League Cup shenanigans

[Acornvilla]

id agree that if ye dont play a full team waterford have an exelent chance but mabe your second string will take it as a chance to get into the team and everyone wants to win a medal who knows when you will get a chance again!

[A N Mouse]

So you check before agreeing the "deal".

Wouldn't surprise me at all if the FAI forgot until it was too late. We asked them last year before the fixtures came out to not give us a game on one specific Saturday. They could have given us a home game (Friday) or 9 of 11 away games (all Fridays), but they gave us a Saturday game. The level of idiocy in there is unreal.

Exactly.

Still that's a few more leads for these magic beans. :D

[roinuj]

get a life bohs ffs,
6 of your away fixtures per season are no more then half an hour from dalymount. and drogheda and dundalk under an hour.
just as well your not based in cork or waterford where the nearest fixture is 50 miles away and the furtherest 300 miles.

so ye have a 2 hour spin to derry and a 15 minute spin to tallagh.
whinge whinge whinge.

[Acornvilla]

very good point!:D

[OneRedArmy]

so ye have a 2 hour spin to derry and a 15 minute spin to tallagh.Whilst I agree with the sentiment of your post, can I ask I ask what kind of vehicle you'd do either of those journeys in?

[SkStu]

Whilst I agree with the sentiment of your post, can I ask I ask what kind of vehicle you'd do either of those journeys in?

We had advanced plans and designs for a Bohs catapult. Though they might have been shelved since Carroll went bust ;)

Id like a count of how many people have missed the point of this thread. Roinuj being the latest in a long line of posters to demonstrate their complete lack of ability to understand the point being made.

[A N Mouse]

Id like a count of how many people have missed the point of this thread. Roinuj being the latest in a long line of posters to demonstrate their complete lack of ability to understand the point being made.

Genuinely, what is this point that people are missing?

That the FAI went back on some 'agreement'?

We've seen the FAI's response to this.

While people are more than willing to believe the worst of the FAI why would Bohs agree to something that they should have know required Derry's consent, without first seeking it?

I have asked for evidence of an agreement, or anything that might show the fai were entitled to make such a unilateral fixture change.

Is the entire argument predicated on what was said it the interview in the OP?


We were lead to believe that if we agreed to play the game in Waterford that we wouldn't be ask to travel to Derry on Tuesday. Oddly enough the powers that be decided we had to go to Derry on Tuesday after being in Waterford on saturday. I think that's out of order.

My big concern with that is the health and safety of the players.

When pressed on the matter he elaborates


We were told to hang on until the cup replays were sorted out. Going out of the cup we thought that might free up a date where we might have been playing in the semi final of the cup. But the powers that be having asked us to wait, and getting knocked out of the cup, they find there's not a date for the game. It baffles me, but doesn't surprise me.

So was there a cast iron agreement? or were there, possibly, conditions?

Again it sounds remarkable similar to what was said here
http://www.eleven-a-side.com/shamrockrovers/news.asp?n=32916

There's the begining of a pattern here.

Yet anyone suggesting ulterior motives is castigated as missing the point. I take it the bohs fans talking about travel and 3 games in a week are also missing the point?

And yes Bohs did agree to play the game in Waterford. So could the fact that they're not kicking up a fuss about this broken 'agreement' possibly indicate ulterior motives on their part? Are they hoping for a larger crowd? Or perhaps they recieved other concessions? ;) That rebuttal from the fai was quite precise over what assurance were not given.

[BohDiddley]

Still waiting for a response from Mr Rice or from the fervent defenders of FAI as to how the League Cup Final venue was settled, if not as part of an understanding with Bohs.

[A N Mouse]

Still waiting for a response from Mr Rice or from the fervent defenders of FAI as to how the League Cup Final venue was settled, if not as part of an understanding with Bohs.

Yes, yes, very good, Bohs agreed to play in Waterford.

Now, what exactly did they agree to?

And do you think they be interested in some magic beans?

Could you answer some of my questions now? Some have been there since saturday :p

[SkStu]

Genuinely, what is this point that people are missing?

That the FAI went back on some 'agreement'?


bingo. Blue Peter badge for you.

What it isnt a case of, as is being weirdly and consistently suggested by a lot of posters, is that Bohs are complaining about travelling. We are complaining about the complete horsesh!t that came out of the FAI in terms of giving us "assurances". Its not unreasonable that there is a bit of ill feeling.

