The Drogheda thread - budget being revised

[ndrog]

Any outstanding monies owed have been paid to the revenue according to our chairman and the rest of the board at the meeting . The rest of the meeting was used to discuss fundraising for the up coming season , if we as supporters didnt know it already we certanily know now that its gonna be tight this season with all revenue being very tight with lots of supporters input being needed on match day and throughout the season . Flat broke like most other clubs .

[Buile Shuibhne]

Have they a tax clearance cert?

Say the tax bill was only settled this week or even last week - when do Revenue issue the TCC and do clubs still have up to the end of Jan to submit it, in time for the licence application?

[Battery Rover]

Say the tax bill was only settled this week or even last week - when do Revenue issue the TCC and do clubs still have up to the end of Jan to submit it, in time for the licence application?

Tax clearance of the top of my head is due with the financials on the 30th January. Revenue will issue it as soon as payment clears

[gufct]

Once the original downpayment which usually has to be over 50% of the debt due is paid and an instalment arrangement is signed up for the TCC will issue immediately.

I dont know how many posters here are involved in the real world where 100's of companies in all lines of business are in the same or worse situations than el Teams like Drogheda. The simple facts are over 1/3 of firms fall behind in their tax payments now due to the extreme pressure on cashflow no matter how high or low their wage bill is.

[chatterbox]

Were we behind in tax payments? Its been settled before the licensing/tax cert deadline without any wind-up orders or court appearances. Seems pretty succesful to me. I'd imagine most clubs go through some sort of negotiation with the revenue from time to time, it just happened that a journo got wind of this particular exchange.

[Mr A]

Success is falling behind with the revenue by over a grand a week (and getting it paid by a benefactor) when you already made a serious enemy of the taxman?

[SeanDrog]

Success is falling behind with the revenue by over a grand a week (and getting it paid by a benefactor) when you already made a serious enemy of the taxman?

where we behind?

Some of the reaction by some posters to what turned out to be a false reported story reflects more on the posters than Drogheda Utd.

Shock Drogs had tax bill (as do all companies), Drogs clear tax bill, doom doom I tell ye.

The league and clubs are in serious pressure but many seem to be on disaster watch constantly with indignation missles ready and always armed.

For me Drogs are very refreshing this year as we seem to be going forward together with everyone aware of the facts. We scrapped by last season (major feat), now we are planning (together) for a new season and we all know we need to raise another 100k to break even, so all hands are at the pumps. If we succeed (and it wont be for lack of effort), we will break even - how many clubs will be able to claim this?)


We have supporters on the board
We have 270 (give or take) members of a Claret and Blue Club giving a 5e each per week (growing, slowly but growing)
We have a Last Drog Standing just kicking off, 77 members and plans to grow it
Formation of new committees for match day programmes, fundraising, match day etc (all supporter based)
We have close club supporter comunication (by default as the suppoers are now heavily involved)
We know the reality of the finacial challange which allows us to tackle it, rather than hiding it from the supporters and allowing he problem get out of hand


Compare this with 2 seasons ago.

Now it is and will remain a struggle but we are alive and we are fighting but is there credit for this - not a chance, some would rather try to jump in wth 2 feet at the drop of a hat.

C'est la vie

[Mad Moose]

Any outstanding monies owed have been paid to the revenue according to our chairman and the rest of the board at the meeting . The rest of the meeting was used to discuss fundraising for the up coming season , if we as supporters didnt know it already we certanily know now that its gonna be tight this season with all revenue being very tight with lots of supporters input being needed on match day and throughout the season . Flat broke like most other clubs .

Isn't it time to close this thread or as in the case of the Cork City and Derry City threads at least change the title to reflect an accurate current position?. I know the original post was in relation to the published article in the press but that story appears to have been unfounded and sensationalist as ever. I've just read the last few posts further to ndrog's comments after the meeting at the club and as said afterward the story is unfounded.

The negative press attached to this league grows and grows every season and much of it sadly is merited with more and more clubs cliff hanging every single season. In this case this negative story is a non-starter.

[Celdrog]

it just happened that a journo got wind of this particular exchange.No he didn't - he was deliberately fed a completely false story and went ahead and printed it without getting any verification from the club or the revenue.
The club also know who the story originated from and it will be legal action if it continues. I'll take any story from the daily mail with a large bag of salt from now on (all clubs stories) and certain journalists in general.

[Macy]

we all know we need to raise another 100k to break even, so all hands are at the pumps. If we succeed (and it wont be for lack of effort), we will break even - how many clubs will be able to claim this?)
Couldn't you just take €100,000 of the budget and then break even anyway?

[chatterbox]

Success is falling behind with the revenue by over a grand a week (and getting it paid by a benefactor) when you already made a serious enemy of the taxman?

