland, Croatia and Italy will have made a bigger impact at the tournament than us. So that pushes us outside the top 11 performances.

But Hungary (beaten 4-0 by Belgium soured my opinion after a good showing in group), Switzerland, Slovakia and Iceland/England (if they go out) probably were on a par or just below our level over all.

So I give us a quick ranking of about joint 12th, which I don't think is "poor" in the context of a 24 team tournament. It's at least average ;)

Our best games were Sweden and France. I agree that you can discount the Italy game a little based on the "half-arsed" nature of the Italians - but those other two performances mentioned are worthy of something. And the 3-0 drubbing by Belgium doesn't even seem that bad any more after seeing them inflict worse on Hungary.

I think that it is also fair to revise up our qualifying performances. We got some amazing results (both games vs Germany) and some which we thought weren't the best (vs Poland) in that group. Now consider that all 3 qualifying teams from that group made the last 16 and 2 are still alive in the last 8. It puts it in context the quality there was in the group over all.

Taking it ALL into account. The toughest qualifying group (3 teams made last 16, Scotland one of the highest ranked teams not to make tournament, after Netherlands, Bosnia, Denmark and Greece), the hardest play-off opponents (Dzeko's Bosnia - if I remember at the time that is the team we most wanted to avoid), the toughest Round 1 Group (to get Italy as 2nd seeds!), the toughest Round 2 draw (The favourites and hosts) ... We did pretty well over all. The lads can be proud. But we need to breathe some new life into the team to kick on.

[Stuttgart88]

Okay. I just can't let this slide for three posts in a row. Indeed, when it's happening three posts in a row I'm being neither pedantic nor OT. Wouldn't HAVE. Not of. HAVE.

As for your substantives -you're on glue.Sorry, but "of" versus "have" IS substantive



So I give us a quick ranking of about joint 12th, which I don't think is "poor" in the context of a 24 team tournament. It's at least average ;)

And continuing the pedantry, median surely?

[Real ale Madrid]

Looking at the teams that made (are likely to make the last 8) I don't think Ireland have much of a claim to be among them. So, that ranks us outside the top 8.

Of the teams knocked out in our round I think that N. Ireland, Croatia and Italy will have made a bigger impact at the tournament than us. So that pushes us outside the top 11 performances.

But Hungary (beaten 4-0 by Belgium soured my opinion after a good showing in group), Switzerland, Slovakia and Iceland/England (if they go out) probably were on a par or just below our level over all.

So I give us a quick ranking of about joint 12th, which I don't think is "poor" in the context of a 24 team tournament. It's at least average ;)

Our best games were Sweden and France. I agree that you can discount the Italy game a little based on the "half-arsed" nature of the Italians - but those other two performances mentioned are worthy of something. And the 3-0 drubbing by Belgium doesn't even seem that bad any more after seeing them inflict worse on Hungary.
.

As far as the group stages go - we were ranked 14th out of 24 - that seems about right. No way id rank us behind NIR - I wouldn't necessarily discount the Italian performance either. Italy had nothing to play for in the last game of qualifying v Norway and Norway were not good enough to take advantage - would NIR, UKR, TUR, ALB, even SWE etc been good enough to beat their 2nd string - I'm not sure - it was a game we had to go out and win and we did. We deserve a lot of credit.

What was most pleasing apart from our ranking was the way we went about our business in the tournament - we played some lovely stuff against Sweden, Italy and France and we continually improved as the whole competition went on. Something really tangible to build on.