But if youre (not you ANM) going to add to the thread, at least read it and be aware what it is that is being complained about, dont just bash us cos its fashionable ;) and makes you feel like a tough guy (not you ANM). :)

[Réiteoir]

http://www.examiner.ie/sport/soccer/domestic/furious-fenlon-issues-ea-cup-final-threat-101361.html

Furious Fenlon issues EA Cup final threat

By Charlie Stuart
Monday, September 21, 2009

ANGRY Bohemians boss Pat Fenlon may field a reserve team in next Saturday’s televised showpiece EA League Cup final against Waterford United at the RSC after his club was ordered to play their rearranged Premier Division league game against Derry City at the Brandywell on the following Tuesday.

That Derry game comes just three days before the crunch Premier Division clash with Shamrock Rovers at Tallaght Stadium and means a hectic schedule of three away games in seven days.

"We are going to have to look at this situation. Without being disrespectful to the League Cup, or to Waterford, or EA, I don’t think it’s going to be the kind of game they’re expecting, to be honest," said Fenlon.

The Bohemians boss will not be making any official protest even though he says had been given assurances that the Derry game, originally scheduled for this Friday, would not be played on Tuesday week.

"What’s the point in protesting? You’re talking to the wall, so there’s no point. It doesn’t surprise me. The problem is that you have to take into account what you’re asking players to do, and it’s dangerous.

"You’re asking players to travel to games the length and breadth of the country. The Waterford game is on a Saturday, not a Friday, and we’ve given up home advantage to go to Waterford to make a spectacle of the game.

"But what can I do? It doesn’t surprise me. It’s like moving the chairs around, you’ve still got the same people running it. It’s not going to change. Surprisingly some of the people involved have played the game so they should know better."

Fenlon will not reveal what top individual gave him an assurance that the Derry game would be moved for fear of having another fine imposed on him.

"I’m not going to say, I got a fine for talking my mind on the MNS show so I won’t give people the credence to go and fine me again.

"We haven’t got any money here so I’ll have to pay that myself but it’s very disappointing the way we’ve been treated.

"The players at this club, over the last two years in particular, have given tremendous entertainment to the fans in this league and represented the club in Europe, and to be treated the way they’ve been treated this week is scandalous."

Fenlon claims it would not be disrespectful to field an under-strength side in the EA Cup final against Waterford on Saturday. "I’m not disrespectful. I have the height of regard for Waterford United, they’re a fantastic football club. Stephen Henderson has done a fantastic job wherever he’s been and he’s a great manager and a good friend.

"I’m not being disrespectful to anyone in Waterford but I’ve got to look after what we’ve got to look after and that’s what I’ll be doing."

[BohDiddley]

http://www.examiner.ie/sport/soccer/domestic/furious-fenlon-issues-ea-cup-final-threat-101361.html

Fenlon will not reveal what top individual gave him an assurance that the Derry game would be moved

Wonder who that is?

[A N Mouse]

bingo. Blue Peter badge for you.

What it isnt a case of, as is being weirdly and consistently suggested by a lot of posters, is that Bohs are complaining about travelling. We are complaining about the complete horsesh!t that came out of the FAI in terms of giving us "assurances". Its not unreasonable that there is a bit of ill feeling.

But if youre (not you ANM) going to add to the thread, at least read it and be aware what it is that is being complained about, dont just bash us cos its fashionable ;) and makes you feel like a tough guy (not you ANM). :)

Ok then once again genuinely

Can the fai make such an agreement in the first place, without consulting Derry?

And let us say for the sake of argument sake they could and did. - Given one of fenlon's main gripes seems to be the H&S of his players wrt travelling and three games in a week, would the fai - who are supposed to look after everyone's interests - not be within their rights to come back and say:

Ah well now pat we'd love to accommodate you an all. But you see to do so Derry would have to play 9 games in four weeks, and we can't very well say to them - Pat is a bit worried about his players playing three games in a week - would you ever mind fitting them in there. Sure you'd only be playing 9 games in four week

[SkStu]

putting aside the fact that they should have asked Derry first (which i agree with by the way and i dont condemn Derry for looking after themselves, which is what we were trying to do for ourselves), its not a one-sided deal where we are just complaining for the sake of it - the FAI got what they wanted out of this! The consideration awarded to Bohs for accommodating their request is NIL.

