View Full Version : Setanta Cup Final
dcfcsteve
25/10/2008, 7:12 PM
Still better than half empty RDS like last years FAI Cup Final plus the atmosphere will be better down here as the placer looks like it will be sold out.
The RDS isn't the only stadium in Dublin, and has never been talked of as a possible final venue, so it's irrelevant in this discussion. Sure why not talk of the alternative of a 95% empty Croker...?
Cork City and Glentoran to be the first 2 teams to sell out a setanta cup final????:cool:
Thanks to a reduced capacity in what would already have been the smallest stadium yet to host it anyway.....
A choice of Final location that was wrong on sporting and tournament-prestige reasons now also appears to be going wrong in terms of physical preparedness as well....
If there was even a small risk the St Annes End couldn't be 100% guaranteed available, Turners Cross shouldn't have got the Final.Good to see the one man crusade continue.
Keep it up Steve.
Fight the good fight.
corkboy360
26/10/2008, 12:58 AM
The RDS isn't the only stadium in Dublin, and has never been talked of as a possible final venue, so it's irrelevant in this discussion. Sure why not talk of the alternative of a 95% empty Croker...?
yes it was
Thanks to a reduced capacity in what would already have been the smallest stadium yet to host it anyway.....
Well if ye won the semi it would of been a smaller capacity.
micls
26/10/2008, 11:42 AM
The RDS isn't the only stadium in Dublin, and has never been talked of as a possible final venue, so it's irrelevant in this discussion. Sure why not talk of the alternative of a 95% empty Croker...?
Em yes it was. It was being touted as the Dublin option
L37Ultra
27/10/2008, 1:47 AM
Does anyone know if there are going to be tickets made available for netural fans or if there will be tickets available at Turners Cross on the night of the game.
:ball:
Candystripe
27/10/2008, 2:18 AM
[QUOTE=corkboy360;1047234]
Well if ye won the semi it would of been a smaller capacity.[/QUOTE
Actually I reckon the final would have been moved to Windsor.No way would we have been able to host the amount of Glens fans who would have wanted to attend.
adamd164
27/10/2008, 10:22 AM
FAO L37Ultra, tickets are on sale in our club shop in the city centre. However, our initial allocation is apparently gone and more are due in. I would highly doubt there'll be any on the night available.
adamd164
27/10/2008, 10:25 AM
Actually I reckon the final would have been moved to Windsor.No way would we have been able to host the amount of Glens fans who would have wanted to attend.
Boohoo, you didn't win. Move on.
Why are Derry fans insistent on trying to spin this as us ****ing Glentoran over?
Réiteoir
27/10/2008, 11:34 AM
because maybe - with a small grain of truth in it - it is screwing them over?
adamd164
27/10/2008, 12:59 PM
because maybe - with a small grain of truth in it - it is screwing them over?
If you mean because it's in our home ground, then were Drogs "screwed over" last season when they had to play the game at Linfield's ground?
If you mean because the distance they have to travel, then tough: it's the FAI's year to host the final and they have the right to choose any of their constituent grounds for it. If the shoe was on the other foot (i.e. if it was next year and the IFA's turn to host it), would the IFA have felt sorry for us and played it in Dublin? Yeah, right!
It's only ever been in a neutral venue once: when we played Drogs in 2006, both teams from the same national association.
BohsPartisan
27/10/2008, 1:33 PM
I think the whole way the Setanta cup final is always unfair on someone but that's not Cork's fault. It has been the way it was run from day one. Having said that, no one complains about the FAI cup final being in Dublin every year so get over it everyone and enjoy what should be a good spectacle. Glens will bring a good cowd, Cork will have a good crowd and it should make for a good atmosphere.
Réiteoir
27/10/2008, 1:39 PM
If you mean because it's in our home ground, then were Drogs "screwed over" last season when they had to play the game at Linfield's ground?
