Republic of Ireland V Switzerland 25th March & Slovakia 29th March 2016 - Friendlies [Archive] - Page 9

paul_oshea

30/03/2016, 10:08 AM

They had 8 changes in their team, so i doubt its their strongest. The squad seems pretty decent but their defense is pretty shambolic, marginally better than ours I think. A combination of the swiss defense and the Slovak attack would be a potent force at the Euros.

I've re-watched the McShame goal a couple of times, and its actually a serious bit of skill to do what he did especially with the angle he was at. I actually think he thought he could safely pat it back to Randolph. Either way a serious bit of innate skill. I say innate because it was all in the subconcious somewhere.

Good to see the consensus on ward, although a couple of posters in earlier posts mentioned they thought he was solid(I thought SkStu-we know his bias :D - but i could be wrong). Lets use this cull to rid the squad of the dead-wood that have been around for a while now. Start with Ward and McShane, cruel but unless we are desperately stuck in friendlies i dont think they should be near the squad. I do like McShane though.

I don't hate or loathe Whelan btw, I just think he is an extremely lucky player. No one realises he is actually a golfer.

SVD I think that post earlier of yours was the first funny post you've ever had, do it more often, you're actually more normal(and even fun) than you let on.

On O'Kane don't be all prematurely ejaculating yourselves here(as there is a tendency to do), he was decent but I think in the bigger scheme of things and over the course of say 30 caps we would see he is fairly average. We have a lot of average midfielders who don't really set us alight, but hoolahan is the exception, i still really wish he had worked on his upper body strenght. Look at messi how strong he is for the size of him, i think it would add so much more to wessis game if he had that. I say this cos I think he has the skill to take on players and run past them, but not the strength to match. Too late now though, and he still is easily able to compete at this level for another couple of years so I hope he doesn't call it quits after the Euros.

I think our defense is going to be our strongest asset coming into the World cup, going on the last couple of games. We could certainly do with unearthing another Striker between now and the "business end" of the WC qualifiers. I also hope MON stays on, but I'm begining to feel that he isn't going to.

We can look to the Euros with optimisim.

paul_oshea

30/03/2016, 10:11 AM

Oh and one final thing. THe argument for 6-8 years previously that "we dont have the players" has been well and truly put to bed now(and i dont think our player ratio of PL:Div1 is much different). Those managers, frauds sorry masquerading as managers!

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 10:23 AM

Good to see the consensus on ward, although a couple of posters in earlier posts mentioned they thought he was solid(I thought delores and SkStu-we know his bias :D - but i could be wrong).

Definitely wasn't me... I thought 'solid' was a very generous assessment also.

paul_oshea

30/03/2016, 10:30 AM

Duly edited, I wont mention anymore names :)

Fixer82

30/03/2016, 10:30 AM

Late to the discussion but just wanted to say that McShane is not an international player. He's too slow and he dives in too much. He likes the blood and guts stuff taking man and ball but, as for the first goal, at international level you can be made look silly doing that. He never should have dived into that tackle.

I like Whelan but he made too many unforced errors last night. O'Kane looked composed.
Wessi class as always.

On a side note, I had a fiver put on a year ago for Rob Elliot to make the Euro squad. FML!

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 10:32 AM

Duly edited, I wont mention anymore names :)

But I can't speak for Delores :)

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 10:34 AM

On a side note, I had a fiver put on a year ago for Rob Elliot to make the Euro squad. FML!

Tricky's gonna faint when he sees this!

Deckydee

30/03/2016, 10:36 AM

geysir

30/03/2016, 10:48 AM

Was that close to their best starting XI last night? They seem a pretty old team, the commentator mentioned that something like seven or eight of the guys that started last night were in their World Cup squad in 2010. That's not that unusual or anything I'm just kind of wondering how they've improved so much? Experience? They did seem pretty impressive in qualifying bar the home defeat to Belarus.
They were were missing 4 or 5, had virtually a rookie midfield alongside Hamsik. I don't know why they have improved so much in this campaign over their last one, new coach? They have a good depth in their squad and are more consistent.

tetsujin1979

30/03/2016, 10:57 AM

Hi All,

May I ask why the bagpipes where played at the start (according to the commentary it was wrap the flag around me)

Is this a new thing? Cant say I have seen it before, loved it and would love to see it at the EUROS.

Just curious

Thanksthink it was for the end of the Easter celebrations. Doubt we'll see it again

Also, the anthem was well sung, one of the best I can remember.

