Leagues Financial facts & Rumours thread

[red bellied]

Did Sligo tear up contracts mid-season to let players go, for example?

You can fail to honour players' contracts in full and yet still not be an hour late with the agreed payment.

Wish people wouldn't get so hysterically uppy whenever somebody hints that maybe their club isn't the best run thing since sliced bread.


They didnt tear up any cotracts but it was of benefit that players left.
Anto Murphy wanted back to Dublin and was let go.
Faz sold to Drogheda.
Moore was on a pay as you play contract.
Foy was under contract but there was a claus in it that he could be let go in the July window.

[sligored]

Did Sligo tear up contracts mid-season to let players go, for example?

You can fail to honour players' contracts in full and yet still not be an hour late with the agreed payment.

Wish people wouldn't get so hysterically uppy whenever somebody hints that maybe their club isn't the best run thing since sliced bread.

Stop digging stu- we agreed termination package of foys and moores contracts which is the clubs right as they were on pay per play contracts . that is any clubs right.

You have no right to say that sligo rovers did not play all their players all their wages on time.

what i hate is people who wont admit that they are wrong and withdraw the comment and then accuse people who are telling the truth about being hysterically uppy. Our club is on a solid financial footing and i wont accept people like you belittling the work of the people and mc of sligo rovers after all the hard work

[pineapple stu]

Fair enough. We'll have to agree to disagree so.

[OneRedArmy]

Did Sligo tear up contracts mid-season to let players go, for example?

You can fail to honour players' contracts in full and yet still not be an hour late with the agreed payment.

Wish people wouldn't get so hysterically uppy whenever somebody hints that maybe their club isn't the best run thing since sliced bread.Since when did operating within the T&Cs of an employment contract equate to not being well run?

I'd argue the opposite. Thats why you have T&Cs in a contract after all.

[pineapple stu]

Do you know if there were T&Cs? Or were players just gotten rid of? (I don't, incidentally).

I'd say having to let people go because you ran into serious budgetary difficulties after forgetting you'd have to pay some back tax isn't something the best run companies do, to be honest.

[OneRedArmy]

Do you know if there were T&Cs? Or were players just gotten rid of? (I don't, incidentally).

I'd say having to let people go because you ran into serious budgetary difficulties after forgetting you'd have to pay some back tax isn't something the best run companies do, to be honest.Well if it was contrary to T&C's then I'd imagine the players in question would be straight to their solicitors and would have gotten a large settlement or would still be at the clubs?

I think we all know most football clubs are unlikely to be given an award for financial probity, but given businesses all over the country are making people redundant and are amending existing employees contracts, I think we're in danger of applying a higher standard.

[pineapple stu]

Wasn't trying to single Sligo out for this (and absolutely agree they shouldn't). But don't think they should get undeserved pats on the back either. I'm cynical like that. :)

[Bald Student]

Wasn't trying to single Sligo out for this (and absolutely agree they shouldn't). But don't think they should get undeserved pats on the back either. I'm cynical like that. :)I think they saw the problems coming and nipped them in the bud. They'll see the benefit of that next season.

[HarpoJoyce]

Wasn't trying to single Sligo out for this (and absolutely agree they shouldn't). But don't think they should get undeserved pats on the back either. I'm cynical like that. :)


You were very critical of there supporters this season while they were raising money for their own club.
The Sligo Rovers fans are correct they they accuse you of not being able to admit when you are wrong.

[John83]

You were very critical of there supporters this season while they were raising money for their own club.
I don't think that's true. He was very critical of the attitude that since they'd raised some money, everything was going to be absolutely fine from now on. As it turned out, he was probably overestimating Sligo's troubles, but the attitude was valid if adversarial.


The Sligo Rovers fans are correct they they accuse you of not being able to admit when you are wrong.
He's slow to do it, yes. Most of us are. Mainly though, he's very slow to take the word of some fans or a manager or chairman that everything was hunky dory when he's heard otherwise, which, while it's a clear bias, is an understandable one born of miserable experience that the bad news tends to be true in this league.

That said, in this instance, there doesn't appear to be any good evidence that Sligo reneged on contracts or deferred wages, so he'd probably be best keeping that opinion to himself.

[pineapple stu]

I think they saw the problems coming and nipped them in the bud. They'll see the benefit of that next season.
True. But that's not what I was talking about in the post.


You were very critical of there supporters this season while they were raising money for their own club.
Links please? Or should I wait for you to admit you're wrong?