If you mean because the distance they have to travel, then tough: it's the FAI's year to host the final and they have the right to choose any of their constituent grounds for it. If the shoe was on the other foot (i.e. if it was next year and the IFA's turn to host it), would the IFA have felt sorry for us and played it in Dublin? Yeah, right!
It's only ever been in a neutral venue once: when we played Drogs in 2006, both teams from the same national association.
As I said - I look forward to making to trip to Stangmore Park to watch Bohs take on Dungannon in next year's Final
adamd164
27/10/2008, 2:38 PM
I think the whole way the Setanta cup final is always unfair on someone but that's not Cork's fault. It has been the way it was run from day one. Having said that, no one complains about the FAI cup final being in Dublin every year so get over it everyone and enjoy what should be a good spectacle. Glens will bring a good cowd, Cork will have a good crowd and it should make for a good atmosphere.
Well said.:)
Does anyone know if there are going to be tickets made available for netural fans or if there will be tickets available at Turners Cross on the night of the game.
:ball:
There won't be any left on the night from the way sales are going
dcfcsteve
27/10/2008, 3:44 PM
I think the whole way the Setanta cup final is always unfair on someone but that's not Cork's fault. It has been the way it was run from day one. Having said that, no one complains about the FAI cup final being in Dublin every year so get over it everyone and enjoy what should be a good spectacle. Glens will bring a good cowd, Cork will have a good crowd and it should make for a good atmosphere.
Not well said at all - you've missed the point.
Firstly - no-one complains about the FAI Cup Final being in Dublin, as everyone pretty much accepts that it should be. It's a big, prestigious final.
Prior to this season everyone had likewise accepted that the Setanta Final should be in Belfast or Dublin. That's why the decision to award the venue deliberately to a finalist for the first time ever - remember that in previous season's it's only been hosted by a finalist by default/coincidence - has been greeted with concern by a broad range of people.
Secondly - you suggest that not using neutral grounds "has been the way it was run form day one". So why was Cork v Drogs played at a neutral ground then ? The first Setanta final would also have been at a neutral ground had Linfield not made it, as it was always planned to be Windsor.
Prior to this season everyone had likewise accepted that the Setanta Final should be in Belfast or Dublin. That's why the decision to award the venue deliberately to a finalist for the first time ever - remember that in previous season's it's only been hosted by a finalist by default/coincidence - has been greeted with concern by a broad range of people.
Em wrong again. We were awarded the final last year too....had we made it. Decision was made before the semi final.
So its not the first time ever.
dcfcsteve
27/10/2008, 4:09 PM
Em wrong again. We were awarded the final last year too....had we made it. Decision was made before the semi final.
So its not the first time ever.
Cork were awarded the final last year - had yees made it...?!? :o
Likewise I was awarded a Gold medal at the Beijing Olympics. Had I made it...
So why weren't yees similarly awarded in 2006 - when yee's did make it...?
No matter what spin or self-delusion people try to put on it - the prestige and standing of the Setanta has been cheapened by putting it on a par with the League Cup in terms of Final venue choice. A poor decision that is guaranteed to back-fire in future. Made even worse by the fact the chosen venue won't even be ready as was originally promised.
Cork were awarded the final last year - had yees made it...?!? :o
Likewise I was awarded a Gold medal at the Beijing Olympics. Had I made it...
So why weren't yees similarly awarded in 2006 - when yee's did make it...?
No matter what spin or self-delusion people try to put on it - the prestige and standing of the Setanta has been cheapened by putting it on a par with the League Cup in terms of Final venue choice. A poor decision that is guaranteed to back-fire in future. Made even worse by the fact the chosen venue won't even be ready as was originally promised.
You claimed this was the first time this decision had been made, it wasnt. In 2006 The Shed was in the process of being torn down, hence the stadium was not fit to hold the final.
Prestige :rolleyes: Its the Setanta cup ffs, just above the league cup in terms of prestige. It's been at a neutral venue once ever and only because neither ground of the finalists could hold the thing.
Originally promised? You on the SSC committee or something? How do you know what was promised?
