Lawrenson must be one of the worst pundits going. I reckon he is a man with very few principles, he always strikes me as been spineless. Great player though
In Trap we trust
Didn't tell anybody a lot we didn't already know. Disappointed though that the FAI didn't have the balls to put some one up to argue their case, especially when they have a much stronger arguement than Howard Wells.
Sad to hear of how the choice for some players is based on either which team calls them up first or how they can best further their careers.
Didn't give an opinion on the eligibility issue. No doubt he was asked but wouldn't give a view for fear of offending anyone. He's basically just on the BBC for comic effect at this stage. Any pretence at serious punditry was given up ages ago.Lawrenson must be one of the worst pundits going. I reckon he is a man with very few principles, he always strikes me as been spineless. Great player though
Fairly one sided as predicted. I dont think I heard anyone say i want to play for ireland because they are my country. They would'nt of had to try too hard in all fairness
Yeah just watched it too it was pretty poor. Does anyone know what Eammon Macann was on about though, he didnt make any since at all.
He tends not to. But he does make nonsense seem interesting and dramatic which is a plus point.Yeah just watched it too it was pretty poor. Does anyone know what Eammon Macann was on about though, he didnt make any since at all.
He went on about Ireland fans in the north supporting England against NI. Personally I was glad NI won but my priorities were very much with the Ireland France match that night.
Given
Hughes Evans Dunne Finnan
O'Shea Carsley
McGeady Keane Healey Duff
And look at that team Lawrenson picked. He managed to squeeze 3 northern players in. (just not to offend im sure)
Its an argument that will never end. If they say its a free for all NI aren't happy. If they lock northerners into playing for NI it will end up in a very messy court case in Belfast between FIFA and someone who wants to play for ROI U-21s or something
Which is i suggest why FIFA are washing their hands of it and walking away. There is little else they can do until there is a united Ireland, an all Ireland international side, or every nationalist in the 6 counties decides to abandon 5000 years of history and throw their lot in with the empire.
An all Ireland international side is the most likely of 3 not terribly likely endings, in the near future at least.
I am loath to get into the wider debate because it has no end, but the spotlight programme itself was a peice of lazy journalism which almost completely failed to offer the other perspective and which leaves serious questions that should be asked of the BBC on their editorial slant on this issue. The BBC's latest charter includes...
- Representing the UK, its nations, regions and communities;
... and they completely failed to represent the Irish nationalist/republican communities in that programme.
Given the subject matter one would of thought they might have had mentioned Derek Dougan playing for Shamrock Rovers XI vs Brasil, or George Best being a declared supporter of an all ireland team. Perhaps some examination of exactly why so many Catholics ceased supporting Northern Ireland sometime around November 1993 might have been worth while.
And that without giving mention to that idiot Lawrenson. the one player i would have above all others from NI in an All-Ireland XI is George McCartney.
Healy over Doyle? On yer bike Lawrenson!
"And that without giving mention to that idiot Lawrenson. the one player i would have above all others from NI in an All-Ireland XI is George McCartney."
I was just about to say it. Although with Steve "the traitor" Finnan retiring arran hughes would probably get in there.
Healy is overrated and has been found out this year in the EPL
Agreed Holylandsman.Originally Posted by HolylandsMan
Was speaking to a guy who helps run one of the Ireland supporters clubs in Belfast yesterday. He got wind of the programme a couple of weeks ago and contacted the BBC about taking part, he never received a reply. Instead they went onto the Falls Road and asked a couple of people if they would rather see the north beat England.
Strange research !
Apart from that we had 'Hard' Wells talking about 'eligibility to the mother association', Enwin Poots playing the 'inappropriate pressure' card, Felix Healy's recollections of terrible sectarian abuse at Windsor Park & and Guys who played 20 years ago.
A case of the BBC shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted.
Should we call Mark McChrystal up to the Ireland squad for a laugh
FIFA don't do court cases.
What, only 5,000 years? Surely your grievances are older than that?
Do you think you can hold your breath for another 5,000 years?
Agree that the programme was poor enough, but I suspect that this was because they only had 30 minutes to cover what is a complex subject, for an audience the most of which aren't much interested in football, never mind the intricacies of FIFA Directives on international eligibility etc. Within those constraints, however, I thought it wasn't that bad, tbh.
As for the balance, I think you'll find that there may actually have been more representatives from the Nationalist side than from their Unionist counterparts - e.g. Felix Healey, Pat Ramsey, Gibson's uncle, two Derry City players, Eamonn McCann and Gerry Armstrong, the two "vox pops" in West Belfast.
I haven't a full count, but I'm sure that that is at least as many as from a Unionist background. Perhaps your disappointment stems from the fact that not all of them said what you might have wanted to hear? E.G. Eamonn McCann, when he pointed out that "footballing nationality" is not the same as "political nationality"? Or Felix Healey when he agreed that the whole eligibility uissue had now become "politicised"? Or those Derry players when they said they just wanted to play for the "best" team thay could, not the "most Irish" team? Or Gerry Armstrong when he said... well everything he said!
