League format 2011-2012

[colonelwest]

Neither point hold any water, as the points gained were against teams in their own side of the split.

Motherwell played Rangers, Celtic and Dundee who hammered them. They managed a draw against the two other top 6 teams, Kilmarnock and Hearts.

Caley Thistle won 5 of their 6 games after the split, against bottom half teams. They did beat Celtic 3-2 at home in the middle of that, but it was a re-arranged fixture from before the split.

In the north, Distillery had to play Linfield, Crusaders, Glentoran, Cliftonville (the only team that didn't beat them) and Portadown.

Coleraine, Dungannon and Ballymena played each other, as well as the bottom three of Glenavon, Donegal Celtic and Newry who hadn't won a game since 2010.


I'd agree with you for being with the split but would have to agree with the poster who points out that points earned in the lower half were against tougher opposition.

The Dane's have a 12 team top division. The Danish league is having decent success in Europe. The top two teams from their league will enter the Champions League qualifiers. They've shown 12 teams playing 3 times a season can work. The LoI had that before, there's no reason why that format can't be brought back. There is a slight imbalance in terms of the number of home and away games. The Danish system for dealing with that is that the prise for finishing in the top 6 is being rewarded the extra home game for the following season.

Agreed on the first point lads, forgot to mention it myself but having said that it does make for some strange outcomes with the table come the end of the season which on first glance looks ridiculous. The main issue with a split I have is that a team (or teams) could still be in with a shout for European football come the last 5 games and then the split happens and they're left playing for nothing for the rest of the season, it makes the table lob sided on both sides of it. The thing with having such a small league is that mid table is pretty much an illusion and you could theoretically be within touching distance of Europe or the relegation play offs on either side at the time the 33rd game rolls around. A 33 game season with the extra home game the following year is probably the best idea of a bad bunch. The one thing we have over here to play around with is the length of the off season break which is one of the longest in Europe, bar the Scandinavian countries for obvious reasons, with a 12 team league the start should be dropped back a week or two and the end extended a week or two to avoid congestion and space the fixtures out so you don't end up with 4 or 5 away games on the hop as happens with the way things are.

One thing I would like to see brought in is the Dutch idea of a play off for the final European spot, slightly different from a split and something would have to be done about the lower teams but sure there's no easy answers!

[legendz]

The Dutch have a good system with that play-off. I think you'd need at least 16 in the top flight to make it work. When a 12 team Premier comes in, I hope a 12 team 1st Division can be formed as well. Generally across Europe the league structure is that the second level should have the same amount if not more clubs than the top division. The point is that there is a certain number of playing pool in the second tier and at the top level then the number of the playing pool is the same, if not less but it will be the elite players. It's one of the reason I go on about the A championship or any 3rd tier. A strong league needs a strong second and third tier as well.

[JM2010]

Hasn't there been alot of talk that the 4 non reserve side's in the A Championship are going to be incorporated into the league next season? This would mean a total of 25 teams in the league. Would this result in a 12 team Premier and 13 team First Division?

[legendz]

Heggy's generally the man that has all the answers regards the way things are going to shape up. Personally I think they should go with 12 and 12, with an optional reserve division where aspiring clubs can be involved as well. Anyways, I'm sure we'll get the official word at some stage over the next few months.

[peadar1987]

Heggy's generally the man that has all the answers regards the way things are going to shape up. Personally I think they should go with 12 and 12, with an optional reserve division where aspiring clubs can be involved as well. Anyways, I'm sure we'll get the official word at some stage over the next few months.

You still don't get this FAI thing, do you? ;)

[colonelwest]

One of the lads on orielweb was saying that the split is due to happen after 22 games next season, so after two rounds. How true that is I don't know but although it would give an even amount of home and away games the reptition would be as bad if not worse than it currently is.

[holidaysong]

One of the lads on orielweb was saying that the split is due to happen after 22 games next season, so after two rounds. How true that is I don't know but although it would give an even amount of home and away games the reptition would be as bad if not worse than it currently is.

It was mentioned in this Irish Independent article at the time of the decision being taken:


There are currently 10 teams in the top flight, and that is now set to rise by two for the 2012 campaign. It is envisaged they will each play each other twice before the league splits into two after 22 games, with the teams in the respective halves encountering each other twice more in the final run-in.