[Quadruple1928]

A statement of lies from the FAI:rolleyes: A club meeting was set for the Tuesday night, a meeting would never have been set for that date had the FAI not gave Bohs assurances about the game not being on the Tuesday.


Spot on ref, let's all go to the FAI and try and get matches changed to suit us. All Bohs are being asked to do is to play a mid week game, big deal. As for Bohs supporters saying they could have had a toss of a coin, sure we all know Bohs don't have a toss of the coin, like they didn't when it came to decide what side the penalties would be taken in last years FAI cup final. Oh maybe that was another prior arrangement with the FAI.

Derry need all the money they can get, so stop trying to be funny when you cant afford to be. Mariborkev it seems, is still the only fan that actually knows what is happening at derry.

[A N Mouse]

putting aside the fact that they should have asked Derry first (which i agree with by the way and i dont condemn Derry for looking after themselves, which is what we were trying to do for ourselves), its not a one-sided deal where we are just complaining for the sake of it - the FAI got what they wanted out of this! The consideration awarded to Bohs for accommodating their request is NIL.

So knowing the fai, and knowing (as they should have) that Derry needed to agree should Bohs have made any agreement? Or were they, possibly, blinded by thoughts of looking after themselves?

I've still got them magic beans :)

[osarusan]

So knowing the fai, and knowing (as they should have) that Derry needed to agree should Bohs have made any agreement? Or were they, possibly, blinded by thoughts of looking after themselves?

In all fairness, if what seems to have happened is what actually happened, don't you think Bohs have a right to feel a bit hard done by?

Whether or not Bohs should have considered if Derry had already agreed to the deal or not, and whether or not it is right for Bohs to be looking for this fixture rearrangement in the first place, and whether or not the FAI should be playing the final of a cup in the home ground of either team, Bohs were offered an agreement by the governing body, and accepted it. Then the carrot dangled in front of them was taken away.

Personally, I think the schedule that Bohs will have to play isn't all that awful, and I'm not so keen on Fenlon's comments that they agreed to play the final in Waterford to "make a spectacle of it" when that obviously isn't the case, but the (apparent) fact remains - they were offered a deal, fulfilled their part of that deal, and then had the other party renege on it.

[CMcC]

So knowing the fai, and knowing (as they should have) that Derry needed to agree should Bohs have made any agreement? Or were they, possibly, blinded by thoughts of looking after themselves?

I've still got them magic beans :)

Jesus wept. Who the hell knows that AN Mouse. Nobody on here can answer that. Mute point anyway because:

When the governing body of the sport in the country say they will agree to a date swap in exchange for Bohs making Delaney the big man in his own town by bringing a final there, it is reasonable for Bohs to agree to this suggestion, in good faith.

Wether they knew Derry would have to agree (reasonable to assume Bohs knew this) or Derry had not been consulted yet is IMO irrelavant. I'm sure Bohs would have trusted the association to have either laid the groundwork with Derry already (maybe this was suggested by the FAI) or they were given assurances that Derry would not be a problem.

Looking at it reasonably IMO I believe they were given the nod that Derry were onside whereas in reality the association probably hadnt even spoken to anyone in the Brandywell at that point.

In hindsight it was silly of Fenlon to trust FAI with their track record but really if something like this is offered to any of our clubs in Bohs situation they all would have grabbed it. It wasn't for Bohs to second guess the association in this instance. They aparently run the sport in this country for heaven sake, so in theory should have the authority to offer this deal (wether its morally right or not).

[A N Mouse]

Jesus wept. Who the hell knows that AN Mouse. Nobody on here can answer that. Mute point anyway because:

When the governing body of the sport in the country say they will agree to a date swap in exchange for Bohs making Delaney the big man in his own town by bringing a final there, it is reasonable for Bohs to agree to this suggestion, in good faith.

Wether they knew Derry would have to agree (reasonable to assume Bohs knew this) or Derry had not been consulted yet is IMO irrelavant. I'm sure Bohs would have trusted the association to have either laid the groundwork with Derry already (maybe this was suggested by the FAI) or they were given assurances that Derry would not be a problem.

Looking at it reasonably IMO I believe they were given the nod that Derry were onside whereas in reality the association probably hadnt even spoken to anyone in the Brandywell at that point.

