Euro 2012 draw

[dan o d]

im prayin for-
croatia
sweden
ireland
latvia
lichtenstein
san marino

[Razors left peg]

whats the most difficult group we could get...Im lazy and havent even looked at the seedings

[TheBoss]

God love the optimists! I may be mistaken but I think we have only once ever topped our group and that was for Euro 88. Not sure we could top our group in a group like Italy/Portugal/Holland, England/Russia/Turkey and Slovakia/Bosniia . So, for example, if we draw Italy, England and Slovakia you'd still be reasonably optimistic that, not only would we qualify, but that we would top our group?

I can see Ireland getting something from the away games against the teams I have mentioned and have a good chance of beating them at Home, Its not optimism, its more realistic thinking. In all the away games that Ireland played, they were pretty impressive. We can not England and Italy but say, England are a good team, but only at the back, in other areas, they lack togetherness, and will rely on Rooney too much. Slovakia were in a group with very little quality, Ireland would have breezed through that group in fairness.

[Colbert Report]

Here's a link to the pots.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2012_qualifying

[Gather round]

Slovakia were in a group with very little quality, Ireland would have breezed through that group in fairness

In fairness to who? All the groups are of roughly the same quality, that's the whole point of a seeded draw. Your 18 points would only have managed third place in the Slovakia and NI group, hardly a breeze. You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnow, everyone else in ours got at least seven.

[pineapple stu]

.....The draw for the Euro 2012 qualifying stages takes place in Warsaw this Sunday morning at 11am, with live coverage on RTE Two television and online at www.rte.ie (http://www.rte.ie/live), hosted by Peter Collins with studio analysis from John Giles and Kenny Cunningham.
Anyone know if it's on t'radio?

[Paulie]

In fairness to who? All the groups are of roughly the same quality, that's the whole point of a seeded draw. Your 18 points would only have managed third place in the Slovakia and NI group, hardly a breeze. You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnow, everyone else in ours got at least seven.

You're not honestly trying to say that just because Montenegro were in the same seedings group as the likes of San Marino for the last WC campaign, that they are of a similar standard? We both know that Montenegro were in that group as that was their first qualifying campaign as an independent state, and therefore had not had the opportunity to gather enough ranking points to move them up the international teams rankings table.

[twoenz]

Here the group i would like
GERMANY
DENMARK
IRELAND
WALES
ICELAND
LUXEMBOURG ;)


Apart from the ease of reaching all the away matches, it'd be a nightmare to get out of.

[TheBoss]

In fairness to who? All the groups are of roughly the same quality, that's the whole point of a seeded draw. Your 18 points would only have managed third place in the Slovakia and NI group, hardly a breeze. You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnow, everyone else in ours got at least seven.

Put it this way, most teams would have wanted to be in that group.

[Gather round]

You're not honestly trying to say that just because Montenegro were in the same seedings group as the likes of San Marino for the last WC campaign, that they are of a similar standard?

No, I'm not implying anything of the sort. I said the groups were of roughly equal standard.


We both know that Montenegro were in that group as that was their first qualifying campaign as an independent state, and therefore had not had the opportunity to gather enough ranking points to move them up the international teams rankings table

Yes, so what? They're a very small country, with a limited playing pool, and unlikely to become a giant of international football. At worst you could have felt slightly hard done by in having effectively two fifth-rate teams in your pool, with no real minnow. It's a bit of a leap from that to assuming that a team unable to score against Montenegro or beat Bulgaria would breeze past Czechia, Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia.

[mypost]

You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnow, everyone else in ours got at least seven.

As it was, we won both games against the team that finished bottom of the group, so Montenegro weren't that bad a "minnow" after all.

[Gather round]

Put it this way, most teams would have wanted to be in that group

How can you be so sure? The other top seeds included Portugal, Greece and Croatia, as well as the Czechs. Good teams all but hardly World-beaters. Apart from the Poles, the second seeds included Israel, Bulgaria and Scotland.

[Paulie]

No, I'm not implying anything of the sort. I said the groups were of roughly equal standard.



Yes, so what? They're a very small country, with a limited playing pool, and unlikely to become a giant of international football. At worst you could have felt slightly hard done by in having effectively two fifth-rate teams in your pool, with no real minnow. It's a bit of a leap from that to assuming that a team unable to score against Montenegro or beat Bulgaria would breeze past Czechia, Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia.

