View Full Version : security for rovers match
the 12 th man
16/08/2004, 10:09 AM
does anybody know if there is any extra security measures in place for the cup match ?
we need extra gardai for a start,4 or 5 won't do.
the scenes at the last game cannot be repeated.
max power
16/08/2004, 10:13 AM
from what i've been told, the club have requested 50 stewards from the fai or rovers fans will not be allowed into the ground.
i know some people think this is not possible, but flancre park is private property after all.
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 10:14 AM
I think the FAI ae providing extra security plus I would think there will be significantly more gardai
WeAreRovers
16/08/2004, 10:16 AM
from what i've been told, the club have requested 50 stewards from the fai or rovers fans will not be allowed into the ground.
i know some people think this is not possible, but flancre park is private property after all.
Get real FFS. Maybe the fact that you have to split the gate would prompt such a stupid move. It would be Health and Safety insanity to lock out a potentially very large away support. Even Longford Town aren't that thick... or are they?
KOH
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 10:18 AM
I dont think it'll come to that. It's just a case of getting the FAI to take responsibility for security, which will probably suit ye too
max power
16/08/2004, 10:20 AM
here is a strange idea, if ya don't like it stay at.....eh home....
sorry but after the trouble of the last game money is not the main worry, health and safety is, of our fans within the ground.
having a half build ground for 3 years is thick, letting scum ruin the name of your club is thick......look closer to...home ( if ya had one ) before mentioning our club.
There's no way they can stop Rovers fans coming in anyway. Unless it's all ticket, with none on sale on the day, Rovers fans without colours will always get in.
Secondly, we need the money from the gate too much to consider a ban.
Thirdly, how many complaints about the stewards in Flancare does it take for Longford fans to accept that trouble isn't necessarily the fault of the away fans?
Certainly at the league game, if the Rovers fans had been let down the other end there would've been no trouble, and whatever about the incident that started the fighting, some stewards hardly helped calm the situation and infact repeatedly inflamed it.
max power
16/08/2004, 10:23 AM
macy why should they be let move ?? ya can't move in any other league, english, spain, italy.....away fans are put in a certain area.....just as we are in richmond when we play them....ya don't see us fighting about it..
sorry macy yes you can ban ANYONE from private property, simple legal fact....the money would be nice, but a stand needs to be taken by some club about the thug element within rovers, and why not us.
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 10:24 AM
Yeah our stewards can over-react alright but as regards last time the Rovers fans were told to stay behind the goals why did they insist on going down the other end, whats the point in having segregation if its just ignored. Thats just a small issue.I would think they'll all be let in the far side with our fans either going behind the goals or in the main stand
max power
16/08/2004, 10:25 AM
.I would think they'll all be let in the far side with our fans either going behind the goals or in the main stand
Section O ????????
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 10:26 AM
They may have to have another temporary home for the night, dont think its been decided yet though
max power
16/08/2004, 10:28 AM
on a seperate but slightly releated issue, will Section O have to move for the league cup final also....
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 10:31 AM
Dont know but I would guess they won't..
Segregation? You are taking the píss. A properly segregated area would mean no mixing between the fans. Not keeping them in an area that Town fans have to walk past (and vica versa if we're giving them the section O side) to go the jacks etc.
If we are going for the psuedo segregation, why give in to the trouble and let them move in the end? If it was that big an issue, the stewards and guards shouldn't have given in. If it wasn't that big an issue (as it isn't for every other club in the league), then they should've been let move in the first place and then there wouldn't have been any trouble. As far as I can remember they have been let move before, so why stop it for that game?
tbh It seems to me that it's all about people in the club/stand getting on the high horse - "they should do what they were told", when the people down the section O side had no problem with them changing ends, even after the trouble. I didn't see anyone move around the ground as a result of the Rovers fans being let down.
