View Full Version : Jason Byrne
Bowsy
20/04/2004, 11:00 AM
Clinton will do for now but really hope O'Flynn, McGeady, Elliott and Yeates develop into serious options soon. Had high hopes for Walters but not sure move to Hull was best idea. Heffernan if he gets a move to a decent club next year and continues his form could be an option. 22 years old and prolific despite playing for a dreadful team.
I don't know much about the Irish League.
I agree cos thats played in Northern Ireland.
Byrne *2 (dunfermline and sh€ls)
Richie Byrne is a defender but then again so is Doherty.
:rolleyes:
Plastic Paddy
20/04/2004, 11:12 AM
Clinton will do for now but really hope O'Flynn, McGeady, Elliott and Yeates develop into serious options soon. Had high hopes for Walters but not sure move to Hull was best idea. Heffernan if he gets a move to a decent club next year and continues his form could be an option. 22 years old and prolific despite playing for a dreadful team.
Expect to see McGeady feature for Celtic between now and the end of the season. He's getting rave reviews from those who have seen him play at u-21 level - no bad thing at all considering he only made the step-up to that level just before Christmas. Not an out-and-out striker though, but more of an attacking midfielder.
I agree with you about Heffernan as well. He's every chance of establishing himself in the senior Ireland squad if he moves to a higher level and transfers this season's form.
:) PP
Ozymandias
20/04/2004, 12:47 PM
Heffernan even as it stands has done really well..County are poor but he is still banging in the goals for them....like to see him in Div 1 and see how he does....rumour is he is on his way to forest.....would be a good move for him
Schumi
20/04/2004, 2:46 PM
Richie Byrne is a defender And a $hit one at that! I assume your man meant someone else?
I'm guessing Ozymandias was referring to Dempsey at Dumfermline.
Sheridan
20/04/2004, 2:56 PM
I'm guessing Ozymandias was referring to Dempsey at Dumfermline.
I'm guessing Noel Hunt, but then he played for Shamrock Rovers (club based in the country you claim to support, so of course you won't have heard of them) so it'll be a while before he's sufficiently decontaminated of eL links to be considered for the national side.
Plastic Paddy
20/04/2004, 2:59 PM
I'm guessing Noel Hunt, but then he played for Shamrock Rovers (club based in the country you claim to support, so of course you won't have heard of them) so it'll be a while before he's sufficiently decontaminated of eL links to be considered for the national side.
Woooooo! Get you! Meeee-owww! :rolleyes:
Mind yerself now Bowsy, pulling those claws out will hurt... ;)
:D PP
Yeah, of course Sheridan, I know nothing about football because i don't think the EL is comparable with Serie A. Now i wonder if that Nice Mr Beckham would play for us if we asked nicely. Sure wouldn't that be grand. :rolleyes:
Ozymandias
20/04/2004, 3:50 PM
ignore me lads..I was typing byrne when i thought some smart arse would come back with which one and for some reason richie byrne came to mind.
Noel Hunt isn't up tomit ...I would put him in the graham Barrett category....might yet come good....dempsey is a midfielder...there I think that covers up that **** up
:o
Never said there were no quality players in the EL. That's not the point i've been making. I just think the step from playing EL football to International level is too big a jump. I want to see O'Flynn, Byrne, Zayed, etc prove they can do it at a higher level before they get into the Ireland set up. Same way i want Heffernan to prove himself at, at least 1st Division standard. No great fan of Connolly, Lee, or Morrison but they have proven themselves at 1st Division level football at minimum. If you think the EL is as strong as the English First Division you are deluding yourselves. But what would i know as i'm alegedly an armchair supporter who wouldn't know an EL player if he smacked him in the face. :rolleyes:
Hardly disgusted. Reckon it's bad move for him though considering he was a regular in the Sunderland side before injury and could well be playing Premiership football next season.
