France V Ireland - Wednesday, 18th November 2009 - World Cup 2010 Playoff Second Leg

[back of the net]

Im just back in the door from paris lads.................just lost for words.

As per most of you, im just devastated over last night.

All i want to say is that im so proud of the team ,the manager, the back room staff and of course the fans.

Looking around at the support we gave the team in stadium just made me so proud.
The world cup wil be alot worse off without the Boys in Green and their Green Army.

[centre mid]

It wont matter a jot to FIFA what we do, I'm sure you could join in with the public sector marches that are planned, they will have the same effect on the budget.

[markmc]

Sorry to repeat myself but is there no support out there for some sort of a aprotest demonstation to show that we refuse to be bullied by FIFA, get a march going in O Connell street and get it on TV - the world would undoubtedly take notice!!!

How about a protest outside the French embassy?

[markmc]

I'm sure you could join in with the public sector marches that are planned

I dont have a beard so they probably wont let me march with them.

[tiktok]

Sorry to repeat myself but is there no support out there for some sort of a aprotest demonstation to show that we refuse to be bullied by FIFA, get a march going in O Connell street and get it on TV - the world would undoubtedly take notice!!!

The world doesn't care ffs.
If it was Slovenia losing out to Russia in similar circumstances a thread on it wouldn't get to a second page on here.

[irishultra]

once the leagues return around europe over the weekend it will be forgotten about.

[Scooby Doo]

The world doesn't care ffs.
If it was Slovenia losing out to Russia in similar circumstances a thread on it wouldn't get to a second page on here.
The world obviously does care ffs. Check out Times, NY Times, France24, Fox - all running it as a major story. But fair enough, maybe FIFA secretly check up on foot.ie and will sit up and take notice of our online whinging. Best fans in the world...

[endabob1]

Give it a week and it'll be old news, FIFA keeping quiet waiting for the storm to pass before quietly getting on with the draw.

[tiktok]

The world obviously does care ffs. Check out Times, NY Times, France24, Fox - all running it as a major story. But fair enough, maybe FIFA secretly check up on foot.ie and will sit up and take notice of our online whinging. Best fans in the world...

Check all those sites tomorrow!
It's an interesting sports story on a slow news day, that fella who hit the crossbar at the rugby game a few days ago got worldwide coverage for a day too.

The world doesn't give a toss ffs.
Why would FIFA take notice of a protest on O'Connell Street?

[richieos]

Changing the tune a bit here lads but i thought damien duff was absolutely outstanding last night. He gave absolutely everything he had just like all the lads, and it almost seemed as if the yard of pace he lost had returned, he has a few years left in him yet. Absolutely shattered, fair play to all the lads, the coaching staff and the fans.

[Scooby Doo]

Check all those sites tomorrow!
It's an interesting sports story on a slow news day, that fella who hit the crossbar at the rugby game a few days ago got worldwide coverage for a day too.

The world doesn't give a toss ffs.
Why would FIFA take notice of a protest on O'Connell Street?
Because it would receive international coverage and as I said would demonstrate that Irish fans are not pushovers. Are you telling me that a colourful citycentre protest by YBIG, for example, and a crowd of noisy Ireland fans wouldn't be a major story on Sky Sports News. They'd have f*ckin helicopters covering it. The tabloids would eat it up and eventually the story spreads. I'm not saying it would definately work but what is the harm in fans voicing their utter disgust.

[L.T.F.C.]

If Robbie Keane or Kevin Doyle did the same and Ireland went through would ye be complaining.

no probably not, but we still would be guilty to know that we cheated our way to south africa.

[tiktok]

Because it would receive international coverage and as I said would demonstrate that Irish fans are not pushovers.

Who exactly is trying to push us over? Every supporter of every club or country has suffered an example of this before. Maybe not in the same level, but it's hardly a new phenomenon that a footballer gains an unfair advantage and officials miss it.


. Are you telling me that a colourful citycentre protest by YBIG, for example, and a crowd of noisy Ireland fans wouldn't be a major story on Sky Sports News.

I'm sure SSN would cover it, unless of course Wayne Rooney was eating an interesting sandwich. Would the world care though? No.


. I'm not saying it would definately work.

I'm saying it definitely wouldn't.

