Owen Coyle

[EalingGreen]

Well done lads for ruining a good thread about Owen Coyle
Oh get off your high horse. There is nothing stopping anyone from making non-partisan posts if they like (see e.g. my own posts #8 and #23, for instance).

As for the more "controversial" posts to which you seem to take exception, these seem to have been provoked by my making the (surely tenable) point that it may be presumptious to assume that if Coyle continues to develop as a manager, he would be tempted to manage ROI one day.

If nothing else, he may well be equally/more tempted by the Scotland job, if he's tempted by international management at all - a debateable enough notion, when you look at others like David Moyse or Martin O'Neill, who could have walked into a job with Scotland/ROI/NI any time they liked.

[geysir]

I didn't claim that it was easier for Coyle to get a full ROI cap than a Scotland one. I merely pointed out that realistically, he wasn't ever close to getting a full Scotland cap, which might partly have explained his "choice" of ROI. That's all.
More tosh,
as pointed out earlier you know féck all about Coyle.
Donegal parents, 7 siblings, grew up in Donegal lite in the Gorbals. He was wanted by Scotland but chose Ireland. He chose Ireland without hesitation according to the man himself. Both choices were on the table at the same time.
His first game was for Ireland V Scotland in the u21s.

[youngirish]

More tosh,
as pointed out earlier you know féck all about Coyle.
Donegal parents, 7 siblings, grew up in Donegal lite in the Gorbals. He was wanted by Scotland but chose Ireland. He chose Ireland without hesitation according to the man himself. Both choices were on the table at the same time.
His first game was for Ireland V Scotland in the u21s.

Shock horror, EG is shown to know nothing about a topic he posts authoritively on while at the same time attempting to get a sly dig in at the ROI football team.

FIFA elligibility rules, Darron Gibson, FIFA's stance on the NI and ROI player situation - how many times do his wild accusations have to be shown to be the rubbish they are before he ultimately has to accept he was wrong?

If you're looking to make wild, unsubstaniated, NI worshipping, chip on the shoulder posts you have the wrong site. I think it's this link you're looking for:

www.ourweecountry.co.uk.

[seanfhear]

I suppose i should wait until after the play off final but if Burnley loose will they be able to keep a hold of Owen Coyle.

To me himself and Alan Irvine are the two outstanding managers in the championship this year.

I suppose premiership clubs like exotic foreign managers but some of them might be better looking close to home.

[Gather round]

I suppose premiership clubs like exotic foreign managers but some of them might be better looking close to home

16 of the 20 already have, surely? Only Benitez, Hiddink (or Ancelotti?), Wenger and Zola are "exotic" managers (ie further from home than Coyle).

Agreed Irvine has also done a good job this term.

[Drumcondra 69er]

More tosh,
as pointed out earlier you know féck all about Coyle.
Donegal parents, 7 siblings, grew up in Donegal lite in the Gorbals. He was wanted by Scotland but chose Ireland. He chose Ireland without hesitation according to the man himself. Both choices were on the table at the same time.
His first game was for Ireland V Scotland in the u21s.

Nice quote from him about that very game here from earlier this year when they played Arsenal....

"As a player I was always in awe of Liam Brady - not just for his sweet left foot, but as a man," he said. "I always remember meeting him when I won my first Under-21 cap for the Republic of Ireland against Scotland. We won 1-0, Mark Lawrenson scored, but it was just as memorable because I got to meet the great Liam Brady."

[EalingGreen]

More tosh,

Donegal parents, 7 siblings, grew up in Donegal lite in the Gorbals.
First generation? Seven siblings? Grew up in an "Irish" area of Britain?

Sounds very much to me like the Gallens of Shepherds Bush. And as we know, all of them chose to represent ROI.

Except the most talented of them, Kevin, who perhaps considering himself good enough to go all the way in international football, chose the country of his birth.

Besides, you still haven't addressed my point about playing international football being different from playing it. Do you know that Coyle has ambitions re the latter?

For as I said earlier, when capable and ambitious managers are offered a choice between a decent club and a decent national team, the former is increasingly winning out - even where the candidate has a natural affinity with the country in question (eg Hughes, McLeish, Sanchez etc)

Unless, of course, the international job is so "big" as to be irresistable - eg Martin O'Neill applying for the England post. Maybe it was O'Neill's "Britishness" :rolleyes: which caused him never to show any interest in either the NI or ROI positions...

[Den Perry]

Has the potential to become a great manager, but I can't see him managing ROI, tbh.

For one thing, international management is no longer the pinnacle of a manager's career - see, for example, how Mark Hughes, Walter Smith/Alec McLeish, even Lawrie Sanchez were notably successful with Wales/Scot/NI, before joining clubs which could hardly be described as huge. Therefore if Coyle can manage in the Premiership, either with Burnley or someone else, why would he want to move? David Moyes, for example, could have had the Scotland job had he wanted it, but has never shown any interest.

Speaking of which, even if Coyle did fancy a spell managing an international team as a "stepping stone", I'd imagine he and Scotland would appeal more to each other than he and ROI.

Of course, the sort of money Trapattoni is on would likely tempt him, but Coyle is hardly a big enough "name" for some Sugar Daddy to offer him a package comparable to Trap's. And let's be honest, Trap wouldn't have accepted the ROI job when he was an up-and-coming manager around Coyle's age, either.

EG, you really are a bitter person....can't resist digs at ROI. sad, narrow minded t wat

[NeilMcD]

I just do not see the point of somebody being a member of a forum of their rival I would never join an English forum or a Shamrock Rovers forum. Especially when it leads to threads like these being hi-jacked and ruined.

[Den Perry]

Originally Posted by EalingGreen:
"Speaking of which, even if Coyle did fancy a spell managing an international team as a "stepping stone", I'd imagine he and Scotland would appeal more to each other than he and ROI"



Yeah, you're right, why would be attracted to managing Scotland? After all, he was only born and brought up there. And played for 12 Scottish clubs. And managed two Scottish clubs before moving to England.