Sheridan
20/04/2004, 4:43 PM
You'll be disgusted at the rumour then that Thomas Butler wants to leave Sunderland - apparently he wants to come back and play here...
Excellent! Hey, maybe he's coming to us. He's from Ballymun like me and I used to play football with his brother (I think.) Might offer my services as a go-between.
Slash/ED
20/04/2004, 5:28 PM
No great fan of Connolly, Lee, or Morrison but they have proven themselves at 1st Division level football at minimum.
Debateble. Lee has had one good half season in the first division and has been absolutley useless, even at that level, since and before then. I might be wrong, but I think he doesn't even get his game for Cardiff anymore.
As for Butler, I wouldn't mind him at Shels. Injuries have really set him back but at one point he was looking like he could be an absolute gem. An injury free season for him would be fantastic, the talent is there.
Qunnie
20/04/2004, 8:03 PM
it may well be true that eL clubs get knocked out of europe by clubs people have never heard of...but most of those clubs would have thier fair share of internationals.
imo crowe didn't look out of place against greece and had a few good chances.
wouldn't it be great if all irish players could play at the top level like richie partridge
Im a Forest fan and its the first Ive heard hes on the way to us I was down their last week. Not sure if hes good enough to step up to be honest. Heffernan that is.
1MickCollins
21/04/2004, 1:16 AM
Err whats he going to say? That its slow and not intense. One of the faults with LOI football is that its too fast, not too slow. Rangers and Celtic of Glasgow derbies may be be fast and intense but that doesnt mean theres much good football on show.
I didn't put it well, I had meant to say he said he was "surprised" how intense the sessions were, the sub-text of what he was saying was that essentially it was a much higher level than he was used to.
As i said i'm no fan of Lee but he had two 15 goal plus seasons with a poor Rotherham side before going to Cardiff. He was first choice before an Injury that kept him out for most of the season. He's started more games than not since returning despite the fact that Earnshaw's partner for most of the season Thorne has had a really good year. Also has a chance of making play offs and playing Premiership football next year.
Ozymandias
21/04/2004, 9:35 AM
Petef...Heffernan has refused a contract with Notts County and apparently their offer would have put him near the top of their wage earners...also I met some notts count y fans and they said tha the is gonna leave and they thought forest were favourites...he can't go on a bosman as he is under 23/24 . To be fair to the guy he has loads of pace and is quite a good finisher. I don't hink he'd walk straight into the forest team but I do think Smoking Joe could make a decent player of him
anyway their only all rumours
Slash/ED
21/04/2004, 6:53 PM
I didn't put it well, I had meant to say he said he was "surprised" how intense the sessions were, the sub-text of what he was saying was that essentially it was a much higher level than he was used to.
What's your point?
Of course it's a higher level than he's used to, the same goes for division one players and probably even premiership players. The debate is weather or not they can step up to the higher level of international football. There's only one way to find out.
No great fan of Connolly, Lee, or Morrison but they have proven themselves at 1st Division level football at minimum. If you think the EL is as strong as the English First Division you are deluding yourselves. :
City, Bohs and Shels would easily be up to the standard of a lot of English division one teams. You're the one whose deluding yourself.... Sky Sports tell you that English football (outside top Premiership teams) is of a good standard and you believe them.
John O'Flynn is better than Connolly, Lee, or Morrison (don't argue unless you've seen him play a few times) and Crowe is as. Don't really rate Jason Byrne myself but I'd play him ahead of a waster like Connolly anyday.
As for the wages, it's irrelevant to the debate really but most of the top players here earn more than any divison 2 or 3 player in England and probably quite a few first division players aswell. In fact, a chairman of a 2nd division club was in the papers a few months ago giving out that they can't compete with the crazy money that Irish clubs are offering players.
So Petef, Bowsy and co answer me this.... why would players want to play in the lower English divisions when they can play in the el and earn more money and have the oppurtunity to play European football.
