Friendly against England?

[youngirish]

This is neither here nor there: the original point was that they were "nobodies". Total rubbish.
They haven't been to a semi-final of a finals competition in 13 years and that was in their own backyard. Before that they had only managed one semi-final in 30 years. I think nobodies is a fair reflection. There are aat least a dozen teams in Europe alone with better records than that in the same time period.

[Stuttgart88]

So are we a force to be reckoned with because we made the QFs in 1990?

I'd say most top international teams in the world would consider England a tough draw.

[youngirish]

So are we a force to be reckoned with because we made the QFs in 1990?

I'd say most top international teams in the world would consider England a tough draw.

No we are sh*t there are lots of teams top international teams would consider a tough draw if they qualify - Czech Republic, Turkey, Russia, Serbia, Ukraine, Ivory Coast, Ghana but I don't see anyone claiming they are a dead cert to win the world cup unless they bottle it which is the original point I pulled as_i_say up on.

[DeLorean]

Well I think it's fair to say that England aren't in the top tier of countries, where they do see themselves. I'd have them in the 2nd tier which would consist of the countries that generally qualify for tournaments and are expected to reach the knock out rounds. Portugal, Holland, Czechs, Croatia, Sweden and the likes would also be in this tier. Spain would have also been in this pool until their Euro win. France, Germany, Argentina, Brazil, Italy are far more reliable bets to make a Final every so often. That said England's optimism is a good thing, even if it's hard for everybody else to listen to. If we had the same mind set Qualifying might become more of a formality as belief counts for an awful lot. There's no real reason that Bulgaria, Denmark and Sweden are always present at these tournaments and we're not.

[as_i_say]

As a know it all I can be 100% certain that your statement that only England bottling it will prevent them from winning the next world cup is pure reactionary nonsense purely based on 1 decent result against Croatia. No doubt if they lose to Ukraine in a couple of months you'll be similarly stating that they probably won't even get out of their group. .

Now youre just talking crap-again making assumptions that i have said this stuff in the past or classing me with delusionals who think england should have won recent tournaments. I am the exact opposite in fact and as a grown man still react with glee when England lose a match for the reaction of their media as much as anything else.

The croatia team that beat England 2 years ago are not the same force and England psychologically are light years ahead of where they were under McClaren. Graham Taylor 1994/Terry Venables 1996. 2 years is a bloody long time.

My main point is that England have never even looked close to not winning any of their qualification games so far. That hasnt been the case in recent tournaments. Stuttgarts point about winning all your games in qualifying and making a balls of the actual thing is valid (Spain for years) but there is something more determined about this English team. Time will tell who is right.

[jebus]

By next year I'm gonna presume the England first 11 will look something like this

--------------Forster---------
--Johnson---Terry-----Rio-----Cole
--Walcott--Gerrard---Lampard--Barry
----------Rooney--Owen-------

So they will have an inexperienced keeper (or an error prone David James)
Johnson is still weak defensively, might change at Liverpool though
Terry's legs are starting to go, Chelsea should have sold him really
Rio is still error prone, although he has improved as a defender
Cole is starting to look like the player he should have been so thats alright
Walcott will start, but how good he will be will depend on his club form, and if Arsenal stutter so will he
Gerrard and Lampard I still don't think can play alongside each other, I'd drop Fat Frank, Capello won't
Barry is a good solid player, but not a world beater
Rooney, depends which side of him shows up
Owen will probably get back in now he plays for Man Utd, even if he doesn't who plays in his place? Bent? Heskey? Crouch? Not great options

They could win it alright, but I'd easily have at least Spain and Argentina ahead of them in the betting

[youngirish]

My main point is that England have never even looked close to not winning any of their qualification games so far. That hasnt been the case in recent tournaments. Stuttgarts point about winning all your games in qualifying and making a balls of the actual thing is valid (Spain for years) but there is something more determined about this English team. Time will tell who is right.
England always coast through their qualification when they qualify for finals. They have topped far more difficult groups than they find themselves in now in the recent past without pulling up any trees at the finals - 2002 and 1998 qualifying spring to mind. In 2006 they also comfortably topped their group even though they experienced a few hiccups along the way and many were claiming they only had to show up to win the tournament yet when they arrived they were shockingly bad, only Ukraine were poorer of the 8 teams that made the quarter finals.

Anyway Croatia and Ukraine are not the quality of team you have the beat to win the world cup I'd be surprised if either qualify if they even make it to the last 16 so I wouldn't read too much into England topping their group thus far. Historically qualifying has no relevance whatsoever to which teams do well at the finals of the world cup.

