Stadium Updates (All Clubs)

**oriel** · 25/04/2023, 7:53 PM

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Maybe, but how would you react is eg teams from NI routinely referred to themselves simply as "Irish"?

Remember that southern international teams (for want of a better term) do not represent the state which chooses to call itself "Ireland". Rather they represent the FAI, under which it is required by FIFA to call its representative teams "Republic of Ireland".

By the same token, teams representing the IFA are called "Northern Ireland" (though technically I believe the IFA could still use the name "Ireland" in matches which are not also open to FAI teams - World Cup, Euro's etc - effectively friendlies, also the British Championship as was).

And why do I make this point? Aside from a general concern for accuracy*, it is because I resent the implication in their use of "Ireland" over "Republic of Ireland" that FAI teams are somehow the "real" Ireland, with NI being relegated to some sort of idiosyncratic appendage.

And maybe it's also because when I first went to internationals in Belfast (l971 onwards), we fans routinely sung and chanted for "Ireland", while FAI teams were routinely referred to as "Eire", in both parts of Ireland and beyond. While the fact of the IFA subsequently choosing to call its teams "Northern Ireland" from the 1980's onwards was a courtesy and respect to its neighbours which is not currently being reciprocated.

Above all, we in NI have at least as proud a place in the story of Irish football, and a hell of a sight older one, as our neighbours, such that if anywhere should be entitled to call itself the "Home of Irish Football", that place should undoubtedly be in Belfast/NI and nowhere else.

Rant over.

* - Some might call it pedantry

I read this am on the train into the office, good lord there is a lot in this to correct.

Ireland is the official name of the country for a start, its on all of the following with 'Republic' not (never) noted.

Passport / Drivers License / EU / UN official term / placemat at table.

I've been going to Ireland games for 40 years, not once have I ever heard anyone say 'are you looking forward to going to the REP OF ireland game next week v France' etc etc, its always 'Going to see Ireland play France' the fans don't chant 'Come on REP OF Ireland' again all Ireland. RTE sports news will generally start with 'REP OF IRE manager Stephen Kenny has injuries concerns over.........etc, then revert to Ireland for the rest of the report.

Even match programmes, from as far back as the 70's and 80's had IRELAND in big letters and over it in small 'republic of'

Back to the passport, it even has a map of Ireland inside it, doesn't shade it out for 6 counties, as all are entitled to reply.

Ordinance survey / google maps, here's another, the term used is 'Ireland' and Northern Ireland, and lastly if you have a UK mobile (I don't but cousins have) when they arrive in Dub the message is 'Welcome to Ireland'

I actually hate the question abroad too, mainly from UK tourists, but not always 'What part of Ireland are you from North or South'.......................East actually Dundalk !

Come on Ireland !

**EalingGreen** · 26/04/2023, 11:09 AM

Originally Posted by John83

Is that supposed to be some sort of sectarian taunt? Those aren't welcome here.

Says the poster who contributed this to a thread discussing a footballing matter:
"How do you think Irish people feel about northerners appropriating the adjective describing our ethnicity that would be entirely uncomplicated if their ancestors hadn't been planted on the island on lands seized by force creating centuries of ethnic tensions that lead to partition of the island, a civil rights crisis, and decades of simmering civil war?"

Originally Posted by John83

It would seem you have no idea what ethnicity means. There are dictionaries online, if you have the wit to use one. Thinking that those three aren't ethnically Irish makes you a racist, by the way. At best.

I was talking about Nationality. You then veered into the realm of Ethnicity, implying that "Planters" i.e. people of a different ethnic background, are somehow not quite Irish. Which if true must also apply to those three random examples, Messrs. Varadkar, McGrath and Lynott.

All three are, of course, Irish, as am I, yet people like you deny the essential Irishness of people from Northern Ireland.. Or at least, certain people from Northern Ireland.

Which brings me back to my point, which is that when talking about football in Ireland, certain posters on this forum seem to consider that "Irish Football" only alludes to the history and activity of the FAI/ROI team, as though the IFA/NI team was somehow lesser, or didn't even exist at all.