If I'm wrong, I acknowledge as much. (Speed is a different issue...). I'm sure you can do a search in my posts if you want.

[sligored]

[QUOTE=pineapple stu;1065363]True. But that's not what I was talking about in the post.

what were you talking about in the post. you were talking about non payment of all wages by sligo rovers stu-prove it or admit you are wrong .

and you said "Fair enough. We'll have to agree to disagree so"

i have validated my earlier post - you are only replying to selective parts of the argument and dodged the real issue. i know this is a facts and rumours thread and i am telling the facts and you are spreading unsubstantiated rumours.

[Mr A]

Annnnnyway.

From the sound of things on the Drogheda forum the latest East Meath Council meeting has not gone their way and they're looking even more f**ked than previously, if that's even possible.

[pineapple stu]

i have validated my earlier post - you are only replying to selective parts of the argument and dodged the real issue. i know this is a facts and rumours thread and i am telling the facts and you are spreading unsubstantiated rumours.
Your validation has been dismissed as easily flawed by a neutral party (not that it is flawed, but that it could easily be).

Facts and unsubstantiated rumours are very difficult to distinguish on an internet message board in such a small world as the eL where everyone knows everyone and news spreads. Your fact is presented with no more grounding than mine.

[Inside Man]

Your validation has been dismissed as easily flawed by a neutral party (not that it is flawed, but that it could easily be).

Facts and unsubstantiated rumours are very difficult to distinguish on an internet message board in such a small world as the eL where everyone knows everyone and news spreads. Your fact is presented with no more grounding than mine.
Look Stu the facts are: Sligo Rovers stayed within their business and moral bounderies this season. Did not ask players to take % pay cut, were not late by one minute in paying wages this season.
Source; Chairman; Michael Toolin, Manager; Paul Cook, Assistant manager; Gerry carr, every member of playing staff, Every single Rovers fan on this forum.

However you state: Five clubs in the Premier paid their players 100%, on time, all the time. Sligo weren't one of them.
Source: Yourself. And an unknown source from your last UCD match.


THOSE ARE THE FACTS
And don't even think of going knit picking Stu, Your simply wrong.

[pineapple stu]

The source was a UCD committee member, if you want it. They've been right on plenty of other stuff before.

LOL at using every single Sligo fan on this forum to back up your argument! In addition, your only source is a journalist quoting Paul Cook - no players, no nothing. That source, it's already been pointed out, could be flawed.

I'll leave it there.

[Inside Man]

Look Stu the facts are: Sligo Rovers stayed within their business and moral bounderies this season. Did not ask players to take % pay cut, were not late by one minute in paying wages this season.
Source; Chairman; Michael Toolin, Manager; Paul Cook, Assistant manager; Gerry carr, every member of playing staff, Every single Rovers fan on this forum.

However you state: Five clubs in the Premier paid their players 100%, on time, all the time. Sligo weren't one of them.
Source: Yourself. And an unknown source from your last UCD match.


THOSE ARE THE FACTS
And don't even think of going knit picking Stu, Your simply wrong.



The source was a UCD committee member, if you want it. They've been right on plenty of other stuff before.

LOL at using every single Sligo fan on this forum to back up your argument! In addition, your only source is a journalist quoting Paul Cook - no players, no nothing. That source, it's already been pointed out, could be flawed.

I'll leave it there.

I'm sorry but when i said all playing staff, it has been from talking to them personnally, and Paul Cook as a matter of fact.
The fact that you still think you are right just makes me feel sad for you mate. You may not be wrong alot in life but you have seriously made a fool of yourself here.
What more Sources do you want? There is not one bit of evidence of Rovers not complying with wages this year but for you and your UCD Committee member, do you realise how stupid that sounds?
Now if I was to just through something out there it would be, take a minute Stu. Re-think this arguement and admit you were wrong.
If you reply to this post it shows me your character, it shows me that you are a stubborn person, somewhat immature and never admits when he is wrong. However if you don't reply it shows me you are man enough to stand up and say you were wrong.

[forza rovers]

The source was a UCD committee member, if you want it. They've been right on plenty of other stuff before.

LOL at using every single Sligo fan on this forum to back up your argument! In addition, your only source is a journalist quoting Paul Cook - no players, no nothing. That source, it's already been pointed out, could be flawed.

I'll leave it there.he said it himself at the questions and answers night!

[pineapple stu]

Re-think this arguement and admit you were wrong.
Admit that what I was told by people who've been right way more often than not in the past isn't what I was told?

No.

