Miller for United? [Archive]

carnstien

21/12/2003, 5:59 PM

Originally posted by Conor74
:eek:

Great, he might learn (i) how to play well for your club and not for your country from J o'Shea Esq. or (ii) how not to play for your country at all, lessons provided by a certain Mr. Keane...
You are so full of ****e.

Can I ask you if its Arsenal or Liverpool you support? It is clear that you are completly blinded by bias and jealously, I was just wondering why?

liam88

21/12/2003, 10:35 PM

Henrik Larsson-played for the hoops and great on international level.

Celtic play enough European matchers and decent friendlies for any player to get a decent standard of oppostion.

If we play roughly the same schedule as last year (and we are back in the U.S this summer though hopefully it's a bit better organised this time), Miller we get trainging against teams such as Liverpool, Porto, Boavista, Man. Utd, Boca Juniors, Fulham and Arsenal.

Sounds good to me ;)

Neil

22/12/2003, 9:30 AM

Originally posted by carnstien
Can I ask you if its Arsenal or Liverpool you support?
Or maybe none of the above?

Henrik Larsson-played for the hoops and great on international level.
I can't remember that. Was that during the Byrne/Doolin/Eccles days ?

tiktok

22/12/2003, 9:49 AM

The training and coaching he'd get at united would help him develop, but he's getting regular games at Celtic and more importantly he'll get regular european football. he's better off staying there at least another season until he can move directly into the first team somewhere else rather than the squad.

Junior

22/12/2003, 12:56 PM

No one seems to have mentioned Millers current dip in form?

After bursting on the scene for Celtic, particularly against Anderlecht and a good 25mins against Lyon, young Liam is not actually setting the world alight in the games he has played in the SPL??

I think this is only natural, and that he needs to continue to concentrate on his game and ignore the media driven hype. He's played a few great games this season but he also played a few very average ones.

Its very similar to O'shea 12 months ago and look what has happened to his performances this year???

I hope he stays with Celtic, and continues to bed himself as an 'automatic' first player which will bring with it Domestic & European experience.

Ozymandias

22/12/2003, 2:56 PM

I agree Junior..but it is only natural that young players have a dip in form....he just needs to play through and once you have a manager that realises this it will sort itself out...

I think O'Shea has improved no end since the start of the season...he is back playing well...(not as good as he was at the early stages)...by the time the qualifiers come around O'shea wil have had 2 and a Half seasons of first team football ...I think that will have turned him into a serious player and miller will only benfit from games as well.

carnstien

22/12/2003, 6:46 PM

Originally posted by Conor74
Sorry Carnstein, John O'Shea has done exceptionally well for Ireland and Roy Keane continues to make himself available for national selection. You're not biased at all.

Still, at least I don't swear on posts, must be because I don't get all excitable about it unlike you. Take it out on an audience that listens, ring Premiership Live After 5 on Today FM sometime...
You didn't answer my question, I will assume that you don't want to, so fire away and continue to dislilke 2 great Irish players just because you don't like the club they play for, it makes total sense.

carnstien

24/12/2003, 5:35 PM

Originally posted by Conor74
Nonsense. You may view everything through the prism of the English Premier League and what club they play for. Hate to puncture your little world where everyone loves or hates Man U, but I thought the following were great great players, Stapleton, Moran, McGrath, Daly, Irwin...see anything in common there? I also hope O'Shea returns to the form he displayed at club level last year and brings that through for this country.

As for Roy Keane, you may have missed it if you were to busy reading Shoot or Four Four Two, it has nothing to do with his club, but there was a certain incident in Saipan last year you see...:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Believe it or not, I am actually farmiliar with that incident. If you were not looking at the situation from an obviously biased stance, you would see that Mick McCarthy is a moron, Roy Keane carried us to the world cup and was perfectly entitled to complain when he saw that an under 10's team would have been better orginised than the Irish camp.

I don't hold what happened to Roy Keane (being SENT HOME, not walking out) against him because he did the right thing and stood up for what he believed in, fair ****s to him, he showed those yellow bellied begrudging *******s!!!!!!

By the way, I'm a Liverpool fan, just so you don't think I'm anyway biased.

Plastic Paddy

08/01/2004, 2:03 PM

Sky Sports News has just announced that he's about to sign a pre-contract agreement with ManUre. If that's the case, **** him. I hope he rots in their reserves. Mercenary little *******.

And if anyone wonders why I'm so bitter, it's because i) my club stood by him, paying him full wages and rehabilitation costs after his injuries, ii) they offered him a new contract which multiplied several-fold his current package, and iii) he has professed publicly on several occasions that he's Celtic through and through. A man of truth and integrity, my arse. Not to mention loyalty. Himself and Judas Keane deserve each other. ******.

