View Full Version : League Cup shenanigans
What evidence is there of an agreement, other than Pat Fenlon's comments?
Since when were the FAI able to make such agreements, magnanimously, for others?
Bohs are not losing out in all this - they simply thought they could have their cake and eat it. Again the FAI could only be asked to move the Derry game (as I believe Derry have in the past wrt the LC final), in return the FAI could only try to accommodate them.
Are you all really that sold on Pat Fenlon's Handheld Transportable Garden Excavation Implements Emporium, that not one of you find his comments on the H&S of his players bizzare? Will any of you, other SkStu care to admit the issue at the heart of the matter:
Oh ok well if Pat Fenlon didnt invent the whole thing to give you something to create another conspiracy theory out of then Bohs have lost out on not playing at home because they made an agreement to play it in Waterford. Of course the fact that its Derry would have influenced Bohs decision to allow the final to be played in Waterford as they thought that the agreement with the FAI would mean not having to travel to opposite ends of the country (insert pun here) within the space of a few days meaning better preparation for Derry who are a good side in a vital league game. It was the FAI that wanted the Final in Waterford though.
Oh ok well if Pat Fenlon didnt invent the whole thing to give you something to create another conspiracy theory out of then Bohs have lost out on not playing at home because they made an agreement to play it in Waterford. Of course the fact that its Derry would have influenced Bohs decision to allow the final to be played in Waterford as they thought that the agreement with the FAI would mean not having to travel to opposite ends of the country (insert pun here) within the space of a few days meaning better preparation for Derry who are a good side in a vital league game. It was the FAI that wanted the Final in Waterford though.
It might be the fact that John Delaney is from Waterford if i am correct.
Will there be any temporary seating brought in at all?
unclekev
19/09/2009, 9:18 PM
Is this League all about Bohs and Fenlon?
They have to travel so seldom. Only to Cork, Derry, Galway & Sligo twice a season.( 8 trips. Other teams have 3 times that.) All their other games are only a trot away. Maybe to suit them the teams out of Dublin and its boundaries should be relegated. Why I wonder did they agree to travel to Waterford in the first place?... now there's a question I would like to hear answered truly.
If a Club is successful of course they will have fixture congestion. Most Clubs would welcome this problem.
Stop moaning Bohs.
blue til i die
19/09/2009, 9:24 PM
They should just play it and shut up about it!!
SkStu
19/09/2009, 10:57 PM
Is this League all about Bohs and Fenlon?
They have to travel so seldom. Only to Cork, Derry, Galway & Sligo twice a season.( 8 trips. Other teams have 3 times that.) All their other games are only a trot away. Maybe to suit them the teams out of Dublin and its boundaries should be relegated. Why I wonder did they agree to travel to Waterford in the first place?... now there's a question I would like to hear answered truly.
If a Club is successful of course they will have fixture congestion. Most Clubs would welcome this problem.
Stop moaning Bohs.
are you for real?
1) this is the first thread about Fenlon or Bohs (bar the financial thread) since the start of the season. Bohs fans here are among the least vocal fans posting in this forum. (i may be the exception that proves the rule although most of the crap i post is easily ignored rubbish).
2) Its not our fault that we travel so seldom. Its also not our fault that the clubs you listed have to travel so much. No one is calling for "Maybe to suit them the teams out of Dublin and its boundaries should be relegated." Why are you putting words into the fans/Fenlons/the clubs mouth? Its not the point at issue.
3) Bohs agreed to travel to and play the final in Waterford at the request of the FAI in return for an assurance from the FAI that the game against Derry a couple of days later would be MOVED. Not cancelled, not relocated to Dalymount Park. A fairly reasonable deal all things considered. We'd still have to make the trip. But its not about the trip, its about the FAI backing out of some sort of agreement that they should never have made in the first place if they didnt have the power or authority to do so. Otherwise we would just have taken our chances with the coin flip. Theres no mystery about why we agreed to play the final in Waterford.
4) We are Bohs, born to moan.