Deckydee

30/03/2016, 10:59 AM

think it was for the end of the Easter celebrations. Doubt we'll see it again

Also, the anthem was well sung, one of the best I can remember.

Thats a shame, I thought it was lovely

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 11:04 AM

Injuries aside, is this our starting team for the Euros?

- - - - - - - Randolph - - - - - - -

Coleman - Keogh - Clark - Brady

-Hendrick - Whelan - McCarthy-

- - - - Walters - Hoolahan - - - -

- - - - - - - - - Long - - - - - - - -

SwanVsDalton

30/03/2016, 11:17 AM

SVD I think that post earlier of yours was the first funny post you've ever had, do it more often, you're actually more normal(and even fun) than you let on.

Thanks Paul but if Glenn Whelan has taught me anything, it's to always ignore the rabble's demand for entertainment. ;)

TheOneWhoKnocks

30/03/2016, 11:22 AM

Stuttgart88

30/03/2016, 11:34 AM

Injuries aside, is this our starting team for the Euros?Very close to it I reckon.

Stuttgart88

30/03/2016, 11:42 AM

You can tell it bruised SVD's ego hyping Glenn Whelan up as some kind of Didier Deschamps like figure to all us peasants and then watching yet another abject performance like that.

The continuous sarky comments are clearly just a defence mechanism.

But yeah it must be because we hate poor Glenn: great protector of defence and oasis of calm on the ball.I find SvD quite amusing and humble. You on the other hand are just petty and tedious. You're rank hypocrite too. You don't have the sole right around here to be sarky.

Whelan played awful last night. We know. Despite that it's fair to have a different opinion on his value to the team in previous games. Personally I think he finished the campaign reasonably well but as much as anyone would love someone else to emerge and take on his role. Neither Quinn nor Meyler came anywhere close last night.

And Paul, you're around here long enough too to know how to make a point constructively without constantly having to pick out someone's previous opinions like a 6 year old. With only one obvious exception I'll engage with anyone around here constructively. When it comes to that exception I'll call him a cnut when he's being one, like he has been for the last day or so.

tetsujin1979

30/03/2016, 11:45 AM

Gentlemen, remember the rules, attack the post, not the poster. There will be no further warnings.

SwanVsDalton

30/03/2016, 11:50 AM

You can tell it bruised SVD's ego hyping Glenn Whelan up as some kind of Didier Deschamps like figure to all us peasants and then watching yet another abject performance like that.

The continuous sarky comments are clearly just a defence mechanism.

But yeah it must be because we hate poor Glenn: great protector of defence and oasis of calm on the ball.

Look man, nearly all of these posts haven't been directed at you and I've been good humouredly sending myself up, as well as the view I'm some enormous Glenn Whelan lover. Bit of craic, or so I thought...

I haven't said one provoking thing to you (merely offered a differing view) and you're continually playing man (me) and not the ball.

Please quote a post where I was "hyping Glenn Whelan up as some kind of Didier Deschamps like figure to all us peasants" or delete the above.

It's simply untrue that I've ever written anything approaching that (or what you've alluded to previously in this thread). It's just generalised hyperbole. My views are pretty well documented, and your post isn't representative of them.

I'll happily have a mature discussion about the pros and cons of Glenn Whelan in his thread, if you like. Your call TOWK.

I find SvD quite amusing and humble.

First Paul, and now Stutts?! This is a real red-letter day in the SwanVsDalton household. :)

Stuttgart88

30/03/2016, 11:55 AM

This was the consensus for France in the car on the way back to Belfast tonight

Randolph, Given, Forde

Coleman, Christie, O'Shea, Keogh, Clark, Duffy, Wilson, Ward

Brady, Whelan, McCarthy, Hoolahan, McClean, McGeady, Arter, Hendrick

Murphy, Walters, Keane, LongI'd have Westwood in the squad all day long. I'd be inclined to pick Doyle and having to leave someone out would have me leaning towards McGeady or Murphy.

Places most at risk if I was picking the squad: Forde/Given, Ward, Wilson, McGeady, Murphy. Players who are close to making it would be O'Kane, Hayes and Pilkington. I think O'Kane has snuck ahead of Meyler in the reckoning. Gibson is not in the picture for me at this stage.

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 12:05 PM

I think it's fair enough at this stage to let McGeady's Sheffield Wednesday form dictate whether he gets in or not. It's still his place to lose (just about) but he needs to show something.