:mad: :mad: :mad: PP

NigeSausagepump

08/01/2004, 2:26 PM

No doubt a hugely lucrative move for him if it comes off, but a bit concerning from an Irish perspective. Can't see him becoming a first team regular for a few years. We could do with him playing as often as possible in the near future - he's not even a regular at Celtic yet.

finlma

08/01/2004, 2:30 PM

Seems like its true and a big mistake by Miller. He won't get a look in with the first team and it will hinder his development and nmay never reach his potential. He's really let Celtic down and has gone down in my estimation.

tiktok

08/01/2004, 3:16 PM

Miller set for United switch

Celtic youngster Liam Miller is on the verge of signing a pre-contract agreement with Manchester United.

The 22-year-old Irish midfielder has impressed Old Trafford boss Alex Ferguson after breaking into the first team at Parkhead this season.

An announcement is to be made in the near future but the news will come as a big disappointment to Celtic boss Martin O’Neill, who was just celebrating the imminent arrival of Stephen Pearson.

The Northern Irishman had been in talks with the Cork-born youngster and his agent about his future.

But the discussions have dragged on and that has become a concern to O’Neill with the player’s current contract due to expire in the summer.

from www.breakingnews.ie

carnstien

08/01/2004, 5:23 PM

Originally posted by Plastic Paddy
Sky Sports News has just announced that he's about to sign a pre-contract agreement with ManUre. If that's the case, **** him. I hope he rots in their reserves. Mercenary little *******.

And if anyone wonders why I'm so bitter, it's because i) my club stood by him, paying him full wages and rehabilitation costs after his injuries, ii) they offered him a new contract which multiplied several-fold his current package, and iii) he has professed publicly on several occasions that he's Celtic through and through. A man of truth and integrity, my arse. Not to mention loyalty. Himself and Judas Keane deserve each other. ******.

:mad: :mad: :mad: PP
Why don't you get your head out of your own arse for a minute?

This is a good move for Miller and a good move for Ireland.

He will play a fare share of games for United because he is a good player, better than Phil Neville, Ronaldo or Djemba-Djemba and Keane, Scholes and Giggs are all getting on in years.

Being a squad player at one of the best teams in Europe in one of the best leagues in Europe is better than player against pathetic opposistion in Scotland, he will develope as a player.

Celtic have themselves to blame for loosing Miller, they should have tied him up to a long term contract 2 years ago.

Celtics loss is Manchester Uniteds and Irelands gain.

Plastic Paddy

08/01/2004, 5:44 PM

Originally posted by carnstien
Why don't you get your head out of your own arse for a minute?

How dare you. I'm a Celtic fan, who's just seen my club been shafted by one of our brightest prospects in years, one we stuck by when it looked as if he'd not make it. Two years ago, he was on the treatment table and had been for twelve months before that. The fact that he's Irish doesn't mean he's suddenly a top man. This action shows it. And anyway, I'm entitled to let off a little steam at news like this. I don't need a pillock like you patronising me in the process.

It's a good move for him to sit in their reserves for a couple of years and not play in the first team until he's, what, twenty-five? Yeah, that'll be great for his career with Ireland. Now, don't take this the wrong way, but please just **** off.

:mad: PP

Éanna

08/01/2004, 5:45 PM

while you can't blame him for wanting to leave scotland and the hotbed of premiership rejects that is $elltic, i think its a terrible move for him. He hasn't been able to force his way in as a regular in team that contains players like lennon and varga, so how does he figure he's even gonna be 5th choice behind nicky butt at man utd?! bad move

Slash/ED

08/01/2004, 6:20 PM

Lads you all seem to be forgetting something. One of the first names in the Manchester United mid field is Phil Neville. If Miller can't displace Phil Neville then he wont amount to much anyway. A move to Man United now is the perfect move for him, he's going to get a fair bit of playing time to establish himself and he will devolop alot more at Man U then at Celtic, no matter how much he plays. Also, in about a year or two, Keane will retire, which will really open up a gap for him, and even know Keanes not playing every week.

Plastic Paddy

08/01/2004, 6:28 PM

To be fair to Phil Neville, Slash, he's been a revelation in the ManUre midfield this term and according to some Reds I know, both their best and most improved player of the season. I take your point about K****, but on that basis Miller will be twenty five before cementing a place in the first team. I don't care if the club he plays for is Manchester United, the boy will need regular first team football before then if he's to build on his potential. And we as followers of the Ireland side can't afford for that regular first-team action to be gained whilst out on loan at somewhere like Preston North End.