SkStu
19/09/2009, 11:00 PM
Will any of you, other SkStu care to admit the issue at the heart of the matter:
i believe i have listed in the post above at point 3, the issue at the heart of the matter.
VinnyDCFC
19/09/2009, 11:57 PM
What's the bottom line here?
Say DCFC agreed to talk about a fixture change versus Bohs (highly unlikely at this late stage and one which most sane Derry fans would be against) when would that take place exactly?
Why have the Bohs fans and/ or Pat Fenlon not suggested such a date?
Is this more to do with the opposition Bohs face following the LC Final, Derry and Shamrock Rovers? (all of a sudden these 2 games could be title deciders)
We've been told the League Cup is a minnow cup for years from Bohs fans so just ignore it then, play your A team and carry on as you were.....problem solved :cool:
topia
20/09/2009, 12:45 AM
Is this more to do with the opposition Bohs face following the LC Final, Derry and Shamrock Rovers? (all of a sudden these 2 games could be title deciders)
We've been told the League Cup is a minnow cup for years from Bohs fans so just ignore it then, play your A team and carry on as you were.....problem solved :cool:
Its been said, When the FAI wanted to play it in Waterford of course Bohs didnt want to play opposition as strong as Derry within a couple of days at the opposite end of the country and so the 'agreement' was made. You seem to be making out that Bohs just didnt fancy a trip to Derry and rang up the FAI to say nah that doesnt suit us.
By the way i agree that Derry would be mad to agree to change it at this stage, its not their problem, it is the FAI who are to blame, making an agreement to suit themselves when they wouldnt/couldnt carry it out.
forza rovers
20/09/2009, 8:10 AM
Don't like it don't play do what fenlon done after the cup game look your team in the dressing room for hours and have a moan
pineapple stu
20/09/2009, 1:43 PM
Have you actually read the thread?
refjohn
20/09/2009, 5:27 PM
Hopefully FAI learn to keep mouth shut - key here is 'probably' they gave assurances to Bohs without speaking to Derry (and given finances across league we all know why Derry need game played - even if it clashes with Champions League).
Just spotted that the week after Derry have worse to do than Bohs (pity it's a Derry example) - they play away to Linfield on the Saturday evening - then play in Cork on the Tuesday. Travel like this is a symptom of success (in Derry's case last season in qualifying for Setanta) and if league is to finish on time games must be played.
I wonder if Fenlon would have made same comments if Boh's form didn't go a bit shaky there for a few weeks.
Hopefully FAI learn to keep mouth shut - key here is 'probably' they gave assurances to Bohs without speaking to Derry (and given finances across league we all know why Derry need game played - even if it clashes with Champions League).
Just spotted that the week after Derry have worse to do than Bohs (pity it's a Derry example) - they play away to Linfield on the Saturday evening - then play in Cork on the Tuesday. Travel like this is a symptom of success (in Derry's case last season in qualifying for Setanta) and if league is to finish on time games must be played.
I wonder if Fenlon would have made same comments if Boh's form didn't go a bit shaky there for a few weeks.
Spot on ref, let's all go to the FAI and try and get matches changed to suit us. All Bohs are being asked to do is to play a mid week game, big deal. As for Bohs supporters saying they could have had a toss of a coin, sure we all know Bohs don't have a toss of the coin, like they didn't when it came to decide what side the penalties would be taken in last years FAI cup final. Oh maybe that was another prior arrangement with the FAI.
blue til i die
20/09/2009, 6:21 PM
Spot on ref, let's all go to the FAI and try and get matches changed to suit us. All Bohs are being asked to do is to play a mid week game, big deal. As for Bohs supporters saying they could have had a toss of a coin, sure we all know Bohs don't have a toss of the coin, like they didn't when it came to decide what side the penalties would be taken in last years FAI cup final. Oh maybe that was another prior arrangement with the FAI.
who agreed to give them a two goal headstart in the shootout...:D
The biggest question is why the FAI would even allow this situation to develop. Toss the coin, the winner gets the choice- simple.
Balls to these 'arrangements', they're always likely to come unstuck somehow, just follow the feckin procedure and both sides get on with it.