Much more likely that he'd prefer ROI, on the basis of a seven minute appearance as substitute for the ROI in a friendly in Tillberg, at the age of 28, following the FAI's exhumation/discovery of his Irish Granny (or whatever). The fact that he was never remotely good enough to play for Scotland obviously had nothing to do with it...;)

I notice what appears to be some mocking of Irland exploiting the "granny rule"....are you trying to tell us that all NI's internationals were born and reared there?

[Den Perry]

Not at all, you were politely brought to task, based on the content of your post, the usual chip laden sarcastic post with opinion based on knowing nothing.

:D
Who can forget that,
I have been presuming to lecture you on Dual Nationality for about 2 years now and with good reason :rolleyes:


There you go again with the 8 minutes.
The country to which he aligned himself in football matters to, is Ireland. He still plays for Ireland. It is an accurate comment to make, that Ireland is his country when it comes to football matters. His nationality is Irish, he holds an Irish passport and is very proud that he came close enough to getting on the WC squad. Doesn't mean that his "Scottishness" is wiped out.

For a dual national yourself you have very little appreciation of the national sentiments of a Dual National and easily sneer at this man's Irishness, a sneer based on "he only played for 8 minutes" while ignoring all the other elements in his life, in Scottish society where Irishness has been engrained for generations.


It's just a significantly irrelevant opinion and probably more appropriate for the playground - a place you probably would feel more at home.

Geysir, you're wasting your time...the likes of EG never take the views of others on board....try to impose their views against the will of others

[Gather round]

I just do not see the point of somebody being a member of a forum of their rival

Variously- this is a good forum generally, with regular topical threads about NI football. You could equally ask the Mods why there's an Irish League section?

Unfortunately, the topical threads do sometimes attract witless sh*t-stirring about the NI team and its supporters. You can hardly be surprised when this is answered.


I would never join an English forum or a Shamrock Rovers forum. Especially when it leads to threads like these being hi-jacked and ruined

Come on, lighten up. It's just gone off at a tangent. Plenty of threads do this- although I realise the mods on here police it more than on other sites.

[Den Perry]

Not so. I was answering your posts (completely irrelevant to the subject of the thread, but hey).



It directly answered your anecdotal claim that Republic of Ireland football is better known abroad than Scottish- which just doesn't ring true in my anecdotal experience. Fans elsewhere in Europe just aren't that interested in either (or Wales or Northern Ireland's), because over a decent length of time (10-15 years at least) we've all tended not to qualify for tournaments. Ireland's most famous ever footballer, George Best, got a respectful but brief obituary in German football magazine, in contrast to the reams of coverage in all British and Irish media.

Abroad just ain't that interested, you know.



One, last week. With due respect to Duff and Finnan, their exploits in the CL haven't added as much to RoI's profile in the competition, as Scotland having a team in the group stages most years has.



Again, I like Robbie Keane, but steady on. He doesn't play in the CL, and his World Cup appearance was in 2002. And see point about George Best above.



Your "doubt" isn't based on anything other than being an RoI fan who talks about RoI players when watching RoI abroad, is it? I mean, fair enough, but it's a bit limiting when dismissing other teams?



At risk of repeating myself, it was a long time ago and it wasn't sustained?



No, read more carefully and you'll see I disagree with all your points quoted above. Which I'm only making to answer your digs at NI, of course.



I went by train to both actually (and similarly to the U-21 game in Germany), so met plenty of locals on the journey, as well as in the pub before and after the game.

I'm not claiming that you're dishonest (although I take your point that as we're two anonymous guys on the internet, the whole exchange could be invented). Just that you're really offering nothing more than anecdote to back up your bias.



Most would agree that 1 September 2001 was eight years ago. And you haven't corrected any other 'factual' errors.

Do better. Or stick to what you know.


I, for one do not agree that 8 Sept 2001 was eight years ago

[tetsujin1979]

First generation? Seven siblings? Grew up in an "Irish" area of Britain?

Sounds very much to me like the Gallens of Shepherds Bush. And as we know, all of them chose to represent ROI.

Except the most talented of them, Kevin, who perhaps considering himself good enough to go all the way in international football, chose the country of his birth.Gallen was told to declare for England by his manager at the time (think it was Gerry Francis, but I'm not sure) on the basis that the club would be able to sell him for more money

[livehead1]

Gallen was told to declare for England by his manager at the time (think it was Gerry Francis, but I'm not sure) on the basis that the club would be able to sell him for more money

Look, don't let facts get in the way of a slanging match!

[EalingGreen]

EG, you really are a bitter person....can't resist digs at ROI. sad, narrow minded t wat
How was what I posted "having a dig" at the ROI?

Having followed football closely for decades now, including having met my share of footballers and managers etc, I have come to appreciate that things aren't always what they seem in the game.

One aspect of this is that international football, which most of us fans would give our right arm to play (even for 8 minutes!), does not necessarily hold the same allure for professionals, as we might think. Indeed, as footballers earn ever more money from their clubs, the significance of international football for some becomes correspondingly diminished (do the names "Stephen Ireland" or "Roy Carroll" ring any bells, to take two examples close to home?).

And this trend is becoming increasingly pronounced when it comes to international management (imo). For whilst there is no doubt that 20 or 30 years ago, this was seen as the pinnacle of football for any manager, that is no longer the case (imo).

Which, to get back to the subject of Owen Coyle, is why when others saw how well he was doing and started imagining him in the ROI role, I was of the opinion that they have been being premature and presumptious, that's all.

But hey, if you want to ascribe every other malign motive to me, irrespective of what I am actually posting, go ahead, knock yourself out. If nothing else, it might hide the embarrassment of some of the ill-thought out tripe which you post...