Point is, player for player, the current English team is the worst I've seen in about 15 years. They will still be dragging Beckham out of his coffin to save games for them by the time the finals start and Capello will be written off as tactically naive and not up to the job when they crash out tails between their legs at the quarter finals stage as per usual.

[boovidge]

Sounds to me like some people just like saying the opposite to what Sky does so they can claim to have some higher knowledge of football. Anyone can tell that England have a good team. Calling them nobodies because they lost a friendly to Spain is laughable. Will they win the World Cup? No. But they're deservedly in the top ten FIFA rankings imo.

[shakermaker1982]

England will get to the Q Finals next summer but don't have the firepower upfront to blow away the big teams like Spain, Brazil, Argentina and France in a World Cup.

Rooney is injury prone and even if they do bring back Owen into the fold he is only likely to injure himself as well so they are left with Defoe, Crouch, Heskey and Darren Bent. I still don't think they have figured out how to play Gerrard and Lampard together and expect this to be exposed once again as soon as they play a quality side.

If we were drawn with em at the group stages at next years WC (if we qualify!) I wouldn't fear them. I know our team on paper looks a lot weaker but I could see us grinding out a draw no bother.

A friendly against em home or away would be a bloodbath. It isn't worth the aggro.

[irishultra]

england(nor france) have enough creativity in the middle imo and especially not at a world class standard. in international football gerrard and lampard are not creative players and imo some of their best attributes go out the window.

england have a deadly team clearly but they will need to rely on their rock solid defence rather than attacking play to win the world cup. they're looking good though.

[shaneker]

Sounds to me like some people just like saying the opposite to what Sky does so they can claim to have some higher knowledge of football. Anyone can tell that England have a good team. Calling them nobodies because they lost a friendly to Spain is laughable. Will they win the World Cup? No. But they're deservedly in the top ten FIFA rankings imo.

Absolutely correct, every word.

Still wouldn't fancy playing them in Dublin, just going to get the scum with a 'we'll really have 'em this time' mentality. Be good to beat them on their own patch though or (even better) in South Africa next summer...:D

[Newryrep]

German poster on TAMB and his views on english fans

Yep, i agree on that. Have had "the joy" to experience the Tommies in my beloved hometown Cologne and they are...no i dont want to get bannded for that.

To me the english are, not all, but felt 70-80 %, wannabe tough burberry cap wearing, gold chain round the neck, fat arse and belly skinheads with racist attitude towards turks, blacks and hatred against germans,. Lots of them tried to intimidate the germans by behaiving like silly Football Factory Danny Dyer and his bunch of thugs and picking up fights when drunk.

Xenophobic bunch of uneducated numheads with a very biased and misconcepted sense of history, holiday for these kind of english is go somewhere drink beer (preffered beer they already know from England-no experiences please!!)and let everyone know that youre english and that you are superior to them. If it is Prague, Germany, France, Turkey, Spain.....have witnessed that my whole life.

They have no sense of respect and if they have nothing to fight, they turn agianst each other. Childrens mind in the bodies of fat arsed hooligans.

Of corse the majority of English is different but their ambassadors abroad are those i characterized above.

I have lost my respect for them-if it comes to football.

[Deckydee]

Brilliant! :D

[irishultra]

German poster on TAMB and his views on english fans

Yep, i agree on that. Have had "the joy" to experience the Tommies in my beloved hometown Cologne and they are...no i dont want to get bannded for that.

To me the english are, not all, but felt 70-80 %, wannabe tough burberry cap wearing, gold chain round the neck, fat arse and belly skinheads with racist attitude towards turks, blacks and hatred against germans,. Lots of them tried to intimidate the germans by behaiving like silly Football Factory Danny Dyer and his bunch of thugs and picking up fights when drunk.

Xenophobic bunch of uneducated numheads with a very biased and misconcepted sense of history, holiday for these kind of english is go somewhere drink beer (preffered beer they already know from England-no experiences please!!)and let everyone know that youre english and that you are superior to them. If it is Prague, Germany, France, Turkey, Spain.....have witnessed that my whole life.

They have no sense of respect and if they have nothing to fight, they turn agianst each other. Childrens mind in the bodies of fat arsed hooligans.

Of corse the majority of English is different but their ambassadors abroad are those i characterized above.

I have lost my respect for them-if it comes to football.


I think we have them here as well. Whatever reason the national team doesn't attract them, they're probably in some pub watching the game.