Republic of Ireland V Uruguay - Tuesday, 29th March 2011 - Friendly

[mark12345]

I assume by this you mean James should be in from the start? Couldn't agree more. It's nailed on now in midfield for me. McCarthy and Fahey in the middle of the middle with Duff and McGeady on the flanks. I'd have Robbie and Walters up front against Macedonia away (and in so doing would be really doing a disservice to Shane Long, because he has been nothing short of superb). But I just feel like we're going to need an aerial presence against them away.

McCarthy should be played in the Paul Scholes role, coming short for the defenders to pick up the ball, and Fahey is brilliant in a green shirt - holds the ball well and uses it brilliantly. To a man every one of the Irish players last Saturday said how good Macedonia were on the ball. When is Trap going to realise that he needs players who can hold possession as much as give it away (Dunne, O'Dea, O'Shea, Kilbane)?

[ifk101]

I thought Uruguay were as poor defensively as we were. But all in all more positives than negatives to take from last night's game.

Westwood had another competent performance.
I thought Kelly was our "best" defender on the night but as a defensive unit we were all at sea. Less positive about Foley starting for us based on the two games. O'Dea can fill a hole against medicore opposition, nothing more. Clark didn't have a good game.

Midfield - by his standards, I thought Green had a good game :). Fahey makes it all look so effortless, McCarthy was effectively double-marshalled by Uruguay's deep lying midfielders. Keogh and Lawrence both gave energetic performances, Lawrence's cross on his weaker foot for Long's goal was sublime.

Long played himself into contention again after a generally poor run out against Macedonia.

Happy we tried something new formation wise. Two more friendly games before the trip to Macedonia - so ample opportunity to get the defence into shape.

[Stuttgart88]

Just watching the highlights on RTE, if Fahey's early shot had gone in off the keeper's gloves, instead of looping over the bar, how different would the game have been?
[/IMG]

Yes, we'd have pressed our advantage home like we always do! I think we play better when behind. Bari, Paris...

[PatJR]

I think Green's performance was down to having the three in midfield. I would speculate that Whelan would have looked better in that system too. 4-5-1 makes a lot of sense for us but picking one from Long, Doyle and Keane is not an easy decision.

[Stuttgart88]

For those who think that Robbie Keane should be dropped, consider this - with him in the side either of Keogh's chances would have been converted. I don't think he should be dropped but Keogh's header was very similar to the header Robbie missed late against Czech Rep., where he failed to anticipate the defender (keeper?) missing the ball, and sent a tame header wide of an open goal.

Keogh's second miss wasn't as bad as Robbie's miss in Slovakia, a near identical situation when Long sent in a sumptuous low cross. Keogh had less time to react than Keane.

Good point about the arm waving though.

Just saying :)

[tetsujin1979]

I don't think he should be dropped but Keogh's header was very similar to the header Robbie missed late against Czech Rep., where he failed to anticipate the defender (keeper?) missing the ball, and sent a tame header wide of an open goal.

Keogh's second miss wasn't as bad as Robbie's miss in Slovakia, a near identical situation when Long sent in a sumptuous low cross. Keogh had less time to react than Keane.

Good point about the arm waving though.

Just saying :)
Fair enough, I'd forgotten those misses. After seeing Keane's goal at the weekend, I think he might be becoming more of predatory striker as he enters the latter stages of his career, and I think he would have done better than Keogh.

[elroy]

Good game, well worth the trip to LR. Not getting into the issue of tickets but from an optical point of view it doesnt look good. There may well have been 20k at the match but nonetheless FAI should consider closing tiers for friendlies if its going to be like this. At least concentrate the crowds in certain areas.

Long played very well and my god did he look fast. All positives from him......pushing for a start.

Westwood, another solid performance, some good saves and he is good in the air. Another pushing for a start.

Defensively we were quite poor but then the back 4 was very makeshift. Clark/Foley did ok. I wondered if O'Dea was good the other night because Dunne was beside him and I suspect so. Dunne will be a big loss away to Macedonia, we will need JOSH and Sledge available for that.

Green and Fahey did ok, I would argue they looked more composed as a pairing than the two lads on sat night.

