QuoteYou mean Davey Barry?, one of the greatest players this country has ever seen?Originally Posted by Réiteoir
I gave up caring about this 'Irish' team a couple of years ago.
Until it includes a fair representation of players born, living & working in Ireland I'll continue to not care.
You mean Davey Barry?, one of the greatest players this country has ever seen?
"Must you tell me all your secrets when it's hard enough to love you knowing nothing."
http://worddok.blogspot.com
You might be going just a bit too far on that one!
One of the greatest Gaelic Footballers alright....thats about as far as his 'greatness' ever went outside of Langerland.
There is zero chance of Delaney going. The FAI will avoid any serious flack over the Irish international set-up - bar in the odd non-tabloid paper.
I'll toss a controversial viewpoint into the mix here. Staunton is a poor international manager - granted. But we're also a poor international team. We should be beating the likes of Cyprus and Israel - but we havn't. Twice.
So maybe it's those of us who expect a country of 4m people to be towards the top of the footballing tree permanently who are being unrealistic ? Look at our team - only Shay Givens is a player of serious quality. Duff is injured, and Robbie Keane is broadly inconsistent. The rest of our squad is frankly make-weight.
Staunton is poor - certainly no better than Kerr. But maybe, just maybe, we're where we are in the table because that's only as good as we are......?
We're in serious danger of turning into the English fans and media here - with constantly over-hyped expectations that do not reflect the varying quality of our squad. We have a weak international team at the moment. They don't help themselves by under-performing, but I doubt we'd have qualified form that group regardless. As Dafydd would say, time for every football fan in the village to just "Get over it"
Some points for last night which kept me awake last night.
The players were rubbish. They did not care. Any LOI top club would have given the Cypriots a game last night. Why this need to constantly defend the "poor Irish players" in the media - they are as bad as Stan and Delaney. Perhaps even worse in many ways. But instead we are expected to adore them because RTE loves English football. They are somehow infallible. Would Stephen Ireland's muppetry be tolerated in any other country. He would never wear the national jersey ever again. Simple as that. Instead all the resources of the FAI and Irish media help the "poor lad". WTF?
Secondly, it is now very possible that the ROI, England, Scotland, NI and Wales will all miss out on the finals.
This tells me the "Pie 'n Mash" British soccer tradition cannot compete anymore. The "have a go" mindset of Stan and Co. is a old joke. Smaller European nations send no players to the land of RTE Soccer West Dreams and still qualify. But in this country we still see the road to success paved in British failure.
When are the morons in the country; the media, the FAI, most of the fans get it into their heads that it going to take more than a bizarre fantasy world that you grew up in Lancanshire to get a top Irish side into major finals. I was watching the RTE 1 o CLock news last night and they announce with a sense of shock and deep seriousness that Bolton have let their manager go as the top news story. What the hell has that got to do with sport in this country? Nothing. Could you imagine the TV news in the Czech Republic having as their main sport story that the manager of Wolfsburg with no Czech connections was fired.
The decades of Britball/National Identity Crises in this country have truly come home to roost.
Just on the radio about the FAI set to offer Stan a pay off.
This is the key. The quality of international football is at an all time low. BY and large the players view it as an inconvenience (except, in fairness, when they get to the business end of tournaments - view the effort of the Italians last time, or the French and Portugese in 2000).
Coaches are broadly reject club coaches who could not get a better gig elsewhere and for some reason, the convenient expediency of ensuring that somebody else is to blame for failure rather than the coach himself is all powerful.
Witness the sheer tactical and courageous ineptness of the Italians and Spanish in 2002, or Perfidious Albion in every tournament since 1990 - hence you get Turkey in 2002, Greece in 2004, Bulgaria in 1994 etc etc all beating so called decent sides.
By the way, result of the night last night was Liechtenstein.
DB Cooper is alive !
Expecting to beat Cyprus twice, looking to beat SM before injury time, and to hold on to a lead in the last minute in Slovakia are not over-hyped expectations, they are standard demands which a competent coach at this level should be more than capable of delivering, whether the team is decent or not. We're not expecting our boss to win the WC like England do, we expect the team to be competitive in international football. When you're tossed out of the qualifiers with 3 games to go, the press and public will react in a suitable manner.So maybe it's those of us who expect a country of 4m people to be towards the top of the footballing tree permanently who are being unrealistic ? But maybe, just maybe, we're where we are in the table because that's only as good as we are......?