To me, the bottom line is either get the ground sorted so that proper segregation is doable - Seperate Entrance, Seperate Jacks, Seperate Shop, or treat the away fans with respect and let them swop ends if they want. The Club/Stewards/Guards let Rovers reputation proceed them, and made sure they got what they expected.
max power
16/08/2004, 10:54 AM
some good points there macy, but the simple fact remains that there was no seperate shop, etc for me either in richmond.....we are not the only club in this boat and improvments are needed.
the league cup final will be another one, will the away support be given a specific area, for example will section O have to move again, given the night and the athmosphere thatis needed that would be a crying shame.
plus the ground wasn't the only place rovers "fans" caused trouble on their last visit...but proper stewerds and training for them is needed badly in flancare and other EL grounds.
one question i would ask is what are the rovers board doing to stop this element with in their club, little from what i can see.
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 10:57 AM
There is a separate gate and there will be separate jacks and shop in place as there was for the UEFA game. The club wasnt blameless but it wasnt all their fault either, it wasnt handled right but hopefully it will be in future
the 12 th man
16/08/2004, 11:07 AM
lads i thinks its pointless who was/is to blame.
i have my own thoughts on it but the point should be that in the interest of safety that adequete security must be in place.
what longfordian has said regarding separate areas should help but the personnell must be there in case people(rowdies,from either side)show up looking for a digging match
WeAreRovers
16/08/2004, 11:13 AM
Contrary to popular belief Rovers fans don't "show up looking for a digging match" but when we are treated like scum we tend to react whether this is in Cork, Longford or anywhere else. The constant high horse nonsense from other fans doesn't help and only reinforces our seige mentality.
Check out my signature, it's there for a reason. Personally I hope and expect that there will be zero trouble on Saturday, my only worry is your new found form and our total crapness. :(
KOH
max power
16/08/2004, 11:21 AM
Contrary to popular belief Rovers fans don't "show up looking for a digging match" but when we are treated like scum we tend to react whether this is in Cork, Longford or anywhere else. The constant high horse nonsense from other fans doesn't help and only reinforces our seige mentality.
Check out my signature, it's there for a reason. Personally I hope and expect that there will be zero trouble on Saturday, my only worry is your new found form and our total crapness. :(
KOH
you don't care, thats the problem...what have your club done to root out these guys, i have heard they are involved in the 400 club so the club wont turf them out...
its amazing rovers never cause trouble at home ( no pun intended ), maybe someone might see them and something would be done...
they are a club with a lot of history and its a pity this element is destroying the good name of rovers, maybe if the fans actually cared instead of backing up this scum element, then the problem could be solved for good.
WeAreRovers
16/08/2004, 11:23 AM
you don't care, thats the problem...what have your club done to root out these guys, i have heard they are involved in the 400 club so the club wont turf them out...
its amazing rovers never cause trouble at home ( no pun intended ), maybe someone might see them and something would be done...
they are a club with a lot of history and its a pity this element is destroying the good name of rovers, maybe if the fans actually cared instead of backing up this scum element, then the problem could be solved for good.
Christ Almighty!! It's like talking to a brick wall. :rolleyes:
Macy, have a word with this chap will you?
KOH
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 11:24 AM
I believe a number of recognised trouble makers are banned from Richmond, that was part of the deal to let Rovers back in. Shouldnt be that hard to spot them at away games either, but I have to agree that we cause a lot of our own problems with them, as I'd imagine other clubs do too, in terms of handling them right
max power
16/08/2004, 11:25 AM
typical response, ignore all i asked. Me and Macy having a chat, not likely. ;)
max power
16/08/2004, 11:26 AM
why should we have to handle them, we don't have to "handle" shels or cork. But our stewards are badly trained, if trained at all.
the 12 th man
16/08/2004, 11:29 AM
Contrary to popular belief Rovers fans don't "show up looking for a digging match" but when we are treated like scum we tend to react whether this is in Cork, Longford or anywhere else. The constant high horse nonsense from other fans doesn't help and only reinforces our seige mentality.
