QuoteIn that case, as you say, there was a misunderstanding, so you can disregard my comments.Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er
I said they can't necessarily be separated. Which is true. Culture can be, and often is, political.
In that case, as you say, there was a misunderstanding, so you can disregard my comments.
Are you from Antrim? Were you born in NI? Then you're almost certainly a UK citizen, too.
It's probably contrary to all the Rules of Forum Etiquette and convention etc to quote oneself, but I posted something a few days back which seems to have been ignored in the midst of all this Nationality/Citizenship debate.
Which I feel is a bit of a shame, really, since it was a sight more relevant to the thread than 95% of what has been posted since. Therefore, has anyone any view on the following:
"Namely, there are two Football Associations, and therefore two international football teams, in Ireland. Each is/should be equally valid and each should respect the other.
Consequently, playing for NI does not make someone either "more British" or "less Irish", it merely means that when someone pulls on the Emerald Green Shirt with the Celtic Cross Badge, he's a Northern Irish footballer - no more, no less. What he does away from the game is no business or interest of mine.
Therefore, I believe if you are born within one part of the island (NI), you should represent the IFA team and if you are born in the other part (Irish Republic), you should represent the other Association team, FAI/ROI (unless you have a suitable connection - parent/grandparent/residence - with another Association, when you may choose).
This is basically how it works for everyone of the other 208 Associations and minor, non-footballing quibbles over anthems, flags etc notwithstanding, I see no valid reason why it should not apply to the two Irish teams"
And I disagree completely and fundamentally with this EG. I would imagine a fair proportion of people born in the Six Counties do too and it certainly looks like FIFA do as well.
and as for quoting yourself ? I can't say I'm surprised!
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Anyone know why it is only now that the FAI is trying to take NI players when they have hitherto respected the previous "gentlemen's agreement" not to?
I think FIFA is viewing Ireland as an extension to the "special case" of the home nations and is waiting for the IFA/FAI to come forward with a "gentleman's agreement".
Yes. It is of benefit to the FAI if no "agreement" exists.
Last edited by ifk101; 23/11/2007 at 1:05 PM.
And it wasn't of benefit in the past?
And often is not. And I don't think it was in this instance. Like I say, agree to differ.
Last edited by Drumcondra 69er; 23/11/2007 at 1:18 PM.
It's not only now and it generally began when it became unpleaseant in certain instances for nationalists to represent NI. I'm sure the Lennon situation for example encouraged youth players and the like to want to represent what they percieve as their country. Plus a number of them approached Brian Kerr when he was underage manager and given that he understood where they were coming from seeing as his father was from Belfast he decided to pick them. Plus at the time the Irish team's stock was considerably higher then NI's. The situation in the 90's was a lot different to when Pat Jennings et al were playing youth football.
Who knows.And it wasn't of benefit in the past?
I suppose it started with Brian Kerr. Maybe he didn't accept the balance of this "gentleman's agreement". After all it's of much more benefit to the IFA than to the FAI.
But you can ring him up and ask if you like. I don't speak for Brian Kerr or the FAI.
There have been several underage lads from Northern ireland represent the Republic in the past 15 years or so.
Why is it only now that the IFA are complaining?
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Probably because they feel that this particular lad has the potential to be a lot better than the rest of these lads and worried that more like this may slip through the net.
How's that?
Didn't realise this went back 15 years.
The answer to the second question might simply be that the IFA is slightly more competent/has more balls now than it did in the recent past.
Well ask yourself why are you so upset with the eligibility proposal? Is it because the potential pool of players for the Northern Ireland will decrease or is it because the potential pool of players for Ireland will increase?
Talk of "Stating the Bleedin' Obvious"!
We all know that you and "a fair proportion of people born in the Six Counties [sic]" disagree with what I am saying.
But what I was trying to get at is why you think that my thesis doesn't stand up? I don't like a lot of things in life, but I have to accept that they are so, and the reasons why. Therefore, if you think my reasoning is faulty, tell me why, rather than just banging on about how much it annoys you.
P.S. I can do without your sneering about my quoting myself, since it was only an attempt to drag a thread about football, on a football forum, back to a discussion about matters footballing, it having been hijacked by posters like yourself who seem to prefer to harp on about politics. Why don't you post on a politics message board? From what little I've seen of them, they seem to have sneering down to a fine art, so you should feel at home.
Speaking for myself, any fan of a team is bound to be upset when he sees his team's potential pool of players dry up, for reasons which he perceives to be contrary to the principles behind international eligibility.
Where those players go is irrelevant: I would be just as opposed/angry/disappointed etc if we were losing NI-born players on unfair grounds e.g. to England (or anywhere else for that matter)
No, I think it's because they didn't have a leg to stand on (as eligibility was purely down to citizenship regardless of how it was aquired) until the change in regulations following the Qatar situation. Once that change came in they thought they had a case hence the challenge.
Remember this challenge was because the thought we were breaking the rules by picking 6 county players with 'born' citizenship' rather then looking for a change to the rules.
The gentlemans agreement was irrelevant and a distant memory at that stage.
Of course - I totally accept and understand that.
But that's, in this particular instance, not our problem.
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