In hindsight it was silly of Fenlon to trust FAI with their track record but really if something like this is offered to any of our clubs in Bohs situation they all would have grabbed it. It wasn't for Bohs to second guess the association in this instance. They aparently run the sport in this country for heaven sake, so in theory should have the authority to offer this deal (wether its morally right or not).

So to sum up what you're saying:

Everyone knows what the fai are like, having dealt with them for years, but no one was cynical enough to say this sounds too good to be true.

I was actually starting to have a little sympathy for ordinary decent bohs fans in all this. It got me to thinking of maybes and what ifs. If only bohs had insisted on a coin toss, and won, and the the final was to be played at Dalymount. Maybe there be no moaning about travel and three games in a week.

And any notion of sympathy vanished

[marinobohs]

get a life bohs ffs,
6 of your away fixtures per season are no more then half an hour from dalymount. and drogheda and dundalk under an hour.
just as well your not based in cork or waterford where the nearest fixture is 50 miles away and the furtherest 300 miles.

so ye have a 2 hour spin to derry and a 15 minute spin to tallagh.
whinge whinge whinge.

grand so move the cup final on saturday to Dalymount ! given it is such a small journey :)

[marinobohs]

So knowing the fai, and knowing (as they should have) that Derry needed to agree should Bohs have made any agreement? Or were they, possibly, blinded by thoughts of looking after themselves?

I've still got them magic beans :)

Sorry, but I think you are wrong about Derry "needed to agree". This would apply were the other club wanted the original date changed, this was not an option as the League/FAI had already cancelled that date (due to MM Cup final :)). therefore it is a matter for the League/FAI to decide on the new date.bohs were not seeking a cancellation of the original date the League/FAI muppet show were. Tuesday was not the original date.

[pineapple stu]

Everyone knows what the fai are like, having dealt with them for years, but no one was cynical enough to say this sounds too good to be true.
So you reckon Bohs should have gone down the alternative route, which is -

FAI - I want to have the League Cup Final in Waterford; do you mind? I'll make it worth your while anyways.
Bohs - Of course we mind, you lying, smarmy fecker. Do you honestly think we have any faith in anything you say, you useless mong?
FAI *Marks Bohs' card for relegation and holds a grudge for years to come*

Seriously, you seem rather naive about FAI politics.

[OneRedArmy]

Sorry, but I think you are wrong about Derry "needed to agree". This would apply were the other club wanted the original date changed, this was not an option as the League/FAI had already cancelled that date (due to MM Cup final :)). therefore it is a matter for the League/FAI to decide on the new date.bohs were not seeking a cancellation of the original date the League/FAI muppet show were. Tuesday was not the original date.Per the FAI Fans Forum at the start of the season Fixtures Secretary Michael Hayes clearly stated that the approach the FAI would take from this season on was tripartite agreement for rescheduled fixtures, specifically to avoid the problems in previous seasons. Only where agreement couldn't be reached between the three parties would the FAI take a unilateral decision.

And thats exactly whats happened.

[CMcC]

So to sum up what you're saying:

Everyone knows what the fai are like, having dealt with them for years, but no one was cynical enough to say this sounds too good to be true.

I was actually starting to have a little sympathy for ordinary decent bohs fans in all this. It got me to thinking of maybes and what ifs. If only bohs had insisted on a coin toss, and won, and the the final was to be played at Dalymount. Maybe there be no moaning about travel and three games in a week.

And any notion of sympathy vanished


No you have not summed up what I am saying at all. You have yet again shown the uncanny knack of missing the point of someones post.

And frankly I doubt if 'ordinary decent bohs fans' give a tinkers curse if you have sympathy for them or not !! Unbelievable.

I think pineapple stu sums up the alternative better than I could in the previous post to this.

[marinobohs]

Per the FAI Fans Forum at the start of the season Fixtures Secretary Michael Hayes clearly stated that the approach the FAI would take from this season on was tripartite agreement for rescheduled fixtures, specifically to avoid the problems in previous seasons. Only where agreement couldn't be reached between the three parties would the FAI take a unilateral decision.

And thats exactly whats happened.

Yep, thats my point exactly this was a decision by the FAI alone, made despite any request from bohs or any nod and wink arrangement 9or to use a shorter term renaging).
as a matter of interest can anyone here explain why Bohs would agree to play the final away knowing this would leave them with the three away games in 6 days ?