:mad: PP

tiktok

08/01/2004, 8:28 PM

It's potentially a good move for him because of the standard of coaching at United, but only in the long term. He will get games because of Ferguson's squad rotation, but he won't play anywher near as often as he would at Celtic.

At the moment United have
Fletcher and Ronaldo on the right,
Giggs and Fortune for the left,
Keane, Djemba-Djemba, Butt, Scholes, Kleberson and Phil Neville in the centre.

I can't see Miller competing for any position at the moment for a regular first team slot (for the record, Phil Neville has been getting better and better over the last two seasons and has developed into an excellent central midfielder) so in that respect he'd probably be better off at Celtic, he needs to get regular first team football at a high level (chamipions league as opposed to SPL) if he's going to continue to improve.

Beavis

08/01/2004, 9:53 PM

Man U are fairly light in wide positions these days with Giggs playing up front.Yer man Fletcher plays regulary and he for me isn't up to much.I still think it is/was a bad move.
He could do with at least another year with Celtic to become a permenant fixture in the side and if things don't go well to begin with at Man U he could easily dissolve into reserve team obscurity.

Also just like to add Carnstein,you've got some problems.There's no need to resort to swearing and name calling any time somebody tries to make a point that differs from your own.

I'm sorry but you refuse to admit the facts:John O'Shea hasn't performed for country as for club (I didn't think that could even be argued),and the other that Roy Keane,as Conor said,doesn't play for us any more,that's not a matter of bias that's actually the case!

Seeing as you are such a Keanite I wonder could you consider/defend this.
Keane didn't play for Ireland in one of our most important games in recent history away against Iran,yet managed to play the full 90mins against none other than Leceister City two days later.We'll I guess we all know where his priorities lay:(

DolansWaistcoat

09/01/2004, 7:18 AM

Wasn't it Bolton that manure played two days after the iran match that keane missed,which I think united lost the game anyway?We all know that there was an agreement made between McCarthy and Ferguson,thats old news.

As for Miller joining manure could reallly help him develop his game when he's playing(hopefully)and training with players of a much higher standard than at celtic.It depends though if he gets 35 or 40 games a season.

PaulB

09/01/2004, 8:12 AM

Whay does every post on every forum harp back to keane/mccarthy/saipan. F*** it , its done with, like it or not he's not coming back.

In my opinion a move to United is good for Miller. How much more improvement is he going to make by staying at Celtic, if he wants to move on as a player he should go, end of story. At he end of the day you look after number one. Celtic fluted about with him during the summer when he wanted a contract, so it's their own fault..

tiktok

09/01/2004, 8:15 AM

www.breakingnews.ie

Miller move was for more than money - agent

Liam Miller’s agent has insisted that money was not the only reason the player decided to leave Celtic for Manchester United.

The 22-year-old has signed a pre-contract agreement with the English champions that will seal a lucrative summer free transfer move.

Celtic insisted they had made the Irishman an offer that would have made him one of the highest paid players in Scottish footballing history.

But Miller’s agent Finton Drury insisted the lure of Old Trafford had been simply irresistible.

He told The Scottish Sun: “The player left for a combination of reasons and money was but one aspect.

“It is a career decision and Manchester United were the only other club that Liam would have left Celtic for.

“In the end it was a choice between one of the best clubs in Britain and one of the greatest clubs in the world.”

A Celtic statement insisted the club had done everything to keep the player.

It read: “We made an extremely generous offer to Liam Miller, the biggest salary deal ever put on the table for a young Celtic player who has come up through the ranks.

“This offer was made following detailed consideration of Liam’s contribution to the team to date during his 16 first-team starting appearances as well as eventual potential.

“It is a salary package which would make him one of the very best-paid young players in Scottish football history.”

But Drury hit back: “The statements that Celtic are making about the financial situation are inaccurate and erroneous.

“But it is inevitable that when a club loses a player they don’t want to lose suggestions are made that everything was done financially to keep him.

“It’s the law of the jungle.”

gspain

09/01/2004, 8:17 AM

Miller does look a class prospect and a move to Manyoo will obviously beenfit him as he will be playing with and against a much better standard of player.

However he does need regular first team football and it will be difficult for him to break into the 1st team. He still hasn't nailed down a regular starting berth at Celtic (appreciate he has had injuries) so maybe a season on loan at anothe rpremiership club would help.

However on balance it has to be good news for us. we need players playing at the top clubs and competing at the highest level

Éanna

09/01/2004, 9:10 AM

Originally posted by PaulB
Whay does every post on every forum harp back to keane/mccarthy/saipan. F*** it , its done with, like it or not he's not coming back.
well said

Lionel Ritchie

09/01/2004, 9:37 AM

Originally posted by gspain
As long as he doesn't retire from International football aged 24 it would be a great move. Playing for and against better quality players would bring him along no end.