McCarthy was only alright, didnt get involved as much as I would like. But the lad is very young, lets give him time. Im now starting to think Fahey and McCarthy may not work in the middle just yet. Any thoughts on this? I just feel that neither is particularly good at breaking up play, both are good on the ball but dont ask me why this keeps coming into my head but remember the CM pairing of Kilbane and Ireland in Cyprus??

Disappointed with Lawrence, one of my favourite Irish players and bar the cross the goal I thought it offered little considering he should be pushing for a place in the team. Very slack from him for their third goal.

Keogh was ok, but I dont think a realistic option at his current level.

Uruguay looked a very good team, very slick passing, great finishing. Not surprised they got as far as they did in the WC.

[DeLorean]

I don't think he should be dropped but Keogh's header was very similar to the header Robbie missed late against Czech Rep

It looked to me like Keogh was afraid of smacking into the post. Any one of us would just love to take a smack off a post to score a goal for Ireland!

[DeLorean]

I think Green's performance was down to having the three in midfield. I would speculate that Whelan would have looked better in that system too. 4-5-1 makes a lot of sense for us but picking one from Long, Doyle and Keane is not an easy decision.

It was a 4-4-1-1, I wouldn't use the three central midfielders argument to take away from Green's ok performance. McCarthy was so far forward he couldn't be seen to have contributed in midfield.

[OwlsFan]

Let's not tip toe around some issues. Clark had a terrible game as a defender. He was caught out of position on a number of occasions and but for Keogh scampering back to try and plug the gap, it could have been far worse. He also drifted inside a lot. McCarthy was for the most part anonymous. Neither player did anything to suggest they are worth a place in the side. Ok, they were playing in a new team and I have no doubt they will get better but on the basis of what I saw, their time has not yet come.

Only two positives for me. Long and Fahey. Whether Fahey can defend, I am not convinced but creatively he is better than either Gibson or Whelan.

[Stuttgart88]

It looked to me like Keogh was afraid of smacking into the post. Any one of us would just love to take a smack off a post to score a goal for Ireland!

There might have been a bit of that, but I watched it just now on SKY and it looks like he just couldn't wrap his head around the ball. He was standing parallel to the goalline whereas he needed to be facing 45 degrees to his right, which he might have been had he anticipated Green missing the ball.

My main memory from watching it in real time was that we shipped an awful lot of chances, but having watched it again it's got to be said so did they. Long made a bit of a botch of the rebound from Keogh's shot, Keogh's misses, Treacy's shot. If you ewatch the incident that led to Keogh's miss, Delaney was practically rugby tackled to the ground and the time Long went down under a challenge - that could have been given. Houghton said in the commentary that it was the defender just being stronger. It was just as much a shove.

Anyway, at least last night showed who we can rely on and who we can't.

[Stuttgart88]

Let's not tip toe around some issues. Clark had a terrible game as a defender. He was caught out of position on a number of occasions and but for Keogh scampering back to try and plug the gap, it could have been far worse. He also drifted inside a lot. McCarthy was for the most part anonymous. Neither player did anything to suggest they are worth a place in the side. Ok, they were playing in a new team and I have no doubt they will get better but on the basis of what I saw, their time has not yet come.

Only two positives for me. Long and Fahey. Whether Fahey can defend, I am not convinced but creatively he is better than either Gibson or Whelan.Westwood not a positive?

I agree with you on Clark & McCarthy. Clark was poor, McCarthy was neither good nor bad, he just never really figured.

[Tipp Townie]

Thanks for all the comments lads. Just watched the goals on Youtube but otherwise i'm relying totally on foot.ie! Really helpful and interesting reading as always.

Their second goal looked like a bit of a shambles by us. Its 5 v 7 and yet they manages to find Cavani in acres of space to tuck it away. To be honest though, with such an inexperienced back 4 who've never played together, i'm not surprised to see/hear that there were frailties. Was always going to happen.

I'll admit i'm completely biased when it comes to Long, but its still great to hear everyone raving about his performance. Some players like/suit international football, and some don't. Even when he wasn't starting regularly at Reading he still looked to me like he could cut it in a green shirt. He must have a pretty good scoring record for us now?