22 +10 = 32 games.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/top-flight-expansion-set-to-be-capped-at-12-teams-2434748.html

[BonnieShels]

It was mentioned in this Irish Independent article at the time of the decision being taken:



22 +10 = 32 games.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/top-flight-expansion-set-to-be-capped-at-12-teams-2434748.html

So let's have a 16 team division in that case and let everyone play each other twice and stop the nonsense of multiple games.

[Dodge]

Is two not a multiple?

It's been at least 3 for the past 25 years.

[peadar1987]

Everyone plays each other once at home, once away, and the third game as part of a "magic weekend", to be held in Termonbarry, with monkey knife fights at half time, and Xano as ref. If I could work Paul Doolin's weight into it somehow, we'd have a full set of foot.ie memes!

[SwanVsDalton]

Everyone plays each other once at home, once away, and the third game as part of a "magic weekend", to be held in Termonbarry, with monkey knife fights at half time, and Xano as ref. If I could work Paul Doolin's weight into it somehow, we'd have a full set of foot.ie memes!

Greg O'Halloran's Pat Dolan impression as between game entertainment.

[thischarmingman]

A Mypost flypast.

[peadar1987]

A Mypost flypast.

In a direct bus of some description.

[marinobohs]

A Mypost flypast.

Would this be confined to Sligo fans ? and would it be timed ? ;)

[culloty82]

Now that the FAI have told the non-League clubs that the A Championship is gone, could be a 13-team First Division next year, but even that would be on the basis that Galway can get a new licence and discounting the regular rumour that Salthill are going back to junior football.

[Mr A]

Will Cobh be in a fit state to step up again? Some of the indications from Cobh posters have been pretty negative.

Not sure whether Fanad will look to step up but they probably could if they wanted to. Can anyone offer any insight on the situation with Carlow or Tralee?

[Ezeikial]

Now that the FAI have told the non-League clubs that the A Championship is gone,

The FAI have been remarkably coy about next season.

Most people seem to drifting along on the assumption that the FAI will have 3 up and 1 down between the first and premier, and now the debate moves on to the number of teams in next years first division.

This is all premature - The FAI have not confirmed that they will even continue running the league next season!

Nor have they formally confirmed the 3 up / 1 down bit or how the playoffs will work even if they are in charge!

Of course as we are only half way through this season, there is no rush !

[razor]

Greg O'Halloran's Pat Dolan impression as between game entertainment."You are joking?" :D

[El-Pietro]

The FAI have been remarkably coy about next season.

Most people seem to drifting along on the assumption that the FAI will have 3 up and 1 down between the first and premier, and now the debate moves on to the number of teams in next years first division.

This is all premature - The FAI have not confirmed that they will even continue running the league next season!

Nor have they formally confirmed the 3 up / 1 down bit or how the playoffs will work even if they are in charge!

Of course as we are only half way through this season, there is no rush !

pretty sure 3 up 1 down - (pending a playoff at the home of the premier team) has been confirmed

also there was a vote to continue with the FAI running the league for the next 3 (I think) years

[redobit]

Would this be confined to Sligo fans ? and would it be timed ? ;)

Chartered air bus on standby. Rumour is John Travolta will be the pilot.

[Ezeikial]

pretty sure 3 up 1 down - (pending a playoff at the home of the premier team) has been confirmed

also there was a vote to continue with the FAI running the league for the next 3 (I think) years

Thats the problem El Pietro - even well informed foot.ie fans have the impression that this is all sorted. The FAI have not confirmed this at all and don't be surprised if they finally confirm a different arrangement then that assumed - if it happens to suit them.

There was a vote among the clubs to continue with the status quo in the administration of the league, but the FAI have not confirmed it on their end!

[Jofspring]

I know this is the LOI and anything can happen but it just seems a bit mad to think Shels, Monaghan, Cork, Limerick, Longford and all the other first division teams are playing games and not know for sure if finishing in the top three barr winning the league actually means anything at all. Surely the clubs got some kind of confirmation from the FAI on what they need to do to get promoted or whats the point in even playing at all and spending money on wages etc.....

[Ezeikial]

I know this is the LOI and anything can happen but it just seems a bit mad to think Shels, Monaghan, Cork, Limerick, Longford and all the other first division teams are playing games and not know for sure if finishing in the top three barr winning the league actually means anything at all. Surely the clubs got some kind of confirmation from the FAI on what they need to do to get promoted or whats the point in even playing at all and spending money on wages etc.....