Derry
21/09/2009, 10:35 AM
Again i can't see why Bohs are so upset at having to play a mid week game. In a couple of weeks Derry City have to travel to Belfast to play Linfield on a Saturday. The following Tuesday they have to travel to CORK, which, including stops will take about 8 hours there and back. Then on the Friday we are home to Rovers, this is far worse than thats being asked of Bohs yet they are having a wee fit.
pineapple stu
21/09/2009, 10:43 AM
Again, that's not the point. The point is the FAI are (allegedly) going back on their word, and the FAI's word was needed for Bohs to forfeit any chance of a home draw just to Delaney could help Waterford.
(And whatever about proving that, if you don't believe that's a possibility, you don't know owt about the FAI!)
FAI - Bohs, what would it take for us just to give Waterford the League Cup Final? You split the gates anyway, and I want to do them a favour.
Bohs - OK, well sure, just put our game in Derry back a week to give us more time to prepare, and we'll call that a deal.
FAI - Done.
FAI (four weeks later) - Actually, remember when I said that was a done deal? Scratch that; changed my mind.
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 11:06 AM
Again i can't see why Bohs are so upset at having to play a mid week game. In a couple of weeks Derry City have to travel to Belfast to play Linfield on a Saturday. The following Tuesday they have to travel to CORK, which, including stops will take about 8 hours there and back. Then on the Friday we are home to Rovers, this is far worse than thats being asked of Bohs yet they are having a wee fit.
And presumably because Derry have to do it that makes it all right ! one of the biggest problems in this League is the begruding attitude to any club that has success. we see this every year with european games where clubs participating are hindered in re-arranging League games.
The stupid argument that "tough luck it happened to us before" so prevelent from derry supporters (perhaps the REAL reason is this think this gives them some advantage ?) here simply perpetuates the crazy mentality of punishing success.
An eye for an eye and eventually all blind.
Again, that's not the point. The point is the FAI are (allegedly) going back on their word, and the FAI's word was needed for Bohs to forfeit any chance of a home draw just to Delaney could help Waterford.
(And whatever about proving that, if you don't believe that's a possibility, you don't know owt about the FAI!)
FAI - Bohs, what would it take for us just to give Waterford the League Cup Final? You split the gates anyway, and I want to do them a favour.
Bohs - OK, well sure, just put our game in Derry back a week to give us more time to prepare, and we'll call that a deal.
FAI - Done.
FAI (four weeks later) - Actually, remember when I said that was a done deal? Scratch that; changed my mind.
And that looks about the size of it. Any talk about anything else on this thread about poor old us alone up (or down) here having to travel all the time is just irrelavant noise.
This is about the FAI (allegedly) making an agreement and then pulling out of it. Absolutely disgraceful and a shameful way for the association to act, if true. Yet another example of how unfit they are to run football in this country. Their credibility is non existent.
Réiteoir
21/09/2009, 11:49 AM
FAI Statement
In relation to comments in today’s media attributed to Bohemian F.C., the Football Association of Ireland would like to clarify that at no point were Bohemian F.C. given assurances regarding the date of their fixture against Derry City F.C.
Bohemian F.C. will play Waterford United F.C. in the final of the EA SPORTS Cup on Saturday, September 26th. Both clubs were originally scheduled to play league fixtures this weekend. However, due to the EA SPORTS Cup final, both clubs will now play these matches on Tuesday, September 29th.
ENDS
Eoghan Rice - Communications Executive
Football Association of Ireland
OneRedArmy
21/09/2009, 12:17 PM
:D
And a verbal agreement isn't worth the paper its written.A verbal agreement isn't worth the paper its NOT written on, surely?!:confused:
FAI Statement
In relation to comments in today’s media attributed to Bohemian F.C., the Football Association of Ireland would like to clarify that at no point were Bohemian F.C. given assurances regarding the date of their fixture against Derry City F.C.
Bohemian F.C. will play Waterford United F.C. in the final of the EA SPORTS Cup on Saturday, September 26th. Both clubs were originally scheduled to play league fixtures this weekend. However, due to the EA SPORTS Cup final, both clubs will now play these matches on Tuesday, September 29th.