There were some negatives and some positives from last night, but all in all this was a great opportunity for the second stringers to have a run out v a really decent team. There's no shame in losing 3-2 to the WC semi finalists with the team we put out (though the fact that they also lost 0-2 to Estonia does slightly detract from that point!)

[geysir]

Uruguay used their reserve goalkeeper for the game again Estonia and he was at a fault for both goals.

[paul_oshea]

Ok so all of us were wrong about somethings, but most wont admit it bar me. :D

Long i wasn't sure about and thought I had been justified given his relatively poor performance against macedonia, perhaps the knock and the bandage around his head interfered with his sight, because his timing on saturday for rising to head the ball was very poor. 1 bad performance but 1 great performance, jury still out for me but I definitely wouldn't be worried about throwing him in for the last 30 minutes in Macedonia if we need a goal.

keogh was out on teh wing but he came in a lot yesterday so i dont buy this lets feel sorry for him, he is still so slight and meek looking, perhaps if he built himself up he might be better, but he looked like a boy against men last night, his touch was dire so many times he took the wrong option and was afraid to get hurt when it mattered.

O'dea is not up to scratch simple as, as usual clouded judgement on a 20 min period in the second half against a tiring Uruguay forwad line who took their foot off the gas. He had kelly in first half running all over the place trying to cover his lapses. Simple against a decent quick, athletic and agile forward line he is shocking i.e. Not international standard.

Clark was too eager to impress going forward that he forgot about his defensive duties, but if he went forward then keogh should have been willing to go back. HIs positional sense was very poor, but thats something that will come with playing the position regularly. I also thought he didnt commit to that challenge based on what Trap said about giving away a penalty etc. A lot to learn defensively but thats not a problem thats easily learned, he has far more skill than kilbane has and he doesn't hoof it forward, which isn't learned its natural ability.

Fahey is not good enough defensively but he always turns into space and holds the ball up that second longer especially when facing goal, in order to create more space and bring about a quick pass to midfield or the wings, so unlike green. He creates a great outlet and is a great reader, more importantly he doesn't panic.

Green tries hard.

Mcgeady sprayed the ball about briliantly when he came into the middle and started to run the show. Perhaps EB has been right all along about this one...

I think we are all agreed that if we could find the right DM then fahey is the obvious partner.

Keogh is a nice lad.

Foley proved what many of us were afraid of and that he is suspect defensively good going forward and playing on the ground but he gets caught out. I think all this shows Wolves problem this year really, Ward being another fine example.

What i really think we are missing now is a really competent Defensive midfielder or a midfielder with Faheys ability going forward and whelans tackling(as limited as it is) which leads to Stephen Reid.

Mccarthy couldn't get into the game, but I put that down to trust from the CMs and also from the game played by westwood who kept hoofing it forward, he never really got a chance, i still think he should have dropped deeper to try and get more involved and influence things, but when he was involved he looked good.

Good to see some humility from Trap, and good to see that he gaves stokes and delaney game time after calling them up last minute, shows a good side to Trap.

So all in all, I have a slightly different view of how Trap sees things now, and for a lot of it he is right.

[geysir]

Post match comment.
Stephen Kelly who spoke of his pride in leading out the Boys in Green in his home town.
"Being from Dublin and growing up watching Ireland and playing for your country, for me is the epitome of everything, the highest accolade you can achieve in football.
"And then, to be captain ... it has just been a spectacular day for me. I can't wait to look back on it. This is such a huge honour and I am so privileged to be allowed do it."

[ifk101]

I was thinking of reading your post paul_oshea but after reading your earlier contributions to the thread, I changed my mind. :)

[paul_oshea]

No worries Ifk101, you probaby wouldn't understand it anyway :)

[DeLorean]

McCarthy was neither good nor bad, he just never really figured.

I really rate McCarthy and I think his anonymity was more down to being played out of position than anything else. That said, he should have tried to impose himself on the game more. I think he could have dropped a bit deeper at times trying to link things up, I'm sure Trap would have allowed this. When a player isn't involved it has to go down as a bad performance surely? Doing nothing wrong because you've barely touched the ball is ok for a centre back or goalkeeper, but for an attacking midfielder it's just poor. I'm sure he'll have better days ahead, I just hope Trap isn't too rigid with regards to playing him off the front man, where he didn't look really comfortable.

