No worries, no offence taken. I'm an optimist, I have watched every Irish game in the last x number years, so I must be one.Originally Posted by Greenforever
Anyway Stan was total crap, worst manager I have seen anywhere & at any time. In any sport. The funny thing is usually when you get two negatives you get a positive
yes, to finish second and qualify for the WC would be a super achievement by Trap and the players. I have a feeling this is what may happen but im jst warning people against getting so carried away that they dont look at things with perspective. Sure we have an experienced manager who has seen it all and we have some good prospects but i think that the 2012 Euro Champs and the 2014 World Cup would be a more realistic target. Put it this way, i would "expect" to qualify for 2012 or 2014 more so than 2010.
Compare the quality of player now to that which got us to 90, 94 and 02. Its not even close. Qualifying for a WC from Europe is no easy task and for Trap and the players to do so would be working wonders. Why do you expect it?
maybe i should up my expectation levels but you need definitely need to be more realistic.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
Correct. Such is the gulf in class the 90 - 94 teams might even beat the current lads if they were to pull themselves out of their wheelchairs.
i reckon we'll come third behind bulgaria. I don't think we'll get six points from the two early away games. I'd love to be proved wrong though especially as this is the first campaign i'll be able to go to all the home games and possibly some away too.
[QUOTE=Ruben Sosa;944846]I tell you why I expect it. Name 5 players playing for Bulgaria? Montenegro? Cyprus? Georgia? That's why... We have a starting 11 playing football in England and Scotland and mixing it week in week out with the top players from around Europe. QUOTE]
I tend to agree with this comment.
There is nothing that we should feel fearful about in this group other then Italy. I think second place is something that Ireland can achieve and I would be disappointed if they did not get it.
However every other team will feel the same way. This looks like a very open group and as someone pointed out I just hope we dont end up as the worst placed second team. Kick in the nuts if thats the case.
My top 3 prediction;
1. Bulgaria
2. Italy
3. Ireland
I think a lot of people are under estimating the Bulgarians. If Trap gets this team to the world cup it will become a new wonder of the world.
I think Italy will exit the world cup early.
The deepest layer of human thinking and feeling somehow knows that God must exist - Pope Benedict XVI
meant to say Euros, Italy will exit euros early at the hands of France.
My predictions: Ireland to pick up home draws against Bulgaria and Italy and nothing else against those two teams.
The deepest layer of human thinking and feeling somehow knows that God must exist - Pope Benedict XVI
Third place again though by a far smaller margin. I haven't seen anything playerwise to suggest that we can substantially reverse the decline in our fortunes over the previous 6 years.
However I do see a gradual improvement under Trap during the next campaign which let's be honest would be the least we should expect after our last manager.
Maybe at best we could make a playoff though we'll struggle to beat anyone we're likely to face over 2 legs (unless we get lucky again with the draw as we did with Iran in 2001).
Last edited by youngirish; 19/05/2008 at 4:46 PM.
Fairly pessimistic view but many of your posts are in relation to Irelands prospects in any sort of competition. I am sure you have supported Ireland for a while so I will ask you two questions. Have you ever been optimistic of Ireland winning anything or reaching a major tournament even in the good auld days? Do you think we will ever reach one again and if so/not, reasons for both and how you would change this so as to a achieve some sort of positive?
its also fair to presume that your average Joe Montenegro, Joe Bulgaria and Johnny Georgia football fan havent heard of more than 5 of our current squad either and to suggest that it would be otherwise is completely and utterly deluded. Dont kid youreslf.
Essentially, we're reading from the same page Ruben as, if you read my post, i said i have a hunch we could come second (due to the guile of Trap).
NOT, i repeat, NOT due to the players we have. We have no right to "expect" to qualify for ANY world cup. Not with the current crop anyway.
edit: so, what makes me a pessimist then considering i think we may take second place? Sorry man, im a realist. I dont think we have the calibre of player that allows me to "expect" that we should qualify. To qualify would be working wonders.
Last edited by SkStu; 19/05/2008 at 2:44 PM.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
I was about to post the same thing. Look at Croatia in the qualifiers. They had very few players playing in the top leagues, but they managed to beat England home and away and win the group. Too many teams have played against opposition that they know nothing about and probably think they should easy turn over only to be humbled. Look at England against Hungary back in the 50s (I think). The English players were laughing at them about how they were wearing "slippers" onto to be destroyed in the actual game.