Firstly, by saying "You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnows, everyone else in ours got at least 7", you are drawing a direct comparison between San Marino and Montenegro. It's a ridiculous comparison. That's a fact.

Secondly, you're correct in saying that we drew 0-0 in both of these fixtures. However, the first fixture against them (away) was early on in the group and considering some of the players available to them, regardless of their seeding, this was viewed as a reasonable result. Not brilliant by any means, but we were content enough with four points from our first two fixtures away to Georgia and Montenegro. The home fixture was irrelevant as it was our last group fixture and we had already secured the playoff spot, with first spot being out of reach to us.

Lastly, I wouldn't assume that we would "breeze past" any of the teams you mention above. Currently though, I don't think it would be beyond us to get 4 out of 6 points against all of them. If we get a reasonable group, I have great hope that we can qualify for the next Euros. This is based on our away form and the hope that if the lessons of the last group are learned with regard to attacking a bit more at home, and the eradication of stupid individual mistakes as opposed to a breakdown in the working of the defensive unit, we can push on and make the most of the opportunities presented to us.

[Bungle]

The group I want

Croatia, Denmark (very good team but we would edge these games I think), Macedonia (could take points off Croatia and probs the poorest in pot 4), Liechtenstein, San Marino.

Predictions;
Ireland 1 Croatia 1, Croatia 0 Ireland 0, Ireland 2 Denmark 1, Denmark 0 Ireland 0, Ireland 1 Macedonia 0, Macedonia 1 Ireland 2, Ireland 4 Liechtenstein 0, Liechtenstein 1 Ireland 3, Ireland 5 SM 0, SM 0 Ireland 2.

The group I would hate

Spain, Serbia, Slovenia, Montenegro, Azerbaijan

Predictions;
Ireland 0 Spain 1, Spain 2 Ireland 1, Ireland 1 Serbia 1, Serbia 1 Ireland 1, Ireland 0 Slovenia 0, Slovenia 1 Ireland 1, Ireland 2 Montenegro 1, Montenegro 1 Ireland 1, Ireland 2 Azerbaijan 0, Azerbaijan 0 Ireland 1.

[Gather round]

Firstly, by saying "You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnows, everyone else in ours got at least 7", you are drawing a direct comparison between San Marino and Montenegro. It's a ridiculous comparison. That's a fact

Gently exaggerated for effect rather than ridiculous, I think. We drew the lowest-ranked minnow, you the highest. You shouldn't overrate Montenegro, over 10 games they still only managed nine points with one win.

To even things up a bit, we drew four and fifth seeds good enough to see off Czechia, Poland and Russia; you got Cyprus and Georgia. As I said, overall the groups tend to be of roughly even standard. So I'd distinguish a bit more carefully between fact and partial opinion, if I were you.


Secondly, you're correct in saying that we drew 0-0 in both of these fixtures. However etc. etc.

You drew both games because in both you weren't good enough to win. Fact. Apart from anything else, four more points might have got you second seeding this time?


Lastly, I wouldn't assume that we would "breeze past" any of the teams you mention above

Fair enough, I was answering another poster who did.

[stiffler]

Gently exaggerated for effect rather than ridiculous, I think. We drew the lowest-ranked minnow, you the highest. You shouldn't overrate Montenegro, over 10 games they still only managed nine points with one win.

.


Which is the same number of points you got for the previous world cup qualifying campaign!! :D

[Uncle_Joe]

....and we're back!

Russia
Slovakia
Macedonia
Armenia
Andora

It could have been a hell of a lot worse. Russia or Croatia are probably the worst of the top seeds. Slovakia dont particularly scare me. We should be able to get Macedonia home and away, as with Armenia and Andora.
Sometimes you have to wait for the chance to get an easier group to crawl up the rankings. Hopefully we can take this chance and make it easier for ourselves to qualify for future tournament.

24 points should do it!:cool:

[pineapple stu]

Have to be reasonably happy with that. We've done OK against Russia and Slovakia in recent campaigns - one point against Russia and four against Slovakia; get that again and it's a huge step to coming second. Can keep an eye on Slovakia in the World Cup too.

Armenia starting to grow on me for a trip away.

[finbarrk]

A few costly away trips there.

[dan o d]

good group for us. a lot hinges on whether hiddink extends his current contract with russia beyond this june, which is unlikely

[Supreme feet]

Very happy with the draw. We avoided more difficult first/second seed pairings like Germany-Turkey, Italy-Serbia, Holland-Sweden, Spain-Czech Republic and Portugal-Denmark, while also avoiding the better lower seeds, such as Belgium and Albania. On paper at least, it's kind in comparison to the other groups.