[EalingGreen]

Gallen was told to declare for England by his manager at the time (think it was Gerry Francis, but I'm not sure) on the basis that the club would be able to sell him for more money
I'm well aware that QPR pushed him in that direction, but he could still have resisted.

[NeilMcD]

[QUOTE=Gather round;1162545]V

Unfortunately, the topical threads do sometimes attract witless sh*t-stirring about the NI team and its supporters. You can hardly be surprised when this is answered.


This is the point its an Republic of Ireland, we should be able to **** stir about our rival esp in the National Team forum. That is what I said before, We should not be PC about it. I would not expect a Shamrock Rovers website to be polite about Bohs. I just do not see why someone would want to defend their team on a rivals website.

[EalingGreen]

I just do not see the point of somebody being a member of a forum of their rival I would never join an English forum or a Shamrock Rovers forum. Especially when it leads to threads like these being hi-jacked and ruined.
This is one of two football forums I browse and contribute to (more than once in a Blue Moon, at any rate).

That is because it covers areas of football which particularly interest me (Irish, international, Irish League etc), generally has a good level of debate, and is well-moderated. Therefore so long as I stay within the Rules, I am as entitled to post as much as you or anyone else.

Speaking of which, when you bitch about this thread being "ruined" or "hi-jacked" etc, are you referring to my posts? For when someone opens a thread about an ex-ROI international player who is making a name for himself as a club manager, and wonders whether he might one day not make a good ROI manager, was it not entirely relevant for me to question whether he might want to manage ROI?

Considering I gave reasons and examples to back up my initial thesis (whether you agree with them or not), it clearly was a pertinent question for me to ask.

Of course, when "the usual suspects" then chose that as their cue to make childish anti-NI digs at me (and Gather Round, when he weighed in), then I ought to have risen above that, but no matter, the Mods took action to delete the offending posts, which was fine by me.

So there you have it, Mr McD, do you have any substantive comment to add to this thread over which you grieve so earnestly? For example, do you think Coyle might one day be interested in applying for the ROI job, or accept that he might possibly consider he has "bigger fish to fry"?

[NeilMcD]

This is one of two football forums I browse and contribute to (more than once in a Blue Moon, at any rate).

That is because it covers areas of football which particularly interest me (Irish, international, Irish League etc), generally has a good level of debate, and is well-moderated. Therefore so long as I stay within the Rules, I am as entitled to post as much as you or anyone else.

Speaking of which, when you bitch about this thread being "ruined" or "hi-jacked" etc, are you referring to my posts? For when someone opens a thread about an ex-ROI international player who is making a name for himself as a club manager, and wonders whether he might one day not make a good ROI manager, was it not entirely relevant for me to question whether he might want to manage ROI?

Considering I gave reasons and examples to back up my initial thesis (whether you agree with them or not), it clearly was a pertinent question for me to ask.

Of course, when "the usual suspects" then chose that as their cue to make childish anti-NI digs at me (and Gather Round, when he weighed in), then I ought to have risen above that, but no matter, the Mods took action to delete the offending posts, which was fine by me.

So there you have it, Mr McD, do you have any substantive comment to add to this thread over which you grieve so earnestly? For example, do you think Coyle might one day be interested in applying for the ROI job, or accept that he might possibly consider he has "bigger fish to fry"?


I was not specifially referring to your posts but you seemed to think I was. I was referring to them all and to be honest I am as bad as you now as I am joining in this debate.


Anyway I think Owen Coyle is doing a good job as manager of Burnley and he seems to like progressive football which is attractive to watch and he is doing it on a tight budget. He seems to bringing out the best in a young group of players. I think its fair enough for our supports to wonder and dream out loud and hope that one day he becomes a top manager or a manager who is interested in managing the country he played for.

Unfortunately this last bit then gets side tracked into an issue about nationality and cultural heritage etc and gets away from the facts that Owen Coyle is doing a good job and some Irish fans would like to see him as manager of our team one day. The good thing about forums is that you can have a forum for collective dreaming. As I said I am sure on a Rovers forum they are shouting from the rooftops about Saturdays Result anad game and fair play to them. I am not about to go now and try to pour cold water on their celebrations and offer some sort of cold light of day analysis of the game for them.

[youngirish]

Unfortunately, the topical threads do sometimes attract witless sh*t-stirring about the NI team and its supporters. You can hardly be surprised when this is answered.


This is the point its an Republic of Ireland, we should be able to **** stir about our rival esp in the National Team forum. That is what I said before, We should not be PC about it. I would not expect a Shamrock Rovers website to be polite about Bohs. I just do not see why someone would want to defend their team on a rivals website.
It's not true anyway. EG only gets slagged when he comes on passing his snide comments about the ROI team and posting links to rankings when (and only when) NI are above the ROI as he did at the beginning of this thread when he and not anybody else initially 'hijacked' the topic. When NI are not above the ROI in the rankings I've noticed he tends to be very quiet.

I personally couldn't care less about the NI team and only bring them up when EG does one of the above as do most of the **** stirrers (described as such by Gather round).

It's the old NI hardliners us against the world attitude. What Gr fails to see is that EG is the biggest **** stirrer on these boards. He only posts negative comments and put downs about our team, I can't remember anything positive in all his posts.

You only have to have a glance at ourweecountry.co.uk to see how obsessed they are about the ROI team. I doubt anyone here would mention NI if EG disappeared.

[EalingGreen]

I just do not see why someone would want to defend their team on a rivals website.
Except that the NI/ROI case is not like that of eg Shams and Bohs.

For one thing, Shams don't want to "take over" the Bohs, nor do they wish to "poach" Bohs' players from under their nose.

Sure, I'm touchy when it comes to defending my team. But tbh, there's not a hell of a sight to be gained by my defending them on an NI forum, where everyone else is pretty much agreed.

