Trapatonni and the Eircom League

**jebus** · 15/02/2008, 1:42 PM

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

Championship standard is a far superior standard that much I do know.

I seem to recall us being on the same side in this debate with the eL circus in quite a few threads now, never gets old does it

**Ambaiste!** · 15/02/2008, 2:05 PM

Originally Posted by Schumi

But when Doyle was in the EL, he stood out significantly ahead of the other strikers in the league and would have merited a call-up then (similar to Crowe when he was called up). There is no one at the moment who stands out like Doyle did, the fact that Zayed (a good striker in EL terms but far from head and shoulders above the rest) is being touted shows that.

But the point is that Doyle didn't get called up until he moved to Reading, seemingly making him a top-class striker overnight.

Personally, I don't think Zayed is in the same class as Doyle, and I think it's unlikely that he would do the trick up front for Ireland, but to dismiss him out of hand just because he plays for Drogheda, while persisting with the call-up of proven failures such as Elliott, Lee and various other nearly men from the lower English leagues makes no sense to me.

**Blue-Army** · 15/02/2008, 2:25 PM

Originally Posted by half_full

No one ever said anything like that, but the likes of Gartland and Zayed should be considered equally to any other players for the Ireland squad. If they were playing Championship in England (which they could) you'd be raving about them.

doubt it....what about Colin Hawkins? forget about him...I don't blame you..He's only played 13 times since joining from Shels in 2006.

**jmurphyc** · 15/02/2008, 2:48 PM

Originally Posted by Ambaiste!

Personally, I don't think Zayed is in the same class as Doyle, and I think it's unlikely that he would do the trick up front for Ireland, but to dismiss him out of hand just because he plays for Drogheda, while persisting with the call-up of proven failures such as Elliott, Lee and various other nearly men from the lower English leagues makes no sense to me.

Elliot is not a proven failure. He has been unlucky with injuries. Most times he's played for Ireland he's played quite well. He'll probably never get to the level that he could have attained, but it's not due to his ability.

**half_full** · 15/02/2008, 4:15 PM

Regardless of whether Drogheda etc. would be comfortable in the English second division, there are LoI players worthy of a call up.

Hopefully Trappatoni will be unlike almost every other Irish manager and give this league respect.

**Ambaiste!** · 15/02/2008, 4:26 PM

Originally Posted by jmurphyc

Elliot is not a proven failure. He has been unlucky with injuries. Most times he's played for Ireland he's played quite well. He'll probably never get to the level that he could have attained, but it's not due to his ability.

Fair enough, but the fact remains that he, and others mentioned are probably never going to cut it. They've had their chance, why not give someone else a fair crack of the whip? I genuinely can't see the harm.

**pineapple stu** · 15/02/2008, 4:53 PM

Zayed had his chance too - Crewe rejected him. So he's a failure too. He's had a fair crack of the whip, to use your phrase.

Also, when Doyle left, he had something like 10 goals in 14 games. O'Donovan had 20 goals in 20 games. Don't have Zayed's stats offhand, but if he got 10 goals in a season, I'd be surprised. There's no comparison, even between those two.

**half_full** · 15/02/2008, 5:09 PM

Right, Zayed was mentioned on the off hand, but the thread is relvolving around him. For instance IF Jason Byrne/Mooney etc. hits 20 plus this season, then he SHOULD be given a call up to a meaningful match.

Why should Crewe be the judge of a player?

**pineapple stu** · 15/02/2008, 5:27 PM

Byrne did hit 20 goals a season, for four seasons. He went to cardiff and failed. Mooney went on trial with Crystal Palace and failed. Sorts your whine about only using Crewe as an example.

Spotting a trend yet?

**micls** · 15/02/2008, 5:29 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Mooney went on trial with Crystal Palace and failed. ?

Mooney was offered an 18 month contract

**GavinZac** · 15/02/2008, 5:40 PM

Originally Posted by Schumi

But when Doyle was in the EL, he stood out significantly ahead of the other strikers in the league

No, no he didnt. He didnt stand out all that much even at City. He had a good run of form, and was swept off to reading. Denis Behan had a similar run of form and hasnt been signed, because the transfer window was closed at the time of his scoring run. Doyler was initialled called up because of the club he was at and would not have been considered if he had stayed put, the same as Behan has not been called up.

**sullanefc** · 15/02/2008, 6:12 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Good argument. Get Given out - Quigley in!

Originally Posted by sullanefc

Well goalkeeper is definitely a position where I feel the eL is stronger than UK bar Shay Given. I can't see too many other positions on the team though. Joe Gamble is as close there is to an international outfield player in the eL IMO.

Try reading my posts. AND it's only a day old.

**half_full** · 15/02/2008, 7:29 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Byrne did hit 20 goals a season, for four seasons. He went to cardiff and failed. Mooney went on trial with Crystal Palace and failed. Sorts your whine about only using Crewe as an example.

Spotting a trend yet?

Mooney didn't fail as pointed out already.

RE: Jason Byrne, two words: Fowler and Hasslebank. Also Byrne only got 10 games, and AFAIK Cardiff have no proper reserve side, which would have dented his chances at getting back to the first team.

**Steve Bruce** · 15/02/2008, 8:03 PM

Originally Posted by half_full

Mooney didn't fail as pointed out already.

RE: Jason Byrne, two words: Fowler and Hasslebank. Also Byrne only got 10 games, and AFAIK Cardiff have no proper reserve side, which would have dented his chances at getting back to the first team.

Fowler and Hasslebank are both well well past their prime and are not the best in the division

Fowler and Hasslebank is the standard of player you need to be to play in the Championship. I'm afraid not too many players on this island are up to that standard. Let alone full football teams.

**half_full** · 15/02/2008, 8:09 PM

Fully aware they are past their best, still are far from poor players, and possibly good enough as Premiership squad players?

So Doyle, Long, Murphy, O'Donovan, and possibly Mooney would all be of Championship standard then?

**pineapple stu** · 15/02/2008, 9:52 PM

Originally Posted by sullanefc

Try reading my posts. AND it's only a day old.

OK so. Carsley out, Gamble in.

It works with any combination. Doesn't make your comments any less ridiculous.

**sullanefc** · 16/02/2008, 2:03 AM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

OK so. Carsley out, Gamble in.

It works with any combination. Doesn't make your comments any less ridiculous.

He hates being caught!!

**mr.untitled** · 16/02/2008, 10:12 AM

it should take an exceptional player to make an international squad, at the moment i dont think there are any LOI players that can make that grade, the championship argument is a different one, IMO there are a host of payers who would hold their own in that league (but not at the top few clubs which is where any internationals might come from)
Stu your brand of pesamism (as opposed to realism) is wholy depressing,

**pineapple stu** · 16/02/2008, 10:14 AM

No-one yet has managed to show why I'm not being realistic.

Simply saying it don't mak it true...

**GavinZac** · 16/02/2008, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

OK so. Carsley out, Gamble in.

It works with any combination. Doesn't make your comments any less ridiculous.

Why is the idea of replacing an average workhorse with a potentially great player ridiculous? Worst case scenario, Gamble runs about a lot, wins a few tackles and always passes the ball backwards. We'd just about break even there I think.