BohsPartisan
27/10/2008, 4:58 PM
Secondly - you suggest that not using neutral grounds "has been the way it was run form day one". So why was Cork v Drogs played at a neutral ground then ? The first Setanta final would also have been at a neutral ground had Linfield not made it, as it was always planned to be Windsor.
Why did they switch it from one non-neutral ground to another? That doesn't make sense! As for Drogs, United park wasn't suibtable obviously, so in the same way they play their European home games in Dublin, so too the Setanta cup.
You lot are very vocal considering you had three out of the last four tin cup finals in The Brandywell!
thischarmingman
27/10/2008, 5:16 PM
You lot are very vocal considering you had three out of the last four tin cup finals in The Brandywell!
Two. Vs Shels and vs Bohs. Given that it's supposedly a random toss of a coin, 50/50 is about right, isn't it?
holidaysong
27/10/2008, 5:22 PM
Secondly - you suggest that not using neutral grounds "has been the way it was run form day one". So why was Cork v Drogs played at a neutral ground then ? The first Setanta final would also have been at a neutral ground had Linfield not made it, as it was always planned to be Windsor.
The first Setanta final was Shelbourne vs. Linfield. It most definitely would not have taken place in Windsor if Linfield hadn't gotten there as that would have meant two LOI sides playing in Belfast..
In the first year (2005) it was always intended to be in Tolka unless two IL sides got to the final whereby it'd be in Windsor. In the second year (2006) it was intended to be in Windsor unless two LOI sides got to it, in which case it would be in Tolka (and that happened with Cork vs. Drogheda taking place in Tolka). In the third year (2007), as it hadn't yet taken place in the North yet it was again earmarked for Windsor unless it was two LOI sides. Therefore we got Linfield vs. Drogheda in Windsor. The precedent therefore has been set that it would be Tolka for an all LOI final, Windsor for an all IL final but alternate between the two capitals for an IL vs. LOI final..
The precedent therefore has been set that it would be Tolka for an all LOI final
Then why was is supposed to be at Turners Cross if it were us vs Drogs last year?
holidaysong
27/10/2008, 6:25 PM
Then why was is supposed to be at Turners Cross if it were us vs Drogs last year?
I don't remember that being announced.. The SSC committee obviously wanted to stop using Tolka (for whatever reason) and decided to change the policy of having finals in the south in Tolka. That would also explain their decision then to use Turners Cross this year, in which case they should have said at the start of the 2008 competition that Tolka Park wouldn't necessarily hold to final and then Glentoran wouldn't have any reason for getting angry with them. By not saying anything about the final venue until now, they've given people a reason to be angry at the decision..
I don't remember that being announced.. The SSC committee obviously wanted to stop using Tolka (for whatever reason) and decided to change the policy of having finals in the south in Tolka. That would also explain their decision then to use Turners Cross this year, in which case they should have said at the start of the 2008 competition that Tolka Park wouldn't necessarily hold to final and then Glentoran wouldn't have any reason for getting angry with them. By not saying anything about the final venue until now, they've given people a reason to be angry at the decision..
It was announced. Ask the Drogs fans.
It happening twice doesnt make it policy, maybe it was simply the most convenient thing at those times...which it was.
They never said Tolka would hold this years final, in fact it specifically states that the final venue will be at the discretion or the organising committee. Given last years decision I dont think anyone could say it was that unlikely that the same would happen if we made the final this year.
They couldnt announce Turners Cross until we were there, it would have been useless if it were Derry Glens. They never claimed it would be in a specific place and last years precedent gave reason to believe there was a chance it'd be at Turner's cross.
Bigger crowd= more money and better tv coverage for Setanta
holidaysong
27/10/2008, 7:15 PM
It was announced. Ask the Drogs fans.
It happening twice doesnt make it policy, maybe it was simply the most convenient thing at those times...which it was.
They never said Tolka would hold this years final, in fact it specifically states that the final venue will be at the discretion or the organising committee. Given last years decision I dont think anyone could say it was that unlikely that the same would happen if we made the final this year.
