Bertie to announce departure date

[Kingdom]

The reason I think there will be a challenge is that cowan is a young enough guy in political terms and another career like Berties would mean Ahern/Martin/Hanafin would never get a shot at it.
Another thing is that from there have been whispers that Cowan has been too forthright in the past 6 months to a year, there will be a lot of people who won't take well to his "gruff" ways. Ahern would be more like, ehm, Ahern, to a lot of FFer's

[Macy]

Apt that one of the last things Ahern wanted to close off before he left office was the readmittance of Flynn fully back into the fold.

[monutdfc]

Apt that one of the last things Ahern wanted to close off before he left office was the readmittance of Flynn fully back into the fold.

Not just apt, but necessary: Pee Flynn is up before the Mahon tribunal in a few weeks and Bertie had to get Bev back in to the party to keep him onside. Wouldn't surpise me if it's part of the deal he cut with Cowen and she's a junior before the end of this Dail term

EDIT - turns out he's up before Mahon next Tuesday. Bev readmitted on Thursday (with the motion nominated by Bertie). Coincidence - I think not!

[pete]

Job Advert for Berties old job.

[dahamsta]

They had 150k views on that ad yesterday by 7pm. Talk about WoM.

I don't agree that mounting a challenge necessarily damages a career. It clearly puts cards on the table for the next opportunity, and a lot of voters in Ireland need to see those cards. There's a lot of thick voters in Ireland, let's be honest.

adam

[Ringo]

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...h-1339720.html

So. Happy now? Was that all worth it? With a media that is given to blowing up fits of indignant rage about everything from Kevin Myers to Dustin the Turkey, this was perhaps inevitable. This was the ultimate fit of righteousness. And now it's over and everyone has calmed down a bit. And what have we achieved exactly?

And the ones on the other side? What did they get? Well Fine Gael, incredibly, seem to be the party most damaged by the events of the last year. Fianna Fail in a bizarre way seems rejuvenated, united.

As much as there is shock about Bertie, life goes on and there is a feelgood factor about the party and about Cowen right now. Fine Gael just look weaker and more muddled than ever.

At no point in all this did Fine Gael ever threaten to take power and now they look further from it than ever.

Don't normally read Brendan O'Connor's articles, but he makes some very good points in this one. The mail in particular have been pushing for Berties head for the last year.

[Lionel Ritchie]

All partys get a bounce when they change leader. I don't have much faith in Enda Kenny either but basically Fine Gaels profile is low because so much coverage has been given over a prolonged period to revelations about Bertie Ahern.

Whatever about feelgood factors, if I were in FF I'd certainly sleep easier now that Ahern is gone because, if I may quote Johnny Cash, I hear a train a-coming, it's rolling 'round the bend.

[pete]

I don't think Bertie is gone yet. Awaiting with interest to see how he explain himself in the Tribunal however I can concede at this stage that will have little affect on the government as most people don't follow the details or care if he took a "few quid".

Better to have an economic downturn at the start of a 5 year turn as will seem like things improving by the time next General Election comes around.

[Macy]

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...h-1339720.html





Don't normally read Brendan O'Connor's articles, but he makes some very good points in this one. The mail in particular have been pushing for Berties head for the last year.

It's called investigative journalism. Not something the SINDO know much about, they've towed the Bertie Party Line since the pre-election meeting. I assume more of the same from Harris? I know it was Corcoran who had the interview with Ahern.

Basically, it's all bull. Journalists that were supposedly running a campaign were just reporting the truth. Ahern has shown in the past he'll sue if it's not true, so do it again now if it's false stories. Papers like the SINDO and "journalists" like O'Connor, Harris and Corcoran invested so much in Aherns version of events of course they're going to attack those that were never hoodwinked/ forced to tow the editorial line. The only person that is responsible for Ahern going, and the media coverage of him, is the man himself. €800,000 of unexplained money, and INM think it was the media that did for him!?!

[Kingdom]

All partys get a bounce when they change leader. I don't have much faith in Enda Kenny either but basically Fine Gaels profile is low because so much coverage has been given over a prolonged period to revelations about Bertie Ahern.

Whatever about feelgood factors, if I were in FF I'd certainly sleep easier now that Ahern is gone because, if I may quote Johnny Cash, I hear a train a-coming, it's rolling 'round the bend.

Mr richie, sir, I'd just like to say thats the best analogy/quote/call-it-what-you-like that I've ever seen on these boards. It made me smile.

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...h-1339720.html





Don't normally read Brendan O'Connor's articles, but he makes some very good points in this one. The mail in particular have been pushing for Berties head for the last year.

I can't see one point he made at all tbh. I've said constantly, that if the same circumstances were in Britain he'd have resigned before the last election. As for the Sunday Independent, they're reporting of things this past year has , along with Fanning, made me switch my choice of Sunday paper.