He is not the finished article but he looks a real prospect.

We need a decent midfielder coming through in green.

Agree with you there G. It has to be a real worry though that Ferguson would we advising him to get a gammy leg/itchy hole/bad hair day any time an international week rolls around.

I'd personally rather see him go to any other club within an asses roar of European competition. But that's as much due to the over stocking of talented players at Man U as the likelyhood he'll not get much football.

They're also closing in on a chinese player who's apparently being bought more to raise the profile of the ManU "Brand" :rolleyes: in China than out of any real intention of playing the guy other than for the last 5 minutes of games they're 3-0 up in.

Éanna

09/01/2004, 9:43 AM

I think the further any international player stays from ferguson the better- fine he's an excellent manager but he seems obsessed about ending/cutting short his players' international careers.

Plastic Paddy

09/01/2004, 9:53 AM

Originally posted by PaulB
Celtic fluted about with him during the summer when he wanted a contract, so it's their own fault..

What? He'd spent most of the previous two seasons on the treatment table. He'd played all of about half-a-dozen first team matches in three years. Yet the club stood by him and told him a new contract would be available for him to sign DESPITE his run of injuries. So, pray tell, how is any of this Celtic's fault?

His behaviour in this regard must speak volumes for the kind of man he is. Callow, ill-advised and totally lacking in loyalty. I hope he brings all these qualities with him to ManUre.

:mad: PP

Éanna

09/01/2004, 9:55 AM

Originally posted by Plastic Paddy
Callow, ill-advised and totally lacking in loyalty. I hope he brings all these qualities with him to ManUre.
they're in high demand there, just look at their captain :)

tiktok

09/01/2004, 10:00 AM

Originally posted by Éanna
I think the further any international player stays from ferguson the better- fine he's an excellent manager but he seems obsessed about ending/cutting short his players' international careers.

That's overstating the case Eanna.
He has a problem with friendy games.
Roy Keane and at a stretch Dwight Yorke were the only players where Fergie is alledged to have applied pressure about international football.

United have always had under Fergie a few key players around whom they build a team.

The only important ones I can remember who didn't play internationally were Steve Bruce and Eric Cantona, because the managers of their respective countries didn't consider them good enough.

Robson, Pallister, Schmeicel, Hughes, Irwin, Scholes, Giggs, Kanchelskis, Cole played for United and their International side whenever they were called.

He's not stopping John O'Shea, Darren Fletcher, Ronaldo or any other current international from playing for their country, no reason to assume he'd stop Miller.

Seanie

09/01/2004, 10:14 AM

Just been officially announced -

REDS CONFIRM NEW SIGNING

Manchester United have finalised a pre-contract agreement for midfielder Liam Miller from Celtic FC.

Liam will join Manchester United on 1 July 2004 on a long-term contract.

Éanna

09/01/2004, 10:14 AM

yeah, fair enough. I know the guys only doing his job, and doing it bloody well, but I don't like or trust him

Ozymandias

09/01/2004, 10:24 AM

Celtic didn't just stick by miller cause they thought he was a prospect..it was because he was a contracted player who under the insurance they pay for him was entitled to get treatment for his injuries...every club does this.. if miller got injured out of contract his own insurance would have to cover him......also miller was fit for most of last season but didn't get a game that often..he played away for the Irish U21's......

His £1,000 contract a week was comming to an end and sought talks in the summer but Celtic stalled...his agent obviously looked around and Man U came in.....it was only after his Champions league form that celtic came with an offer......now obviously it was not as good as Utd's.......do you not think another factor was that Celtic is an ageing team....and a team about to break up....Larsson going....talk of sutton and Hartson going......Lennon and lambert near retirement.....and most importantly...O'Neill linked with Liverpool,spurs,newcastle etc....maybe he is getting out before Celtic go into downturn.....

I hope all the above is wrong as I support Celtic and would have loved to see miller stay.....but just cause I don't like the move doesn't make it a bad one for Liam Miller......

I think it is bad for celtic and I worry for the great club over the next few seasons.....not in scotland but in europe...the great euro nights might just be over once this campaign finishes...

hopefully not

Plastic Paddy

09/01/2004, 10:27 AM

Ozymandias, you must be the happiest Tim I've ever come across. Ninety per cent of the time you'll be proved right, and the other ten per cent you'll be pleasantly surprised.

I just hope your predictions are the exception to prove the rule...