[Fixer82]

lads we're all getting bogged down with feeling sorry for ourselves here and feeling cheated and hard done by. And we are indeed all immensely proud of our team....
but jaysus we should have put them away in 90 minutes. Doyle, Keane, Duff, O'Shea.
we had the chances and didnt take them. Nobody is talking about that.

It was a great display that should have gotten us to penalties and then who knows what would've happened. Also, if we'd have played like that in the group games I've no doubt we would have won the group....

Just putting things into perspective a little bit before mass hysteria really kicks in

[as_i_say]

http://www.kontraband.com/pics/20500/Cheating-Surrender-Monkey/?gpage=11#show

:D

[markmc]

Here is another replay case. Minor offense also.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football-leeds-ordered-to-play-third-match-1555300.html

[DeNiro]

Teachers' Union?

Big hitters now.

Well, they might go on strike if they don't get their way. We don't want that now do we.

[bgille]

Dear all,
I am proud to write my first message on this thread.
Let me introduce myself, I am a french guy.
And definitely, what I've seen yesterday was a great game !
A great game from Ireland !

I consider that my country, France, has stolen Ireland's place to the 2010 Championchip...
Be proud of your team !
Be proud of yourself !
Be proud of your football !
You have been the best team on the fild yesterday. You should have won that game, it is obvious !
I am not proud of The French team. I am not proud of Thierry Henry's fault.
You are right, I consider it as a shame.
But I can't really blame him because such things can occur in live action, when a football player is engaged in the game, he act and think after... whatever the country he is playing for... he just plays football...
But what I really can't accept, it is the comment done after the game by French officials, by the french players, or by our coach...
Do they have forgotten what honnor is?
haw can Thierry Henry says that the ball cames to his hand !?! he controlled the ball with his hands. it is obvious ! has he forgotten that we all have seen the video replay many times ?
Why don't he simply admit that in live, he had done a mistake? an error is human and we can understand this but it is different of lying !!!
How can our coach or the french federation president feel happy with such victory?
Is it really a victory?
Many people have talked today in France about yesterday game. from what I have heard, many people feel embarassed with this goal...
Of course many are happy to be qualified but they don't feel happy enough to sing and shout as it should have been the case in case or legal victory.

I really hope the game will be replayed !
How happy i should be to see one more time Ireland playing football. And you know what? If the game is replayued, I will be An Ireland Supporter !

thank you for you great spirit and sorry for this stolen victory.


Please Be proud !!!
Ireland can be proud!

let me applause your team !

PS : sorry for my poor english as this is not my native language.

[Den Perry]

The whole Henry affair is getting totally out of hand. Ireland should have had the game wrapped up in full time if Doyle, Duff or Keane took one their gilt-edged chances. They only have themselves to blame, same old hard luck story from the brave Irish. Fair enough Henry clearly handled the ball twice. The referee and assistants missed it. But these things happen in football, just have to roll with the punches, referees make mistakes. Perhaps it's karma with Ireland getting out of jail on a couple of occasions during the qualifying campaign with generous refereeing decisions (eg Jouni Hyytia awarding Ireland a penalty for a "dubious at best" handball against Georgia). How many Irish were crying foul then?! The FAI and Dermot Ahern (trying to score some cheap political points) are making asses of themselves. It is a good argument for video tech or to follow the Europa League example who have an extra assistant behind the goal to prevent it happening again. But nothing more will come of this affair. Its time to just accept it even though it's a bitter pill to swallow. These things happen in football, let sleeping dogs lie.

The chances we missed are irrelevant to the fact that we were cheated

Ok, we got a very dodgy penalty against Georgia, but had a stone wall peno denied against Montenegro away.

That said, I don't really agree with the game being replayed.However, I do agree with creating as musch fuss as possible.Henry is a cheat - he admitted to getting Puyol sent off in Euro qualifiers

[Stuttgart88]

The world doesn't care ffs.
If it was Slovenia losing out to Russia in similar circumstances a thread on it wouldn't get to a second page on here.One of the best and most famous players in the world cheats blatantly in a high profile game. That's why it's big news, duh.

[Stuttgart88]

Yes, we should have scored ourselves. Probably 6 gilt edged chances in 2 games.

That's one issue.

Another is that Thierry Henry is a cheat and a hypocrite, or at least was last night. How he had the gall to sit down and shed crocodile tears beside the collossal Richard Dunne I'll never understand. Are there no depths?