And in any case, Spotlight can hardly be blamed if nobody from the FAI was prepared to go in front of the camera. Might they have been worried that the programme was going to give the lie to the assertion that the FAI doesn't approach players, but just waits to be approached. Some of the testimony coming out of Derry clearly suggested the latter.
What would that have proved? How would it have shed light on the present issue of eligibility? It was 35 years ago, for goodness sake.
I closely followed Best's career almost since he started playing. I've heard other people (invariably Nationalists) repeat this line, yet none has ever been able to produce any evidence. Can you? I seem to recall an interview where he agreed that an all-Ireland team would likely be stronger than two separate teams (a statement of the bleedin' obvious, if ever there was one) and that he would have been prepared to play for them if asked (whether he'd actually have turned up is another thing, mind). But that is not the same as what you (and others) claim.
Anyhow, exactly what authority does George Best's (alleged) opinion from 25-odd years ago have on the issue of eligibility in 2008?
There are a number of reasons, some of which were touched on (Felix Healey on sectarianism, Neil Lennon etc), but the core subject of what was an already packed programme was whether Northern Nationalists should be eligible to play for ROI, not whether they want to.
Besides, the situation has changed out of all recognition since 1993, whether some people wish to admit it or not.
At last! Something we can agree on (if that's not being unkind to idiots...)
It is a poor state of affairs when the most acute intelligent statement in the programme comes from the FAIwho acted like some sort of Politburo, heard but not seen to be heard.
Howard Wells is waiting for the minutes of the Fifa meeting, what an áss.
Programme didn´t mention that NI born were always entitled to play for the Republic but there was an unwritten gentlemans agreement between the 2 federations not to mix.
This changed in Brian Kerr's time with the youngsters.
Too much was made of the GFA
The GFA has nothing got to do with eligibility. Automatic citizenship has.
The GFA has political significance from a Nationalist perspective in the North, it cements their citizenship rights into a NI constitutional type agreement.
On Eamonn McCann, he said something like
There is no Scottish citizenship, there may be sense of Scottishness. There is no Welsh citizenship or NI citizenship, that in itself tells you that the rules to do with football and the eligibility to play for national teams is not dependant on the political arrangement on the ground
Nice opening footage from Alan McLoughlin
The most interesting bit was the players saying repeatedly that 'they were never asked' to play by the IFA.. ergo they were asked by the FAI? Kinda flys in the face of the rubbish about not poaching our players doesnt it?
See to be honest, the one thing that has annoyed me more about this than anything else is this - for ages we have tried to take the religion out of our team.. it was a milstone around it and it has taken ages, and some dedicated people, to get rid of it.... then the FAI come up and start religiously segragating gthe kids again? WTF is that about? And none of you down there can't say it hasn't happened, but you come up here and see what it has done. Thanks.
Shelbourne FC Longford Town FCDrogheda United FCGlentoran FC Derry City FC Cork City FC
All fallen beneath the Linfield Sword
Audaces Fortuna Juvat
Leviathan I am not saying I dont believe you but at this stage we are only talking about a handful of kids.How has the FAIs actions resulted in the return of religous segragation in football(in practical terms).I am not in the habit of defending the FAI btw.
BTW Eamon McCann can be amusing at times but he was a bad choice for this.Boy did he talk a lot of b******s.
Last edited by cheifo; 30/01/2008 at 12:26 AM.
You talking about the bit that was spoken by Felix Healy when he said the IFA never phoned them up once in all the years to ask about the Derry players and the FAI were phoning up the club regularily?
Or the bit spoken by Darron Gibson's uncle Peter McLoughlin who said that the IFA cut off contact and he brought Darron himself to the attention of the FAI?
If we want to pick them we are entitled to pick them. See the eligibity thread. Use of the word "poaching" is hardly accurate in this context.
I agree. The FAI is at fault for everything. Delaney OUT!
I seen an interview with George Best that was not that old, it was broadcast either on UTV or BBC NI one evening by a lady interviewer. He said during the interview something along the lines of a combined Irish team making sense. However after a quick search I could not find any links to it.
But I did find this link which may be from around the same time;
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/foot...sh/4374631.stm
I broadly agree with EG, although
a) the evidence that Best supported an all-Ireland side is widely referred, including on OWC
b) McCann's a (waffling) socialist
Hard Wells is lazy, if he genuinely didn't bother to get briefing on how many players we've lost to RoI age-group sides in recent years. He must have expected the question?
Delaney did the FAI no favours by blanking the program.
Let lie, I say. Although regardless of dual citizenship factors I'd prefer anyone who's played internationally at post-school/ youth level to be ineligible for anyone else thereafter.
Failry one sided delivery I thought.. ( i.e Emotive words like "Defect" being used).. There are allot of factors and it needed more than a half hours attention.. I can see why the IFA feel agrieved, but question the focus of their efforts.. Neither the FAI or Wells didn't come accross very well for me.
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