Check out my signature, it's there for a reason. Personally I hope and expect that there will be zero trouble on Saturday, my only worry is your new found form and our total crapness. :(
KOH
if you check my post it says quite clearly from EITHER side.
absolutely no high horse in sight here i can tell you.
max power
16/08/2004, 11:32 AM
absolutely no high horse in sight here i can tell you.
yeah i heard your more of a pram man :D
Macy, have a word with this chap will you?
I try to avoid him WAR, tbh....
Longfordian, I tried not to imply it was all the clubs fault, infact I'd put it down to individual stewards/ guards as much as anything. However, the stewarding has been a constant complaint since our second season in the premier and has severally effected goodwill towards the club. There's been less trouble at previous Rovers matches in Flancare than there's been against Bohs, yet it's still Rovers Scum this, Rovers Scum that. IMO the alledged trouble involving Rovers fans in Tarmon totally influenced their treatment in the ground, and had people "up" for the trouble.
IMO, it's very hard to ban individuals from any club without prosecutions and banning orders (are they even over here?). They only work in England as they're made to sign in at a Police station at kick off time, although most grounds have a CCTV set up similar to the one the bogballers where going on about last week (if though they're the only ground in Europe to have a set up like that :rolleyes: ) Whatever about banning people from Richer, I remain to be convinced how it would operate league wide, and an totally against any bans without the offence being proven.
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 11:58 AM
Thats a very good point about the alleged trouble in Tarmon, it did put some stewards and Gardai on edge before the match now that I think of it. I suppose banning people from your ground for no reason except that they misbehaved at another ground wouldn't really be enforceable legally, I was thinking more of them being pointed out so you could keep an eye on them. To be honest I'd prefer to just look forward to the football match which given our improving form should give us a real chance of making the quarter finals again this year..
City Hero
16/08/2004, 1:18 PM
Thats a very good point about the alleged trouble in Tarmon, it did put some stewards and Gardai on edge before the match now that I think of it. I suppose banning people from your ground for no reason except that they misbehaved at another ground wouldn't really be enforceable legally, I was thinking more of them being pointed out so you could keep an eye on them. To be honest I'd prefer to just look forward to the football match which given our improving form should give us a real chance of making the quarter finals again this year..
Banning someone from the ground is enforceable, for any reason you like. I'm sure you have seen the phrase "the management reserve the right to refuse admission", it's probably on most tickets to anything you have tickets for. Although no matter how right you might be banning an individual supporter from any club, the reality is that it could cause more trouble if his (or her) buddies find out.
Can't imagine you being too brave on Saturday Macy. You'd run a mile ! But at least you'd be courteous about it.
Why should I be brave or otherwise, I don't have an illogical fear of Rovers fans! I have no more problems with Rovers fans, than with any other clubs. If they were treated the same as every other club that comes to Flancare, there wouldn't have been trouble the last time. If stewards hadn't kept going back in for more the trouble would've been over far quicker the last time too. If the guards had been nicking people that day, there would be Longford people charged as well as Rovers.
Bully boy tatics are what has tarnished the clubs image - everyone's impression of Rovers maybe of hooligan fans, but equally everyone's image of Longford is of over zealous stewards.
The opinion of people that side of the ground that day was "what were they doing not letting them through in the first place". That was people that would have to "suffer" them walking past us. It seems the people who have the biggest problem with all this are the yes men in the stand who won't/weren't anywhere near it in the first place.
max power
16/08/2004, 1:57 PM
[QUOTE=Macy]
everyone's image of Longford is of over zealous stewards.
QUOTE]
well said, heard it from fans of a lot of clubs.
[, but equally everyone's image of Longford is of over zealous stewards.
