Brazil friendly?

[ifk101]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/internationals/8392932.stm

[dan o d]

last two friendlies against brazil have been fairly uninspiring. id rather play a big european team ie. germany holland or spain

[back of the net]

last two friendlies against brazil have been fairly uninspiring. id rather play a big european team ie. germany holland or spain

i would prefer a big european team myself, however the uninspiring game against brazil the last time was down to the fact that we had a temporary manager in charge who should have had his association with coaching our national sides, ended quite some time ago.....Mr Givens take a bow!!

[shakermaker1982]

hopefully my love for football is back by then!!!

I would have preferred Argentina/Spain or Holland myself.

[peadar1987]

I think we should play some games against Scotland, Wales and Norn Iron. Nice short trips for away supporters, none of us are playing at the world cup, and we'd have a better chance of winning, to improve our world ranking.

And I'd love to see a match or two against an LOI select, but I doubt that's going to happen.

[stiffler]

The Real World Cup Final!

[peadar1987]

The Real World Cup Final!

Ireland against Costa Rica?! :p

[tetsujin1979]

not really in favour of this, 3rd time playing Brazil in recent times, surely there are other teams in Europe we could play that would attract a big audience?

I would have preferred Argentina/Spain or Holland myself.
Argentina are set for the opening game in the Aviva

[Fester]

The Real World Cup Final!

Funny out :D

[Not Brazil]

I think we should play some games against Scotland, Wales and Norn Iron. Nice short trips for away supporters, none of us are playing at the world cup, and we'd have a better chance of winning, to improve our world ranking.


You've that to look forward to in 2011.

[Wolfie]

last two friendlies against brazil have been fairly uninspiring. id rather play a big european team ie. germany holland or spain

France would be handy..................

[seanfhear]

France would be handy..................
You beat me to it:p

[shakermaker1982]

Argentina are set for the opening game in the Aviva

I won't get tickets for that one though!!

[Schumi]

I think we should play some games against Scotland, Wales and Norn Iron.
Zzzzz. We'll have enough of that in the next few years anyway.

[peadar1987]

Zzzzz. We'll have enough of that in the next few years anyway.

I don't see why the Zzzzz was called for, I'm actually really excited about the 4 nations torunament. You never hear the rugby heads going "Oh no, not another crucial 6 nations match against England at Croker", so why should the football equivalent draw any less excitement?

[dan o d]

beacause wales and scotland are a great deal better at rugby than they are at football!

[Schumi]

You never hear the rugby heads going "Oh no, not another crucial 6 nations match against England at Croker", so why should the football equivalent draw any less excitement?

We're not playing England in this for a start. Besides that, Wales, Scotland and the North are mediocre sides at best. Would you honestly be more interested in a friendly against Scotland than Spain or Germany?

[jbyrne]

We're not playing England in this for a start. Besides that, Wales, Scotland and the North are mediocre sides at best. Would you honestly be more interested in a friendly against Scotland than Spain or Germany?

but how often do we play the likes of spain or germany? the little bit of competitive edge the home tournament brings is far more desireable than a non event brazil friendly that is nothing more than a photo op

[irishultra]

Competition against the North? Yes
Competitions against Wales and Scotland? Not a chance. Nobody will go to these games. Theres no rivalry. What do Irish know about Scotland or Wales? More of a rivalry with Poland or hell Lithuania I'd say.

[Schumi]

the little bit of competitive edge the home tournament brings is far more desireable than a non event brazil friendly that is nothing more than a photo opWill there be much of a competitive edge to this? I can't imagine there being much prestige to winning the tournament.

I agree on the Brazil friendly by the way, nearly everyone who wants to see Brazil play in Dublin has at this stage. There must be other more interesting teams available.

[peadar1987]

We're not playing England in this for a start. Besides that, Wales, Scotland and the North are mediocre sides at best. Would you honestly be more interested in a friendly against Scotland than Spain or Germany?

Well seeing as I live in Scotland, I'd be very interested in a friendly against them! And I was using the six nations as an example of another sport where we play the same teams repeatedly, yet don't get bored of it. I could (and probably should) have used Wales or Scotland in the example.