As for credible candidates for Taoiseach apart from Cowen, the only person I can think of is Dermot Ahern. I mean, would any of ye seriously entertain the thoughts of Michael Martin, Noel Dempsey, for Taoiseach? As for Hanafin, there's stuff a happening within her department, that is going to make things really ugly. she won't be Education minister next year, I'd nearly put money on that.
As for Fine Gael, yes it does seem like Enda Kenny has shot his load so to speak. If he was going to assume power it would have happened by now, and I think its time he steps aside. As for his successor, Richard Bruton seems the obvious choice.

Off-topic, could the more seasoned political campaigners amongst us tell me what became of Alan Dukes? I regularily see him on tv and he seems quite knowledgable, sincere and honest. He also uses the auld public transport which is a plus in my books.

[pete]

Off-topic, could the more seasoned political campaigners amongst us tell me what became of Alan Dukes? I regularily see him on tv and he seems quite knowledgable, sincere and honest. He also uses the auld public transport which is a plus in my books.

Wikipedia says he was involved in the EU after he lost his TD seat in the 2002 Fine Gael General Election disaster. His greatest success I suppose was the Tallaght strategy not that he got much credit.

[Macy]

Wikipedia says he was involved in the EU after he lost his TD seat in the 2002 Fine Gael General Election disaster. His greatest success I suppose was the Tallaght strategy not that he got much credit.

I think he's still involved in FG, and I think (but could be very mistaken) I only read recently that he's working on policy documents for them. The Tallaght Strategy was the wrong policy politically, but for the good of the country.

[pete]

I have increasingly noticed that apologists for Bertie list as achievements things such as "huge increase in infrastructure investment". I always thought achievements were things you completed or delivered.

[Dodge]

I think he's still involved in FG, and I think (but could be very mistaken) I only read recently that he's working on policy documents for them

He is. He was on with george hook a couple of weeks ago. He's got pretty wide ranging terms of reference and has to report back with 3/4 key policies that he believes would help FG. He said he has a number of months to prepare his report

Also found him to be a honest and upfront politician

[jebus]

I think Enda Kenny and Fine Gael's problem from this is that they are not seen as the ones who took Bertie down, more it was Bertie's own arrogance that eventually got the better of him (allegations about the Mahon Tribunal, the pay rise nonsense etc.) coupled with hanging Grainne Carruth out to dry. They really should have gone after him more at last years elections, I know it's honourable to try and focus on policies and issues, but governments rise and fall by the marketability of their leader and exposing Bertie for the piece of filth that he is would have done wonders for Enda's 'Can He Hack It' credentials

[Lionel Ritchie]

I have increasingly noticed that apologists for Bertie list as achievements things such as "huge increase in infrastructure investment". I always thought achievements were things you completed or delivered.

Plenty more to add to that. Average annual utility bill for a primary school is 125,000 and rising while Average annual government contribution to utility bills is 75,000 and falling.

Class sizes still woefully high and now we have an admission that any move to reduce them was based on pie in the sky mathematics and a shur it'll be grand it will attitude.

If it wasn't going to get fixed in the last ten years -it's not getting fixed.

The state now spends barely over half as much educating our kids as is done in consistently well off countries ...Finland for example.

[Macy]

I think Enda Kenny and Fine Gael's problem from this is that they are not seen as the ones who took Bertie down, more it was Bertie's own arrogance that eventually got the better of him (allegations about the Mahon Tribunal, the pay rise nonsense etc.) coupled with hanging Grainne Carruth out to dry. They really should have gone after him more at last years elections, I know it's honourable to try and focus on policies and issues, but governments rise and fall by the marketability of their leader and exposing Bertie for the piece of filth that he is would have done wonders for Enda's 'Can He Hack It' credentials

Kenny and Rabbitte let Ahern off the hook before the election - they should've lived and died by the sword, not on poll results (no matter how poor there were/ how thick the electorate were). However, in fairness to Kenny he brought FG back from the brink over the last few years, and really was let down (unfortunately) by Labour and the Greens.

I'm certainly no FG supporter, especially because of some of the right wingers that got elected, but you'd really wonder what FF are running scared off with the focus on getting him out? If he's as poor as they reckon, surely the FF Politicians, Supporters and Hacks would keep quiet and let him carry them through to the next election? Just what are they scared off if Biffo's the heavyweight they claim? Surely it's in their interests that he stays? Some sites like politics.ie have got ridiculous in with FF supporters stirring it up - if he's crap, why?

[pete]

FG need to stick with a leader for a while & stop chopping & changing. At least people will recognise him then. Labour were the big failure of the last election & even an extra 3-5 seats could have put a rainbow together.

I think the opposition were damned of the did or they did not in relation to Bertie attacks as most of the damning information has only come forward in recent months.

[Sheridan]

So the Cowen era dawns. O brave new world...

Living in this country is like being a porn actress at a gang-bang. No sooner do you get rid of one enormous pr1ck than another one rears up at you.