What do you expect when visiting fans come West looking for trouble ? If Town fans acted similarly, don't you think we'd get a similar reception at Tolka, Richmond, etc., etc. ? Do you honestly think Ollie wouldn't have a couple of heavies at the top of Richmond road ready to beat the living hell out of any of us out to cause trouble ?
Why should we be expected to lie down and let this thrash element walk all over us ? Would they be allowed do it in your beloved Old Trafford Macy ? Like hell !
That's right, every club comes to Longford looking for trouble. Including Galway who actually head east looking for trouble, or Derry who are coming South. What exactly did all these fans do to provoke the stewards? Mind you, they're right to be scared cos we have so many problems with the Dubs in McDowells/the Bohs Bars/The Shels bar etc. Can't set foot in them without being attacked. No wonder the stewards have to be vigilant.
Wouldn't happen at OT, as the policing/stewarding is professional (and if over zealous it's aimed at the home fans :rolleyes: ), and United fans wouldn't let it happen. However, I see few of the "crack down hard on the Rovers fans" brigade volunteering to steward for the game, just as there wasn't a mass exodus to "protect" all the "innocent" Longford fans that were involved in the trouble.....
ccfcman
16/08/2004, 2:56 PM
That's right, every club comes to Longford looking for trouble.
what?i go to the away matches with my fuppin dad and grandad and i dont remember causing havoc.
cork city fans regularly travel to longford and as my away trips a re curtailed to 2 or 3 a season i make the most of them and indeed lonford is a good place to go to,if anything the stewards take the pi$$ outta me :)
max power
16/08/2004, 2:58 PM
what?i go to the away matches with my fuppin dad and grandad and i dont remember causing havoc.
cork city fans regularly travel to longford and as my away trips a re curtailed to 2 or 3 a season i make the most of them and indeed lonford is a good place to go to,if anything the stewards take the pi$$ outta me :)
read macy's sig........
Longfordian
16/08/2004, 2:58 PM
I think you may have missed the tone of the post there ccfc ;)
what?i go to the away matches with my fuppin dad and grandad and i dont remember causing havoc.
Do you like my signature?
Bully boy tatics are what has tarnished the clubs image - everyone's impression of Rovers maybe of hooligan fans, but equally everyone's image of Longford is of over zealous stewards.
Who is this "everybody" you talk about?? Iv talked to fans from bohs, cork, derry, pats (all clubs basically) in the past in Longford and never has this great hatred of longford stewards being an issue.. Only last week i met 3 rovers fans on the way into town after the rovers waterford game in richmond park and they we re planning they re trip to longford for the cup asking me for places to stay etc. They said how they loved the away trip to longford and thought it was a great place to go..
So please man stop making such sweeping general statements with no basis in fact.
And if ur seriously blaming the stewards for the disgracful violence/coin throwing/general hooliganism that took place the last rovers match then u must be having a laugh :eek:
max power
16/08/2004, 4:12 PM
sorry it doesn't happen very often but i agree with a lot of macy's points. even as a town fan i've had a problem with the stewards in the past, if you've been a steward what trainng have you had in crowd management and control ???
ccfcman
16/08/2004, 4:15 PM
Do you like my signature?
*holds hands up*
:o :o :o :o :o
max power
16/08/2004, 4:35 PM
did you get any training from the club or were you just handed a jacket and told, keep the peace ????
you seen at the rovers game what a lack of training can do.
WeAreRovers
16/08/2004, 4:48 PM
So please man stop making such sweeping general statements with no basis in fact.
And if ur seriously blaming the stewards for the disgracful violence/coin throwing/general hooliganism that took place the last rovers match then u must be having a laugh :eek:
Read the first sentence, pause for a moment to let it sink in, then read the second sentence. :rolleyes:
KOH
Oh sorry, your right my mistake... that _was_ a big group of longford stewards huddled together in the corner of the ground showering coins onto Seanie Dillon any time he went to take a throw in down in that corner.
