President at ROI matches

[Ambaiste!]

No it's not illogical at all - quite the opposite really and a fair comprise I think. In fact the 'Ulster' flag flown is the original yellow 'Irish' version of the provincial flag rather than the red and white one with the red hand of Ulster in the middle favoured by the Unionist tradition of the North. So I'm surprised some Northern people aren't up in arms about that.

Any I think it's brilliant that both traditions from the island are representing the island together - unfortunately can't see it happening in soccer any time soon though.

It's a bit of a muddle IMO when you consider that the yellow Ulster flag is not in fact the 'original' version of the NI flag at all. The yellow flag represents all nine counties, while the St. Georges' Cross/Red Hand flag represents only the six counties known as NI. I doubt any Unionist has ever felt any allegiance to the yellow flag - although why they ever chose to rally round the Red Hand of O'Neill in the first place has always been a mystery to me. But Hey, that's Ireland!

[lopez]

...Is Blanchflower going to explain why he asked such a random question?

Has the German lady broken her leg recently?

[lopez]

And what a completely illogical policy that is.

Agreed. It is illogical. As it's two political jurisdictions (one independent and sovereign; one a region), then I think it isn't unfair to have the flags of both these jurisdictions. Having the flag of Ulster is not the same as the flag of NI/the O6C.

[Lionel Ritchie]

I'm sorry I opened my mouth now.

[kingdomkerry]

The president of Ireland will always be welcomed my an overwhelming majority at all Ireland games.

GSTSQ should never be played to represent Ireland in soccer or rugby. Its the Irish team not the British team. When unionists in the north offer the hand of friendship to their nationalist neighbours and develop a neutral flag and anthem for the north all games in ireland can have Amhrain na bhfiann and the neutral northern anthem played. And the tricolour and the neutral Northern flag can both be flown side by side. Then everyone should be happy. I wont hold my breath. Unionist politicians dont want equality in the north!

[EalingGreen]

Not exactly true. But not far away.

The Soliders Song is not regonised by the IRFU as the national athemn of all Ireland. Up until 50 years ago all home Ireland rugby matches alternated between Dublin and Belfast. When the game was played in Belfast God Save the Queen/King was played to acknowledge the jurisdiction in which the game was been played. And when the game was played in Dublin the Soldiers Song was played to acknowledge that the game was been played in the south. Up until the mid-90's, when Ireland played away from this Island, no athemn was played until that crap that is Ireland's Call came into being. That's why the two athemn's are played at home games.

There was a huge uproar in the North before the last World Cup when God Save the Queen wasn't played before the Ireland v Italy game. This was the first International in the North in 50 years. The Ulster fans felt that they were made stand for the Soldiers Song when they watched Ireland play in Dublin over the previous 50 years and that their jurisdiction wasn't recognised when the game was played in Belfast last year. Only Ireland's call was played.

Also, if you look closely at home rugby internationals, you will see three flags flying. The Irish tricolour, the visiting nations flag and the Ulster flag.

About right, Harp. Just two slight elaborations:
1. In Dublin internationals, the Soldiers Song is played in full (to acknowledge the games location/jurisdiction), plus an extract is also played as a "Presidential Salute" whenever the Pres is present (which she always is, since she somehow never seems to have any bother getting a ticket!)
2. For the Ireland v Italy match at Ravenhill, the official reason given by the IRFU's spokesperson for not playing GSTQ (in acknowledgement of the game's location/jurisdiction), was that "only Ireland's Call is played for games staged outside Ireland"*. It has been further alleged that Ulster Rugby raised no objection to this deviation from stated protocol in return for being allowed a much-increased allocation of tickets to distribute to Ulster Branch clubs (once the IRFU Blazers had got thier share, no doubt)


* - That's right, Belfast isn't in Ireland, which came as a bit of a shock to me, never mind NI's Nationalist population!