Slash/ED
21/04/2004, 7:27 PM
Didn't Thomas Heary, a regular for Huddersfield in both the first and second division, leave them to join Bohs despite being offered a new contract by them and being a regular in their side?
Also, there's talk of this fella Dean (I think that's his name) from Charlton is being let go, Irish U21 international, he has an offer from Luton on the table but wants to come here and Bohs, Shels Cork and another team, I forget who, are all bidding for him at the moment.
Thomas Butler has also asked for the remaining 12 months of his Sunderland contract to be cancled so he can come over here but that's just a rumour at the moment.
Plastic Paddy
21/04/2004, 7:51 PM
City, Bohs and Shels would easily be up to the standard of a lot of English division one teams. You're the one whose deluding yourself...
You're taking the ****, right?
Two years ago as a Division 1 side, Ipswich got to the third-round of the UEFA Cup before losing narrowly to Slovan Liberec. When Cork, Bohemians or Shelbourne do the same, then I'll take your comments seriously. Until then, it's all I'll be able to do to keep a straight... no... can't... :D :D :rolleyes:
:D PP
Slash/ED
21/04/2004, 7:54 PM
You're taking the ****, right?
Two years ago as a Division 1 side, Ipswich got to the third-round of the UEFA Cup before losing narrowly to Slovan Liberec. When Cork, Bohemians or Shelbourne do the same, then I'll take your comments seriously. Until then, it's all I'll be able to do to keep a straight... no... can't... :D :D :rolleyes:
:D PP
A side which had just finished fifth in the premiership a year before and still had alot of players from that side, including their captain. I think he was talking mainly about the lower sides in division one rather then the premiership promotion chasers. Bohs, Shels and Cork are, at least, the higher end of second division in England standard, which isn't far away from the lower end of division one
Hmm Bohs and Shels would be fighting a relegation battle in Division One, if even. Forest are struggling and look at the players they have, Reid and Thompson Irish Internationals, Williams - Scottish International, David Johnson top scorer last year albeit injured, Gareth Taylor, Darren Ward - Welsh Internationals, Michael Dawson - 5,6 million rated, the list goes on. Your saying they could compete, I severely doubt it.
Plastic Paddy
21/04/2004, 8:20 PM
A side which had just finished fifth in the premiership a year before and still had alot of players from that side, including their captain.
They didn't, Slash. They had a fire-sale and sold at least seven of their first team. Holland was also due to go, but turned down a £4million move to Aston Villa. Hard to believe now, innit? :)
I think he was talking mainly about the lower sides in division one rather then the premiership promotion chasers. Bohs, Shels and Cork are, at least, the higher end of second division in England standard, which isn't far away from the lower end of division one
I'm still not convinced, mate. Even at the top of the Second Division, you're talking about sides like Plymouth, Bristol City and QPR, each of whom get upwards of 15,000 each week to watch them and have playing budgets to match. I'd honestly take you half a division lower. The likes of Wrexham, Stockport and Grimsby may well be more of a match for Cork, Bohs and Shels.
:) PP
Slash/ED
21/04/2004, 8:24 PM
I don't think attendences are a good guide to be honest. The English lower divisions is helped by far more media coverage which gets people to the ground aswell as a tradition of supporting them, it doesn't really show standard of the players on the pitch imo. Even an English example of this would be comparing Fulham to Sunderland. Despite their attendences, their still struggling massively financially and are slashing wage bills left right and centre. That's why examples like the Thomas Heary one are starting to happen now.
Even with Ipswich selling a few, they were still a top side in the division. Not many other sides in that division would have got three rounds into Europe.
And useing the Forest example is a bit wrong imo, individually their good enough to be in the play offs imo, they've just woedully underachieved for whatever reason this season, and even at that, Houlihan had Reids favoured left wing role for the U21s for the majority of the last campaign, and he can't get a game on the left for Shels :)
You're taking the ****, right?