I'm not saying Sligo are majorly screwed, I'm not saying they could be done out of a licence, I'm not even saying there was a major problem; I'm just passing on what I heard from very good sources for the sake of a rumours thread.

LOL at the notion that club officials are a bad source! Do you have any idea how close-knit (as opposed to knit picking, incidentally) this league is?

Also, take out the 10-year-old hysterics, underlining and bold. You come across like dcfcsteve, a person who loses every argument before he even starts it with that attitude.

[Battery Rover]

I spoke to someone on the Sligo management committee on the 14th October at Croke Park and all they needed to raise to be totally debt free at the end of the season and all people paid was 70k. I am sure they have managed that with gate receipts and some fundraising.

They will be pushing for the league next season in my opinion.

[Rovers Maniac]

Admit that what I was told by people who've been right way more often than not in the past isn't what I was told?

No.

I'm not saying Sligo are majorly screwed, I'm not saying they could be done out of a licence, I'm not even saying there was a major problem; I'm just passing on what I heard from very good sources for the sake of a rumours thread.

LOL at the notion that club officials are a bad source! Do you have any idea how close-knit (as opposed to knit picking, incidentally) this league is?

Also, take out the 10-year-old hysterics, underlining and bold. You come across like dcfcsteve, a person who loses every argument before he even starts it with that attitude.

Paul Cook & Our Chairman v Some ramdom UCD punter, i wonder who is the more reliable :):D

Stu you're making a fool of yourself give it a rest and run along. ;)

[sligoman]

They will be pushing for the league next season in my opinion.Not if rumours that Paul Cook is leaving because of the budget offered to him for next season are to be believed.

[WoodquayBoy]

Having read comments after my post, I retract my allegation about Sligo. I thought - wrongly, it appears, and I apologise for that - the fact that Toolan and the club was out whinging abouyt the need for people to give money to the club was a sign of it being in financial trouble, or am I the only one who remembers the campaigns with deadlines set for x amount of cash to be raised.
I say again, if players were paid on time and 100%, I apologise for suggesting that was not the case, but the mutual back-slapping over being financially sound sticks in the craw a little considering the size of the begging bowl being passed around earlier this season.

[Rovers Maniac]

Having read comments after my post, I retract my allegation about Sligo. I thought - wrongly, it appears, and I apologise for that - the fact that Toolan and the club was out whinging abouyt the need for people to give money to the club was a sign of it being in financial trouble, or am I the only one who remembers the campaigns with deadlines set for x amount of cash to be raised.
I say again, if players were paid on time and 100%, I apologise for suggesting that was not the case, but the mutual back-slapping over being financially sound sticks in the craw a little considering the size of the begging bowl being passed around earlier this season.

Nobody is back slapping anybody else to be be fair, you and stu spoke rubbish you were corrected and now you have apologised thats the end of it lets move on. I am quite proud how we came through it, we had to cut our cloth and we did just that. We needed to raise funds save the club we did that, and even though we lost some of our best players but now we are in Europe and Setanta cup so ok maybe there is some back slapping going on:). But it amazing reading some posts here some people would have loved to have seen us go bust.

[WoodquayBoy]

Well I for one would have HATED to see ye go bust, Connacht only has 2 clubs, and both struggled badly this year, the last thing we need is for either one of us to go ti.ts up

[GalwayRed]

But it amazing reading some posts here some people would have loved to have seen us go bust.
Its amazing that in the current state the league is in that anybody on here wants any irish club to go bust.

[maroon ultra]

Where does anyone say that they want to see a club go bust? :confused:

Its all very petty really from both sides.

[Lim till i die]

Its amazing that in the current state the league is in that anybody on here wants any irish club to go bust.

There's at least a half dozen clubs I want to see go bust.

What's wrong with you people. :confused:

[GalwayRed]

There's at least a half dozen clubs I want to see go bust.

What's wrong with you people. :confused:

I just dont see how its helping the league to wish clubs to go bust when there clearly arent clubs of a high enough quality to replace them. Im thinking for the sake of the league we need clubs of the quality of drogheda and sligo regardless of what i think of them in general

[John83]

I just dont see how its helping the league to wish clubs to go bust when there clearly arent clubs of a high enough quality to replace them. Im thinking for the sake of the league we need clubs of the quality of drogheda and sligo regardless of what i think of them in general
Imagine a season without any bad news about the league? No court cases over lost titles due to lost points due to lost documents. No banruptcies, winding up orders, unpaid wages, unpaid laundrettes, unpaid child slave labour. No ****heads throwing bricks at busses or threatening a manager's family.
We'd still have **** referees, European disasters, terrible commentators, Cork fans' misplaced sense of entitlement and mad Tom, but it'd all be worth it. And maybe we'd get somewhere. Maybe not somewhere spectacular, but somewhere real, not built on dodgy promises and dodgier debt.
Ah, who am I kidding? See you in hell*, Drogheda.