[A N Mouse]

Ok,

I'll make it easy for. Hypothetically speaking

Do you, honestly, think we wouldn't be have a debate about how shambolicly Bohs were treated by the FAI if the game was at Dalymount?

[pineapple stu]

No, because then the FAI wouldn't have made any deal to renege on.

Are you deliberately missing the point at this stage?

[OneRedArmy]

Yep, thats my point exactly this was a decision by the FAI alone, made despite any request from bohs or any nod and wink arrangement 9or to use a shorter term renaging).
as a matter of interest can anyone here explain why Bohs would agree to play the final away knowing this would leave them with the three away games in 6 days ?From what I've read it sounds like there was a discussion between Bohs and the FAI, a date was suggested, this was proposed to Derry who disagreed, as they are permitted to. Therefore final decision reverts back to FAI.

What am I missing?

[roinuj]

grand so move the cup final on saturday to Dalymount ! given it is such a small journey :)

even been a part time club it still wouldnt bother us if it was in dayler,
and i bet we wouldnt have hendo or anyone from the club whinging about it like fenlon is.

[pineapple stu]

What am I missing?
The possibility that the FAI told Bohs the date change had been agreed, so just cede home advantage if you wouldn't mind.

[marinobohs]

Ok,

I'll make it easy for. Hypothetically speaking

Do you, honestly, think we wouldn't be have a debate about how shambolicly Bohs were treated by the FAI if the game was at Dalymount?

bohs would not be travelling if the game was at Dalymount and therefore the FAI would not have renaged on the matter consequentially there would not be an issue to talk about. At this stage are you just refusing to address the issues to wind things up ?

Mind you, Waterford have home advantage on saturday for the final - FAI fixture decision means Bohs almost certain to play a weakened team (improving chance of a Waterford win) - makes for one happy Delaney !

If Derry think any of this is about them then I think it might be them that has a false sense of importance (I won't use the Derry language)

[marinobohs]

even been a part time club it still wouldnt bother us if it was in dayler,
and i bet we wouldnt have hendo or anyone from the club whinging about it like fenlon is.

Easy enough to say when you have Delaney to do your dirty work for you. can we expect Waterford to suggest/ propose a change of venue ?

[A N Mouse]

No, because then the FAI wouldn't have made any deal to renege on.

Are you deliberately missing the point at this stage?

Hang on a minute the point in question is an unsubstantiated allegation made by someone with a history of how shall we say this...

Well, what exactly did he say to Stuey Byrne in order for him to come out with that outburst?

The fact that this allegation is against an organisation people about here have little faith in seems to be the justification for vilifying anyone who dares question the validity of the allegations. Or the enforceability of any 'agreement' resulting from it.

If you came to an arrangement with me, and for whatever reason I was unable to fulfill my end of the agreement you'd be well within your rights to be annoyed. It would not however excuse you from fulfilling any obligations, related to the agreement but beyond my control. You simple made a bad deal.

If you're entitled to believe the worst of the FAI then I'm entitled to believe that Pat Fenlon would still be complaining, about something, even if the final was in Dalymount

[blue til i die]

bohs would not be travelling if the game was at Dalymount and therefore the FAI would not have renaged on the matter consequentially there would not be an issue to talk about. At this stage are you just refusing to address the issues to wind things up ?

Mind you, Waterford have home advantage on saturday for the final - FAI fixture decision means Bohs almost certain to play a weakened team (improving chance of a Waterford win) - makes for one happy Delaney !

If Derry think any of this is about them then I think it might be them that has a false sense of importance (I won't use the Derry language)

Thats obviously the reason, case closed :rolleyes: :D

To be honest, I wouldnt have cared if it was on in Dalymount, for most proper fans it wouldnt have made a difference.

[Quadruple1928]

Anyone see the promotion of the game today in the star? Along the lines of Do you want to be the ball boy at the Waterford v Bohs game? Picture of a ball boy........... in a Barcelona jersey:ball::confused:

[blue til i die]

Anyone see the promotion of the game today in the star? Along the lines of Do you want to be the ball boy at the Waterford v Bohs game? Picture has a ball boy........... in a Barcelona jersey:ball::confused:

Was it not to lead the Bohs team out?
Wasnt surprised not to see a bohs jersey, thats how we do things in this league!