SwanVsDalton

30/03/2016, 12:09 PM

I think it's fair enough at this stage to let McGeady's Sheffield Wednesday form dictate whether he gets in or not. It's still his place to lose (just about) but he needs to show something.

He's at risk for sure, particularly if the likes of Judge, Arter and O'Kane kicking around.

I do wonder if Meyler is fully out of it as well. He didn't show up well on Friday, but the squad lacks truly powerful, defensively minded midfielder and he showed in the campaign he was adept at coming off the bench and shoring up play. It's possibly the kind of thing Arter or O'Kane can do but I haven't seen as much of them.

Might be the kind of player invaluable if we're looking to protect a late lead.

paul_oshea

30/03/2016, 1:28 PM

think it was for the end of the Easter celebrations. Doubt we'll see it again

Also, the anthem was well sung, one of the best I can remember.

You can only have one "anthem" anyway so we wouldnt be able have it at the euros. Also I thought the one on Friday was brilliant as well. Fair play to the FAI.

Stuttgart88

30/03/2016, 1:47 PM

Overall I think it was a useful 2 games. Duffy, Clark, Randolph, Christie, Wes and Long stood out for me. Others looked useful, including some newcomers. Ward, Whelan and McShane posed worrying questions. Diamond / 451 is way more effective than 442 and we actually played proper attacking football for a lot of last night. If I was O'Neill I'd be very happy with what I learnt (both good and bad), disappointed for Elliott and I'd give Judge another look in May, even if only for next season.

paul_oshea

30/03/2016, 2:04 PM

Randoplhs kicking really is a good asset, he is so bloody accurate, the laid back swagger but some potency with the boot. He was also quicker off his line yesterday on two occassions which was good to see.

I still think he isn't as agile as needed to be a premiership keeper and mainstay. One time yesterday he ran across and dived to make the save as though he was quicker doing that than actually diving. I just feel he is a bit slow getting down and out-stretching, and I hope it doesn't cost us at the Euros.

And no CD i'm not saying its a waiting to happen, as we might not have a chance against us like that, but I still feel he isn't reactionary and/or agile enough for us.

Breen had the diamond as a 4 in midfield, and 2 strikers out and out. Also we did play 2 up top even with the diamond so it was like a more compact 4-4-2 - in the first half at least before forced subsitutions.

TheOneWhoKnocks

30/03/2016, 2:51 PM

I find SvD quite amusing and humble. You on the other hand are just petty and tedious. You're rank hypocrite too. You don't have the sole right around here to be sarky.

Whelan played awful last night. We know. Despite that it's fair to have a different opinion on his value to the team in previous games. Personally I think he finished the campaign reasonably well but as much as anyone would love someone else to emerge and take on his role. Neither Quinn nor Meyler came anywhere close last night.

And Paul, you're around here long enough too to know how to make a point constructively without constantly having to pick out someone's previous opinions like a 6 year old. With only one obvious exception I'll engage with anyone around here constructively. When it comes to that exception I'll call him a cnut when he's being one, like he has been for the last day or so.

You don't think it's a bit childish to have a pop at someone for their opinions on a player and try to camouflage it by hiding it in a comment ostensibly replying to someone else i.e. "Unless They (i.e. me) Hate Whelan".

All because I said he was culpable in both goals, including when his giving the ball away under no pressure started a litany of errors that led to the second goal.

Now I didn't say solely culpable and if I did I would deserve a backlash, but I said culpable and he was. And it's McShane & Ward who will get the brunt of the blame for it.

Someone with Whelan's experience and # of caps is supposed to be setting the tone for the rest of the team. At the very least, he has to have some composure that reflects his vast experience, but it was the same as Warsaw - his nerves running through the rest of the team.

I agree Meyler and Quinn didn't do enough to take his role but equally McCarthy could have done everything Whelan did last night better.

And I know my moaning gets tedious but so does constant sark.

Charlie Darwin

30/03/2016, 3:06 PM

Can we have one thread that doesn't turn into being all about TOWK? It was tedious before and it's already become tedious again.

OwlsFan

30/03/2016, 3:44 PM

We actually played proper attacking football for a lot of last night.

Never happy with that description. A long ball is just as "proper" in an attacking sense as other forms of attacking play. Our goal against Germany at home was a so-called "hoof ball". I am happy with either style of play provided it gets results. Hoof ball = victory or "proper football" = draw, I'll take the former any time and, of course, vice versa. There are many ways to skin a cat as the saying goes.