They couldnt announce Turners Cross until we were there, it would have been useless if it were Derry Glens. They never claimed it would be in a specific place and last years precedent gave reason to believe there was a chance it'd be at Turner's cross.
Bigger crowd= more money and better tv coverage for Setanta
I'm not disagreeing with you. That the final was held twice in Tolka did create precedent, if not policy. I'm sure a lot of Glentoran fans didn't know about Turners Cross being announced last year (I didn't), hence the reason for their anger with Setanta breaking from what they perceived as the precedent (even if it wasn't actually policy).
As you say, the fact that they announced Turners Cross as a possible venue last year means they are justified (if they even needed any extra justification) in holding it there this year, especially when they say that the final venue will be at the discretion of the organising committee.
I dont blame the Glens fans for being annoyed, in fact I would have picked Dublin for fairness sake.
But this is Setanta, they dont and never have cared about fans. Its the whinging(factually incorrect whinging) of some other fans(non glens) on here that gets tiring.
It's done, get over it.
Its the whinging(factually incorrect whinging) of some other fans(non glens) on here that gets tiring.In fairness steve isn't usually like that :D
corkboy360
28/10/2008, 7:13 PM
Does anyone know if there are going to be tickets made available for netural fans or if there will be tickets available at Turners Cross on the night of the game.
:ball:
Sold out at the moment.If more come available maybe someone in Cork might pick one up for ya but ya wont get them on the night FACT!
because maybe - with a small grain of truth in it - it is screwing them over?
Not a suprising comment from a rambler:p
Two. Vs Shels and vs Bohs. Given that it's supposedly a random toss of a coin, 50/50 is about right, isn't it?
FAI don't do 50/50;)
Latest pictures from the cross.
Rear of new roof (http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj40/RedXKev/5-2.jpg)
Closer angle (http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj40/RedXKev/2-2.jpg)
Will look good when completed but does not look like would be open on Saturday.
fionnsci
29/10/2008, 6:00 PM
Why can't people sit in the stand while the roof is being asembled? Safety hazard?
A face
29/10/2008, 6:36 PM
Why can't people sit in the stand while the roof is being asembled? Safety hazard?
I'd say so, its technically a building site even though its going on over head.
viagogo
29/10/2008, 6:45 PM
St Annes end closed. Two sections of the shed closed off. Only 4,000 at game. Could have been way more. Loads of City fans going all year unable to get tickets for game. Another mess for Irish football. Munster FA said that the roof would be ready for final.
St Annes end closed. Two sections of the shed closed off. Only 4,000 at game. Could have been way more. Loads of City fans going all year unable to get tickets for game. Another mess for Irish football. Munster FA said that the roof would be ready for final.
Absolute farce. Our owner offered to bring his own men in and get it finished but was refused permission.
**** up and brewery
holidaysong
29/10/2008, 8:05 PM
St Annes end closed. Two sections of the shed closed off. Only 4,000 at game. Could have been way more. Loads of City fans going all year unable to get tickets for game. Another mess for Irish football. Munster FA said that the roof would be ready for final.
Quite a few Glentoran fans have booked travel and hotels and now are left ticket less.. I hope the media picks up on this and has a real go at Setanta for having the final in Cork in the first place if that stand couldn't be guaranteed! What a joke..
Quite a few Glentoran fans have booked travel and hotels and now are left ticket less.. I hope the media picks up on this and has a real go at Setanta for having the final in Cork in the first place if that stand couldn't be guaranteed! What a joke..
I agree.
Allthough apparently the MFA guaranteed it'd be done, the FAI just took the clowns at their words and didnt check.
Rumour is Coughlan has offered to get his own men in and have it fit for 2000 poeple anyway but the MFA have refused
holidaysong
29/10/2008, 8:19 PM
I agree.
Allthough apparently the MFA guaranteed it'd be done, the FAI just took the clowns at their words and didnt check.