**EalingGreen** · 26/04/2023, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Yes, the FAI team is required to be called the "Republic of Ireland", but it can't represent the Republic of Ireland as there's no such country. It's a term used nowhere else but in football to the best of my knowledge. The FAI absolutely does represent the country called "Ireland", and we know this because FIFA explicitly admitted the FAI on the basis that it only organised football in the 26 counties.

I hope that you're merely confused, and not being deliberately obtuse.

The Dublin government does not pick the ROI team, or otherwise organise football within its boundaries. The FAI is not a State body and the governing body for football is the FAI, not the Dail. Indeed, when governments try to interfere in the affairs of a Member Association of FIFA, then FIFA intervenes to prevent this, if need be suspending the Association in question (the "nuclear option").

Which is why FIFA has so many more members than the UN (a point you fail to acknowledge) and is entitled to tell its Member Associations what they must call their representative teams and determine where their jurisdiction applies. On which former point, FIFA has instructed the FAI to call its teams "Republic of Ireland", i.e. to distinguish them from those of its other Member Association on the island, the IFA.

All of which is why it is erroneous, misleading and exclusionary to refer to the ROI team as "Ireland", as though football in the other part of the island didn't exist, or that it is just the same as eg
Rugby or Cricket. Worse still when it is claimed that somewhere in Dublin is the "home" (birthplace) of Irish football, that ignores the inescapable fact that football was first introduced to Ireland in Belfast, leading to the first Irish football club being formed; the foundation of the IFA by 6 Belfast clubs (and Limavady Alexander); the first football stadium beng built; and the first matches, including Ireland internationals, being played in Belfast. All of which happened 40 years before the FAI, or more accurately (ahem) the Football Association of the Irish Free State, even existed.

Yet you ignore all of this to try to deny the blindingly obvious fact that Belfast is the home of Irish football.

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

The IFA does not, any more, represent the country called Ireland, despite what its fans may think about a competition that hasn't been run in nearly 40 years. It represents the country called Northern Ireland (which, like England, is a country - it's just happens to be, strangely, a country within a country) and has a mandate to organise football only within the six counties.

The state whose capital city is in Dublin is called Ireland. That's literally a statement of fact enshrined in the Constitution. I'm not sure (and indeed don't really care) what discussion there is to be had there.

Northern Ireland teams are the representative teams of the IFA, nothing more nothing less. And there's nothing "strange" about "Northern Ireland" being a "country" in footballing terms, since the IFA is the fourth oldest Football Association in the world, predating FIFA, never mind the FAIFS/FAI. While many States make all sorts of claims within their Constitution eg Turkey claiming jurisdiction over Northern Cyprus or Serbia over Kosovo, both of which are ignored by FIFA when it comes to football.

Meaning that where you're going wrong is in believing that "country" in the footballing sense is indistinguishable from "country" in the political sense - it is not (UN = 193, FIFA = 209).

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

I am... ... stating that Belfast [is not] the home of Irish football.

See above.

**EalingGreen** · 26/04/2023, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by oriel

I read this am on the train into the office, good lord there is a lot in this to correct.

Ireland is the official name of the country for a start, its on all of the following with 'Republic' not (never) noted.

Passport / Drivers License / EU / UN official term / placemat at table.

I've been going to Ireland games for 40 years, not once have I ever heard anyone say 'are you looking forward to going to the REP OF ireland game next week v France' etc etc, its always 'Going to see Ireland play France' the fans don't chant 'Come on REP OF Ireland' again all Ireland. RTE sports news will generally start with 'REP OF IRE manager Stephen Kenny has injuries concerns over.........etc, then revert to Ireland for the rest of the report.

Even match programmes, from as far back as the 70's and 80's had IRELAND in big letters and over it in small 'republic of'

Back to the passport, it even has a map of Ireland inside it, doesn't shade it out for 6 counties, as all are entitled to reply.