Sickened for Elliot who seemed to be clasping his knee even before he hit the ground. Why is it friendlies nearly always throw up serious injuries?

Despite McShane's horror appearance, there is a good chance he might go due to his versatility. He did ok when switched to centre-half. However, only he and Elliot (for other reasons) damaged their chances.

Negatives as regards MON: Why not bring on Pilkington earlier to play the striker's role rather than Brady? He is doing well there at Cardiff. Disappointed Judge didn't get another run. Why take another look at McGeady and Brady when we know what they can do? If Forde was there, and I assume he was, why wasn't he brought on instead of Randolph or has he no intention of bringing him. Is that a "given"? Two games for McCarthy?

Positives as regards MON: Unlike my pal, Trapp, he tried different players and tactics.

Despite it all, I still seem him playing his usual team in Paris: Randolph (Given if "fit"), Brady, O'Shea, Keogh (where was he?) and Coleman, McGeady/McLean, Whelan, McCarthy, Walters, Hoolahan, Long.

The only changes I'd make would be keeper (obviously) and try and fit Arter someplace but not sure where

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 3:56 PM

His usual team would include Hendrick at this stage I think.

SkStu

30/03/2016, 3:58 PM

Positives as regards MON: Unlike my pal, Trapp, he tried different players and tactics.

This is huge in my opinion.

Re Ward: I am going to defer to the masses here and admit I must have gotten it wrong!

zero

30/03/2016, 4:06 PM

His usual team would include Hendrick at this stage I think.

yes, and doesn't include both long and walters i think? certainly not all of hoolahan walters and long... i'm not sure he'll start hoolahan in all 3 group games, maybe the first game and see how we go for there.

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 4:44 PM

Long has surely done enough now to start ahead of Murphy, surely....

SwanVsDalton

30/03/2016, 4:56 PM

You don't think it's a bit childish to have a pop at someone for their opinions on a player and try to camouflage it by hiding it in a comment ostensibly replying to someone else i.e. "Unless They (i.e. me) Hate Whelan".

And I know my moaning gets tedious but so does constant sark.

I've refuted and challenged this in a direct post to you, a post you haven't had the courtesy to respond to yet either here or privately. Hey, that's your choice, but if you've a problem PM me and leave the thread be.

SwanVsDalton

30/03/2016, 5:04 PM

His usual team would include Hendrick at this stage I think.

I think Clark might be pushing Keogh a little bit too, after his late showing in the qualifiers. Or, at least, there's a question mark over who will partner O'Shea.

geysir

30/03/2016, 5:15 PM

Long has surely done enough now to start ahead of Murphy, surely....
The mere fact that you ask this question is an indication of a low level of confidence in O'Neill.
At the very least, it reflects an image of a manager all too prone to vacillating, sometimes interpreted as tactical flexibility :)

Stuttgart88

30/03/2016, 5:43 PM

I knew Owls Fan was going to respond to my "proper football" description!

I take the point but I firmly believe that purposeful positive and measured use of the ball is the way to win games these days but having route one in your locker is a good asset too. Only having the latter is unlikely to get consistent results. Down the years we have lost points due to an inability to get the ball down, use and retain it well. And Brian Kerr referred to our football last night as "proper" too :) it warms my heart to see a player like Wes find space between the lines. A goal from a hoof is still a goal but modern refereeing and modern tactics favour more technical play and if you can't do that you'll struggle to compete consistently.

OwlsFan

30/03/2016, 6:26 PM

I knew Owls Fan was going to respond to my "proper football" description!

I suppose I am predictable, although the ball over the top does suit Long's pace rather than one twos around the box. Two things will always garner a response. RTE Panel comments and whether there is a proper way to play football but over the years I have learned that I am a reactionary. If the majority thought Giles was someone who envied the success of other Irish managers, I'd come down in the opposite camp or believed that the long ball was the way forward, I'd say that wasn't proper football.

But enough about me. DeLorean states that MON's usual team would include Hendrick at this stage. Perhaps as he had slipped my mind (see what happens when someone misses a couple of games!).

DeLorean

30/03/2016, 6:52 PM

I think Clark might be pushing Keogh a little bit too, after his late showing in the qualifiers. Or, at least, there's a question mark over who will partner O'Shea.