Didn't you guys pi$$ off the FAI recently?

If you finish 3rd in the division be afraid, very afraid....

[BonnieShels]

Which makes you wonder what they'll manage to fudge if its shels or limerick in first and second and cork in third.

That's right. Galway United stay up Harps play off with Bray and Athlone go straight up.

[bullit]

Which makes you wonder what they'll manage to fudge if its shels or limerick in first and second and cork in third.

That's right. Galway United stay up Harps play off with Bray and Athlone go straight up.

And Christmas trees as kindling :)

[BonnieShels]

And a Partridge in Oswes-tree...

[culloty82]

Will Cobh be in a fit state to step up again? Some of the indications from Cobh posters have been pretty negative.

Not sure whether Fanad will look to step up but they probably could if they wanted to. Can anyone offer any insight on the situation with Carlow or Tralee?

It was Tralee who gave the story to the local media (http://www.kerryseye.com/sports.html), so whether or not they could step up, they've presumably been told by Merrion Square it was a possibility - "Dynamos have been invited to express an interest in becoming part of a restructured Division One". In any case, Castlebar and Tullamore pulled out because they knew they weren't able to scale up for the First, so presumably Carlow and Tralee think they wouldn't be rejected straight off.

[MagicMon]

Which makes you wonder what they'll manage to fudge if its shels or limerick in first and second and cork in third.

That's right. Galway United stay up Harps play off with Bray and Athlone go straight up.

You wanna see what they have planned if Monaghan finish in the promotion spots- the whole LOI will be cancelled and all the footballs in Ireland will be confiscated by the FAI

[BonnieShels]

That would be quite the huff.

[Martinho II]

It was Tralee who gave the story to the local media (http://www.kerryseye.com/sports.html), so whether or not they could step up, they've presumably been told by Merrion Square it was a possibility - "Dynamos have been invited to express an interest in becoming part of a restructured Division One". In any case, Castlebar and Tullamore pulled out because they knew they weren't able to scale up for the First, so presumably Carlow and Tralee think they wouldn't be rejected straight off.
is this the same noel white that was coach at UCD, Longford Town and Shels?

[nigel-harps1954]

Which makes you wonder what they'll manage to fudge if its shels or limerick in first and second and cork in third.

That's right. Galway United stay up Harps play off with Bray and Athlone go straight up.

I'll take that. Although us in Play-offs doesn't generally work well.

[culloty82]

is this the same noel white that was coach at UCD, Longford Town and Shels?

Yes, it is, they needed someone with a UEFA licence when they were applying.

[peadar1987]

Will Cobh be in a fit state to step up again? Some of the indications from Cobh posters have been pretty negative.

Not sure whether Fanad will look to step up but they probably could if they wanted to. Can anyone offer any insight on the situation with Carlow or Tralee?


Jeebus, Cork to Fanad would be some away trip! According to Google Maps, 509 km, and it'd take you six and a half hours! Estimated fuel cost a very reasonable 70 quid

[Sam_Heggy]

Jeebus, Cork to Fanad would be some away trip! According to Google Maps, 509 km, and it'd take you six and a half hours! Estimated fuel cost a very reasonable 70 quid

Probably an extra 30 minutes than what they would have traveled last night.

[peadar1987]

Probably an extra 30 minutes than what they would have traveled last night.

I've spent almost 30 minutes trying to get across one junction in Ballybofey! The greatest of respect to anyone who makes the trip up to Finn Park, or any Harps supporter who travels away, Donegal isn't the easiest place to get to or from!

[gufct]

Big rumor in Galway is that Salthill are pulling out of the leagus at the end of this season. Hopefully we can see ourselves through until then.

[Sam_Heggy]

I've spent almost 30 minutes trying to get across one junction in Ballybofey! The greatest of respect to anyone who makes the trip up to Finn Park, or any Harps supporter who travels away, Donegal isn't the easiest place to get to or from!

If it's the junction Bar then It's safe to say lots of people have spent alot more than 30 minutes trying to get through it.

Wait until ye are trying to find Fanad, now that will be a story and a half.