[drummerboy]

Post match comment.
Stephen Kelly who spoke of his pride in leading out the Boys in Green in his home town.
"Being from Dublin and growing up watching Ireland and playing for your country, for me is the epitome of everything, the highest accolade you can achieve in football.
"And then, to be captain ... it has just been a spectacular day for me. I can't wait to look back on it. This is such a huge honour and I am so privileged to be allowed do it."

Very refreshing statement from Kelly. He didn't complain about being played out of position, he just got on with it. Its a pity other fellow countrymen didn't have the same attitude.

[Stuttgart88]

It was a good post.

I'm not sure we're arguing the same point on O'Dea. I don't think he's international standard either and would be quite happy if he never had to be capped again. However, with no fit high-standard CB available to partner Dunne, O'Dea was certainly not a ridiculous choice, and luckily for us he did his job well on Saturday. Last night O'Dea played OK for parts of the game but was exposed sufficiently to show his limitations. I think the same could be said of all the back 4, and if I could erase the memory of Georgia at home I'd be inclined to rank Kelly ahead of Foley at RB, but lack of game-time is a major worry.

Do people think Delaney should keep his squad place? I do.

[paul_oshea]

He didn't have to do an awful lot did he in fairness? I thought he looked a bit heavy. But he kept his position better than clark, still he is 28 or so isn't he? If its him or clark then you have to stick with clark given his age.

Ya of course if you don't have anyone else available then you have to select him. Perhaps the opinion has changed on him? Or perhaps I mistook people advocating his selection and saying it was justified for saying he was a competent and capable defender?

I think the fact he made kelly captain, was for his age and experience and that georgia game showed nerves and a lack of experience as he didn't show a cool head. I think I would have kelly there too ahead of foley. I suppose it shows that ousdie our first choice back 4(even then ) we are very weak really.

[ifk101]

No worries Ifk101, you probaby wouldn't understand it anyway :)

Can't disagree with that. :)

[paul_oshea]

I think you have IFk ;D where is the winkie smiley gone? Where is the fly when you need him...

[jbyrne]

Uruguay used their reserve goalkeeper for the game again Estonia and he was at a fault for both goals.

also, the pitch was awful with snow etc

[ifk101]

I think you have IFk ;D where is the winkie smiley gone? Where is the fly when you need him...

I've gotten down to the part where you say "Keogh is a nice lad". That can be interpreted in many ways. Especially after saying this previously;

"keogh was out on teh wing but he came in a lot yesterday so i dont buy this lets feel sorry for him, he is still so slight and meek looking, perhaps if he built himself up he might be better, but he looked like a boy against men last night, his touch was dire so many times he took the wrong option and was afraid to get hurt when it mattered."

[paul_oshea]

Ok well seeing as you read it i think you deserve a reply :)

Keogh comes across as a really nice lad, in any interviews or whatever ive seen of him, and he has gone to a lot of the lads weddings ive noticed in the press(and Paul Mcshanes sister i think too :)), he is obviouslly a good addition to have around the squad - whatever he offers morale, motivation, good craic -and Trap obviouslly likes him. And I feel that its almost this loyalty and whatever he offers around the place might see him being unfairly picked ahead of other players, given how poor his performances have been for us. The other point about not feeling sorry for him I meant as in because he was being played out of position, as he came in quite a lot and i think it was more in the second half he was out on the left.

[ifk101]

I didn't think Keogh had a bad game all things considered. As mentioned earlier in the thread he helped alot with covering Clark defensively, got himself into the box on a few occasions and can count himself unlucky not to have gotten a goal.

Given the players we started the game with, I would have moved McCarthy into Fahey's position, Fahey to the left and Keogh into McCarthy's position behind Long. Fahey is much better in the center but he is more effective on the left to Keogh based on previous performances. Keogh's best when playing "in the hole" while McCarthy looked like he had never played in that position before.

[geysir]

I'd have no issues with O'Dea still being the reserve CH.
It's a partnership and even if Dunne wasn't as sharp on Saturday, there is a world of difference to a rookie like O'Dea if he has Dunne by his side in an important qualifier than without any experienced partner, like last night.