My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method, is love. I love you Sheriff Truman.
Some of us may be underestimating the Bulgarians, but you sir are over-estimating them. They are about on a level with us. We did very well in their last group while coming 3rd behind Holland and Romania but they certainly are not a team we should fear. Just looking through the list of second seeds again shows IMO that they are arguably the best we could have hoped for
2nd seeds
England, Romania, Scotland, Turkey, Bulgaria, Russia, Poland, Sweden and Israel.
5 of those teams have qualified for the European championships, while England and Scotland would be matches which would obviously be very difficlut for us.. With the exception of Israel I think Bulgaria were the weakest from that pot. I was quite happy when we drew them. Im not underestimating them whatsoever but we shouldnt be making more out of them than what is there
Really? I would of thought our current squad has a better chance of qualifying than 2012 or 2014, Our best players, Keane, Dunne, Given will be gone or past their best by the time those tournaments come around and I don´t see any players of their cailbre coming, possible exception of McGeady, especially in defence where we seem to have a lot of average players coming though, we are also very unlikely to have a manager as experienced as trap for those touraments so I´m interested to know why you would think we have a better chance in 2012 or 2014
hey Morbo.
i actually feel we have a crop of very promising young talent coming through the ranks at club level. With Trap (hopefully) at the helm, things could be very exciting.
we have some decent young keepers getting regular first team footie. No Shay Givens, granted...
defenders - foley, painter, st. ledger, O'Halloran, O'Dea - O'Shea, Dunne and a couple of others may be the older, wiser heads in the group.
midfield - young James McCarthy, Garvan, McGeady, O'Toole, Gleeson, Gibson, Scannell, the Reids will still be around as will Joey O'Brien.
strikers - scarce but heres hoping Cillian Sheridan and Stokes come good. Not to mention the talent of Keogh, Walters, Clarke, Long. Doyle will still be young. Robbie should still be around.
of course there are no guarantees that all these players will have great careers but theres enough there, i think, to have higher hopes for 2012/2014 than this campaign.
I like high energy football. A little bit rock and roll. Many finishes instead of waiting for the perfect one.
montenegro beat norway 3-1 in a friendly few weeks back. they will probly cause us problems. trap has to sort our away form out. if he can do that, aswell as holding on to a one goal lead, i dont see y we cant make the playoff. italy will win the group and ne1 that thinks otherwise, is in dreamland.
yeah very bad luck us getting Montenegro. There are no easy teams in the group. That could work in our favour though if they nick points off bulgaria.
4 points after the two games in September would be a good result. 6 would be fantastic, 2 draws and we are already facing a struggle.
I think 22 points should get us 2nd place.
[QUOTE=shakermaker1982;945955]4 points after the two games in September would be a good result. 6 would be fantastic, 2 draws and we are already facing a struggle.
I think 22 points should get us 2nd place.[/QUOTE
Thats about right 22 points is what we need I was thinking more towards 23 but its such a tough group that points will be taken off everybody.
To top the group we will need an impressive 26-27 points I think will do it to win the group. Cant see us reaching that total but with a few prayers............
I'd like to echo these sentiments.
There's no need for the pessimism. I happen to believe that we could have a right lash at topping the group. It'll be extremely tight between Ireland Bulgaria and Italy and it'll come down to the games between the three.
Italy are being overestimated and Bulgaria under. Italy don't have the players of yesteryear and Bulgaria have a very strong spine to their team
Hi lads first time poster(which is obvious as you can see from my post count)
Anyway I think we have every right to feel we can qualify. I'm not saying we have better player than Bulgaria, but at the same time I don't think they are better than us. They have one standout player in Berbatov.
I fear Petrov in the away game, but while I think he's a fine player I think we could easily deal with him.
I think the away game against Bulgaria might end up like those matches we had against the Swiss.
I have faith in Trappa, but I also would not be saying ''oh yeah we're going to qualify'', but there is no reason to be saying ''Oh Montenegro, blah blah...Vucinic..blah'' they will be a difficult no doubt but we are a good bit better.
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