No replay for me, but a lot of fuss. No harm whatsoever little Ireland flying the flag against FIFA and it's corrupt and anti-sporting ways. As Patrick Barclays asked in the Times recently, if England has to schmoozle up to creeps like Jack Walker to get the WC then maybe they just shouldn't bid.

Very proud of the lads and only a deluded tool would deny that the support was fantastic. Nobody is saying "best fans in the world" - that's a myth that the domestic football talebann love to bring up - but they were superb last night.

[Alf Honn]

It's a dead end at this stage.

Why was Delaney not calling for this rematch on the airwaves at 7am this morning instead of featuring on every radio/tv progrm from 4.30-8pm today?


According to him, whatever Trap says is gospel. Yet, two hours after the manager says at 2pm there's not as ass's roar chance of a rematch, the CEO takes a completely diff view.


Seems to me he's trying to milk it for a few days at the expense of giving fans false hopes for a game that's never going to happen.


I suppose, imo, he needs to keep the FAI centrestage in the public arena when there's reportedly only 2,500 of these 10,000 robbery 10-yr tickets for the Aviva Stadium sold.

[tiktok]

One of the best and most famous players in the world cheats blatantly in a high profile game. That's why it's big news, duh.

No, actually it's not.

It's only big news because we didn't get through. If one of the best and most famous players in the world cheated blatantly in a high profile game last night but we were already two up, no-one would care. The cheating isn't the issue, the result of that cheating on Ireland is the story.

duh.

It'll be a small story come 5.45 on Saturday when everyone goes back to checking the Premiership results. The Sundays will pick at it next weekend, but it'll fade after that.

[geysir]

Another is that Thierry Henry is a cheat and a hypocrite, or at least was last night. How he had the gall to sit down and shed crocodile tears beside the collossal Richard Dunne I'll never understand. Are there no depths?

Did you cop on that it was a hand ball by Henry or were you just going by Shay's reaction?

[SkStu]

in fairness it is a huge story worldwide, has made all the news here and in arsehole canada thats saying something!!!

[Stuttgart88]

Did you cop on that it was a hand ball by Henry or were you just going by Shay's reaction?What's that got to do with anything?

I was 150 yards away. I only copped on by Shay's reaction and then the texts I got a minute later.

[Billsthoughts]

Very proud of the lads and only a deluded tool would deny that the support was fantastic. Nobody is saying "best fans in the world" - that's a myth that the domestic football talebann love to bring up - but they were superb last night.

?bit of an unfair generalisation there? most of the league fans seem to go to the games as well..

anyway regardless....great game and agree am happy with the fuss but would be embarressed by a replay.

[Stuttgart88]

It's only big news because we didn't get through. If one of the best and most famous players in the world cheated blatantly in a high profile game last night but we were already two up, no-one would care. The cheating isn't the issue, the result of that cheating on Ireland is the story.

duh.

It'll be a small story come 5.45 on Saturday when everyone goes back to checking the Premiership results. The Sundays will pick at it next weekend, but it'll fade after that.Big news because big star cheats to affect outcome. That bit was assumed as given but you obviously need everything spelt out. You were saying the world doesn't care & that it'd be a non-issue if it was a Slovenian. It was Thierry Henry, global superstar so it is news.

No, it's not as big or long lasting an issue as climate change or global poverty (which the world doesn't seem to care about either as you insist on peing pedantic) but it is big news as scooby & stu point out. France is mortified.

[Stuttgart88]

?bit of an unfair generalisation there? yeah maybe Bill but there are some as you know - a few of whom have started threads on the ssue recently, which is why it was forefront in my mind. I was only referring to the LOI talebann, which isn't all the LOI.

[geysir]

What's that got to do with anything?

I was 150 yards away. I only copped on by Shay's reaction and then the texts I got a minute later.

I was only curious as to what you could see of the incident at the game or if it was also replayed on the big screen.

[kingdom hoop]

The cheating isn't the issue, the result of that cheating on Ireland is the story.

duh.



The "duh" is well positioned. Obviously if some high-profile person, say the Garda Commissioner, breaks the speed-limit it might register as small news. But if such speeding leads to the death of someone, the headlines will scream much louder. Sometimes it can take a horrifying result to draw the necessary attention to common misbehaviour.