I'd like to know what you're basing any of that statement on. Who's this benefactor? We were 100k short at the end of last year so some debt was going to go unpaid (if that is indeed what happened). Makes sense to wait till January to pay the revenue.


I'll take any story from the daily mail with a large bag of salt from now on (all clubs stories) and certain journalists in general.

+1

[SMorgan]

The story was nice while it lasted:mad:

[Macy]

Despite all the bluster and critism of the Mail, there was a fire generating the smoke.

[Celdrog]

What was the fire Macy????
Drogs cleared their tax bill completely (a relatively small one by LOI standards) two weeks before a journalist decided to tell anyone interested that we were facing a revenue winding up order unless we cleared all our outstanding tax by last Friday.

Do you know how much Longford owe the revenue? If its more than 1c then you could be facing a winding up order if its not cleared. Would that be a "smoke without fire" story - no it would be complete nonsense.

Keep on dreaming, we're still in business, fully tax compliant, no outstanding wages due and in a much much healthier position than this time last year, when we were still in examinership. Hey, we even have 15 players who have agreed to play with us this season. 11 months ago we had 0.

We are looking forward to the new season and this time we all have very large umbrellas to cope with people raining on our parade.

[Mr A]

Right- I'm genuinely confused here- did Drogheda fall 50k behind or not? Was this cleared by Vincent Hoey? Is he still involved with the club or not?

[pineapple stu]

citizen smith on the Drogheda forum mentioned that there was a bill of E50k, but that it was recently paid. That's all I've seen anyway.

[gufct]

No matter what line of business your in January is P35 time so even if you were paying a set sum on direct debit there would be either a balance payable or repayable. I know we settled up with the revenue ourselves this month so making a mountain of a molehill is what the Mail was doing.

I look after the accounts in our own business and laugh sometimes when I see some of the sanctimonious bull spouted on here by some posters. Ive said before 2/3rds of the businesses in the country are struggling big time with cashflow problems and things arent getting any better its actually worse with commercial activity at a standstill.

[tiktok]

We are looking forward to the new season and this time we all have very large umbrellas to cope with people raining on our parade.

If you huddle together and hold them all up it'll look like a proper Stadiuuuuuu.....:eek:
So that's how United Park is going to meet the Premier Licencing Criteria

[pineapple stu]

Ive said before 2/3rds of the businesses in the country are struggling big time with cashflow problems and things arent getting any better its actually worse with commercial activity at a standstill.
No, you said before that 1/3rd of businesses are struggling (post 54). You've provided no evidence whatsoever for that either, and now it looks like you're making stuff up.

Individuals have an option to pay tax by DD, and even then it must come to pretty damn close what the final balance for the year is. I don't think companies have that option; that's why they have to do monthly P30s. If (if) Drogheda had a tax bill of E50k built up after one year that interested the Revenue this much, that's very bad management regardless of what spin you'd like to put on it.

Also, probably worth noting that no winding up order issued in the end.

[ndrog]

Right- I'm genuinely confused here- did Drogheda fall 50k behind or not? Was this cleared by Vincent Hoey? Is he still involved with the club or not?

Are you not the one who claimed all this in the first place :confused: So we presume you just made it up for some strange reason ...Your confused allright , very confused :mad:

[ndrog]

If you huddle together and hold them all up it'll look like a proper Stadiuuuuuu.....:eek:
So that's how United Park is going to meet the Premier Licencing Criteria

You have a looong way to go before your club meets Premier Licencing Criteria so i wouldnt be so smug .Lost interest in goings on down there a long time ago. Do cork still exist ?

[Macy]

What was the fire Macy????

The €100,000 needed to break even that was said by Sean above? I'm not clear whether it's that you are budgetting for raising an extra €100,000 to break even this coming season, or that's the hole in last seasons figures?

[tiktok]

You have a looong way to go before your club meets Premier Licencing Criteria so i wouldnt be so smug .Lost interest in goings on down there a long time ago. Do cork still exist ?

Ah diddums, it was a joke, untwist your knickers. I don't think Tommy No bobs has a hope of getting a Premier Division Licence [or any licence].

Cork still exists by the way, I'd say any map or atlas issued after 1850 would give a pretty good representation of where it is and it's size etc.,

[Mr A]

Are you not the one who claimed all this in the first place :confused:

I asked questions based on the newspaper and what was posted on your forum. None of this originated with me.


So we presume you just made it up for some strange reason ...Your confused allright , very confused :mad:

Oooooooooooo.K. Now can you answer the questions?

[SeanDrog]

The €100,000 needed to break even that was said by Sean above? I'm not clear whether it's that you are budgetting for raising an extra €100,000 to break even this coming season, or that's the hole in last seasons figures?


