Bit of a bizzare statement IMO......Originally Posted by eirebhoy
You'd swear we had a squad comparable to Spain, France etc.
McGeady and Ireland are excellent young players who have perfomed at a hghh level. Ireland has 1st calls technique but McGeady is more skill than technique......
THe others are have not achieved anything yet as yet and are playing at a fairly low level. Stokes has done absolutely nothing in the PL and he lacks pace and movement to lead the line.
McCarthy is only 17 and its unfair to put too much pressure on him.
Gibson and Garvan - there is no guarantees that these two will make it at the highest level.
His scoring record for Arsenal resevers was pretty poor (when he did play upfront) - and they do know how to play.
If you look through the record of the Scottishl league over the last 20 years that scored goals in the SPL and did **** all elsewhere
from October 2004:
"A natural finisher, Anthony excelled last year, making three reserve team appearances and scoring four times from eight Under-19 appearances - all as a 15 year-old.
He scored 12 goals from 17 Under-17 outings, and netted four from two FA Youth Cup games.
The young Irishman has trained with the first team on several occasions."
March 2005:
"Stokes' 7th goal for the reserves this season. Pretty good considering he has only started 10 or 11 games and played in midfield in his last 5 or so matches."
He rarely played up front after that.
Larsson - Proven everywhere.If you look through the record of the Scottishl league over the last 20 years that scored goals in the SPL and did **** all elsewhere
Hartson - 24 goals in a season with West Ham.
Viduka - scored 22 for Leeds after leaving Celtic.
Negri - scored 15 Serie A goals the season before joining Rangers.
Cadete - scored 25 goals for Sporting in a season in Portugal before joining Celtic.
Van Hooijdonk - scored 34 for Forest the season after leaving Celtic and also 22 in the Dutch league after that.
Boyd - Hasn't played outside Scotland. 7 goals in 13 for Scotland.
Riordan - Hasn't played outside of Scotland.
Anyone else?
I watched Stokes in person for almost 18 months playing for Arsenal reservers.
THose four goals mentioned scored above were in a youth cup tie against wait for it........Crawley Town. Arse won 7-1. Wow - what a legend.
His scoring record for the reservers / youth team overall was pretty poor. There is a reason why they moved him from HIS preferred striking role to a midfilelder bevause they didn't rate him as a striker. THey know there stuff and from I bave seen I tend to agree with them.
My point about the SPL is that many average strikers have done very well there - scoring goals in the SPL doesn't count for much.
I'm not saying that there have been no good strikers in the SPL over the last 20 years. THere's a difference.
I actually just listed the players that have scored 20 goals in the SPL in the last 12 years. I don't know where to find records for the previous 8 years.
With regards Stokes. I'd rather he joined Celtic for his own good tbh. He'd most likely be playing up front and being coached to improve the attributes that are required to be a top striker. I think it's pretty clear he's a terrible winger.
Anyway, apologies. We're going way off topic here and my main point is we have better than "limited resources".
I'd like to see him succeed aas much as any other young Irish player......= whether it be as a striker or attacking midfilelder......perhaps a spell in the championship or the SPL where he is getting regular 1st team football would make all the difference....
Eirebhoy I'm not trying to be disrespectful to the republic,but you have to look at the calibre of the squad,with the exeption of Shay Given can you name me one irish player that would get into the english team and they did not even qualify for the euros.so when i talk about limited that's where i'm coming from.I actually just listed the players that have scored 20 goals in the SPL in the last 12 years. I don't know where to find records for the previous 8 years.
With regards Stokes. I'd rather he joined Celtic for his own good tbh. He'd most likely be playing up front and being coached to improve the attributes that are required to be a top striker. I think it's pretty clear he's a terrible winger.
Anyway, apologies. We're going way off topic here and my main point is we have better than "limited resources".
ok fair enough. It's not about which of our players could make the English team though. I could name quite a few Irish players that'd make the Polish team. And the English team would be more suited to Lawrie Sanchez's style of play than the Polish team. It's about playing to our strengths and I'll go mad if James McCarthy and Owen Garvan are coached into typical British players like Steven Gerrard. I'm not saying Steven Gerrard isn't a top class player but there's a reason England aren't at the Euro's. Brainless football.
Last edited by eirebhoy; 22/12/2007 at 7:06 PM.
Sanchez plays long ball football. We dont have the players for that style of football. Therefore he is not suitable to be our manager.
In Trap we trust
How are players like
Dunne
Finnan
Duff
McGeady
Hunt
Keane
Doyle
limited resources? All top players!
you obviously havent been paying attention to the last rake of irish games
The usual thing was irish player in defence has ball, panics, passes it back to Shay who boots it up the field, hoping that kilbane will get a head to it. Repeat about a thousand times, and we might get a lucky goal.
I was so happy to see sanchez get the boot, selfish *******., and wouldnt want him near the irish job
(but to be fair he isnt a bad coach)
I think its the fact that I have been paying attention How have we done using the tactics you say, lost 5-2 to Cyprus away and drew at home and barely beat San Marino. You have just proven my point. I am not saying we have not played it with these players but it does not suit the players we have at the moment or coming through to play long ball football.
Thanks again for proving my point.
In Trap we trust
These players are average premiership players, not top of the range internationals.
I give those "wee tinted" specs a wipe.
In fairness though, I think Hunt would fall into the "limited" category.
Hunt is a hugely under-rated player. Will be playing for Everton come Feb.In fairness though, I think Hunt would fall into the "limited" category.
I was thinking the same...except for kingdom kerry.
You honestly believe we have 7 top of the range internationals in our team
...and yet can barely beat San Marino and can't beat Cyprus
And? That certainly does not make him a top quality international. He is a lad with limited ability but plenty of energy and heart.
He will never be a top quality player
Yes I do. Not of Brazilian quality. But good enough to qualify and get to the finals of a Euro championship or World Cup. I heard all this negative stuff before Charlton took over. No World class players other than Brady. Turned out to be nonsense once a manager who knew what he was doing took over.I was thinking the same...except for kingdom kerry.
You honestly believe we have 7 top of the range internationals in our team
...and yet can barely beat San Marino and can't beat Cyprus
Last edited by Noelys Guitar; 23/12/2007 at 2:34 PM.
But the question wasnt do we have 7 players good enough to take us to a major championship.
Waide(rightly imo) made the claim that the 7 players named were ' average premiership players, not top of the range internationals'.
You told him take off the tinted glasses.
Thats what i'm challenging. I see nothing wrong with his claim(although Id argue 2 would be above average). Thats not to say 7 average premiership players cant get us to a major championship with the right management.
I dont see how it was nonsense. What other player was world class? You dont need world class players to qualify or even do reasonably well in a tournament.
You need stability in the team, a manager who knows what he's doing and a bit of quality aswell as luck.
Last edited by micls; 23/12/2007 at 2:51 PM.
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