That's the way we learn things, and we shouldn't feel the episode is overblown just because little Ireland was the victim.

[The Fly]

Like everyone else, I am shocked, angry and disgusted at the events of last night. To have been the superior side throughout and to then fail to qualify for the World Cup due to a disgraceful act of cheating is very hard to take.

Just a few points;

I am getting annoyed at the absolving of blame for Henry in some quarters. I've lost count of the amount of times I have heard that what he did was instinctive, inferring somehow that that diminishes his culpability somewhat. Since when is it instinctive to handle the ball in association football? Err...duhh - it isn't! To the best of my knowledge Henry wasn't playing basketball or gaelic football last night. He handled the ball to keep it in play and then, as if once wasn't enough, he decided to palm the ball to his leg to assist Gallas. HE CHEATED!!!
His reputation is now tarnished!
I will never buy Gillette products again ;)

The nightmare scenario for FIFA and for football as a whole is the possibility that France go on to win the World Cup in South Africa next summer. FIFA would get what it deserves!


Football lost it's soul for me last night - although some might say it lost it long ago!

[tiktok]

Big news because big star cheats to affect outcome. That bit was assumed as given but you obviously need everything spelt out. You were saying the world doesn't care & that it'd be a non-issue if it was a Slovenian. It was Thierry Henry, global superstar so it is news.

No, it's not as big or long lasting an issue as climate change or global poverty (which the world doesn't seem to care about either as you insist on peing pedantic) but it is big news as scooby & stu point out. France is mortified.

Everyone who cheats does so to affect outcome.
As for it being Henry, are you claiming there would be less outrage if if had been Malouda.
The World doesn't care, they may be mildly interested but they'll swiftly move on. I never suggested it would be a non issue if it was a Slovenian, it would be the same issue, but we [as the outside world if it had been] would have been mildly interested, but wouldn't care.

As I insist on being a pedant, it's spelt Taliban

[tetsujin1979]

I was only curious as to what you could see of the incident at the game or if it was also replayed on the big screen.

no, but I don't think any replays were shown on the big screen. Certainly none of the chances were, and I don't remember Robbie's goal been shown there
I didn't know anything about the incident until the lads around me started getting text messages

[tiktok]

That's the way we learn things, and we shouldn't feel the episode is overblown just because little Ireland was the victim.

If it leads FIFA to look at video referees, then something will have been learned.
The national association demanding a replay, calls for protests, foreign affairs and sports ministers lodging official complaints is what's making me feel it's overblown.

I'm disgusted that we've gone out in such a way when we deserved to go through, but some of the wailing and gnashing of teeth is pathetic.

[NeilMcD]

Dont have the time or patience to read the whole thread. But just like to add that was the finest performance by an Irish side that I have been lucky enough to attend. Every single one of the players can be proud. It was an honour to support them in the stadium and to be part of the supporters who are a credit to the nation. It was a great night to be Irish. This forum is full of knockers and cynics and wannabe Dunphys who love to knock everything iln the guise of rigorous criticism. However as in most forums it is all hot air and swapping of overbloated opions of which I am guilty of also. However there is a groundswell of people who are willing to do things that as supporters that we can change, and we have seen teh effect over the last few games.

From 18 months ago this team were the laughing stong of the nation and those of us that go to the games were getting slagged and abused for supporting them from many people. Well I held my head up high comilng back into Dublin airport tonight and I have always been and will continue to be proud supporter of the Irish football team.

Feck the begrudgers, the cynics, the wannabe critics. Lets support the team and use this and other forums as a means to create a better atmosphere and give our team a greater chance to qualify for major tournaments.

Come on you Boys in Green.

[Stuttgart88]

Everyone who cheats does so to affect outcome.
You were saying that the outcome was what made the cheating the issue, the cheating by itself wouldn't have been a big deal if it was unlikely to have affected the result.

If it had been at 2-0 rather than at 1-0 the outcome would have been affected in that it'd have finished 2-1. I'm talking about the bigger outcome - the direct qualification of France rather than the likelihood of a penalty shoot out. Come on man, you're back tracking on a lot of your points.

I think if it had been Malouda we'd have been just as outraged but it mighn't have been news in NY or Canada. That's why I think Henry's profile is a factor in the scale of the story.