100k is this years budget requirement for fundraising etc to breakeven. Once the C&B club, gates, sponsorship etc are taken into account they beleive that 100k is required through additional sources (mainly fundraising I would imagine) to breakeven.

Your point about just reducing the budget by 100k is moot but (I am only repeating what I have heard , no inside info bar being a C&B member) I assume that to run a team in the premier has a base cost (interesting thread if somone wants to start one - what is the none playing staff cos of running a club) and we are sailing close if not on it hence we cannot reduce the budget by 100k otherwise we might as well apply for the 1st div (IMO).

The challenge for us as a club and group of supporters is to stay in the top flight and the club believe we have the plan in place to do so with the judged most realistic budget to do so.

We have a challenge as does every team for the fothcoming season but I suppose the difference is that we are communicating our exact challenge (off field) and tackling it head on. Its a pleasent change TBH as it allows us all to pull in the same direction. i.e. no more carzy spending and realisitic goals (ie last season survival, this season breakeven and hopefully a few places higher in the table, next season a few baby steps more).

The aim is that after each season we will have put in place more structures to help finance the club (ie C&B club). I am sure there is plenty we arent doing correctly but its not for lack of honest effort.

I know other supporters would be spectical as we went into examinership but things have and will continue to change in UTD PARK, it will take time but we are getting there.

[ndrog]

Success is falling behind with the revenue by over a grand a week (and getting it paid by a benefactor) when you already made a serious enemy of the taxman?

That dosent read like a question to me . You made a statement about a benefactor paying our debts , its not true . All payments to the revenue have been made and yes vincent is still involved in the club for whoever wants to know .

[Celdrog]

Despite all the bluster and critism of the Mail, there was a fire generating the smoke.

The indo are reporting we've issues with our licence, once again (thanks Mr A). Any idea's what they are this time?

Nothing too serious from what I've heard. There was a small amount of wages owed at the end of the season but as far as I know they were paid or being paid. Small amount owed to Revenue as well apparently but again they weren't too worried about it. Minor issues as the article says.

Amazing how some people (apart from Rovers fans, obviously) know the financial dealings of another club while not having a clue whats going on at their own club.:rolleyes:
I wonder have Longford paid their back wages or tax?
I know we have....

[Longfordian]

As far as I'm aware we have paid it. We have a tax clearance cert and I think all players were paid it was the final week's wages as far as I know somewhere around 2.5k. They're not expecting any Licensing issues from what I've heard anyway.

[Macy]

Amazing how some people (apart from Rovers fans, obviously) know the financial dealings of another club while not having a clue whats going on at their own club
Can you also link to the posts where I said that it was a non-story and tried to spin that everything was hunky dory?

[Celdrog]

You didn't - you said there were problems at our club but had to ask your own fans what was going on at Longford.

[Macy]

I don't know what's that strange about that tbh - some fans are obviously closer to what's going than others, never mind in terms of location. I'm not sure of the relevance really, bar a diversionary tactic.

[Celdrog]

A diversionary tactic - from what? Have the revenue issued a winding up order? The money had to be paid by last Friday according to the Daily Mail, even though it was cleared a few weeks before then:rolleyes:

It was a bull**** article, the lack of a revenue winding up order proves that. Several Drogs were on here immediately confirming it was false. Everyone else seems to be of the opinion that there was no substance in the story, yet me pointing out that you claim to know more about our club finances (after a bull**** story appears in the paper) than what goes on at your own club is a tactic to divert away from the fact that the revenue are winding us up.

Sweet God, I don't care what you believe, say it as often as you want, it still won't make it true.

[wexfordned]

A diversionary tactic - from what? Have the revenue issued a winding up order? The money had to be paid by last Friday according to the Daily Mail, even though it was cleared a few weeks before then:rolleyes:

It was a bull**** article, the lack of a revenue winding up order proves that. Several Drogs were on here immediately confirming it was false. Everyone else seems to be of the opinion that there was no substance in the story, yet me pointing out that you claim to know more about our club finances (after a bull**** story appears in the paper) than what goes on at your own club is a tactic to divert away from the fact that the revenue are winding us up.

Sweet God, I don't care what you believe, say it as often as you want, it still won't make it true.

I say the simplest way to solve this argument is ask the Shamrock fans on this board.

They are the self appointed guardians of the league & as they know everything that goes on behind the scenes in Dalymount some of them must know if there is any truth in this.

[SeanDrog]

I say the simplest way to solve this argument is ask the Shamrock fans on this board.

They are the self appointed guardians of the league & as they know everything that goes on behind the scenes in Dalymount some of them must know if there is any truth in this.

:D

time to lock thread - serving no purpose at this point.