I actually think Clark has jumped ahead of everybody, it's more a question of who will partner him now. I'd imagine Keogh will start against The Netherlands, if indeed he doesn't have a playoff final to tend to the next day, and if he gets through that with no major errors, I think he'll start in France.

geysir

30/03/2016, 7:02 PM

I don't regard Randolp's assist for Long as defining hoofball nor does it justify hoofball, that particular piece of artistry can fit into any type of football and be applauded as a brilliant piece of football.
Our options for playing "proper football" are limited and fragile. Mo'N is half hearted, as in not fully trusting it,
we only have a single player who can make it effectively work and Mo'N hasn't bothered blooding in a deputy.
But when it comes to hoofball, we have more options, hoofball plan A, B and C.
Teams we will be playing in the Euros are settled in their game for years
Most every team has a deputy if needed to run midfield, they don't radically shift from one tactic to another depending on who's available. When Raketic is out for the Czechs then the main man is Darida.
.

zero

30/03/2016, 7:59 PM

no ireland games now for two whole months but we'll be monitoring about 35 players even more so than usual.

and at the end of those 2 months a few really intense weeks where our collective focus will be at max levels.

can't wait.

Stuttgart88

30/03/2016, 8:55 PM

When Raketic is out for the Czechs then the main man is Darida.
.
Darida mist play a lot then because Rakitic is a Croat :)

O'Neill versus Trap?

Both like solid systems and mistrust real creativity
Both like, in an ideal world, the wide positions to provide a threat
O'Neill trusts full backs to get further forward
Trap started with the ball more in the deck, finished with only hoofball
O'Neill started confused, seemed to prefer hoofball, then added more nuance and flexibility
O'Neill prefers to press without the ball, Trap preferred to stand off
Trap responded to accusations of not looking beyond core players by picking and persisting with strange choices
O'Neill, so far, seems to be serious about blooding new players at the right time even if his extended squads include some dinosaurs
ONeill got a great result at just the right time for him /us

DannyInvincible

30/03/2016, 9:05 PM

think it was for the end of the Easter celebrations. Doubt we'll see it again

Also, the anthem was well sung, one of the best I can remember.

We had bagpipes before for a home game against Germany a few years back. Anthem was played with them and all.

Edit: Video here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kR7wh0dIRrg

tricky_colour

31/03/2016, 12:28 AM

Tricky's gonna faint when he sees this!

That is really bad luck, I don't really see how a keeper can injure himself doing next to nothing, same thing
happened with Jack Buckland for England. What is up with these keepers that they can barely walk without
injuring themselves? I had better luck with my bet but I am not allowed to comment on it. :emptiness:

SkStu

31/03/2016, 12:39 AM

That is really bad luck, I don't really see how a keeper can injure himself doing next to nothing, same thing
happened with Jack Buckland for England. What is up with these keepers that they can barely walk without
injuring themselves? I had better luck with my bet but I am not allowed to comment on it. :emptiness:

I'm sorry but I'm not buying any of that without some FIFA16 stats to back it up! ;)

Kingdom

31/03/2016, 12:55 AM

Charlie Darwin

31/03/2016, 1:39 AM

I'd love to see him try the three centre back's and wing-backs in a friendly.

Keogh O'Shea Clark

Coleman McCarthy Brady

Arter Hoolahan

Walters Long

Westwood Randolph Given

Coleman Christie Clark Keogh O'Shea Duffy Ward

McCarthy Whelan Arter Hendrick Hoolahan Brady Judge/McGeady McClean

Long Walters Keane
While I agree with you that three at the back is meant to provide more defensive stability, I'd still try and play with a goalkeeper, at least for the first half.

DeLorean

31/03/2016, 7:28 AM

I'd love to see him try the three centre back's and wing-backs in a friendly.

With the midfield diamond it pretty much frees up the space to allow Brady and Coleman to bomb forward anyway. The only difference is that instead of having three centre backs, we have an extra midfielder to try to close off the space vacated by the attacking full back(s). I've found with teams that have used the wing back formation (three centre backs), it only works for so long. Celtic under O'Neill and Liverpool under Roy Evans both enjoyed initial success, but after a while the opposition seem to be able to pick holes in it. That said, I was eager for O'Neill to try it out with us as well, because I thought it would suit our personnel, Coleman & Brady in particular, but I think he's come up with something better in this diamond shape. It allows us to get more of our best players on to the pitch and have a bit more solidity in midfield. Where do you see the potential advantages of a 5-3-2 (3-5-2)?