Rumour is Coughlan has offered to get his own men in and have it fit for 2000 poeple anyway but the MFA have refused
Yeah, I seen your posts about it all over on ILS. It looks like a complete and utter **** up by the SSC/FAI/MFA! I really hope they don't get away with it though..
dcfcsteve
29/10/2008, 8:30 PM
Sudden change of tune in here, with people now accepting that it was daft to give the Final to Turners Cross.
So the capacity will only be 4,000 ? That's shocking if true.
In the immortal words of Maxi : "It's a faaaarrrcceeee !"
Sudden change of tune in here, with people now accepting that it was daft to give the Final to Turners Cross.
Well given that circumstances have changed then yes....that tends to happen when things change.
My first opinion was that it should have been in Dublin, but had the St Annes been open(as it should be) at least anyone who wanted a ticket would have gotten one.
This on the other hand is just ridiculous.
So the capacity will only be 4,000 ? That's shocking if true.
Shed-1200
because they still think its necessary to close an entire block, 400seats, for segregation...as if the gap between the stands wasnt enough.
Derrynane-1100
Glentoran fans. It just emphasises what a screw up this was because the Glens were promised as many tickets as they needed. Fai planned to give them to them out of the St Anne's allocation and gave us the other 2 stands to sell. They promptly sold out and now there are no more tickets for teh Glens fans who are entitled to them
Donie Forde-1900
1600 and odd City fans and the rest for suits.
4200 altogether
In the immortal words of Maxi : "It's a faaaarrrcceeee !"
True
brianw82
30/10/2008, 2:14 AM
I hope the media picks up on this and has a real go at Setanta for having the final in Cork in the first place if that stand couldn't be guaranteed! What a joke..
Asking the Irish media to pick up a negative story about domestic football is like asking a group of starving dogs to fight over a chunk of meat, ie. not at all necessary.
EalingGreen
30/10/2008, 6:40 PM
Ralph fury over ticket shortage
Glentoran chairman Aubry Ralph slammed Setanta Cup organisers after hundreds of Glens fans have been left without tickets for Saturday's final in Cork.
"We have received 1100 tickets but the stand for which we hoped to get extra tickets has not been issued with a safety certificate and will be closed.
"Fans have paid for accommodation and travel but have no tickets which is a recipe for disaster," said Ralph.
"Any pleasure we had in getting to this final has been seriously eroded."
Ralph explained that at least 200 supporters had been left ticketless, including some who are due to travel from the United Kingdom and one from Hamburg.
"We were promised an extra 400 or 500 tickets, in addition to the initial 1100, but obviously can't happen now.
"My grievance is not with Cork City but with the Setanta Cup Organising Committee as it is obvious that Turner's Cross is not fit to host such a final."Construction work has been going on at the ground for some time and I have to question the individuals who planned this and why it was allowed to get to this stage.
"How do we explain the situation to supporters without tickets and all this could have been avoided."
The Oval chairman reiterated his objection that Turner's Cross was chosen to stage the final but said his club had been realistic in the allocation they had requested.
"We were confident that we could sell 1500 tickets and would have remained hopeful that that would be the case.
"The IFA has been lobbying on our behalf and I have sent a very strongly worded email to Milo Corcoran and Michael Hayes at the FAI calling on those men to consider their position.
"We have been treated disgracefully for this final and have already held informal talks with Linfield about the future of the competiton.
"I will take a lot of convincing that Glentoran should be part of the Setanta Cup next year under the present regime and there will have to be serious changes to the organisation of the tournament.
"The prize money is considerable but the tournament must be operated on a fair basis and I believe that the FAI has too much sway in how the thing is run at the moment.
"It is time for clubs in Northern Ireland to stand up and be counted."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/irish/7700557.stm
Cork get home ground advantage.
Glens have to travel a distance which means coach fans MUST stay overnight.
Cork get more than half the tickets, with the Glens getting fewer than they could sell.
Glens fans who've already arranged to travel will not get tickets.
Total capacity is around 4,000, because building work was not completed in time.
TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE.