Two years ago as a Division 1 side, Ipswich got to the third-round of the UEFA Cup before losing narrowly to Slovan Liberec. When Cork, Bohemians or Shelbourne do the same, then I'll take your comments seriously. Until then, it's all I'll be able to do to keep a straight... no... can't... :D :D :rolleyes:
:D PP
Since you live in England and your knowledge of the el is probably very limited, I'll excuse your ignorance.
Plastic Paddy
21/04/2004, 9:23 PM
Since you live in England and your knowledge of the el is probably very limited, I'll excuse your ignorance.
My first League of Ireland game was at Oriel Park in 1980, watching the then all-conquering Dundalk side play Shelbourne. I've probably watched upwards of 150 LoI games since, which may or may not be as many as yourself in the same near-quarter century, but I think that qualifies me to talk with some degree of knowledge on Irish domestic football. So I'll see your term "ignorance". And raise you a "deluded".
I was comparing English and Irish club sides in the only competitive way we have. Europe. And with the notable exception of Bohemians a couple of years back, frankly, eL sides just don't even come close. Even way down the ladder. Get past the likes of Sliema Wanderers, Sigma Olomouc, Suduva et al, and I may just believe you.
Ignorance. Hmmm... :rolleyes:
:ball: PP
I was comparing English and Irish club sides in the only competitive way we have. Europe.
Yeah but to do that you've essentially got to compare el clubs with English Premiership clubs. That's hardly comparing like with like. I think we all acknowledge that el teams are not quite up to the standard of the Premiership teams. I'd say the el is on a par with Division 2 and, as I said, the top 3 teams would do quite well in Division one.
petef
21/04/2004, 11:19 PM
Houlihan had Reids favoured left wing role for the U21s for the majority of the last campaign, and he can't get a game on the left for Shels :)
Andy Reid has only come into form this and last season, very much underachieved until Harty got the best out of him. Lost some weight may I add too. ;)
Colm, what makes you think i've never seen O'Flynn play. Watched him in all the under 21 qualifiers he played and his goal against Germany. Always keep track of potential Irish players no matter what league they play in. Don't dismiss my comments as ignorance. If you'd read any of my other comments on this thread you'd know i rate him. My arguement is he is doing it in a league in which the standard is too low for International football. Just like the English 2nd Division is too low for Internationals to play in.
This is not discrimination against EL players. I don't want Partridge or the like called up either until they are regulars at very minimum Division 1 standard.
The thread is not whether Irish clubs would struggle in the English First Division, or would they win the Second Division. The thread is whether players who play here are as (or are more) equipped for a senior call up as players who play in England.
Exactly, if Ireland had 4-5 players playing & scoring regularily in the Premiership they would probabloy get the nod but they ain't so have to look at next tier.
I've only seen marginal cases against Bryne, crowe or O'flynn getting an Ireland callup.
You're taking the ****, right?
Two years ago as a Division 1 side, Ipswich got to the third-round of the UEFA Cup before losing narrowly to Slovan Liberec. When Cork, Bohemians or Shelbourne do the same, then I'll take your comments seriously. Until then, it's all I'll be able to do to keep a straight... no... can't... :D :D :rolleyes:
:D PP
Thats because they were able to benefit from Man U, liverpools co-efficients. In other words they got an english seeding. They started from the first round. Which means they got be two rounds. hardly awe inspiring.
Because of Bohs improved record in Europe they are seeded in this years UEFA Cup. The first time an irish club has been seeded in that competition. I can virtually predict to you because of that Bohs will get by their opponents. Being seeded makes a huge difference.
I didn't put it well, I had meant to say he said he was "surprised" how intense the sessions were, the sub-text of what he was saying was that essentially it was a much higher level than he was used to.
Good to see youre able to look into Crowes subtexs. Crowe is a full-time professional so no matter what you think of his ability, his fitness levels are just as good as english based players. In fact, if you've been reading the papers Kerr has been imposing rigid discipline on the squad and they have been complaining as a result. Proper preparation in other words - so its not just Crowe who thought it was intense.