Ordinance survey / google maps, here's another, the term used is 'Ireland' and Northern Ireland, and lastly if you have a UK mobile (I don't but cousins have) when they arrive in Dub the message is 'Welcome to Ireland'

I actually hate the question abroad too, mainly from UK tourists, but not always 'What part of Ireland are you from North or South'.......................East actually Dundalk !

Come on Ireland !

https://www.fifa.com/fifa-world-rank...d-mens-ranking

**EatYerGreens** · 26/04/2023, 12:20 PM

Good to see so many of you sharing in the joyous experience I have had previously of trying to have a sensible discussionn/debate with @EalingGreen

He's the kind of pedant that other pedants complain about for being excessively pedantic.

If dancing on the head of a pain was a round in Strictly, he'd be scoring straight '10s' from the jury. And don't expect him to admit he's got anything wrong either.

**EalingGreen** · 26/04/2023, 3:03 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

Good to see so many of you sharing in the joyous experience I have had previously of trying to have a sensible discussionn/debate with @EalingGreen

He's the kind of pedant that other pedants complain about for being excessively pedantic.

If dancing on the head of a pain was a round in Strictly, he'd be scoring straight '10s' from the jury. And don't expect him to admit he's got anything wrong either.

Any chance of your playing the ball instead of the man?

No?

Thought not.

**Buller** · 26/04/2023, 3:13 PM

Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

Good to see so many of you sharing in the joyous experience I have had previously of trying to have a sensible discussionn/debate with @EalingGreen

He's the kind of pedant that other pedants complain about for being excessively pedantic.

If dancing on the head of a pain was a round in Strictly, he'd be scoring straight '10s' from the jury. And don't expect him to admit he's got anything wrong either.

Is this a bad time to bring up the football pyramid?? Pineapple Stu or EalingGreen? ...

I'll let myself out.

**EatYerGreens** · 26/04/2023, 3:22 PM

Originally Posted by Buller

Is this a bad time to bring up the football pyramid?? Pineapple Stu or EalingGreen? ...

I'll let myself out.

Or the Brandywell funding or Leinster Senior League?

**oriel** · 26/04/2023, 3:48 PM

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

https://www.fifa.com/fifa-world-rank...d-mens-ranking

Once again, everyone knows that team to be Ireland, plus the new FAI badge has only two words on it 'IRELAND Football'.

Back to the passport / drivers licence / EU and Nato Membership, all only state 'Ireland'..............The Govt is another one 'a message from the Government of Ireland' (never Rep of).

Ireland and Northern Ireland, these are the official names used in most cases.

90% of people would refer to the 'soccer' team playing out of the Aviva as 'Ireland', I don't think that is ever in question.

**nigel-harps1954** · 26/04/2023, 6:10 PM

May I direct some of you to the Football History forum:

https://foot.ie/forums/102-Football-History

For others, if you wish to discuss politics and who's more Irish:

https://foot.ie/forums/87-Current-Affairs

Thanks kindly.

**WexCar.** · 26/04/2023, 7:15 PM

Originally Posted by oriel

Back to the passport / drivers licence / EU and Nato Membership, all only state 'Ireland'..............The Govt is another one 'a message from the Government of Ireland' (never Rep of).

Might want to retract that NATO membership bit.......

**oriel** · 26/04/2023, 8:38 PM

Meant UN !!!!!!!!!!!!!

But that was funny all the same.,,,,,,,,,,,NATO - Christ !

**Nesta99** · 27/04/2023, 10:28 AM

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

I hope that you're merely confused, and not being deliberately obtuse.

The Dublin government does not pick the ROI team, or otherwise organise football within its boundaries. The FAI is not a State body and the governing body for football is the FAI, not the Dail. Indeed, when governments try to interfere in the affairs of a Member Association of FIFA, then FIFA intervenes to prevent this, if need be suspending the Association in question (the "nuclear option").

Which is why FIFA has so many more members than the UN (a point you fail to acknowledge) and is entitled to tell its Member Associations what they must call their representative teams and determine where their jurisdiction applies. On which former point, FIFA has instructed the FAI to call its teams "Republic of Ireland", i.e. to distinguish them from those of its other Member Association on the island, the IFA.