If Corcoran and Hayes don't either resign or are sacked, I hope the Glens turn up, win the game, bank the cheque, then tell Setanta and the FAI to shove the competition up their arse.
Glens have to travel a distance which means coach fans MUST stay overnight.
.
No it doesnt.
We did Linfield up and down in the one night last year...and derry this year.
Not much fun but certainly do able
thischarmingman
30/10/2008, 6:46 PM
.
Total capacity is around 4,000, because building work was not completed in time.
Do Cork and Glentoran get the same amount of tickets each?
We did Linfield up and down in the one night last year...and derry this year.
Not much fun but certainly do able
Depends on the result one would imagine. ;)
Do Cork and Glentoran get the same amount of tickets each?
No. The idiots involved gave the Glens an initial allocation of 1100 before checking to ensure the St Annes would be ready. They promised them 400 more from the St Annes.
They gave us an initial allocation of 2800 thinking the glens would have more than enough with their St Anne's tickets
Depends on the result one would imagine. ;)
True...the last trip back from Derry was far far better than the Linfield one ;)
EalingGreen
30/10/2008, 6:57 PM
No it doesnt.
We did Linfield up and down in the one night last year...and derry this year.
Not much fun but certainly do able
You may be correct. Alternatively, NI companies may operate under a different regime.
I posted this on the strength of what a Glens fan posted on another site, after he approached some coach companies. I'll try and look it out.
EalingGreen
30/10/2008, 7:05 PM
No. The idiots involved gave the Glens an initial allocation of 1100 before checking to ensure the St Annes would be ready. They promised them 400 more from the St Annes.
Although it amounts to the same thing (i.e. an "allocation" of 1,100), my understanding from what the Glens' Chairman has said is that GFC were asked how many tickets they wanted and replied 1,500. They were not told that this might be a problem, so their fans started booking travel and accommodation etc.
The club estimates that 1,300 had already done so when Setanta/FAI came back and said they could only have 1,100, since the St.Anne's Stand was not actually going to be completed, as promised.
P.S. I watched BBC NI this evening and Alan McDonald (GFC manager) was on. He's not happy, to say the least. And you do not want to make Big Al unhappy. I hope he uses this anger constructively to fire up the boys.
You may be correct. Alternatively, NI companies may operate under a different regime.
I posted this on the strength of what a Glens fan posted on another site, after he approached some coach companies. I'll try and look it out.
AFAIk theres a couple of Glens coaches going back after the game.
ifk101
30/10/2008, 7:18 PM
.... then tell Setanta and the FAI to shove the competition up their arse.
Any excuse to have a go at your friends in Ireland. :D
EalingGreen
30/10/2008, 7:47 PM
Any excuse to have a go at your friends in Ireland. :D
I appreciate you're only joking, but if I may be serious, then this is real bad news for domestic football in Ireland (imo).
For coupled with reservations which Linfield have recently expressed, Setanta really cannot afford to p1ss off the Glens, since no Big Two means no Setanta Cup, end of.
And what's really bad is that reading between the lines, it's not just the actual decisions which are being taken which appear to have annoyed so many in NI, but the manner in which they have been taken.
For instance, it has been strongly implied by the IFA that a "consultation" process with them over where the Final should be played was conducted after the decision had actually been made to give it to Cork.
And for individuals at the IFA and GFC to be prepared to go on the record in specifically naming Corcoran (Setanta) and Hayes (FAI?) as the subject of their anger, shows just how p1ssed off they really are.
All of which is a shame, since despite my reservations over other aspects of cross-border relationships(!), I am 100% behind the concept of a competition such as this.
EalingGreen
30/10/2008, 7:49 PM
AFAIk theres a couple of Glens coaches going back after the game.
Fair enough, I stand corrected.
BohsPartisan
30/10/2008, 8:11 PM
It'd be a shame if the Setanta cup collapsed in a year that shows real promise at least on the pitch for north-south competition on this island. Two of the three major cup competitions on the island and one of the lesser ones have been contested between a team from the north and a team from the south!
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