[pineapple stu]

Hang on a minute the point in question is an unsubstantiated allegation made by someone with a history of how shall we say this...
The specific point to which I replied - and again, you're missing the point here - is that if the game had been in Dalyer, there wouldn't have been a need to enter into an agreement specifically to host it in Waterford, and so your post was redundant.

Of course this whole thing is based on hearsay; no-one's saying otherwise. But if the hearsay is correct, it appears Bohs are entitled to be annoyed. If it's wrong, Bohs are whingey feckers. It's that simple.

[Quadruple1928]

Was it not to lead the Bohs team out?


You're right, either way it looks stupid!

[A N Mouse]

The specific point to which I replied - and again, you're missing the point here - is that if the game had been in Dalyer, there wouldn't have been a need to enter into an agreement specifically to host it in Waterford, and so your post was redundant.

I may have missed the point on which you were replying to, as you didn't quote it :p

But given the contents of your post, and the fact that it immediately followed mine, I thought maybe it was that you were responding to, apologies if this seems incorrect. If so you seem to be missing the point I was making and deliberately adding irrelevancies to advance your case. The potential for Pat Fenlon to find something to moan about is irrefutable. Its like the sun in the sky - and similarly we all take it for granted. :D

[Derry]

The specific point to which I replied - and again, you're missing the point here - is that if the game had been in Dalyer, there wouldn't have been a need to enter into an agreement specifically to host it in Waterford, and so your post was redundant.

Of course this whole thing is based on hearsay; no-one's saying otherwise. But if the hearsay is correct, it appears Bohs are entitled to be annoyed. If it's wrong, Bohs are whingey feckers. It's that simple.

Well Stu you got some of it right:), When this alledged agreement was made between the FAI and Bohs, surely a board with Bohs experience would have asked the FAI, "Did Derry City agree with this"? And we all know the answer to that would have been "No". So maybe there is a bit of mind games going on with Fenlon. After all he always seems to be crying about something.

[OneRedArmy]

If Derry think any of this is about them then I think it might be them that has a false sense of importance (I won't use the Derry language)Its about us to the extent that we have a vested interest in when we play you.

[MariborKev]

If Bohs were so sure of the deal, why did they contact Derry to request a change.....

[Iorfa2MaccaJim]

With Fenlon coming out in yesterdays press saying he'd put out " a second team " for the League Cup Final, what players can we expect to see at The R.S.C. on Saturday ?

[Mr A]

If Bohs have any sense they'll field a strong team. If they miss out on the league then they may well run afoul of the 65% rule and suffer a points deduction/ be relegated. In that case the LC would keep them in the Setanta at least.

[SkStu]

the Setanta is a dead duck at this stage. Its no incentive.

Apologies to Waterford in all this as they will be the innocent victims in all this but im not surprised that we wont field a full strength team after this shambolic treatment from the FAI. I fully support Fenlons decision to field our young players if thats what ends up happening. The inability of the large group of vociferous Derry fans to first grasp the point and then debate it smacks of wummery but then empty vessels make the loudest noise.

[MariborKev]

The inability of the large group of vociferous Derry fans to first grasp the point and then debate it smacks of wummery but then empty vessels make the loudest noise.

There are about 6 Derry fans posting on the thread.

At least half of them are making reasonable points. If we are back to debating the issue, perhaps you may want to answer the point I raised above.

[hoops1]

The inability of the large group of vociferous Derry fans to first grasp the point and then debate it smacks of wummery but then empty vessels make the loudest noise.

Pity the same cant be said about empty grounds, then Dalymount would be a place to fear.

[SkStu]

Pity the same cant be said about empty grounds, then Dalymount would be a place to fear.

brilliant, that is just genius! :D:D

:rolleyes:

[SkStu]

There are about 6 Derry fans posting on the thread.

At least half of them are making reasonable points. If we are back to debating the issue, perhaps you may want to answer the point I raised above.

because i dont know if its a point or not. Either way, it is just a further attempt to muddy the waters of what is a very legitimate complaint from Bohs regarding the way the FAI has acted. Ill leave it at that.

[blue til i die]

Apologies to Waterford in all this as they will be the innocent victims in all this but im not surprised that we wont field a full strength team after this shambolic treatment from the FAI. I fully support Fenlons decision to field our young players if thats what ends up happening. The inability of the large group of vociferous Derry fans to first grasp the point and then debate it smacks of wummery but then empty vessels make the loudest noise.

The full bohs squad will travel for game, guaranteed!