All of which is why it is erroneous, misleading and exclusionary to refer to the ROI team as "Ireland", as though football in the other part of the island didn't exist, or that it is just the same as eg
Rugby or Cricket. Worse still when it is claimed that somewhere in Dublin is the "home" (birthplace) of Irish football, that ignores the inescapable fact that football was first introduced to Ireland in Belfast, leading to the first Irish football club being formed; the foundation of the IFA by 6 Belfast clubs (and Limavady Alexander); the first football stadium beng built; and the first matches, including Ireland internationals, being played in Belfast. All of which happened 40 years before the FAI, or more accurately (ahem) the Football Association of the Irish Free State, even existed.

Yet you ignore all of this to try to deny the blindingly obvious fact that Belfast is the home of Irish football.

Northern Ireland teams are the representative teams of the IFA, nothing more nothing less. And there's nothing "strange" about "Northern Ireland" being a "country" in footballing terms, since the IFA is the fourth oldest Football Association in the world, predating FIFA, never mind the FAIFS/FAI. While many States make all sorts of claims within their Constitution eg Turkey claiming jurisdiction over Northern Cyprus or Serbia over Kosovo, both of which are ignored by FIFA when it comes to football.

Meaning that where you're going wrong is in believing that "country" in the footballing sense is indistinguishable from "country" in the political sense - it is not (UN = 193, FIFA = 209).

See above.

So it's not Oriel Park??? But it says so on a big sign outside the main stand so it hs to be true just cause it says so!

**EatYerGreens** · 27/04/2023, 1:53 PM

Originally Posted by Nesta99

So it's not Oriel Park??? But it says so on a big sign outside the main stand so it hs to be true just cause it says so!

Is it true that as part of the North Stand development at Tallaght Stadium they're creating a new ornamental archway which wil say 'The Home of the Homeless" ?

**oldfan** · 28/04/2023, 8:00 PM

Tony O'Donoghue always says "Republic of Ireland" when referring to the FAI's International team?

**toffeejay84** · 29/04/2023, 10:04 AM

Does anyone know if Bohs are planning a duplicate of the Mono stand on the other side of the halfway line for next season? Aware there was some asbestos found that delayed the destruction at that end but seems like adding another 400 odd stand there would suit there needs for the next couple of years till the full renovation would be to start.

**Shinkicker** · 29/04/2023, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by toffeejay84

Does anyone know if Bohs are planning a duplicate of the Mono stand on the other side of the halfway line for next season? Aware there was some asbestos found that delayed the destruction at that end but seems like adding another 400 odd stand there would suit there needs for the next couple of years till the full renovation would be to start.

If they had a 1000-1500 mono keep it for home support. Remove the seats and give the Des Kelly to away support and let them see if they can fill it. After all they are all complaining about being limited to 450. It would give a capacity of 5000-5500 and would also be an indicator as to what to expect crowd wise in the new stadium. Hm hm, when it is built, hm hm. The temporary Mono stand could be there for a while yet.

**Jamesie** · 02/05/2023, 7:07 PM

Originally Posted by Shinkicker

If they had a 1000-1500 mono keep it for home support. Remove the seats and give the Des Kelly to away support and let them see if they can fill it. After all they are all complaining about being limited to 450. It would give a capacity of 5000-5500 and would also be an indicator as to what to expect crowd wise in the new stadium. Hm hm, when it is built, hm hm. The temporary Mono stand could be there for a while yet.

There's no way we're giving the 1300 capacity Des Kelly to away teams again. We could fill the ground with home fans for every game this season, so we're only giving away fans the 450 because we have to.

**bohsmug** · 02/05/2023, 7:23 PM

Originally Posted by Jamesie

There's no way we're giving the 1300 capacity Des Kelly to away teams again. We could fill the ground with home fans for every game this season, so we're only giving away fans the 450 because we have to.

Don't get a job as a PR man... jeez

To be fair the club have put a bit of effort and money into the away section. The club doesn't own the land but have bought that stand. I would love the possibility of a 2nd one to the other side of the gantry but (without knowing the cost) I think it was expensive enough.