[El-Pietro]

Probably an extra 30 minutes than what they would have traveled last night.
depends which way you do it, bunch of us split the journey by going to Galway on Friday for the UCD game first

[legendz]

You wanna see what they have planned if Monaghan finish in the promotion spots- the whole LOI will be cancelled and all the footballs in Ireland will be confiscated by the FAI

lol, I'm sure that'll be the case alright. It's a joke really that so many seem to be sure or unsure and no official word on the league format for next season. Are there any journalists worth their salt who can report on the story?

[dfx-]

You wanna see what they have planned if Monaghan finish in the promotion spots- the whole LOI will be cancelled and all the footballs in Ireland will be confiscated by the FAI

It'll take more than that to get rid of Bray Wanderers..

[culloty82]

The latest development, according to Tralee, is that even if all four A Championship clubs meet the First Division licensing criteria, only two will be elected. If other clubs are selected on merit, there will be no complaints, but given the progress made by individual clubs (Dynamos, Killarney Celtic, Castleisland, Fenit Samphires), especially at youth level, failure to win First Division status would be a hammerblow to the development of the sport in Kerry, so it would be in the KDL's interest to work closely with Dynamos to ensure they make the grade.

[Mr A]

But hold on- we have 11 D1 clubs currently, or 9 for next year after the format change, so electing 2 makes no sense. 1, 3 or even 5 if they could be found would make a lot more.

In any case, how would Tralee not making it (and I hope they do) affect other clubs in Kerry?

[culloty82]

That's the key issue that's been going around the last three years, after the KDL were forced out of the U-20 league, the plan was that a Kerry team would enter the A Championship, but when that fell through, Tralee went it alone. Since then, they've wanted players from the other KDL clubs to join up with them, but for the most part, they've refused. Maybe if Tralee become full League members, the prospect of playing Waterford, Limerick etc would encourage the other clubs to come on board, but the goal of all sides for the last decade at least has been to have an adult team in the First Division.

[Mr A]

Hmmm.. junior clubs happily cooperating with their local senior side?.... tricky.

That's hard to achieve for established senior clubs and it could well be even harder for those that come up from the junior ranks.

[gufc2000]

But hold on- we have 11 D1 clubs currently, or 9 for next year after the format change, so electing 2 makes no sense. 1, 3 or even 5 if they could be found would make a lot more.

In any case, how would Tralee not making it (and I hope they do) affect other clubs in Kerry?
If the rumour of Salthill dropping out is true that would even it up again.

The strange thing is, where do they expect two of Tralee, Carlow, Cobh and Fanad to go? Going back to the regional leagues would be a step back.

[Mr A]

Ah, I had forgotten about the Salthill rumour. In fairness it was around last year as well so not sure what to make of it, but if the lack of interest from them at our last fixture was anything to go by it may well be true.

For the record, I think they should let in any A championship club who meets the criteria.

[shep]

Ah they should just put the whole lot together....sure it would be great craic if nothing else

[passerrby]

Ah they should just put the whole lot together....sure it would be great craic if nothing else

there speaks the voice of sanity... tinged with some sarcasm

[legendz]

Is the Premier definitely expanding to 12, with 10th Premier v 3rd in a play-off?

I still don't see why the A Championship can't continue, just remove the stipulation Premier clubs have to field a team. A Championship clubs don't seem to have lobbied much for it's retention, even in a revamp of the format, so I guess there can't be too many complaints at the same time.



That's the key issue that's been going around the last three years, after the KDL were forced out of the U-20 league, the plan was that a Kerry team would enter the A Championship, but when that fell through, Tralee went it alone. Since then, they've wanted players from the other KDL clubs to join up with them, but for the most part, they've refused. Maybe if Tralee become full League members, the prospect of playing Waterford, Limerick etc would encourage the other clubs to come on board, but the goal of all sides for the last decade at least has been to have an adult team in the First Division.
If it's true the plan was for a Kerry team to enter, it's a shame that didn't materialise. Tralee isn't going to get the backing of Killarney and other areas. A Kerry team to represent the region would've been a great way to go, in terms of getting more players involved and getting more support behind the team. When Tralee Dynamos joined forces with Kingdom Dynamos, I thought at A Championship level the team could've gone with the name Kingdom Dynamos reflecting the merger for that level and more a representation of the region while Tralee Dynamos continue in the KDL.

[Sam_Heggy]

Legendz, if you remove the compulsory entry for Premier Teams you'll be left with maybe 3 or 4 in each section, meaning all will have to be put in together and Im pretty sure that if we have to travel to Tralee to play an A League game, it simply won't happen.