Far better, imo, to try to disabuse the fans of the team which threatens us, to one degree or another, of some of the misconceptions and myths which some of them (ROI fans) seem to hold about us.

[NeilMcD]

Except that the NI/ROI case is not like that of eg Shams and Bohs.

For one thing, Shams don't want to "take over" the Bohs, nor do they wish to "poach" Bohs' players from under their nose.

Sure, I'm touchy when it comes to defending my team. But tbh, there's not a hell of a sight to be gained by my defending them on an NI forum, where everyone else is pretty much agreed.

Far better, imo, to try to disabuse the fans of the team which threatens us, to one degree or another, of some of the misconceptions and myths which some of them (ROI fans) seem to hold about us.

Thats like a Zyonist going on to a Palesinian website trying to change their views. If you are so touchy do not go on to a rival website simple as that. It wont be good for your health. If I was Jewish I would not start posting on New Nazi forums trying to defend my race.

[EalingGreen]

Thats like a Zyonist going on to a Palesinian website trying to change their views. If you are so touchy do not go on to a rival website simple as that. It wont be good for your health. If I was Jewish I would not start posting on New Nazi forums trying to defend my race.
Er, I do not consider myself to be the NI equivalent of a "Zionist", nor this to be a forum for the "Neo-Nazi" wing of the ROI fanbase.
And my health is quite fine, thank you very much.

As for "changing peoples views", from those people who are kind enough to have pressed the "Thanks" button, I would hope that at least some posters appreciate my posts from time to time.

I know I have certainly learned a lot from very many of the posters on here, in turn.

Anyhow, should you have any interest in international football etc, rather than advising that you should eg not go near OWC, on the contrary, my view is "the more the merrier" - it makes for lively debate.

[youngirish]

For one thing, Shams don't want to "take over" the Bohs, nor do they wish to "poach" Bohs' players from under their nose.

We've a panzer division waiting on the border ready to go on command. Once it crosses you will all be forcibly baptised to the true faith and made sing Amhrán na bhFiann at the top of your voices in Gaelic until you can recite it word for word.

Replace poach with "allow their citizens born in the six counties to play for them" and you've something closer to the truth.

[EalingGreen]

I doubt anyone here would mention NI if EG disappeared.
Oh I dunno - SkStu even started a thread entitled "Northern Ireland".

Or was that why he was suspended? ;)

[NeilMcD]

Er, I do not consider myself to be the NI equivalent of a "Zionist", nor this to be a forum for the "Neo-Nazi" wing of the ROI fanbase.
And my health is quite fine, thank you very much.

As for "changing peoples views", from those people who are kind enough to have pressed the "Thanks" button, I would hope that at least some posters appreciate my posts from time to time.

I know I have certainly learned a lot from very many of the posters on here, in turn.

Anyhow, should you have any interest in international football etc, rather than advising that you should eg not go near OWC, on the contrary, my view is "the more the merrier" - it makes for lively debate.

No thanks I spend enough time posting on my own teams forum never mind going near anybody elses. Anyway my last post on the matter. I really hope that Owen Coyles continues to progress as a manager and if he applies for the job and is the best man for it I hope gets to manage the country he played for as a player.

[youngirish]

Oh I dunno - SkStu even started a thread entitled "Northern Ireland".

Or was that why he was suspended? ;)

Hopefully it was. I've been suspended for less.

[EalingGreen]

Replace poach with "allow their citizens born in the six counties to play for them" and you've something closer to the truth.

Your "allow" is my "poach".

Which I always thought was what this type of forum was all about. For I, for one, see little point in contributing to a "debate" [sic] which never gets any further than everyone agreeing how great they all are...

[youngirish]

Your "allow" is my "poach".

Which I always thought was what this type of forum was all about. For I, for one, see little point in contributing to a "debate" [sic] which never gets any further than everyone agreeing how great they all are...

I agree, however, a little impartiality every now and then doesn't go amiss instead of the NI against the ROI attitude that prevails in many of your posts imo.

[Drumcondra 69er]

I'm well aware that QPR pushed him in that direction, but he could still have resisted.

That's a blindingly stupid post, he was a young player put under immense pressure by his manager as the 4 foreigners rule was in place in Europe at the time and QPR had European ambitions at the time believe it or not, Gallen always regretted it but was too young to stand up against his managers wishes at the time.

[Den Perry]

This is one of two football forums I browse and contribute to (more than once in a Blue Moon, at any rate).

That is because it covers areas of football which particularly interest me (Irish, international, Irish League etc), generally has a good level of debate, and is well-moderated. Therefore so long as I stay within the Rules, I am as entitled to post as much as you or anyone else.

Speaking of which, when you bitch about this thread being "ruined" or "hi-jacked" etc, are you referring to my posts? For when someone opens a thread about an ex-ROI international player who is making a name for himself as a club manager, and wonders whether he might one day not make a good ROI manager, was it not entirely relevant for me to question whether he might want to manage ROI?

Considering I gave reasons and examples to back up my initial thesis (whether you agree with them or not), it clearly was a pertinent question for me to ask.

Of course, when "the usual suspects" then chose that as their cue to make childish anti-NI digs at me (and Gather Round, when he weighed in), then I ought to have risen above that, but no matter, the Mods took action to delete the offending posts, which was fine by me.

So there you have it, Mr McD, do you have any substantive comment to add to this thread over which you grieve so earnestly? For example, do you think Coyle might one day be interested in applying for the ROI job, or accept that he might possibly consider he has "bigger fish to fry"?


was accusing me of being a bigot on the "World Football " thread within the rules? Not that I am going to be a snitch and go running to a moderator....