Competition against the North? Yes
Competitions against Wales and Scotland? Not a chance. Nobody will go to these games. Theres no rivalry. What do Irish know about Scotland or Wales? More of a rivalry with Poland or hell Lithuania I'd say.

Who do we have a rivalry with? England and the North, and that's pretty much it. Cyprus, maybe?!

And your post reveals the problem with the Irish event junkie attitude. We won't even go to watch our national team in a tournament if it's not against a glamour team we deem worthy of our attention. At least if we play against Scotland or Wales, there's some chance of them bringing over some supporters.

[Schumi]

I was using the six nations as an example of another sport where we play the same teams repeatedly, yet don't get bored of it. I could (and probably should) have used Wales or Scotland in the example.But those rugby teams are good!

I don't have any particular problem with friendlies against those teams (although at current ticket prices, the value's not very good), they just wouldn't be anywhere near my top choices and the tournament doesn't excite me at all.

[Newryrep]

I think we should play some games against Scotland, Wales and Norn Iron. Nice short trips for away supporters, none of us are playing at the world cup, and we'd have a better chance of winning, to improve our world ranking.

And I'd love to see a match or two against an LOI select, but I doubt that's going to happen.

TBH I would rather play anybody but those ones

The rugby analogy is a total red herring. Different crowd altogether, all their games are competative and there are only a dozen major rugby countrys in the world and only half a dozen in this neck of the woods.

As regards competative ? TBH if its not the WC or EC I couldnt give a monkeys about the result - granted it probably wouldnt do our ranking anygood but Celtic Cup - hopefully will be strangled at birth

[peadar1987]

As regards competative ? TBH if its not the WC or EC I couldnt give a monkeys about the result - granted it probably wouldnt do our ranking anygood but Celtic Cup - hopefully will be strangled at birth

Why? Just because it hasn't got the golden stamp of approval from FIFA and UEFA's money-making division doesn't mean it's not worth winning.

I actually relish the chance to see Ireland win any tournament, whether it's organised by FIFA, UEFA, or individual associations. I know if we won the 4 nations tournament, I'd be immensely proud to be Irish, and knowing we'd earned that trophy, and anyone who says any different is probably lying.

[Newryrep]

Why? Just because it hasn't got the golden stamp of approval from FIFA and UEFA's money-making division doesn't mean it's not worth winning.

I actually relish the chance to see Ireland win any tournament, whether it's organised by FIFA, UEFA, or individual associations. I know if we won the 4 nations tournament, I'd be immensely proud to be Irish, and knowing we'd earned that trophy, and anyone who says any different is probably lying.

Bald men and comb spring to mind

Are you not immensely proud now to be Irish ?

[Riddickcule]

Scotland would be a brilliant option, not NI or Eng disaster waiting to happen i'm afraid.

On second thought, wouldn't mind a Scandinavian team, Denmark, Sweden or Norway

[Murfinator]

I can't think of anything more boring than playing somebody like Scotland in a friendly. Total snorefest, technically abysmal team who throw themselves about enough to try and bring the opposition down to their level. no thanks.

[Murfinator]

Why? Just because it hasn't got the golden stamp of approval from FIFA and UEFA's money-making division doesn't mean it's not worth winning.

I actually relish the chance to see Ireland win any tournament, whether it's organised by FIFA, UEFA, or individual associations. I know if we won the 4 nations tournament, I'd be immensely proud to be Irish, and knowing we'd earned that trophy, and anyone who says any different is probably lying.

There's no pride to be gained from beating 3 abysmal teams, only shame from potentially losing to them. It's a no win competition for us.

[peadar1987]

I can't think of anything more boring than playing somebody like Scotland in a friendly. Total snorefest, technically abysmal team who throw themselves about enough to try and bring the opposition down to their level. no thanks.

That's quite shocking arrogance!

So only teams in the top ten are good enough for the mighty Irish to play against? It's a good thing for you that the Brazilians, Spanish and Dutch don't share your contempt for lower-ranked nations, because if they did, then we'd never get to play exhibitions against them.

[eaststand85]

I can't think of anything more boring than playing somebody like Scotland in a friendly. Total snorefest, technically abysmal team who throw themselves about enough to try and bring the opposition down to their level. no thanks.