Sigma Olomouc, Suduva et al, and I may just believe you.
Ignorance. Hmmm... :rolleyes:
:ball: PP
In your case about Ipswich you point out that they coudnt get past Czech oposition. Now you want Irish football to do better than English football teams to prove that they are nearly as good as them? Odd
Of the two teams you mentiom above when did an Irish team meet either of them? Not for a long time, if at all. I think youre getting mixed up in your choice of teams :rolleyes: I suppose they are all the same. :rolleyes:
Maybe a good comparison would be comparing how Rovers did against Polish opposition and Manchester City did ? Rovers progressed, manchester didnt.
Getting knocked out by nobodies is getting knocked out by nobodies whether it be in a preliminary round or otherwise. Fair enough Bohs got knocked out by Rosenburg this year(very easily - 5 nil on aggregate if i remember rightly) who got knocked out by Depor, but Rosenburg are a shadow of their former selves. Until an El teams do better than beating BATE Borisov and the like you can't tell me it's a strong enough league for Irish Internationals to be playing in.
Two years ago as a Division 1 side, Ipswich got to the third-round of the UEFA Cup before losing narrowly to Slovan Liberec.
If you want to play that game- Shamrock Rovers played Slovan Liberec last season in the intertoto cup and lost both legs 2-0. This was a Shamrock Rovers side which finished 7th in the eircom League last season- 10 points off the bottom of the table, 20 behind Bohs and 25 behind Shels.
I honestly don't think that any of those 3 sides would do well in divison 1. They might scrape survival, but they would comfortably compete in divison 2. The standard of this league is improving and the players who are good enough should get international recognition. Right now there's a choice to be made- do we send the good players back to england and watch standards here fall ,or do we keep them here in the knowledge that if this trend continues, more quality players will follow. I'd rather the latter because it would raise the standard of Irish football and be good for the international team as well. Also, is it not better for a guy to play for Bohs or Shels and play 2, 3 or 4 european games a season than play in division 1 or 2 in the hope they draw a "big" team in a cup, so they can play their reserves? Can you find any fault with that argument?
dcfc_legend9
22/04/2004, 1:50 PM
Jason Byrne for ireland catch your self on ya dirty dublin jackeen *******.Jason Byrnes a wee ******. youse lads think hes deadly. Liaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Until an El teams do better than beating BATE Borisov and the like you can't tell me it's a strong enough league for Irish Internationals to be playing in.This is the chicken and the egg question. Irish internationals will improve the league but the league needs to improve to attract Irish internationals. One way is for the 'soccer community (basically barstoolers and 'connoisseurs' going to Parkhead and Old Trafford every weekend') to support their local teams, either through the gates or by lobbying for more TV coverage.
Getting knocked out by nobodies is getting knocked out by nobodies whether it be in a preliminary round or otherwise. Fair enough Bohs got knocked out by Rosenburg this year(very easily - 5 nil on aggregate if i remember rightly) who got knocked out by Depor, but Rosenburg are a shadow of their former selves. Until an El teams do better than beating BATE Borisov and the like you can't tell me it's a strong enough league for Irish Internationals to be playing in.
They got Knocked out by Depor by 1-0 on agg to a team who are in the semi-finals of the european cup.
They went on to play in the UEfa cup. Against Ventspills they won 10-1 on agg.
The next round they beat Red Star Belgrade and only lost to Benfica on the away goals rule in the next round.
They have won the norwegian league again - cruise to the title.
They reached the champions league group stage god knows how many times in a row. Hardly a team in decline.