[geysir]

First generation? Seven siblings? Grew up in an "Irish" area of Britain?
Sounds very much to me like the Gallens of Shepherds Bush. And as we know, all of them chose to represent ROI.
Sounds like you refuse to read Owen Coyle's story in brief. Sounds like you missed the part of Owen Coyle having the choice of declaring for both at the same time and chose Ireland without hesitation also knowing his first squad calling would be for a game against Scotland.

It sounds like there is no separation from your back orifice to your front.
Hard to credit that you are regarded as one of the more rational posters on the OWC :D
I suppose it's all relative.


Besides you still haven't addressed my point about playing international football being different from playing it. Do you know that Coyle has ambitions re the latter?
How could anyone address such a question.:rolleyes:
If you meant managing. I don't know his ambitions.
But he was asked directly about had he been contacted by the FAI in Jan last year, he replied that yes he received a letter the other day, offering him tickets for a game. Managing Ireland, he added that it would be "an honour" to be considered for the Ireland job.

[Deckydee]

Hi,

Here is a thread that I started about that very story on a QPR website:

http://qprdot.org/viewtopic.php?t=36294&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=kevin+gallen+truth&start=0

Their replies make for interesting reading! :D

Here is the article BTW in case you dont want to read the responses (Orginally from the Irish Times)

Gallen’s call stirs Ireland

His brothers played for Ireland while he chose England, but now Kevin Gallen has told Brian Kerr he wants to wear green

The scene is an Irish club in Acton, west London. It is June 2002 and on the big screen Ireland and Spain are set to lock horns in the last 16 of the World Cup. The bar is a sea of green flags and painted faces. The atmosphere is charged and electric, the mood expectant. The Gallen family sit among them, proud and happy and Irish.

Stephen Gallen waves his scarf in the air and casts a reproachful glare at one of his companions across the table. “How could you be shouting for Spain?” he scolds, waving a finger in his brother Kevin’s direction. Kevin Gallen stares back in outrage. “There’s no need to be saying that to me,” he complains. “Why would I want Spain to beat Ireland?” He knows protests are futile. They always have been. It’s 11 years since Gallen, the product of an intensely Irish upbringing, accepted the invitation to play for England and forfeited, in many eyes, any rights he had to consider himself an Irishman. Protesting his innocence has always been a pointless exercise. Context and circumstance were luxuries that the narrow-minded interpretation of his case never allowed.

What had always been a complex and contentious issue was, in Gallen’s case, reduced to convenient clarity. He was a traitor and a turncoat, deserving of our scorn. Mocked by many journalists and Ireland supporters, some friends and even members of his own family. Nothing he could say, he felt, would ever change it.

All he ever hoped for was a time when he could return to Ireland, have a drink in his uncle’s pub in Mayo and not have a local remind him of his treachery. He never believed it would happen. But he never imagined that his story would take the strange twist that it has.

It happened in November. A man from County Limerick sent him a letter pointing out a rule change by Fifa that enabled players capped by one country at under-age level to switch their allegiance to another. He read and re-read the letter and was intrigued by its contents but wary too. Would the Irish people accept him? Was he merely setting himself up for a hard and painful fall? He talked to people: his parents and brothers, Gary Waddock, youth coach at QPR, a friend in the Republic of Ireland supporters club in London. The feedback was reassuring. He thought about going to the press but balked at the inevitable “Come and get me” headlines. Instead he wrote a letter setting out his story and sent it to Brian Kerr. Encouragingly, Kerr wrote back.

“He sent me a very nice letter,” Gallen says. “I appreciated that. It wasn’t something he had to do. He said he was sympathetic to my case but wasn’t able to make any promises. I understand that. But he’s been to see me play and I know the door isn’t completely closed.”

Whatever happens, Gallen knows, it is a chance he had to take, an opportunity to heal old wounds. To represent Ireland like his two brothers did before him, to put an Irish cap alongside the English ones on the sideboard in a house where his parents are equally proud of all their sons. What, he thinks, is there to lose? “I could get more abuse. I could be called a traitor again. I’m well used to it. I’ve had it all and I could handle it again.”

THEY were a typical Irish family growing up in west London. Jim left his native Donegal in the 1960s and ended up on the buildings in Shepherd’s Bush. Tess left Mayo around the same time and ended up in the same area via a spell in America. They met in an Irish pub, married and raised a family of three boys and two girls to love Ireland and Queens Park Rangers.

The boys’ school was the Cardinal Vaughan Memorial in Holland Park. Their social life revolved around the Acton and Ealing Whistlers, the Irish music club Jim and Tess helped set up as a focal point for the Irish community.

The Whistlers also fielded seven or eight soccer teams who wore the Irish green. The Gallen brothers were the stars.Kevin was so talented he played on the same team as Joe, three years his senior. Jim was their manager.

Watford would come looking for Joe, and QPR for Kevin when he was 14. England schoolboys was the next step. That didn’t mean much in terms of national fealty. In 1992 Joe made his debut for the Ireland under-21s; that Kevin would follow in his footsteps was accepted as a formality.

But neither Joe nor Steve, who would play for the Ireland youths in 1994, were quite like their brother. Kevin was a teenage sensation, the most talked about young striker in England apart from Robbie Fowler. In two seasons in the QPR youth team he knocked in more than 130 goals and in the spring of 1993 the English FA came calling, enlisting him for the European under-18 championship finals that summer.

The loss to Ireland, a country with a chronic shortage of quality strikers, was inestimable. Inevitably it magnified the extent of Gallen’s perceived crime. He says vehemently that nobody from the FAI ever approached him directly. In the middle of the Charlton years, when the approach to youth football was feckless, that is well believable.

At the time Joe McGrath, the FAI’s national director of coaching, said he had been aware of Gallen since the turn of the decade. “Somebody at QPR was absolutely determined that Kevin should opt for England,” McGrath explained. Gallen tells a similar, more detailed story.