Well spotted :eek: :eek:
WeAreRovers
16/08/2004, 5:43 PM
"sweeping general statements with no basis in fact"
"the disgracful violence/coin throwing/general hooliganism that took place the last rovers match"
Can you see the point I'm trying to make? Is it sinking in? Will I keep repeating it for you? Are you bored yet? Have I asked enough questions? Am I wasting my time?
KOH
I have just read some of the posts regarding the security from the rovers game and I have never heard such a load of crap in all my life! :mad: People are talking about this issue as if they know something about it. Max Power blabbing on about 'professional training' should i enlighten you to the fact that we are not talking about the bloodly well special forces! better still we'll ring up the sas to ask for some 'training' tips max.I agree with Macy, there are a number of crazy over zealious stewards at Flancare,dragging down the name of the club.Next time you see something out of line report it, there is no point getting it off your chest on foot.ie Irrespective of this, I do not see the 'cribbers' on this forum willing to lend a diplomatic hand as a steward which they have been referring to anyway! :D This brings me onto my second point regarding the situation. I believe that much of the blame can be apportioned to the Rovers fans and the stewards but most of all to a number of Longford Town 'supporters'. (I normally go into the ground area for the games) One of the last times Rovers came down to Flancare I witnessed first-hand the root of this problem. One Town 'fan' who shall remain unnamed decided that the friendly banter between the two sets of supporters was too friendly. This meglomaniac idiot rose to their feet and proclaimed to the rovers contingent that they were a pack of drugdealing dublin scum and that they should go back home. Obviously this created some hassle and is not an isolated incident. Rovers do NOT have trouble-makers, they have a number of fans who persist in involving themselves in trouble often having been provoked in the first place.
With regard to the people in charge at Flancare, it is senseless having Longford fans passing in front of the rovers fans, as in the many hundreds that pass by the goal nearest the road, there is bound to be one snipe to come of the woodwork; will forget to keep their mouths under control; thereby creating hassle; thereby adopting a "protect-me im an innocent fan" watching a game caught up in hassle with these hooligans from rovers approach. As a result the real innocent town fans get dragged into a preventable mess, with the rest of the ground onlooking at the supposed hooligans in action when in fact, they have more often than not bee provoked.
For all those doubters of what I have just said, count the no. of references, on saturday,u hear that shall refer to the rovers fans as troublemakers etc. Just stop and think that it only takes one fool to provoke these people who are already on edge due to their reputation.Then you have a fight.
Incider
16/08/2004, 10:40 PM
here's the story for security on saturday nite. it's been siad that there may be up to thirty guards on duty at the game and also talk of a dog unit (beware) along with longford stewards and possibly some rovers stewards. most stewards have had training so don't be worryin about them and it was not them that caused the trouble at the last rovers game.. as for segregation, if the club could afford it, it would be done. they just haven't the funding at the moment, but it'll be done fairly soon.
i heard that the fai are footing the bill for a security company and the GARDAI will be there with the dogs.....ah the end of the day seems like a drastic measure. if people just keeps calm and dont treat rovers fans like they're all criminals, everything will be grand..........
max power
16/08/2004, 11:30 PM
Max Power blabbing on about 'professional training' should i enlighten you to the fact that we are not talking about the bloodly well special forces! better still we'll ring up the sas to ask for some 'training' tips max.I agree with Macy, there are a number of crazy over zealious stewards at Flancare,dragging down the name of the club.Next time you see something out of line report it, there is no point getting it off your chest on foot.ie .
flea, all people dealing with large crowds should have crowd control training, if only from an insurance point of view. Most of the stewards are ordinary working people who don't deal with situtiuons such as the rovers game, when it occur they haven't a clue what to do.
i reported 25 mins into the rovers game to a steward ( i have his number if u wish to know) that there were peoblems with the rovers fans which could be seen clearly by all, he don't me " to mind my own ****in business and sit down ".....classy act there for a start.
over zealious stewards, yes, if they were trained with how to deal with games like the rovers one, that wouldn't happen. i'll give you the numbers for the company who hold the contract for FAI games in Landsdown ( general security ) and the number of the personal team security if you wish to talk about crowd control etc.
no trouble makers in Rovers, well then the people in rovers jersies setting fire to a car outside my apartment in inchicore must have been a mirage then :rolleyes:
we all agree a simple sitution is to "house away fans on the oppisite side of the ground, but only with the correct facilities inplace for them.