*Hell, a.k.a. the First Division.

[Martinho II]

Well I for one would have HATED to see ye go bust, Connacht only has 2 clubs, and both struggled badly this year, the last thing we need is for either one of us to go ti.ts up

not any more what about mervue utd??

[Mr A]

No banruptcies, winding up orders, unpaid wages, unpaid laundrettes, unpaid child slave labour.

It just shows you how badly the league run when we can't even afford unpaid child labour.

Grow a set and sort it out Delaney! :mad:

[John83]

It just shows you how badly the league run when we can't even afford unpaid child labour.

Grow a set and sort it out Delaney! :mad:
****. I didn't mean to put that in. Now the secret of UCD's balanced budget is out. I must perform hari-kiri.

[Trainee]

Athlone in trouble as well
http://www.athlonetownfc.ie/?p=447#more-447

[Lim till i die]

Athlone in trouble as well
http://www.athlonetownfc.ie/?p=447#more-447

Quelle Surprise

Love the way it's now the credit crunches falt even though a dog with a mallet up his ahem could have seen it months ago.

Reckon we could be looking at a more "streamlined" LoI next season.

[Longfordian]

From reading that they have a tax bill to pay ASAP. How much of that mooted €300,000 is tax I don't know but at a guess it'd be under €100K or it would have been further progressed at this point. I suppose there could be a good bit of players' wages owed too given that their local paper was reporting something like seven weeks owed recently enough. They're not the only club I've heard of and know of having a tax liability or wages owed and I'm by no means having a go at Athlone and if it stirs the people of Athlone into action then good luck to them.

[Lim till i die]

if it stirs the people of Athlone into action then good luck to them.

That kind of sentiment always bugs me to be honest.

Much like in Drogheda, the people of Athlone don't care, simple as that.

If they did the club wouldn't be in the mess they are in.

I hate when clubs act the absolute maggot and then come out trying to put a big feel good community spin on it.

Other clubs are breaking their ar$es trying to live within their means and you have these showers acting as shabbily as they feel like and then expecting a bail out at the end of it.

Yes, we did it in Limerick on occassion but I was just as annoyed then, I can assure you.

Clubs like Athlone are a scourge on the First Division.

Now I hope they survive, honest I do, I always liked Athlone as a club, there's some good people there, but it aint so long ago they were on here bragging about their zillionaire backers and winning the league.

And if they are waiting on 300k from the people of Athlone I shant be holding my breath.

Moving out of St. Mels was the worst thing that club ever did. (Hilariously enough.)

[Longfordian]

I agree with you in lots of ways and God knows I don't have much time for the 'sporting public' of Longford which would be similar to Athlone but at some point a decision has to be made "Do we keep going?". No harm in putting it up to to the people of Athlone to have an input in that decision so they can't be complaining if and when it all goes south. As long as it's a once off though and you can't keep expecting bail outs year on year from now on.

[SeanDrog]

That kind of sentiment always bugs me to be honest.

Much like in Drogheda, the people of Athlone don't care, simple as that.

If they did the club wouldn't be in the mess they are in.



Well there is a pretty general statement - wonder how many other clubs can raise 100k in a week from its uncaring supporters. Drogs should be ashamed of their uncaring selves. Intersting coming from a supporter of a club based in a city but has been plagued with money issues over the years and can gather no real substantial support from a CITY based population. Glass houses my friend and stones don't mix.


Info on fundrasing below and amount collected so far (in 1 week)
http://www.droghedaunited.ie/news/single/id/1508


Also Emmett Malone was at the public meeting last week and wrote an article about it here - might change your opinion (then again maybe it wont as some people can't change)

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2008/1205/1228337450423.html

[Ash]

Yep, its make or break for us at the moment. Unfortunately we are still paying
for sins of the past and although the "credit crunch" is being blamed, all it did
was speed up the inevitable as past debts which were being put on the long
finger are now biting us in the árse :o

The "soccer public" are a fickle bunch, even more so the "Athlone soccer public"
so it really is time to either all pull together or just nod, call everyone a shower
of c u next Tuesdays-it was all better in my day (which is the current mindset
of the majority in Athlone) and just shut up shop and close the gates.