“What I said in my letter to Brian was that I didn’t know whether contact had been made between the FAI and QPR but nobody from the FAI spoke to me directly. I knew they had to be aware of me through my brothers but I was never told of any approach. Maybe I could have taken a step back and thought about the consequences but when you’re a kid you don’t think much about the future. It’s all about the here and now.”

And that’s only half the story. The three-foreigner rule was then in place and QPR didn’t need a Republic of Ireland international on their books. He remembers people at the club who were disparaging of the idea of playing for Ireland. “People who wouldn’t call it Ireland,” he says, “but refer to it as Eire, you know, in a joke sort of way.”

QPR wanted him but their interest was conditional. A new four-year contract with gob-smacking bonuses was waved in front of him, hinging on one crucial detail. “It all hung on whether I played for England. It was all England, England, England. Ireland was never mentioned. Ireland didn’t enter the equation as far as they were concerned.”

His situation has always been compared with that of other Irish players, usually to compound his guilt. It’s been reported that Kevin Kilbane withstood pressure at Preston to declare for England, as if Kilbane was a similarly talented prodigy, as if he had suffered the same overbearing influence.

History was not to be Gallen’s friend. His goals would help England win that European under-18 championship. Fowler, Gary Neville, Paul Scholes and Sol Campbell were among his teammates. After that a senior debut for QPR would follow at Old Trafford and his first senior goal at Loftus Road a few days later. But people in Ireland don’t remember that now. They recall only one thing.

“When I come to Ireland I get it all the time,” he says. “‘Why didn’t you play for Ireland? Why? Why?’ If I’m with family and I go to my uncle’s pub somebody will bring it up and I’m like, ‘Oh for f*** sake. It’s gone. I can’t do anything about it now’.”

Nor did his family grant him immunity. “I get it off my two brothers. We get on very well but they take this very seriously, especially Steve. He’s very patriotic and I know he’d be delighted if I got the chance to play for Ireland.”

As luck would have it one of his four England under-21 caps came against Ireland at Lansdowne Road in March 1995. He was sitting in the dressing room when he heard his name announced followed by loud hoots of derision. “It was a hard day. Little kids coming up to me and effing and blinding me.

I don’t think it was nice for my parents in the stands. I tried to laugh it off. What else could I do?” He never got a senior cap for England. He knows there are those who feel justice was served, that karma prevailed. The pressure of being a starlet didn’t help, neither did a cruciate ligament injury in August 1996. Only now, he thinks, is he approaching the form that earned him such a lavish reputation.

He’s blunt about his situation, though. He knows Ireland are short of strikers and feels he could do a job as a foil for Robbie Keane, but while he has scored 16 goals for QPR this season and played as well as ever, they are still in Division Two and he will be 29 in September. If Kerr passes him over for football reasons he will understand.

“I can see that point of view,” he says. “I know for a fact a lot of people would not be happy to see me in the Ireland squad. But then a lot of people would be happy, too. Everybody’s got an opinion. You can’t please everyone. I understand, too, if he wants to bring youngsters through. But at the end of the day it’s about getting results and I feel the way I’m playing at the moment I can help.”

No illusions. He’s neither apologising nor playing the victim’s card, he’s just explaining and asking for compassion. He only has hope. “A part of me is preparing for the worst,” he says. “People telling me to go away, to f*** off. I know that’s a possibility.”

But maybe, just maybe, in the months ahead the one person who matters might come whistling a different tune.

[geysir]

Good article thanks DD,


In case you don't know what Deckydee looks like

http://qprdot.org/images/avatars/154267639049351c88adb8c.jpg

[Den Perry]

I notice what appears to be some mocking of Irland exploiting the "granny rule"....are you trying to tell us that all NI's internationals were born and reared there?

I notice Ealing Green has not responded to the above...unusual for him to be so quiet....

[Deckydee]

Good article thanks DD,


In case you don't know what Deckydee looks like

http://qprdot.org/images/avatars/154267639049351c88adb8c.jpg

Tasty :D

[Donegalcelt]

http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/donegalsport/Owen-Coyle39s-Wembley-date.5269273.jp


Owen Coyle's Wembley date


Owen Coyle's Burnley are one step from the Premier League

Date: 14 May 2009
By Alan Foley
Donegal will have a special interest in the Coca-Cola League Championship play-off final with former Republic of Ireland striker Owen Coyle's Burnley side facing Sheffield United at Wembley on May 25.
Coyle, who was born in Paisley to Donegal parents, saw his Burnley side overcome Reading on a 3-0 aggregate scoreline over the two legs of the play-off semi-finals.

Tuesday's 2-0 win at the Madejski Stadium came courtesy of superb second-half goals, from Martin Paterson and Steven Thompson, adding to Saturday's 1-0 success at Turf Moor when Graham Alexander scored the only goal of the game from the penalty spot.

With his mother Frances a native of Glaserchoo in Gortahork, and his late father Owen from Gweedore, Coyle qualified to play for the Republic of Ireland during his own playing days, when he lined up for a number of clubs including Bolton Wanderers, Dundee United and Motherwell.

He made just one appearance for Jack Charlton's side, in a 1994 friendly against Holland in Tilburg, which Ireland won 1-0 thanks to a goal from Tommy Coyne.

After managing St Johnstone in the Scottish First Division, Coyle took over at Burnley in November 2007. This season, his first full term in charge, as well as making the play-off final after finishing fifth in the Championship, Coyle's team have defeated Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham Hotspur in the Carling Cup, losing to the latter over two legs of the semi-final.







Owen Coyle's late father is buried in Gweedore and as a child, he played in summer cups in the Falcarragh/Gortahork area.

[Gather round]

I, for one do not agree that 8 Sept 2001 was eight years ago

OK, so that's two of you can't manage basic arithmetic.