Are both O'Dea and St Ledger left sided CH's?

[paul_oshea]

Did Dunne not play left side first half anyway against macedonia?

I see the point re: Odea but wasnt the reasoning behind Traps selection put forward that he had experience playing in CL etc and that he is 24 years of age now, that he is no longer a rookie? By rookie do you mean that he isn't of the same standard and games behind his belt as Dunne? Or a young inexperienced newbie? Either way he has been around the Irish squad and Celtic a fair time now, over 2 years with Ireland and with celtic since 2006(senior appearance i think).

[geysir]

I see the point re: Odea but wasnt the reasoning behind Traps selection put forward that he had experience playing in CL etc and that he is 24 years of age now, that he is no longer a rookie? By rookie do you mean that he isn't of the same standard and games behind his belt as Dunne? Or a young inexperienced newbie?
Do most things have to spelt (spelled) out?
O'Dea is a more experienced rookie then. Age is not an accurate guideline to CH maturity.
At what age was Dunne trusted to be our CH? He was 22 or 23 at WC2002 and still Mick went with an unattached player and Stan.


Either way he has been around the Irish squad and Celtic a fair time now, over 2 years with Ireland and with celtic since 2006(senior appearance i think)
Which is why Trap went went him in an important game over Clark.
Any young player who has not played competitively for us can be considered a rookie and more so in O'Dea's case as you pointed out, his club record of starts this season is not exactly overwhelming. .

[Noelys Guitar]

Barring injuries very few players starting last night are going to start against Macedonia. Still going to be
Westwood
Foley, O'Shea, St Ledger, Kilbane
Duff, Whelan, Gibson, McGeady
Doyle, Keane

Foley is probably the one most at risk of losing his place. Coleman might feature at right full when he comes back in the upcoming games. Green might replace Gibson. Doyle should be back to near full fitness come Macedonia. There is also the possibility O'Hara might stop *****ing around and declare (Trap and Tardelli to meet him this week possibly). Otherwise I see the 11 I have selected starting against Macedonia.

[paul_oshea]

Do most things have to spelt (spelled) out?
O'Dea is a more experienced rookie then. Age is not an accurate guideline to CH maturity.
At what age was Dunne trusted to be our CH? He was 22 or 23 at WC2002 and still Mick went with an unattached player and Stan.


Which is why Trap went went him in an important game over Clark.
Any young player who has not played competitively for us can be considered a rookie and more so in O'Dea's case as you pointed out, his club record of starts this season is not exactly overwhelming. .

Yes it does, I have had to dumb down mine for you to understand, but it looks like I didn't go far enough. I wanted to know what you mean by the term rookie. Dunne was not trusted at that stage because he was still a messer and had severe lapses in concentration, but he showed he had the ability just required full concentration and to sort himself out. I would not say O'dea has shown the same.

Rookie has less to do with age in my opinion than experience, and as you say O'Dea hasn't got any of that really because most managers don't seem to rate him either.

[ifk101]

O'Hara ??? :rolleyes:

JoSH has to play in the center in Dunne's absence. The players that came in didn't do enough to stake a claim for the doc's and Kilbane's places in the team. Foley must likely to start at RB, Kelly might come back into the reckoning for that position. I think Trapattoni sees Coleman as a right midfielder rather than a defender.

The only other position in the team up for grabs is Whelan's partner in the center. I think Fahey and Gibson are ahead of Green in the reckoning at this stage. McCarthy and possibly Andrews (depending on his injury situation) are the other options.

Despite Long's good form Doyle and Keane are first choice. Robbie gets the goals and I can't find fault with Doyle's performances in a green jersey - he is consistently one of our better players when he plays.

[paul_oshea]

Ifk101 i was going to read your post but I just couldn't be arsed :D Only joking

I think if we take the lead in Macedonia with 20 mins or so to go to ensure we close out the game then taking keane off and putting on mccarthy might be an option. Pack the midfield i mean because without the ball I don't see us not conceding.

[Duggie]

i think long should get the nod over doyle for the next game. Long is just as good in the air as doyle, holds the ball up just as well but crucially is a goal threat. Doyle isnt, and never really has been. as much as we all love him id like to see what a keane/long partnership could bring for a few games.