Mondays attendence will tell its own story.

[Battery Rover]

Things have changed big time downhere this season. Playing budget was cut by a huge amount and this season only Wexford, Limerick and Kildare were playing of lower budgets than us. Even Monaghan were running of higher costs than us

Seven weeks into the season a sponsor pulled out for economic reasons and that deal was worth 35k a season. In July we had another sponsor pull out and that was worth 10k a season

It is payment of past debt that is killing us we are totally up to date with the revenue (this season), league fees, referess fees etc

We are one of the clubs running in profit this current season even with the sponsorship problems we have had.

We expect sponsorship to be down at least 70% next season in the midlands area.

LTID: Maybe have a look closer to home and ask your own committee where you would be without Jack McCarthys money this current season without judging someone elses club that you know nothing about.

[OneRedArmy]

That kind of sentiment always bugs me to be honest.

Much like in Drogheda, the people of Athlone don't care, simple as that.

If they did the club wouldn't be in the mess they are in.

I hate when clubs act the absolute maggot and then come out trying to put a big feel good community spin on it.

Other clubs are breaking their ar$es trying to live within their means and you have these showers acting as shabbily as they feel like and then expecting a bail out at the end of it.

Yes, we did it in Limerick on occassion but I was just as annoyed then, I can assure you.

Clubs like Athlone are a scourge on the First Division.

Now I hope they survive, honest I do, I always liked Athlone as a club, there's some good people there, but it aint so long ago they were on here bragging about their zillionaire backers and winning the league.

And if they are waiting on 300k from the people of Athlone I shant be holding my breath.

Moving out of St. Mels was the worst thing that club ever did. (Hilariously enough.)Whats your point?

[A face]

Whats your point?

I think he is saying that its history repeating itself, clubs doing the damage to themselves and then look to others to sort themselves out.

The age old problem with LOI Clubs, if only we could sort that one out we'd be grand ;)

[OneRedArmy]

I think he is saying that its history repeating itself, clubs doing the damage to themselves and then look to others to sort themselves out.

The age old problem with LOI Clubs, if only we could sort that one out we'd be grand ;)In other shock news, the world isn't flat after all and spins on its axis [gasp].

The point is applicable to almost every club, so I'm not sure what having a pop at Athlone achieves?

If anything I have more sympathy for Athlone as at least their money was spent on infrastructure and not straight into players pockets. That is definitely the lesser of two evils.

[Mr A]

In other shock news, the world isn't flat after all and spins on its axis [gasp].

The point is applicable to almost every club, so I'm not sure what having a pop at Athlone achieves?

If anything I have more sympathy for Athlone as at least their money was spent on infrastructure and not straight into players pockets. That is definitely the lesser of two evils.

I don't think this debt comes from the move, but rather the big spending splurge on players directly after it.

That said, I really hope Athlone pull through. A good club with great history.

[Magicme]

Things have changed big time downhere this season. Playing budget was cut by a huge amount and this season only Wexford, Limerick and Kildare were playing of lower budgets than us. Even Monaghan were running of higher costs than us




Unless your team and management were coming in at under €2,500 that is incorrect. From what I have heard some of your players were on 250-300 a week so cant see how you were less than ourselves.

[The Lilywhites]

If anything I have more sympathy for Athlone as at least their money was spent on infrastructure and not straight into players pockets. That is definitely the lesser of two evils.

Actually, most of their money problems, I would imagine, come from the ridiculous wages they gave to players in 2007. They were reported to have the highest wage bill in the division that season.

[GalwayRed]

That kind of sentiment always bugs me to be honest.

Much like in Drogheda, the people of Athlone don't care, simple as that.

If they did the club wouldn't be in the mess they are in.


You are aware those "uncaring" people of drogheda raised 100000 euro for their club in week right?

[Steve Bruce]

You are aware those "uncaring" people of drogheda raised 100000 euro for their club in week right?

Correct me if I'm wrong, Droghedas problem isn't the people in surrounding areas, it is actually the fact they didn't get there ground built and lost a lot of revenue there and not to mention the money from the sale of the current ground?

[Dodge]

Correct me if I'm wrong, Droghedas problem isn't the people in surrounding areas, it is actually the fact they didn't get there ground built and lost a lot of revenue there and not to mention the money from the sale of the current ground?

Well the current ground isn't theirs to sell, so consider yourself corrected.

There loads of reason why Drogheda is in the mess it currently is. There's no point in trying to fit into 1 or 2 handy bite size lines.