ENDS
Eoghan Rice - Communications Executive
Football Association of IrelandIts all a big Rovers-Derry anti-Bohez conspiracy :D
Seriously though, given the FAI pontificated to all who would listen at the start of the season that the days of willy nilly unilateral fixture changes were over and that tripartite agreement would likely be needed for changes (both clubs and FAI) they've, yet again, made a rod for their own back.
Minding my words here, but I wouldn't be surprised if Bohs weren't given a wink and a nod by someone that they'd be looked after, but then when Derry found out and didn't acquiesce (and why should we, its in our interests to play them asap), the FAI may have had to live by their previously stated position. Allegedly.
A N Mouse
21/09/2009, 12:35 PM
(And whatever about proving that, if you don't believe that's a possibility, you don't know owt about the FAI!)
FAI - Bohs, what would it take for us just to give Waterford the League Cup Final? You split the gates anyway, and I want to do them a favour.
Bohs - OK, well sure, just put our game in Derry back a week to give us more time to prepare, and we'll call that a deal.
FAI - Done.
FAI (four weeks later) - Actually, remember when I said that was a done deal? Scratch that; changed my mind.
Given what we'd all like to believe about the fai this seems entirely plausible.
However surely both parties should have known that the fixture can't be changed without someone else's consent?
brianw82
21/09/2009, 12:36 PM
Minding my words here, but I wouldn't be surprised if Bohs weren't given a wink and a nod by someone that they'd be looked after, but then when Derry found out and didn't acquiesce (and why should we, its in our interests to play them asap), the FAI may have had to live by their previously stated position. Allegedly.
That's pretty much what I'm thinking too.
pineapple stu
21/09/2009, 12:40 PM
However surely both parties should have known that the fixture can't be changed without someone else's consent?
So you check before agreeing the "deal".
Wouldn't surprise me at all if the FAI forgot until it was too late. We asked them last year before the fixtures came out to not give us a game on one specific Saturday. They could have given us a home game (Friday) or 9 of 11 away games (all Fridays), but they gave us a Saturday game. The level of idiocy in there is unreal.
brianw82
21/09/2009, 12:44 PM
So you check before agreeing the "deal".
Wouldn't surprise me at all if the FAI forgot until it was too late. We asked them last year before the fixtures came out to not give us a game on one specific Saturday. They could have given us a home game (Friday) or 9 of 11 away games (all Fridays), but they gave us a Saturday game. The level of idiocy in there is unreal.
Do the FAI not ask all clubs to submit certain "no can do" dates before the fixtures come out, and then plan the fixtures accordingly?
pineapple stu
21/09/2009, 12:49 PM
You'd think so, wouldn't you?
John83
21/09/2009, 1:02 PM
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&source=hp&q=wexford+to+derry&ie=UTF-8&output=html&oi=nojs
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?output=html&hl=en&f=d&source=s_d&saddr=waterford&daddr=derry&btnG=Get+Directions
Google maps makes it about half an hour :o
Am I really alone in taking a little pleasure in a Derry fan having to post a link to "Driving directions to Londonderry, County Londonderry, UK"? It's like I don't know this site any more. :p
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 1:29 PM
Am I really alone in taking a little pleasure in a Derry fan having to post a link to "Driving directions to Londonderry, County Londonderry, UK"? It's like I don't know this site any more. :p
So caught up in an anti Bohs/ Pat Fenlon rant that they probobly did'nt even realise ?:rolleyes:
And presumably because Derry have to do it that makes it all right ! one of the biggest problems in this League is the begruding attitude to any club that has success. we see this every year with european games where clubs participating are hindered in re-arranging League games.
The stupid argument that "tough luck it happened to us before" so prevelent from derry supporters (perhaps the REAL reason is this think this gives them some advantage ?) here simply perpetuates the crazy mentality of punishing success.
An eye for an eye and eventually all blind.