I know some people will take offence at this but sounds a bit like us (up until recently perhaps) to be honest.

[Closed Account 2]

Russia, Croatia, Hungary, Bosnia, Turkey - these would be good games that would actually test us and those teams would all be available in the summer.

[Closed Account]

We should use Friendlies to get the optimum number of ranking points.
Edgar here (http://foot.ie/forums/showpost.php?p=1249791&postcount=220) said that he offered his services to the FAI to suggest games to move us up the rankings. Wonder if he'd still be willing to do it.

[finbarrk]

hopefully my love for football is back by then!!!

I would have preferred Argentina/Spain or Holland myself.
I thought we had Argentina next year allready?

[ifk101]

The words that catched my attention when reading about the proposed Brazil friendly were "money" and "spinner". Personally I'd like us to wait until the Euro 2012 draw, see who we get, and play friendlies against teams with similar styles of play to those of the top seeds we have been drawn against. But Brazil again, and Brazil don't come cheap, plus factoring in the lost revenues from failing to qualify for the WC (did this more than anything else motivate the manner of the FAI's actions in the aftermatch of the French game?) and then the cost of the Lansdowne Rd project/ slow ticket sales - all brings you to wonder is there cause for concern?

[Ash]

On second thought, wouldn't mind a Scandinavian team, Denmark, Sweden or Norway

Those 3 games have 0-0 written all over them :p

seeing as we have the Argentina game already, from the WC10 qualifiers I'd like for us to play Spain and then any from Portugal, Japan, Ghana, Cameroon, Ivory Coast depending on how many games we play.

[Gather round]

Zzzzz. We'll have enough of that in the next few years anyway

Er, what's the problem with playing one of your neighbors next year as well as in the 2011 tournament? Which may not become a regular thing anyway.


We're not playing England in this for a start. Besides that, Wales, Scotland and the North are mediocre sides at best. Would you honestly be more interested in a friendly against Scotland than Spain or Germany?

Mediocre sides tend to play other mediocre sides, basically because the top dogs want to play each other.

As a NI fan, I'm all for an occasional game with Tartanarnia. Close, cheap, there's always some edge and we haven't forgiven the b*st*rds yet for doing a runner from the Home internationals ;)


Competition against the North? Yes. Competitions against Wales and Scotland? Not a chance. Nobody will go to these games. Theres no rivalry. What do Irish know about Scotland or Wales? More of a rivalry with Poland or hell Lithuania I'd say

Ha ha. If you can nearly fill Croke for a nothing game against the Black Mountain-top, fans will turn out for your neighbors with even a minor trophy at stake. I imagine fans of the Scottish club sides that are the first and fourth best supported teams in Ireland know a bit about the country?

[ifk101]

Er, what's the problem with playing one of your neighbors next year as well as in the 2011 tournament? Which may not become a regular thing anyway.

It'd be similar to Ireland playing against a regional Connacht select. Those from connacht might be interested in the game but would it capture the imagination of the rest of the country?


Mediocre sides tend to play other mediocre sides, basically because the top dogs want to play each other.

Yes and why would we want to play NI then?


As a NI fan, I'm all for an occasional game with Tartanarnia. Close, cheap, there's always some edge and we haven't forgiven the b*st*rds yet for doing a runner from the Home internationals ;)

I thought you were going to bring up something about national anthems there ;)

[Gather round]

Will there be much of a competitive edge to this? I can't imagine there being much prestige to winning the tournament

Not the highest priority for the players, but the fans will take it seriously enough I think. The four teams have managed ONE successful qualification between us from 20 attempts in the last 10 years. Any success is welcome.


TBH I would rather play anybody but those ones

OK, but presumably for reasons other than boredom. A friendly against a weak, defensive, unsupported Kazakhstan or Moldova might not be a bundle of laughs either.


Celtic Cup - hopefully will be strangled at birth

I know anecdotally (basically from reading this forum and the Tartan Army MB equivalent) that there's plenty of opposition in the two bigger countries, but I've feeling it may be reasonably well supported come the time. I'd give it a chance.