Russia, having failed to qualify for the last two World Cups, can be flakey during qualifying campaigns. They certainly don't have the consistency of a France, Germany or Italy, who seem to cruise through qualifying without necessarily playing well. However, they have enough good players to beat anyone, particularly in Moscow, and they have a few very promising youngsters, including Dzagoev. A plus for us is that Hiddink probably won't be there come September. A minus is that the Ruskies will probably be doubly determined to reach the finals, having lost out this year. They're certainly beatable in Lansdowne Road, though.

Slovakia were very impressive in qualifying, dropping only eight points. They were quite workmanlike and ordinary when we played them in 2007, but they've added a bit of flair since then in Weiss and Hamsik. They've been playing well, but the question remains if they can maintain that form over two campaigns. Most small countries do suffer 'second campaign syndrome' (think of us after 2002) for whatever reason, and hopefully Trap will have them figured out after the World Cup. On paper, they're at about the same level as Bulgaria. 4 points is achievable.

Macedonia will be a difficult away trip, but I saw Scotland beat them last September, and they didn't look up to much. A lot like Montenegro, except for Jovetic, read Pandev. We should be disappointed if we don't take six points off them, as I expect Russia to do so.

The only problem with Armenia is the long trip. We should give beat them comfortably if we're not too jet-lagged in Yerevan. As for Andorra, well at least we have a couple of 'easy' competitive games for a change.

Overall, it's a group we can win. A lot will depend on injuries, and the possibility of Slovakia and Russia dropping points against the weaker teams. We need Trap to fill out the squad a bit, and be more adventurous in the home games. We got away with dropping six points at home in the last campaign - we will need to take maximum points at Lansdowne this time. We can't afford to drop more than 8 points overall.

[TrapAPony]

....and we're back!

Russia
Slovakia
Macedonia
Armenia
Andora

It could have been a hell of a lot worse. Russia or Croatia are probably the worst of the top seeds. Slovakia dont particularly scare me. We should be able to get Macedonia home and away, as with Armenia and Andora.
Sometimes you have to wait for the chance to get an easier group to crawl up the rankings. Hopefully we can take this chance and make it easier for ourselves to qualify for future tournament.

24 points should do it!:cool:

Aside from Slovakia and Russia away, Macedonia & Armenia away could be very tricky ties for us though. Spain only beat Armenia 2-1 in Yerevan and they beat Belgium there in their last World Cup group game so are capable of doing something on their day. Macedonia beat Scotland & Iceland at home, drew 0-0 with Norway & only lost 2-1 to Holland there in their World Cup Qualifying campaign. However, that being said, we still have a great chance of topping this group & that's what we should be aiming for.

[elroy]

I think this is as good a group as we could have hoped for.
Russia are a beatable first seed.
I dont know much about Slovakia but obviously they have progressed since our last meetings, it will interesting to watch them this summer. I think we should play them early in the campaign as they may very well have a WC hangover.
Armenia and Andorra should both be six pointers, cant accept anything less there.
Macedonia is tricky, need to be careful what time of year we play there......see Scotland lost there last time out. But are they a more difficult prospect than say Cyprus were, no way.

Overall, with the progress we have made in the last 2 years, with promising talent coming up through the ranks and a good blend of experience not to mention a very competent manager in particular away from home, we should for the first time in a while be realistically aiming to top this group!

[Greenforever]

Have to be reasonably happy with that. We've done OK against Russia and Slovakia in recent campaigns - one point against Russia and four against Slovakia; get that again and it's a huge step to coming second. Can keep an eye on Slovakia in the World Cup too.

Armenia starting to grow on me for a trip away.

Come on Stu, have to be looking for at least 3 points off the Russians, really looking forward to this group, we have a great chance, would love to see the Russina game played in Pertersburg but will be there regardless.

[pineapple stu]

You're misreading my post.

[Closed Account 2]

Russia
Slovakia
Republic of Ireland
Macedonia
Armenia
Andorra

It's do-able, a decent enough draw without being a walkover. Russia are potentially very hard and I'd even take 3 points from the possible 6 against them at this stage, a winter match in Moscow would be a nightmare. But we have a great chance of second, and if the Russians do slip up which could well happen if Hiddink is given the boot, we could pip them for first place. In any case we should be more than capable of winning all the games bar Moscow and Skopje, and for the latter if Pandev is out we've a good chance there too.