:) PP

gspain

09/01/2004, 10:34 AM

Taggart's is well known for players feigning injury. Looks at Ryan Giggs's friendly International record. In fairness he is not alone Liverpool used to do it as well when they were successful.

Keane did play 90 minutes v Leicester 48 hours after the Iran game. Keane also played in the Nike tour this summer when according to "medical advice" too many game scould be harmful.

John O'Shea was poor v Russia and Switzerland but so were a lot of others. His early season from was not good either. He appears to be back to his best.

Taggart obviously sees huge potential in Miller and so do Celtic given the fuss they are making. I respect and trust his judgement.

tiktok

09/01/2004, 10:39 AM

Originally posted by gspain
Keane also played in the Nike tour this summer when according to "medical advice" too many game scould be harmful.

Sick of the keane thing: didn't want to get involved but......
For god's sake gspain, he's not going to sit out preseason training and go into the first game of the season not match fit. What would the point of that be, your argument is ridiculous.

PaulB

09/01/2004, 11:10 AM

Originally posted by tiktok
Sick of the keane thing: didn't want to get involved but......
For god's sake gspain, he's not going to sit out preseason training and go into the first game of the season not match fit. What would the point of that be, your argument is ridiculous.

You beat me to it tiktok, it was a non-sensical post. is the man not allowed to play any football?

Éanna

09/01/2004, 11:19 AM

Originally posted by Conor74
Well he does have this medical condition that does not allow him play any football for his country...
:D

PaulB

09/01/2004, 11:23 AM

Originally posted by Conor74
Well he does have this medical condition that does not allow him play any football for his country...

News to me, where may i ask did you pick of this information from. From my knowledge of the situation he was advised, and which history has shown to be true, that he would be unable to play as much football as he previously did. He's left with a choice, shorten his career by a couple of years or give up international football, no contest.

Listen, try rid yourself of these inner demons about Roy Keane, i for one am sick of it..

Éanna

09/01/2004, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by PaulB
He's left with a choice, shorten his career by a couple of years or give up international football, no contest.
a choice of "to lick or not to lick (Fergie's arse)" is more like it. If R*y K***e had rid himself of his inner demons he wouldn't have caused (and be continuing to cause) all this shíte in the first place.

finlma

09/01/2004, 11:30 AM

What's going to happen to Liam Miller for the rest of the season at Celtic? Do you think he'll be picked since he's made his decision. I don't see the Celtic supporters cheering him on anyway.

This thread is supposed to be about Liam Miller. If you want to talk about other things (which don't even warrant discussion) set up your own thread and maybe entitle it "Let's have the same stupid argument about Roy Keane".

Éanna

09/01/2004, 11:33 AM

unbelievably, there are some posters on the eircomLeague messageboard calling for Miller to be booed if he plays for Ireland, because
He has turned his back on a great Irish club
:rolleyes:

I feel sorry for these people, no grip on reality at all

gspain

09/01/2004, 11:34 AM

I apologise for dragging this thread down the Roy Keane rathole.

Keane did not have to go to the U.S. Pre-season training is needed but these were promotional games and a player with a serious hip injury would have been better off staying at home. The players were dragged right across the U.S. - hardly ideal preparation but then needs must and money talks.

Now as we all know Keane is in flying form this season and playing out of his skin. He is still the key player for manyoo (more important than RVN in my opinion) but we produce very few world class players as a country and it hurrts deeply when one of them is not playing for us. Yes McCarthy was all wrong too but it still hurts.

Neil

09/01/2004, 11:42 AM

Originally posted by Lionel Ritchie
It has to be a real worry though that Ferguson would we advising him to get a gammy leg/itchy hole/bad hair day any time an international week rolls around.

:D

Your spot on though. Between Ferguson and K***e they'll have Miller playing for England in Euro 2004.
Cúnts.

ProfFrink

09/01/2004, 11:43 AM

From the BBC website Miller has signed for Man Utd. He will transfer to them on 1 July.

There is no mention of how much Celtic will get in compensation as he has been there since '97.

PaulB

09/01/2004, 11:44 AM

Originally posted by Conor74
And, similarly, that's news to me, and sounds like the choice presented to him by his club.

Medically, I can only presume that there is no difference between kicking a ball in a green or a red shirt. So true, the choice may have been play less games or shorten his career. But what doctor could decide that the games to be axed would be all the ones for his country, and the games to be played all the ones for his club, as you suggest?

Are you sick of the suggestion that Keane was wrong, like his fan club? Or, like me, kinda sick of the whole argument either way?

Good man Conor74. I'm sick of the whole argument,its been going on for 18 months, peoples attitude either way are not going to change.

lets drop it..