Longfordian
17/08/2004, 12:03 AM
The latest I've heard, as of tonight is that the Rovers fans are going to be located in Sections I, J and K, i.e. either side of the gate at the far side. There will be toilet facilities, shop facilities and a chipper van all provided on that side for them. Also, the FAI stewards are being detailed to that area to take responsibility for the Rovers fans. Ideally, none of our stewards will be near the Rovers fans. The one thing that the club want to make clear is that they are asking all the Rovers fans to stay in their allocated sections and not try and go behind the far goals, much as ye might want to. Dont shoot the messenger on this one thats just what they have decided.
Our fans will be allowed as far as I know on that side but will probably have to go the long way around, i.e round by the stand, to the toilets and shop. There will be no dog unit on duty. Nobody wants or expects trouble but can the Rovers fans that dont want it either please pass along that you are being asked to stay in your allocated sections, anyone who tries to move on down risks being ejected. All the facilities and stewarding from the "trained pros" of the FAI are being provided for you so can we all just concentrate on the game
Dead right boots. As I said before, I've been a steward at Town games and never had a whiff of trouble.
Macy is just being an apologetic bore. Look, he just wants something to whine about. A dedicated man yoo fan, he realises they haven't a hope of winning ANYTHING this season - that's right - nothing, so he supports the TOWN. He's lucky he landed in Longford - imagine if he went to Monaghan, Kildare, Mullingar or Tullamore !!! He'd have the crack then. So, leave him be. He'll whinge wherever he goes. As you're passing the stewards on Saturday, give them a hug - poor buggers are bieng blamed for a lot these days. Next thing it'll be THEIR fault that our strikers aren't scoring !!
Great, so attack the poster not the post. Sign of a great debater :rolleyes:
At least we get to the bottom as to why the stewards can do no wrong.
Off the top of my head, clubs fans that have complained about the stewarding in Flancare - Bohs, Galway, Pats, Rovers, Dundalk, Drogheda, Derry. It's been an on going issue, which the club have recognised and it has been largely sorted out. However, mistakes were made against Rovers the last time - which the club admits, but you can't.
observer
17/08/2004, 9:08 AM
Last match of the season before last Rovers beat Longford 3 -2 to qualify for the Inter Toto. When the final whistle went Rovers fans invaded the pitch and one of them charged straight at a Longford player and tried to kick him. This was after winning, what would this guy do if they lost? Of course we acknowledge Rovers incredible and proud history and the fact that it is only a small element of supporters who are causing the trouble. However, it is up to you genuine Rovers fans to put the pressure on the committee to weed out this element. When this happens you will be welcomed with open arms by all clubs, as the additional gate money is badly wanted.
By the way any club who had Seanie Francis can't be all bad. :)
Albert
17/08/2004, 1:25 PM
I have to agree with Macy ive been following LOI for along time now and while I have no time for what a certain element of the Rovers fans did in Longford and in other grounds I have to admit that other clubs do complain about our stewards in Flansiro, I also have to say I rarely have found them overly helpful even to home fans, ask them something and I get the impression you are ****ing them off and disturbing them. I went inot Main stand for first time in quite a while for the Uefa match and the seating was all overthe place people seemed to sit where they like because no one could find their proper seats and the stewards wre unable to sort it. I know its not an easy job but other clubs supporters have made the point and I have to agree that sometimes our stewards foget they are there to SERVE the paying public not to act like they are in charge of everyone. :(
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