[Jerry The Saint]

About right, Harp. Just two slight elaborations:
1. In Dublin internationals, the Soldiers Song is played in full (to acknowledge the games location/jurisdiction)

Further elaboration - Amhrán na bhFiann/The Soldiers' Song is almost never played in full.

[Ambaiste!]

When unionists in the north offer the hand of friendship to their nationalist neighbours and develop a neutral flag...

This is another concept that always leaves me scratching my head. If the governments announced tomorrow that they were holding a competition to design a neutral flag, or better yet, one inclusive of both major communities on the island, the winning entry would most likely end up being...the tricolour - Green for Catholic, Orange for Protestant, and White for Peace between them.

Sorry for going off-topic a bit, I'm obviously obsessed with flags.

[EalingGreen]

Further elaboration - Amhrán na bhFiann/The Soldiers' Song is almost never played in full.

Quite right, I think that the traditional two verses(?) are played to mark the jurisdiction, but only a segment as the Presidential Salute.

Let's face it, if they played the SS in full, plus the Visitors' anthem, plus Irelands Call, plus the Pres. Salute they'd be there all night.

And that's not counting when the All Blacks or various Pacific Isles come to town and want to perform their Haka!

[Lionel Ritchie]

This is another concept that always leaves me scratching my head. If the governments announced tomorrow that they were holding a competition to design a neutral flag, or better yet, one inclusive of both major communities on the island, the winning entry would most likely end up being...the tricolour - Green for Catholic, Orange for Protestant, and White for Peace between them.

Sorry for going off-topic a bit, I'm obviously obsessed with flags.

What pray tell the fcuk has green got to do with Roman Catholicism?

If it was about Cats and Prods being represented then surely Papal Yellow or Marian Blue should represent the papists?

Or is our flag a colour mixing exercise? Blue + yellow = green?

[tetsujin1979]

Topic. Off. Again.

[geysir]

Way off from the starting line at post one.
Should have been moved to off topic beside the Happy Pancake thread

[KianD]

The Ulster fans felt that they were made stand for the Soldiers Song when they watched Ireland play in Dublin over the previous 50 years and that their jurisdiction wasn't recognised when the game was played in Belfast last year.

My "jurisdiction" wasn't recognised at the game, thats true - as they didn't play the soldiers song. There ARE Ulster fans from our 3 counties, remember...

The wan in the ticket office wasn't very happy to be selling tickets to a game that was at least 80% Ulster attended to someone with a Dublin accent until I dug out my URSC membership number though

[ifk101]

2. For the Ireland v Italy match at Ravenhill, the official reason given by the IRFU's spokesperson for not playing GSTQ (in acknowledgement of the game's location/jurisdiction), was that "only Ireland's Call is played for games staged outside Ireland"*.

* - That's right, Belfast isn't in Ireland, which came as a bit of a shock to me, never mind NI's Nationalist population!

But he is correct. Ireland is the official name of the state I was born and raised in. Belfast is in Northern Ireland which is part of the UK and not Ireland. The island of Ireland includes Ireland and Northern Ireland, and is also the name used by cross-border international teams. The Republic of Ireland refers to Ireland's football team and the country's form of government.

This has been covered countless times before, as you are well aware of EG. But as there is an undying, unwillingness to accept the official state name of your near neighbours I propose that cross-border international teams change their name to the "Island of Ireland" or "Hibernia".

It's becoming clearly obvious that wee little minds are becoming consumed by "looking South". Time to move on and stick to football related matters.

[RogerMilla]

same **** different thread

[Ambaiste!]

What pray tell the fcuk has green got to do with Roman Catholicism?

If it was about Cats and Prods being represented then surely Papal Yellow or Marian Blue should represent the papists?

Or is our flag a colour mixing exercise? Blue + yellow = green?

Dead right, what was I thinking? Maybe the symbolism behind the flag in informed by an earlier, lesser know conflict on the island between Protestants and environmental conservationists. Back to the drawing board so.