There is nothing begrudging about it, It's the fact you think the likes of Derry will get some sort of advantage. You're away to Waterford at the weekend, and then you have to play Derry City mid week. How is that an advantage to Derry City. Every team has to play mid week games, yet when Bohs are told to do so, they cry foul. As for your belief of punishing success. Sure for the last four years you have been making a mockery of the LC as it was only for minnows, although to win the treble which was every Bohs supporters dream at the start of the season, you have to win the LC. So treat it as a minnow's cup and send your 3rd team to play the game. Your dreams of the treble are for another day.
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 1:48 PM
There is nothing begrudging about it, It's the fact you think the likes of Derry will get some sort of advantage. You're away to Waterford at the weekend, and then you have to play Derry City mid week. How the f*** is that an advantage to Derry City. Every team has to play mid week games, yet when Bohs are told to do so, they cry foul. As for your belief of punishing success. Sure for the last four years you have been making a mockery of the LC as it was only for minnows, although to win the treble which was every Bohs supporters dream at the start of the season, you have to win the LC. So treat it as a minnow's cup and send your 3rd team to play the game. Your dreams of the treble are for another day. You are so far up your a*** in terms of importence.
Obviously the schools provided by HMG are not as good at the old reading as schools down here, the issue is T-R-A-V-E-L not the number of games played (do try reading the preceeding posts, it helps)
Amazed at the St Paul like conversion of Derry fans over the League Cup (which has now morphed into a minnow cup - as soon as they are out after years of (literally) banging the drum about it). For most fans it still rates below the League and FAI Cup but like most fans I want my team to win any/every trophy possible and do not see why the club should have to sacrifice one or the other, if that is self importance then mea culpa but how many fans would honestly have a different view ?
MariborKev
21/09/2009, 1:51 PM
Right lads,
This thread is now descending into childishness. Debate the issues, without personal abuse.
MariborKev
21/09/2009, 1:53 PM
Amazed at the St Paul like conversion of Derry fans over the League Cup (which has now morphed into a minnow cup
MB,
I doubt there has been a St Paul conversation with regards to the trophy. My take is that the other Derry fans are poking fun at Bohs being up in arms of the scheduling with has occurred, due to the fact they are in the final of a competition they commonly slag off.
That's just my personal read on it.
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 2:03 PM
MB,
I doubt there has been a St Paul conversation with regards to the trophy. My take is that the other Derry fans are poking fun at Bohs being up in arms of the scheduling with has occurred, due to the fact they are in the final of a competition they commonly slag off.
That's just my personal read on it.
Are you suggesting Derry fans are just WUMMING and not seriously engaging on the issue ?;) how shocking would that be were it to happen on FOOT.IE ?
MariborKev
21/09/2009, 2:09 PM
I think they are seriously engaging on the issue, but the reference to the "minnow" and "tinpot" cup is in reference to the terminology of GypseyWeb in recent years....
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 2:20 PM
I think they are seriously engaging on the issue, but the reference to the "minnow" and "tinpot" cup is in reference to the terminology of GypseyWeb in recent years....
I should have remembered the high level of commitment in Derry to Bohs web site ! At times it was difficult to get them off it.:)
BohDiddley
21/09/2009, 2:24 PM
In relation to comments in today’s media attributed to Bohemian F.C., the Football Association of Ireland would like to clarify that at no point were Bohemian F.C. given assurances regarding the date of their fixture against Derry City F.C.
Bohemian F.C. will play Waterford United F.C. in the final of the EA SPORTS Cup on Saturday, September 26th. Both clubs were originally scheduled to play league fixtures this weekend. However, due to the EA SPORTS Cup final, both clubs will now play these matches on Tuesday, September 29th.
Eoghan Rice - Communications Executive
Football Association of Ireland
Thanks for that Eoghan. Can you now please direct us to the location, whether on fai.ie, loi.ie or the press, providing details of when, where, and in whose presence the coin toss took place to determine the venue of the EA SPORTS Cup final?
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 2:30 PM
Thanks for that Eoghan. Can you now please direct us to the location, whether on fai.ie, loi.ie or the press, providing details of when, where, and in whose presence the coin toss took place to determine the venue of the EA SPORTS Cup final.