[Macy]

Sweet God, I don't care what you believe, say it as often as you want, it still won't make it true.
But Sean's confirmed that you need €100,000 in extra fundraising to break even this season. And no one actually answered Mr A's question whether you were behind with the tax (accepting it is settled). I don't see what the big deal is about asking questions in those circumstances.

[BohsFans]

And no one actually answered Mr A's question whether you were behind with the tax (accepting it is settled). I don't see what the big deal is about asking questions in those circumstances.

Who the hell cares? Mr A and pineapple have far too much time on their hands imo. You're asking about a not for profit/companies tax details on an internet forum! Lets get Peter Halpin or Vincent Hoey on here to confirm it for the fans of small insignificant clubs like Finn Harps, Longford Town and UCD!:rolleyes:

Get a life lads!

[Mr A]

Football fans discuss football related matters on football forum shocker!

[Sam_Heggy]

to confirm it for the fans of small insignificant clubs like Finn Harps, Longford Town and UCD!:rolleyes:

Get a life lads!

Not called for.

Bohs fans usual responce to something they don't like is to call other fans clubs, small and insignificant.

Poor form.

[Longfordian]

It's the same when such small insignificant clubs are playing Bohs, especially in Dalyer. Their fans go into apoplexy if the opposition have the temerity not to roll over for the Big Club. "Come on Bohs deal with these f*ckin minnows!" was one cry that I remember particularly. It wasn't amazing wit either, yer man was genuinely angry.

[Celdrog]

It's the same when such small insignificant clubs are playing Bohs, especially in Dalyer. Their fans go into apoplexy if the opposition have the temerity not to roll over for the Big Club. "Come on Bohs deal with these f*ckin minnows!" was one cry that I remember particularly. It wasn't amazing wit either, yer man was genuinely angry.Who was he referring to, Longford, Albion, Danninger or the bank?

[Longfordian]

Longford were the particular irritant at the time but I'm sure much the same sentiments apply to the others!.

[pineapple stu]

Lads, if ye don't want to discuss the topic, don't bother posting on it; simple. Some want to discuss it, and stuff like "Who cares; your all stupid and bitter" is just trolling in that regard. Stay on topic or go to another thread, FFS.

[Schumi]

It's the same when such small insignificant clubs are playing Bohs, especially in Dalyer. Their fans go into apoplexy if the opposition have the temerity not to roll over for the Big Club. "Come on Bohs deal with these f*ckin minnows!" was one cry that I remember particularly. It wasn't amazing wit either, yer man was genuinely angry.

Ref usually sorts it out for them though.

[mr.untitled]

Lads, if ye don't want to discuss the topic, don't bother posting on it; simple.

I think the point is, this 'no smoke without fire' discussion is pointless and does no one any favours. Both the club and its fans have said that the article was rubbish yet some persist. For years everyone has been calling for more transparency. Our club announce that part of the annual budget will be made up by fund-raising and people are questioning it ????
I agree with Sean

[pineapple stu]

I think the current facts are -

> It was reported that Drogheda were threatened with a winding up order if tax wasn't paid.
> No winding up order has issued, so either the report was wrong or the tax was paid.
> This was discussed at a public meeting which had been arranged a week beforehand for the purposes of fundraising for the coming season.
> Drogheda's budget contains an income item of E100k from fundraising. This seems reasonable, in fairness, although there's not much of a safety net if the target isn't met.

The only real issue people are now querying is citizen smith's post on the Drogheda forum where he accepted that a balance of E50k was due, but that it had recently been paid. The questions then are - is he correct in what he says (and he puts himself about as one with the inside track, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's correct) and if he is correct, is it a concern that Drogheda built up a tax arrears of E50k less than a year after coming out of examinership? In addition, if citizen smith's post is correct, then it means that the newspaper article has some basis.

This is the post (which Mr A also alluded to) -


Tripe. Got it on the very best authority that the tax bill concerned (circa 50K) has already been settled. No prizes for guessing who by. Typicla ****stirring without the full facts.

[WindmillWarrior]

Citizen Smith is full of it at the best of times! From the same thread, this is the post you should be reading:

Revenue have not mentioned any winding up order. They have a strict (and rightly so) agreement with the club which is being settled.

[pineapple stu]

Citizen Smith is full of it at the best of times!
I thought that was just me. Good to hear someone else agree. :)

[John83]

Citizen Smith is full of it at the best of times!
I thought that was just me.
No, lots of people here are full of it. :p

[pineapple stu]

Ba dum tish!

[MeathDrog]

Lads, if ye don't want to discuss the topic, don't bother posting on it; simple. Some want to discuss it, and stuff like "Who cares; your all stupid and bitter" is just trolling in that regard. Stay on topic or go to another thread, FFS.
And be told the exact same thing on any other thread??