I've seen Talibann / Talebann spelt both ways by the way. Can we move on? (edit: or even just with one "n" !)

I agree that getting Cowen & Ahearn involved is OTT. We were hard done by, just as we were in Heysel all those years ago. It was a formative factor in my bonding with the BIG. Hopefully last night will create a legion of new fans (and players) in the same manner.

[Thunderblaster]

David Ginola made an apology on BBC 2's Newsnight tonight.

[OwenGoal]

Ah, the French. Watched the game in an Irish pub in France, where I,m a long term resident. On the way there the streets were filled with cars blaring their horns in premature celebration and I thought it not at all surprising. Turns out it was Algerian supporters after their game -- the French don't get that passionate.

The outcome was inevitable. But the reaction of the French around me was the most galling (pun intended). No leaping around, no pouring out onto the streets. Just a momentary hubbub.

Vous pouvez confirmier le meme chose chez vous, Le Bleu, Giuly et autres?

First I thought it was just the usual emotional constipation. But, after reading the views on a few French forums, I wonder was it shame. The reaction in the wider community has actually stunned me. It's provoked one of those crises of confidence and identity the French specialise in. They really don't like being the object of the world's opprobrium - imagined or otherwise. The intellectuals have jumped all over it but even the punters are very unhappy with events, and nothing but kudos for the Irish team.

So a replay after a bout of national soul-searching? Just maybe, but probably not.

French PM Francois Fillon would appear to have put the kaibosh on Cowen's clumsy overtures at the EU summit, saying the Irish government should stay out of football.

Ah the French, at least they can't patronise me this time.

[Stuttgart88]

Front page of Le Figaro is about Henry, with a small piece on the new EU president. It's big news in France not just Ireland.

[markmc]

Front page of Le Figaro is about Henry, with a small piece on the new EU president. It's big news in France not just Ireland.

Even the yanks are looking at it.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/?eref=sinav

[Closed Account 2]

Just got back from Paris, and what can you say after such a crushing blow... I was too far away to really see what went on at the time in precise detail (goal was at the far end to where I was standing). But you could tell that a huge contraversy had occured. Given was incandescant and 2-3 other players were speaking to the ref. Then they went to the linesman (who you have to say really should have seen it) - and the ref was next to the linesman for what seemed like an age. There was obviously a huge doubt in the ref's mind, we all know that video evidence was used in the world cup final (and seemingly at the confederations cup) but not last night...

It's horrible to go out in such fashion and as a fan its very upsetting - I can't even imagine what the players are thinking now, no player can expect to go to more than 5 world cups (even if he's Brazilian) and who knows when these ones will get another chance.

We can look back at the campaign with immense pride, and our players have grown tremendously as individuals and as a team over the last 2 years. Ones like St. Ledger, Andrews and Whelan have been brilliant despite hardly featuring before the qualifiers. We've not been outclassed by any team in qualification and last night we finally managed to beat a big team away from home (over the 90 mins). I would say no team would want to draw us as third seeds (assuming we are) in the Euro Qualification. None of this seems to really matter at the moment, but we should all acknowledge the efforts of the manager and players... fair play to them for throwing their shirts to the fans at the end and coming over to us, they must have been feeling sick with the injustice. I think Trap is only around for the next campaign (Euro2012) I hope he can be persuaded to have another crack at the World Cup in 2014 - I know he has family commitments but I think he must feel there is also unfinished business ahead.

Last night was what we all feared back in September when they said the playoffs would be seeded, some dubious botched decision favouring a big side. It probably wasnt a conspiracy, but it's just another case of a small country being bullied by a combination of big reputations/countries and bloated hierarchical organisations (FIFA / UEFA / Swiss-based federations etc). I dont think there will be replay and I dont really know if there should be one - I do wish the Lisbon vote was now so we could all vote no just to stick it to them*

* I know the world cup has little to do with political integration and FIFA / UEFA and the EU are not the same, but at this heated irrational moment I feel they're all similar.

I'll leave this as the last word:

"You have to be fair in football - you have to be honest and well done to you if you've won, but you have to win in a good way."