Strong arguement Eanna and i do think the League will continue to improve as many players now see it as a viable, if not more attractive, alternative to 2nd division football in England. It's a long term policy however. How do you balance holding back players like O'Flynn and Houlihan who could probably make it at the highest level and letting the league grow. Unless you want to compete with Northern Ireland then having players who play 2nd Division standard football in your National team shouldn't be an option. Therefore IMO at this stage players like Heffernan, Alan Quinn, etc shouldn't be called up either.
it is a very hard call to make, no doubt, but IMO Bohs beating Aberdeen and running Kaiserslautern close a few years back was a turning point. Since then the league has improved a a rapid pace and I think if we can keep this pace up for another 4 or 5 years having internationals playing the league will be a vpossibility.
gustavo
22/04/2004, 3:08 PM
Since you live in England and your knowledge of the el is probably very limited, I'll excuse your ignorance.
doesnt that by the same token then mean that us in Ireland wouldnt be able to give a qualified view of the merits or otherwise of the English Second Division ..
doesnt that by the same token then mean that us in Ireland wouldnt be able to give a qualified view of the merits or otherwise of the English Second Division ..
well, we get TV coverage of the english leagues over here. they dont broadcast irish football in england
You're taking the ****, right?
Two years ago as a Division 1 side, Ipswich got to the third-round of the UEFA Cup before losing narrowly to Slovan Liberec
The same Slovan Liberec who Shamrock Rover narrowly lost to in the Intertoto?
:rolleyes:
Plastic Paddy
22/04/2004, 6:37 PM
Thats because they were able to benefit from Man U, liverpools co-efficients. In other words they got an english seeding. They started from the first round. Which means they got be two rounds. hardly awe inspiring.
Fair point, but still not a bad showing for a second-tier side.
Because of Bohs improved record in Europe they are seeded in this years UEFA Cup. The first time an irish club has been seeded in that competition. I can virtually predict to you because of that Bohs will get by their opponents. Being seeded makes a huge difference.
I hope you're right. :)
In your case about Ipswich you point out that they coudnt get past Czech oposition. Now you want Irish football to do better than English football teams to prove that they are nearly as good as them? Odd
That's not quite what I said, is it? I merely pointed out that Ipswich - as a second-tier English side - had made the third round, something Irish top-tier sides have singularly failed to do since...
Of the two teams you mentiom above when did an Irish team meet either of them? Not for a long time, if at all. I think youre getting mixed up in your choice of teams. I suppose they are all the same. Maybe a good comparison would be comparing how Rovers did against Polish opposition and Manchester City did ? Rovers progressed, manchester didnt.
Maybe it would. You're getting better at this.
The same Slovan Liberec who Shamrock Rover narrowly lost to in the Intertoto?
I'd hardly call a 4-0 aggregate reverse "narrow". :rolleyes:
If you want to play that game- Shamrock Rovers played Slovan Liberec last season in the intertoto cup and lost both legs 2-0. This was a Shamrock Rovers side which finished 7th in the eircom League last season- 10 points off the bottom of the table, 20 behind Bohs and 25 behind Shels.
I honestly don't think that any of those 3 sides would do well in divison 1. They might scrape survival, but they would comfortably compete in divison 2. The standard of this league is improving and the players who are good enough should get international recognition. Right now there's a choice to be made- do we send the good players back to england and watch standards here fall ,or do we keep them here in the knowledge that if this trend continues, more quality players will follow. I'd rather the latter because it would raise the standard of Irish football and be good for the international team as well. Also, is it not better for a guy to play for Bohs or Shels and play 2, 3 or 4 european games a season than play in division 1 or 2 in the hope they draw a "big" team in a cup, so they can play their reserves? Can you find any fault with that argument?
Hey eoinh, this is how it's done. And no, Éanna, I can't find any fault. Great reply. :)
:) PP
gustavo
29/07/2006, 1:42 PM
He scored another two goals last night ,Bang on form at the minute:)
Jeez there was some rubbish muttered in this thread.
Byrne for Ireland!
ger121
29/07/2006, 3:16 PM
Any of the Shels lads who post on here know how many goals in total Byrne has scored so far this season and what's the breakdown?
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