As I say it could have been worse. For instance Finland's group (Dutch, Sweden, Finland, Hungarians, Moldovans, Dan Marino) is much harder - while the Dutch are beatable for a pot one team, the Swedes are very compact and functional (if totally devoid of flair and skill) and could stagnate both games to 0-0 - which was their game plan vs the Portuguese last time. The Hungarians are also on the up and have a number of talented players, nothing like the Puskas heyday but still a problem, especially in the Nepstadion. Moldova are a tricky team, they caused the Israelis and even the Greeks problems in the last set of matches, again a fixture out in Kishinev would be, potentially, a big banana skin. The North also have a bit of a nightmare group from a third pot perspective, with Italy, Slovenia, Serbia.

Our group and Spain's group are the only groups in which there are no repeat fixtures from WC2010 qualification. From a selfish point of view one of Iceland, Kazakhstan, Belarus or Finland (even Israel at a push) would have been nice as that would have meant visiting a new country...

[TheBoss]

Very pleased with the draw, we should be competing for first place. Russia are a good side but not great, they have been over-rated for the last few years imo. We should give them a good battle and Slovakia, decent side, but Ireland are better than them. Hopefully the team can perform in these games, cause if they do, we are able to top this group.

[Closed Account 2]

Have to be reasonably happy with that. We've done OK against Russia and Slovakia in recent campaigns - one point against Russia and four against Slovakia; get that again and it's a huge step to coming second. Can keep an eye on Slovakia in the World Cup too.

Armenia starting to grow on me for a trip away.

Sort your hotel / hostel for this asap!

[pineapple stu]

Why say you that?

Also, saw somewhere that the fixtures meeting is on the 28th.

[shakermaker1982]

I'm very happy with the draw. I'd expect us to finish at least second.

Good to be back! Missed the place.

[Closed Account 2]

Why say you that?

Also, saw somewhere that the fixtures meeting is on the 28th.

I was there in May / June this year and there is not a huge amount of accomadation. I ended up staying with the friend of a colleague, but there are about 3 hostels in total in Yerevan, 2 of them are about 30EUR a night. Most of the hotels there are business orientated, if you book early you might get a good deal on them, otherwise it could be expensive. One other thing to note is flights could be expensive, I'd advise flying to Trabzon then getting a bus via Batumi... of course if the Turkish Armenian border opens by 2011 you could get a cheap flight to Kars and then it would be a 2-3 hour drive.

[SkStu]

very exciting draw - should be aiming for first place for this one.

[Yard of Pace]

The draw is an absolute gift after being in with France, Germany and Italy in the last 3. If we play as we did in St. Denis we're capable of tearing every one of these sides a new one. Trap's had time, he has some new options, a great draw........please God this time.

[Greenbod]

Don't think we could have got a better draw!............."moral compensation" anyone???

[SalvadorSanchez]

hoping to go to the Armenia game
Yerevan is actually a nice lttle city, was there in May, everything interesting is in the centre and you can walk pretty much everywhere in the city centre, foods good, beer cheap and the locals are friendly.
There's a nice little park dead in the centre with all bars and restaurants.
just avoid the cops, the strip clubs and accept that you'll be fleeced in taxis and it'll be alright.
1000 drams (€2) will cover most taxi rides in the centre.
1,500 drams should get you 2 beers and vodka in most bars meaning you can get smashed on €20...

[mypost]

Very pleased with the draw, we should be competing for first place. Russia are a good side but not great, they have been over-rated for the last few years imo. We should give them a good battle and Slovakia, decent side, but Ireland are better than them. Hopefully the team can perform in these games, cause if they do, we are able to top this group.

Moscow is tough for everybody, players and fans, Macedonia away will be hard, and we know what our history there is.

Could have been worse football wise, not a great group for travelling, but fortunately we avoided that trek to Indo-China, only because Armenia were sent to our group as Azerbaijan were already in Group 1. Belgium have it instead.

The fixtures meeting is down for the 20th of the month, and as sure as eggs are eggs, we'll be looking to get Moscow out of the way asap.

[newrynyuk]

I echo the sentiments of the posters here, it's a good draw, albeit a ruddy expensive one travel wise.

Croatia aside, Russia were probably the weakest of the top seeds. By the time we play them, Hiddink will probably be in charge at Liverpool (please?) Man United or Juventus. Winning the group is a far from fanciful notion.