This is the point its an Republic of Ireland, we should be able to **** stir about our rival esp in the National Team forum. That is what I said before, We should not be PC about it. I would not expect a Shamrock Rovers website to be polite about Bohs. I just do not see why someone would want to defend their team on a rivals website

No-one's forcing you to stop ****-stirring, to be "PC" nor to be polite. But- as I've explained patiently on numerous past occasions- if you do any of the above, you can hardly be surprised when it's challenged.

I've explained why I do- if you can't see it, never mind, no harm done. Let's move on?


It's not true anyway...I personally couldn't care less about the NI team and only bring them up when EG does one of the above as do most of the **** stirrers (described as such by Gather round)

No, it's true enough. You care enough to post snide digs against the NI team and its fans: were you really indifferent, you wouldn't, regardless of what EG or I or anyone else posted.


It's the old NI hardliners us against the world attitude

No, it's poor argument getting challenged. Not sure what you mean by "hardline"- just empty cliche, maybe? I don't think anything I've said on this forum is that. I don't suggest abolishing anyone else's team, I don't begrudge people for playing for whichever team(s) they're eligible, etc.


I doubt anyone here would mention NI if EG disappeared

Ha ha. I've been reading this forum since 2003 (my previous id got banned after a lively row with mi buen amigo Lopez), and the same themes recur regularly. And have done since well before EG weighed in.

[Stuttgart88]

Originally Posted by EalingGreen:
"Speaking of which, even if Coyle did fancy a spell managing an international team as a "stepping stone", I'd imagine he and Scotland would appeal more to each other than he and ROI" Yeah, you're right, why would be attracted to managing Scotland? After all, he was only born and brought up there. And played for 12 Scottish clubs. And managed two Scottish clubs before moving to England.

Much more likely that he'd prefer ROI, on the basis of a seven minute appearance as substitute for the ROI in a friendly in Tillberg, at the age of 28, following the FAI's exhumation/discovery of his Irish Granny (or whatever). The fact that he was never remotely good enough to play for Scotland obviously had nothing to do with it...;)Come on lads, if this post wasn't a mischievous wind up I don't know what is. This is what started it all.

I enjoy the NI lads' football contributions to this site but when they resort to this type of stuff it's tedious & unwelcome. GR had the decency to admit his error when corrected over the "rigged" UEFA 2000 play-off draw and the apology was accepted generously. Why don't you do the same EG and we'll all move on?

[Den Perry]

OK, so that's two of you can't manage basic arithmetic.



No-one's forcing you to stop ****-stirring, to be "PC" nor to be polite. But- as I've explained patiently on numerous past occasions- if you do any of the above, you can hardly be surprised when it's challenged.

I've explained why I do- if you can't see it, never mind, no harm done. Let's move on?



No, it's true enough. You care enough to post snide digs against the NI team and its fans: were you really indifferent, you wouldn't, regardless of what EG or I or anyone else posted.



No, it's poor argument getting challenged. Not sure what you mean by "hardline"- just empty cliche, maybe? I don't think anything I've said on this forum is that. I don't suggest abolishing anyone else's team, I don't begrudge people for playing for whichever team(s) they're eligible, etc.



Ha ha. I've been reading this forum since 2003 (my previous id got banned after a lively row with mi buen amigo Lopez), and the same themes recur regularly. And have done since well before EG weighed in.

Ehm, think you are the one that can't manage basic arithmetic....eight years have not elapsed since Sept 1 2001....and if you try and argue that point it really proves that you lot will never admit when you are wrong.

[tetsujin1979]

First generation? Seven siblings? Grew up in an "Irish" area of Britain?

Sounds very much to me like the Gallens of Shepherds Bush. And as we know, all of them chose to represent ROI.

Except the most talented of them, Kevin, who perhaps considering himself good enough to go all the way in international football, chose the country of his birth.



I'm well aware that QPR pushed him in that direction, but he could still have resisted.
so you knew you were wrong, but you posted it anyway?

[youngirish]

OK, so that's two of you can't manage basic arithmetic.

So let me get this straight the time elapsed between 31 December 2008 and 1 January 2009 was a year in your calender, was it? I've heard the UK education system is considered poor by developed world standards but who knew?



No, it's true enough. You care enough to post snide digs against the NI team and its fans: were you really indifferent, you wouldn't, regardless of what EG or I or anyone else posted.

Pure nonsense of course. If you or EG posts NI related nonsense on an ROI forum I'll challenge it and respond in kind. I honestly don't care about your football team and you may consider this a snide comment if you wish but I don't look at you as rivals to us. You try to compare the two teams when your team has never done anything in International football in well over 2 decades (most of my lifetime) whereby we've been in 4 final tournaments since then so let's be realistic here, why would I care about your team?

Our team however, is obviously hugely important to both yourself and EG and that's where the problem lies when EG belittles the ROI and throws in comparisons that paint NI in an unrealistically favourable light I'll challenge them and why wouldn't I? Isn't this an ROI board after all?

Just to clarify EG also posted rankings that have since been deleted that caused most of the trouble (when I stated my surprise that NI where a few places above Gabon) before anyone mentioned NI. It's not just his Owen Coyle rant.

[Den Perry]

So let me get this straight the time elapsed between 31 December 2008 and 1 January 2009 was a year in your calender, was it? I've heard the UK education system is considered poor by developed world standards but who knew?


Pure nonsense of course. If you or EG posts NI related nonsense on an ROI forum I'll challenge it and respond in kind. I honestly don't care about your football team and you may consider this a snide comment if you wish but I don't look at you as rivals to us. You try to compare the two teams when your team has never done anything in International football in well over 2 decades (most of my lifetime) whereby we've been in 4 final tournaments since then so let's be realistic here, why would I care about your team?