Scotland would be a brilliant option, not NI or Eng disaster waiting to happen i'm afraid

I recognise your concerns. There must be a risk of crowd trouble at either game. On the other hand, you'll have to play England in a tournament sometime (and us when you manage to get into a different seeding pot).

There must also be the possibility of a British team making the Europa League final in Dublin 2011, so a game with England could act as a 'rehearsal' for that.


There's no pride to be gained from beating 3 abysmal teams, only shame from potentially losing to them. It's a no win competition for us

There's no 'shame' per se in losing to similarly-ranked teams, which Scotland and Northern Ireland are. You need to recognise your own place in the grand scheme- third rate over the last three tournaments and thus seeded for the next; 19th in Europe on the basis of the qualifiers just finished.

PS morning IFK. Shouldn't you be in hibernation with all the other nordic trolls?

[ifk101]

PS morning IFK. Shouldn't you be in hibernation with all the other nordic trolls?

Gather round

(a) Games against NI would not fill Croke Park
(b) Games against NI would not cover the rental costs of Croke Park
(c) The "fans" won't pay to watch games against NI.

Games against Brazil on the other hand .....

[peadar1987]

Gather round

(a) Games against NI would not fill Croke Park
(b) Games against NI would not cover the rental costs of Croke Park
(c) The "fans" won't pay to watch games against NI.

Games against Brazil on the other hand .....

I would pay to watch a game against NI at Croke Park. Does that mean I'm not a fan?

[jbyrne]

Gather round

(a) Games against NI would not fill Croke Park
(b) Games against NI would not cover the rental costs of Croke Park
(c) The "fans" won't pay to watch games against NI.

Games against Brazil on the other hand .....

games will be in lansdowne

[ifk101]

I would pay to watch a game against NI at Croke Park. Does that mean I'm not a fan?

Fan and "fan" - there's a difference. Figure it out for yourself.

Point is that it costs around €1.5 million to rent Croke Park a game. To break-even that's 30,000 paying €50 a ticket. I couldn't imagine more than 15,000 turning up for a friendly against NI.


games will be in lansdowne

Hopefully ;).

[Gather round]

Gather round

(a) Games against NI would not fill Croke Park...Games against Brazil on the other hand ...

If NI (or Scotland, or Wales) and Brazil were the only choices and teams available, by all means book Brazil and get a bigger crowd.

They aren't the only choices.


(b) Games against NI would not cover the rental costs of Croke Park

b1) play it in Limerick or Tallaght

b2) apart from Brazil, who else would cover Croke's costs? England, Spain, Germany, Argentina, maybe Netherlands or Portugal? I don't see that NI would attract a significiantly lower crowd than anyone else. If all the big boys are unavailable, you'd presumably prefer to have Scotland or Wales than an eastern European country who are no or little better and wouldn't draw many fans?


(c) The "fans" won't pay to watch games against NI

How do you know? They've turned out in number for recent friendlies and against weak oppo in qualifiers.


Fan and "fan" - there's a difference. Figure it out for yourself

Why not just explain it?


Point is that it costs around €1.5 million to rent Croke Park a game. To break-even that's 30,000 paying €50 a ticket. I couldn't imagine more than 15,000 turning up for a friendly against NI

How many do you expect to turn up to watch either

a) any one of the half dozen countries realistically likely to challenge for the World Cup, or

b) anyone else from Europe or a visiting N/S/American, African, Asian country?

If the answer to b) is a lot less than 30,000, you could be looking at a significant loss.

[Newryrep]

[QUOTE=Gather round;1287805]

OK, but presumably for reasons other than boredom. A friendly against a weak, defensive, unsupported Kazakhstan or Moldova might not be a bundle of laughs either.


I know anecdotally (basically from reading this forum and the Tartan Army MB equivalent) that there's plenty of opposition in the two bigger countries, but I've feeling it may be reasonably well supported come the time. I'd give it a chance [QUOTE]

Maybe not but if we draw them later in a campaign they might not be the unknown quantity they once were. what exactly are we going to learn about playing a team of similar style ?

I agree with the opposition, the only reason the irish games in LR will be well supported will because of fans afraid to lose their place in the BB scheme. If we are being forced to pay which we essentially are I would prefer to see something exotic/different than a Scotland B team (or a Scotland A team for that manner).