[Wolfie]

Barring injuries very few players starting last night are going to start against Macedonia. Still going to be
Westwood
Foley, O'Shea, St Ledger, Kilbane
Duff, Whelan, Gibson, McGeady
Doyle, Keane

Andrews should be available for selection in June???? I think he'd have Gibson under pressure for that midfield slot given the fact its an away game. Trapp could be in "don't lose" mode.

It would be great to see Stephen Reid back - although its wishful thinking. He was brilliant against Montenegro away in the last campaign, and it would be great to see him available to reprise that role in Macedonia.

If Doyle is injured - Long's emergence is more than welcome and he should slot in alongside Keane.

All said - right now, barring injuries, there's options. We haven't always had that luxury.

[Stuttgart88]

That was part of Trap's reasoning. The other part was that he was a "stopper" (and Clark by implication more of a Gary Breen) and that's what he wanted beside Dunne. That's what he got.

I'm not sure exactly what he meant by rookie, but by any definition Clark is more of one than O'Dea.

O'Dea is certainly left-footed so I'd guess he plays left-sided CB.

Geysir, if SSL was injured and Dunne available, would you move JOS into the middle and bring in a new RB, or would you leave JOS at RB and pick O'Dea? Let's say we're talking about both Russia away and Slovakia at home.

[ifk101]

Ifk101 i was going to read your post but I just couldn't be arsed :D

That's alright paul_oshea. I would have simplified it if I thought you were going to read it. Wouldn't want that arse of yours getting a headache.

[Kingdom]

Last night was a great night if you were in the stadium, and more specifically in the Lower Lansdowne end. Great atmosphere. If they closed off the upper tier for the friendlies it would make a big difference. Can't wait to watch the full repeat this evening.

As for the game - first things first. I cannot remember seeing a faster opposing team at Lansdowne. They were a seriously quick team, quick in mind, quick in body, quick in possession. A very experienced team too, something in marked contrast to our team. They're probably the best team we've hosted in Lansdowne for quite a while too - even taking into account the lack of competitive edge. And for all that for large parts of the game we were equal to them and kept possession as good as them.
The change in formation was nice, but I think he got a couple of selections wrong, Andy Keogh being one, and Lawrence the other, in spite of a superb assist for the first goal. I find it frustrating that he didn't opt for the similar player to Duff in Keith Treacy, but picked Andy Keogh who clearly cannot play wide on either flank. It totally unbalanced the team, and I didn't think it helped Clark either. Lawrence wasn't terrible, and he has been a decent asset for Ireland since breaking through; but I feel he is now firmly behind McGeady/Duff and I'd nearly say Coleman for the right hand slot (I say this based on the type of game we should be looking from our wingers).
Yesterday I was happy Kelly was played cb to allow Clark a run on the left, that decision hasn't changed today as Clark's performance wasn't hectic and maybe that will curb some of my(our) enthusiasm to have Clark placed on a pedestal too soon. Still, I would like to see him get more game time alongside something close to a first choice centre half partnership.
That said, the back 4 was cobbled together, and there was always a likelihood that they could struggle against a top quality front line like Uruguay. Like other posters I was disappointed that Delaney flitted away in recent times, without doing too much wrong, maybe that was down to injuries, dropping down etc, but he is definitely worthy to be considered a contender - something Stephen Ward surely deserves at this stage too.
I didn't think Foley had a bad game, he is another worth persisting with. I think what is good about him getting time is that it creates the possibility of moving JOSH into the centre, something I'd be a big advocate of, provided the right back is as competent (I think Foley is). I could be going against the grain here, but I think one thing to take from the two new full backs is that both are comfortable on the ball, and both look to use the ball rather than give possession away. Eagerness and lack of experience will cause problems initially, but that's something that can be learned.
Fahey for me showed the best performance from a central midfield player since Whelan in Paris. He deserves a run there. I think himself and Whelan could work in the short term, and I definitely think himself and McCarthy could compliment each other very well in the near future. Gibson was poor. Green was himself, but not nearly as bad as I expected.
Long was excellent, and I agree totally with anyone who says that he is now firmly in for a starting role. Despite being our greatest goalscorer, for me he is in direct competition with Keane, as he's sharp enough in the box, but has the aerial threat that Robbie doesn't have. He is a real candidate now.
Westwood deserves his place now. I do care about reputations, but for a super-important position like nets, if the incumbent is showing how capable he is, and he has an attribute that we've lacked for a while - a keeper in command of his area - then he deserves to keep his place if his predecessor has been out of action for a season and injured also - it's a no-brainer.
Finally McGeady, he's first choice now, no doubts about it. Anyone who doubts that isn't judging the fella fairly.