Can anybody really believe a word that comes from the FAI at this stage ? who else could balls up something as simple as a coin toss ? No wonder the League is a standing joke, with flexible rules and make it up as you go along criteria
think I will call over and tell them, now where is my can of petrol ? :D
BohDiddley
21/09/2009, 2:39 PM
I suppose it's a 50-50 question (http://www.random.org/coins/?num=1&cur=60-eur.ireland-1euro). :rolleyes:
though it would be nice to win the League Cup (any trophy is a positive) i hope we field a weakened team.
BohDiddley
21/09/2009, 2:49 PM
though it would be nice to win the League Cup (any trophy is a positive) i hope we field a weakened team.
If we're serious about winning the league, we don't have any option but to field a reserve or semi-reserve team.
Ronnie
21/09/2009, 2:56 PM
Fenlon will probly play the part timers, you know yer man Byrne, plays up front, works in the bar, and that coach, Crowe, give the full timers a rest before the two big games next week.
marinobohs
21/09/2009, 3:07 PM
Fenlon will probly play the part timers, you know yer man Byrne, plays up front, works in the bar, and that coach, Crowe, give the full timers a rest before the two big games next week.
Ah yes the old brown envelope system was/is so much better (or redirecting sponsorship money or.......)
gspain
21/09/2009, 3:21 PM
Thanks for that Eoghan. Can you now please direct us to the location, whether on fai.ie, loi.ie or the press, providing details of when, where, and in whose presence the coin toss took place to determine the venue of the EA SPORTS Cup final?
Err where does he claim there was a Coin toss or am I missing something?
BohDiddley
21/09/2009, 3:27 PM
Err where does he claim there was a Coin toss or am I missing something?
If not by coin toss, how was the venue decided?
Are Bohs taking the p*ss.So what if they have 3 games in a week (one in Dublin ffs):mad: id hate to see what they would do if they had to do as much travelling as the Provincial Teams in the league.
BohDiddley
21/09/2009, 3:34 PM
Are Bohs taking the p*ss.So what if they have 3 games in a week (one in Dublin ffs):mad: id hate to see what they would do if they had to do as much travelling as the Provincial Teams in the league.
Why don't you save yourself even more effort and simply write 'I've read absolutely nothing in this thread but I know what I think'?
It wouldnt surprise me in the least if the FAI gave these assurances.
If so, Bohs are dead right to be annoyed.
I'd imagine the FAi wanted this to be a big game in Waterford, but now Bohs will probably field a team of kids, and rightly so. That's what would have been avoided by the assurances.
A N Mouse
21/09/2009, 3:46 PM
I knew this all sounded vaguely familar.
http://www.eleven-a-side.com/shamrockrovers/news.asp?n=32916
OneRedArmy
21/09/2009, 3:46 PM
If so, Bohs are dead right to be annoyed.
I'd imagine the FAi wanted this to be a big game in Waterford, but now Bohs will probably field a team of kids, and rightly so. Why would you play your 1st team in a "minnow" Cup?
LMFAO.
No surprise about Fenlon not wanting to travel to Derry, he couldn't even hack it when we were paying him to do it.
Why would you play your 1st team in a "minnow" Cup?
LMFAO.
They'd have no reason not too if the Derry game was moved, also I'd imagine the FAI would 'encourage' them too.
Come on ORA, it IS a minnow cup and I said the same after our quarter final win last year.
Also when these 'assurances' were given they were still on for the treble, something that does have significance, With that gone now Id imagine they wont be as bothered
Dalymountrower
21/09/2009, 3:55 PM
You're away to Waterford at the weekend, and then you have to play Derry City mid week. .
Saturday and Tuesday and Friday
. If it had been scheduled for Friday and Wednesday and play Rovers on the following Sunday at 1pm, it wouldn`t have been a problem. No one really gives two hoots about the League Cup so it will be a question of whether Fenlon plays half or none of the first choice team. As Waterford are in top form and Bohs have a terrible record against them in the RSC, I don`t think that less than a full strength Bohs team will win out.
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