Games against Northern Ireland will most likely attact every village idiot from a 200 m radius
Games against Scotland - again due to Mageady/MaCarthy the Scots are not that enamoured with Ireland
Games against Wales - will not exactly set the pulses racing

Nothing to be gained from a footballing sense, potential difficculties off field - its a no brainer.

[ifk101]

How do you know? They've turned out in number for recent friendlies and against weak oppo in qualifiers.

The games against Australia and South Africa, both played in Thomond, attracted small crowds - something like 19,000 for Australia and 11,000 for South Africa.

The FAI also bundles ticket sales. For example, the matches for the Italian and Montenegro games were sold as a pair - ie to see the Italian game you had to purchase a ticket for the Montenegro game as well.

Based on my own observations, I'd guess that a competitive game (ie qualifier) against NI would attract a crowd of 40,000. For a friendly I'd imagine the crowd would be around 15,000.

[dan o d]

surely a competitive game against northern ireland wud be a sell-out?

[Gather round]

If we are being forced to pay which we essentially are I would prefer to see something exotic/different than a Scotland B team (or a Scotland A team for that manner)

OK, I know you want exoticism, but only a few teams are really exotic (in the sense of attracting widespread interest rather than just being difficult to find on the map of Europe). None of the exotic teams may be available.


Games against Northern Ireland will most likely attact every village idiot from a 200 m radius

12,000 for the 1999 friendly I believe. Not sure of the idiot quotient. Although it clashed with the Scottish cup final (featuring Celtic) on TV ;)

I think your point might counter IFK's. Yes, trouble is a real possibility. But it (with other factors) would see a much higher crowd


Games against Scotland - again due to Mageady/MaCarthy the Scots are not that enamoured with Ireland

I think the Glasgow media exaggerated this a bit. One top player and a promising youngster lost, they're over it.


Games against Wales - will not exactly set the pulses racing

That's the thing about friendlies. 3-4,000 Welsh fans in Dublin will move more lentils than an eastern u-21 side and a handful of fans.


Nothing to be gained from a footballing sense, potential difficculties off field - its a no brainer

There's something to be gained from all friendlies. A sparkling win over Hungary might reveal more than a sterile 0-0 with the Maracana globetrotters.

Point taken, you don't want to play NI and to a lesser extent Scotland. Not a problem- I doubt you'd be the first choice for us or them either.

[ifk101]

surely a competitive game against northern ireland wud be a sell-out?

I don't think so. If it was the last game in the group that decided qualification - maybe. Otherwise I think there'd be plenty of empty seats. For example, if you consider the home game against Bulgaria - a very important match in deciding the group outcome - it was far from a sell-out.

[Gather round]

The games against Australia and South Africa, both played in Thomond, attracted small crowds - something like 19,000 for Australia and 11,000 for South Africa

Fair enough, although I think you underrate 19,000- without knowing the background to publicising the game etc., I call it a decent crowd. I expect NI would attract a similar crowd to Limerick.


The FAI also bundles ticket sales. For example, the matches for the Italian and Montenegro games were sold as a pair - ie to see the Italian game you had to purchase a ticket for the Montenegro game as well

Correct me if wrong, but weren't the tickets for Georgia/ Cyprus/ Bulgaria sold individually to those without block bookings? Did all three games not draw decent crowds? NI would be at least an equal draw, as above.


Based on my own observations, I'd guess that a competitive game (ie qualifier) against NI would attract a crowd of 40,000. For a friendly I'd imagine the crowd would be around 15,000

What are your observations (genuine question)? They just look like random figures to me.

[Wolfie]

The 2011 tournament will be as good or as bad as the teams and supporters allow it to be.

If the players are motivated enough to try and win the competition and supporters "buy in" to some healthy competition between neighbours - it could prove a bit more valuable than an aribitrary friendly, where most of the opposition are half hearted anyway.

Sceptiscism and indifference will certainly kill it off before a ball is kicked. I'm not sure Trapp would subscribe to this attitiude.

Anyway, on a lighter note - there's bragging rights at stake here!!