[paul_oshea]

You make some very good points kingdom, paricularly the one about the formation change being nice to see, but it was let down by a couple of bad selection decisions. We could have come out witht he draw I reckon had this not been the case.

[Kingdom]

Geysir, if SSL was injured and Dunne available, would you move JOS into the middle and bring in a new RB, or would you leave JOS at RB and pick O'Dea? Let's say we're talking about both Russia away and Slovakia at home.

I know you asked Geysir, but I might comment too if that's ok?
If everyone is fit, and able come Slovakia at home
I'd have
Foley ---- OShea---Dunne----LB

[BonnieShels]

Brady could never play there! You're mad.

[DeLorean]

Green was himself, but not nearly as bad as I expected

Does this mean he's always better than you expect?

[Kingdom]

You make some very good points kingdom, paricularly the one about the formation change being nice to see, but it was let down by a couple of bad selection decisions. We could have come out witht he draw I reckon had this not been the case.

It was let down by necessary team selections. Was it more important last night to give Clark a run at Left back and have a weaker centre back partnership in order for him to get (even a chastening) experience in the position identified for him in the relatively short term? Or was it more important to have a solid 4, with little chance of further selection, and a left full (kelly) with little chance of becoming first choice?

[Kingdom]

Does this mean he's always better than you expect?

:D Not quite! I anticipated that he'd be utter garbage. I figured I'd be screaming blue murder about him, but didn't feel he did too bad. Having Fahey as a constant option of an out ball definitely helped.

Still want to watch the full game again though, so that opinion might change by tomorrow. ;)

[paul_oshea]

It was let down by necessary team selections. Was it more important last night to give Clark a run at Left back and have a weaker centre back partnership in order for him to get (even a chastening) experience in the position identified for him in the relatively short term? Or was it more important to have a solid 4, with little chance of further selection, and a left full (kelly) with little chance of becoming first choice?

Nope im talking about keogh on the right wing.

I mentioned on here that for Villa, Clark was very poor in the centre against City, so although I would have liked to have seen him in the centre with Dunne, there was no way it could happen with the likes of O'Dea

[DeLorean]

:D Not quite! I anticipated that he'd be utter garbage. I figured I'd be screaming blue murder about him, but didn't feel he did too bad. Having Fahey as a constant option of an out ball definitely helped.

Still want to watch the full game again though, so that opinion might change by tomorrow. ;)

I think he gets undeserved abuse to be honest. He's actually very popular amongst the Derby supporters and he plays a very different midfield role for them. He's pretty much a box to box player but contributes more offensively. He is being asked to play a defensive role for us and I don't think it comes naturally, but I couldn't fault his endeavour. That said, I would much prefer to see McCarthy or Fahey in there, although I would suggest the defensive side of things might not come so naturally to them either. Andrews has played the role effectively enough for us I think. I'd take Green over Gibson in a heartbeat.

[Kingdom]

Nope im talking about keogh on the right wing.

I mentioned on here that for Villa, Clark was very poor in the centre against City, so although I would have liked to have seen him in the centre with Dunne, there was no way it could happen with the likes of O'Dea

Andy played on the left did he not? I agree with the sentiment - I'd have had McGeady and Treacy on the flanks for what it's worth. I actually think it was a big mistake not to have started Treacy last night. I think he could be very useful for us given Duffer is going to be coming to the end of his career (even taking into account the existence of Stephen Hunt)

[Stuttgart88]

I think Geysir's conspiracy theory wrt new formation might hold water! Trap can point to no improvement and some people will be too thick to realise that the formation didn't contain players suited to the roles they were allocated.