T. Henry, Stade de France, Arsenal 1 - 2 Barcelona, 16-05-2006.

[LeBleu]

Ah, the French. Watched the game in an Irish pub in France, where I,m a long term resident. On the way there the streets were filled with cars blaring their horns in premature celebration and I thought it not at all surprising. Turns out it was Algerian supporters after their game -- the French don't get that passionate.

The outcome was inevitable. But the reaction of the French around me was the most galling (pun intended). No leaping around, no pouring out onto the streets. Just a momentary hubbub.

Vous pouvez confirmier le meme chose chez vous, Le Bleu, Giuly et autres?

First I thought it was just the usual emotional constipation. But, after reading the views on a few French forums, I wonder was it shame. The reaction in the wider community has actually stunned me. It's provoked one of those crises of confidence and identity the French specialise in. They really don't like being the object of the world's opprobrium - imagined or otherwise. The intellectuals have jumped all over it but even the punters are very unhappy with events, and nothing but kudos for the Irish team.

So a replay after a bout of national soul-searching? Just maybe, but probably not.

French PM Francois Fillon would appear to have put the kaibosh on Cowen's clumsy overtures at the EU summit, saying the Irish government should stay out of football.

Ah the French, at least they can't patronise me this time.


2 years very difficult for a french supporter. Lots of match "de merde" with a stupid and pretentious coach surrounded by lazy players who don't arrive to remove their finger out of their arse (french expression).

I wished a big game with passion and sweat. I saw dancers against warriors. I wanted a reason to be proud.

I was for france, but at the 103 min with this shameful goal,with this indecent joy on the field. I couldn't, I wanted see Ireland scores and kick the arse of those usurpers.

I'm angry against frenchteam (except Evra & Lloris) and french federation.

My feeling is largely shared in france.

And "the cherry on the cake" we continue with the same staff in South Africa.

Pauvre football.

[Closed Account 2]

2 years very difficult for a french supporter. Lots of match "de merde" with a stupid and pretentious coach surrounded by lazy players who don't arrive to remove their finger out of their arse (french expression).

I wished a big game with passion and sweat. I saw dancers against warriors. I wanted a reason to be proud.

I was for france, but at the 103 min with this shameful goal,with this indecent joy on the field. I couldn't, I wanted see Ireland scores and kick the arse of those usurpers.

I'm angry against frenchteam (except Evra & Lloris) and french federation.

My feeling is largely shared in france.

And "the cherry on the cake" we continue with the same staff in South Africa.

Pauvre football.

Actually lots of French people said this on the metro on the way back. One of the stewards was so embarresed he gave the match ball (or one of the ones on the sidelines) to a little kid in an Ireland shirt a few rows in front of me.

[IsMiseSean]

Dear all,
I am proud to write my first message on this thread.
Let me introduce myself, I am a french guy.
And definitely, what I've seen yesterday was a great game !
A great game from Ireland !

Fair play buddy. If it was one of the Ireland players that won the game this way, i'd be happy for the game to be replayed.
Its a shame the French FA dont feel the same....

[IsMiseSean]

And you have one damn good keeper in Lloris

[Crosby87]

IS there any chance the game would be replayed? Im guessing no, but I ask anyway.

[SkStu]

Lloris is an excellent keeper - agreed. Some super saves and confident and in control of his area.

[jebus]

bit of perspective on the way Ireland came across in the past 24 hours for ye lads

nibS1aoowNg

[Jicked]

Just home and don't really know what to say. Those who were there probably won't forget the look us fans have been giving each other on metros and streets around paris, a shrug of the shoulders and a look of bewilderment. It sounds so hyperbolic but it really is a similar thing to how ppl act after a death. Ridiculous i know.

Thank you so much to mr trapattoni for building a great team from scratch, and to the brave players who i feel awful for. I couldn't possibly go through each player who has been magnificent during this campaign, but robbie for me has just been unreal this campaign. A captain we can be so proud of. My heart broke for shay when he came over to us at the end pointing to his arm and then gesturing No.

Les bleus and france should be ashamed of henry. Most seem to be. After the game the fans i talked to were mocking us, smugly saying that these things happen in football and it was our own fault for not finishing them off earlier. Today after everyone saw replays and how obvious and embarassing the cheating was the attitude changed, literally a dozen times i was approached by french men, women and children apologising and talking at length about how bad they felt.

F+ck henry and f+ck FIFA