Can anyone confirm that the fuxtures will be decided on the 28th? I'd like to see a Russia Armenia away double header for this September, with a Slovakia Macedonia away double header next September. Away to Andorra in Barcelona in June would be ideal too.

BTW, notice the way the UEFA fella at the draw said that Georgia and Russia and Armenia and Azerbaijan were to be kept apart "Due to special circumstances". I suppose "Otherwise they'll kill each other" might be a bit close to the bone...

[Hibernian]

The more I think about the draw the more happy I am with it. There tricky games away but maybe bar Moscow there all chances to get 3 points too.

When you look at group Northern Ireland or Scotland got we cant complain.

[Acornvilla]

11-13 points away from home in those games is very achievable and 11-15 at home really so things looking good :)

[eaststand85]

Think this was about as good a draw as we could have dared hope for and while it gives us a chance of topping the group, what could prove even more important is that it also gives us a chance of qualifying automatically as the best second placed team (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2012_qualifying).

The fixtures meeting has provisionally been arranged for Feb 20th in Bratislava (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2010/0208/1224263953535.html).

[Acornvilla]

yep we could easily come second with a points total of 22-25 or so and probably be the best runner up

[keenanboy]

Quite happy with the draw,
got caught up in the romantic notion of getting the French again and avenging Paris but in hindsight I'm happy that it didn't happen,

Need to get Slovakia and Russia away put to bed this September/October. I fancy Slovakia as an away trip but I heard some nasty stuff about what happened our fans over in Russia in 2002.
I think England fans got a similar dose on their visit recently. Might do Armenia or Macedonia away for the experience too.

Obvious challenges are in Russia and slovakia but for once I didn't wince as the draw unfolded.
Here's to a favourable fixture schedule on the 20th and the usual scramble foor flights/tickets and accommodation.
Do we dare to dream again?

[Acornvilla]

if it wasnt for dreaming i'd kill myself :)

[Drumcondra 69er]

In fairness to who? All the groups are of roughly the same quality, that's the whole point of a seeded draw. Your 18 points would only have managed third place in the Slovakia and NI group, hardly a breeze. You couldn't score a single goal against the group minnow, everyone else in ours got at least seven.

Anyone else find this statement priceless following that draw?? :D

You still think all groups ared roughly the same quality? Because I wouldn't swap ours with yours for all the tea in China.....

[sheao]

Not a bad draw overall. If we play to the same level as we did against France and Italy last year then we may have a great chance to win the group. But can we reach that level every game against weaker oppisition, we have in the past played poorly against the so called weaker nations.

[stojkovic]

Delighted with the draw and think we could easily win it with abit of luck and hard work and an attacking philosphy.
Terrible draw for the travelling support though.
Probably just do Macedonia and Barcelona. Armenia could be an adventure.
Wont be going anywhere near Moscow or Bratislava.

[tricky_colour]

Seems, a decent draw, the only negative is last time we had Russia in the group we got beat home and away,
but that was then and this is now, so to speak.

Russia are FIFA ranked 13, unlucky for some, hopefully not us :D
Slovakia are ranked 36, just one point above us.

In the last group I think we had two in the top 10, in cluding the number one?

And it toolk a cheating Frenchman to stop is that time :cool:

[mypost]

Seems, a decent draw, the only negative is last time we had Russia in the group we got beat home and away,
but that was then and this is now, so to speak.

We took 1 point from 6 against Russia last time, they went on to the finals, while we as top seeds, stayed at home.

To get the best runner-up, we'll need 23 points or so from 10 games, -6 from Andorra, which would leave us with 17. Then it's down to goal difference, head-to-heads, and all manner of other complicated criteria to determine who qualifies, and who faces a play-off.

[ifk101]

I'm happy with the draw. There are some tricky away ties there but they are still games I feel we should be relatively confident of winning. On paper it is a much easier group than our WC group so a strong second place finish in the group should be the minimum of our expectations levels for the campaign.

[Gather round]

Anyone else find this statement priceless following that draw?? :D

You still think all groups ared roughly the same quality? Because I wouldn't swap ours with yours for all the tea in China.....

Aye, roughly. Of course I realise with three in-form World Cup finalists in our group it'll be difficult. I reckon we'll finish third or fourth, you'll be second or third.

But you never know, see you for a coffee in Wroclaw or Dnepropetrovsk ;)