Our team however, is obviously hugely important to both yourself and EG and that's where the problem lies when EG belittles the ROI and throws in comparisons that paint NI in an unrealistically favourable light I'll challenge them and why wouldn't I? Isn't this an ROI board after all?

Just to clarify EG also posted rankings that have since been deleted that caused most of the trouble (when I stated my surprise that NI where a few places above Gabon) before anyone mentioned NI. It's not just his Owen Coyle rant.

Excellant post....

[Gather round]

Ehm, think you are the one that can't manage basic arithmetic....eight years have not elapsed since Sept 1 2001....and if you try and argue that point it really proves that you lot will never admit when you are wrong

Don't worry, I don't argue with the empty-headed. Except to say that I don't claim to represent any "lot" :(


So let me get this straight the time elapsed between 31 December 2008 and 1 January 2009 was a year in your calender, was it? I've heard the UK education system is considered poor by developed world standards but who knew?

See above. It's 'calendar', by the way.


I honestly don't care about your football team and you may consider this a snide comment if you wish

No, it's a wrong comment- you obviously do care, as detailed above and below. I've no problem with anyone else being indifferent to the NI football team.


but I don't look at you as rivals to us. You try to compare the two teams when your team has never done anything in International football in well over 2 decades (most of my lifetime) whereby we've been in 4 final tournaments since then

Fine, you can choose as rivals whoever you like, or nobody. You can argue that qualifying for the finals 15 or 20 years ago is hugely more significant than 25 or 30 years ago; I disagree. Both teams are mediocre at the moment: qualifying for one tournament out of seven makes you merely a bit less mediocre over those 15 years as a whole. You beat arguably the weakest team at the finals in 2002- we've beaten England, Spain and top-seeded Sweden since. On current form we're a bit better, it's straightforward enough.


so let's be realistic here, why would I care about your team?

Don't know. But you obviously do, as you keep posting on here about it?


Our team however, is obviously hugely important to both yourself and EG and that's where the problem lies when EG belittles the ROI and throws in comparisons that paint NI in an unrealistically favourable light I'll challenge them and why wouldn't I? Isn't this an ROI board after all?

Up to a point. I don't post that often- 800 over six years. Why would it be a problem even if I posted ten times that?

The thing is, your challenge to what you see as EG's wind-ups doesn't really amount to much more than reminding us you how much better you used to be in the past, and more seriously telling us ad nauseam that NI are rubbish even though you're not interested in them.

[gustavo]

Please get back on topic and take your squabbling to P.M

[Gather round]

Please get back on topic and take your squabbling to P.M

Will do. I'm looking forward to a shoot-out between Paterson and Ward in the play-off final. Burnley to win 2-1.

[youngirish]

Fine, you can choose as rivals whoever you like, or nobody. You can argue that qualifying for the finals 15 or 20 years ago is hugely more significant than 25 or 30 years ago; I disagree. Both teams are mediocre at the moment: qualifying for one tournament out of seven makes you merely a bit less mediocre over those 15 years as a whole. You beat arguably the weakest team at the finals in 2002- we've beaten England, Spain and top-seeded Sweden since. On current form we're a bit better, it's straightforward enough.

2002 is not 15 or 20 years ago though we've already established that maths is not your strong point. What exactly is?

You also ignore the fact that we've been consistently better in every qualifying campaign in over 20 years getting to 4 play-offs for qualification. How many have NI made? The last campaign NI punched way above their weight and we underperformed horribly which resulted in our manager getting sacked yet still we both finished 3rd in the group.

I would also comfortably say even though we are pretty mediocre we are way better than NI at the moment. David Healy the Sunderland reserve striker is your best player ffs. When the group winds down I fully expect you to be nowhere in it while we'll at least be third. Get back to me then and only then with your unrealistic, ill-informed, NI biased drivel. That's all I have to say on the matter I can only devote so much time per day to the less gifted amongst us.

[Gather round]

2002 is not 15 or 20 years ago

Indeed, which is why I distinguished between the two. No-one doubts you had consistently excellent teams from 1986-1994. Their relevance to football now is limited.


though we've already established that maths is not your strong point. What exactly is?

Dealing patiently with sh it-stirrers.


You also ignore the fact that we've been better in very qualifying campaign in over 20 years getting to 4 play-offs for qualification

No, I've taken your point that failing to qualify is mediocre- therefore failing to qualify for six of the last seven tournaments is consistently mediocre. You can't have it both ways. If you aren't interested in other mediocre teams, don't drone on about being slightly less mediocre than them in the past.


The last campaign NI punched way above their weight and we underperformed horribly which resulted in our manager getting sacked yet still we both finished 3rd in the group

We got more points, six wins to four, beat all three potential qualifiers. We've also got more points this time, albeit from a game more. But honestly, we aren't any more stirred by this than you (RoI fans generally). We'll remain mediocre unless and until we qualify for a finals.


I would also comfortably say even though we are pretty mediocre we are way better than NI at the moment

However comfortable you are, the evidence (group tables) suggests otherwise.


David Healy the Sunderland reserve striker is your best player ffs

Are you on drugs? He's been poor in every NI game this season. Luckily, our squad now is strong enough to cope.


When the group winds down I fully expect you to be nowhere in it while we'll at least be third. Get back to me then

Must I? I'll get to you (or anyone else) when you need to be corrected. But yes, if you get more points in the final table in October, of course you are better.


and only then with your unrealisitic, ill-informed, NI biased drivel. That's all I have to say on the matter I can only devote so much time per day to the less gifted amongst us

Right oh, bye.

It's "unrealistic" by the way.

[youngirish]

Right oh, bye.

It's "unrealistic" by the way.
If all you can do is nit pick a couple of typos to back up your arguments on an internet forum then you really are onto a loser from the off. I don't have time to check my spelling before posting, I have a job I need to be doing. Learn your maths and you too could one day follow in my footsteps (unlikely but anything's possible).