We're in serious danger of turning into the English fans and media here - with constantly over-hyped expectations
We don't have that bad a squad, we even have a CL winner in our ranks. With the right coaching, and a dose of professionalism brought in, we could be top 10 in the world material, not struggling to finish third in a poor qualifying group. It's quite clear who is to blame for the situation, and we demand that action is taken against those concerned, so that we're not here in 2 years time, wondering why we're not going to South Africa.
I hear what you're saying, but results don't lie !
We're not talking one-off freak results here - we've finished mid-table in our group for 2 tournaments in a row, largely due to our inability to beat other mid-to-lower table teams. We failed to beat Israel home or away in the last campaign, and we failed to beat Slovakia away and Cyprus home or away this time round. One of those results in isolation would've been excusable/forgettable. All 5 of them suggest an underlying trend.
So what if we have a CL winner in our squad ? Such is the international reach of top footballing clubs these days, that having a single CL winner in a mediocre international team is almost par for the course. Current international footballing giants with a CL winner in their team include Finland, Australia, Mali, Norway, Lithuania, sweden and South Africa. Until a round of international retirements earlier this year, that list also included Trinidad & Tobago, Wales and Bosnia. I doubt there's any teams there we'd lose sleep over having to play against.
Our team is under-performing - for sure. But we also do not have the potential to be a Top 10 global footballing nation for the forseeable future either - that's absolutely for sure.
CuanaD and Boh so good, you have somewhat restored my faith in football fans in this country. Great points, you're both spot on.
Since Stan took over i've been delighted because i get to see the reaction of the goons that support the national team. I get to see them cry into their pints and say something like "That was depressing, if Liverpool lose on the weekend too, i'll top myself"
Last edited by Anto McC; 18/10/2007 at 7:01 PM.
im sorry but i dont agree with that, .so we are a small country so we should think small! balls to that......i remember latvia and slovenia qualifying for tournaments
we have the players but we need a decent manager...........its as simple as that..................just look at the downward spiral of Norn Iron.....same team but different managers..........
Cuana D
While giving up caring about the Irish team is your own business, the results , performances and attitude of some of those over paid prats might even warrant it; the fact remains that there are more Irish born players in the present squad than at any time since we regularly chose League of Ireland Players. And using your logic David O'Leary and Paul McGrath were both born greater London!
So you think Ireland deserves to be towards the top of the global footballing tree permanently ?Name me another country of 4m people that is ? In fact - name me a country with a population of less than 15m that is a consistently good performer in Europe (don't even dare to suggest Sweden or Denmark, btw !
) ?
I don't think Norn Iron is a good example to give. They just went from woeful, to temporarily quite good, and have slipped back to woeful again. Manager's aside - the good bit is a blip in their last 15-20 years of performances. Regardless of the numerous manager's they've had over that period.
sure China with its population should have at least 5 world cups by nowSo you think Ireland deserves to be towards the top of the global footballing tree permanently ?
I don't think Norn Iron is a good example to give. They just went from woeful, to temporarily quite good, and have slipped back to woeful again. Manager's aside - the good bit is a blip in their last 15-20 years of performances. Regardless of the numerous manager's they've had over that period.
Look at the **** that's happening at Wales at the moment. It's the players who're taking the flak. They lost 3-1 in Cyprus and only won 2-1 in San Marino - I know a team who did worse than that and it's the manager that's getting the boot.
They players ARE good enough. They're just not committed enough.
With an international team including, Given, Dunne, Finnan, Duff, Doyle and when he's arsed Robbie Keane we should be able to give any team a run for their money.
The pathetic performances being delivered by these lads are unacceptable. Most international players are passionate about playing for their countries but look at the English, Irish, Northern Irish and Welsh players at the moment and it's anything but that.
It strikes me that these guys all think they're superstars because they listen to the Sky hype.
I genuinely believe one of the major mistakes in the international team's recent history was making Robbie Keane captain. His attitude should be an example to nobody.
I phoned the speaking clock to hear a voice speak, it said - "At the tone you will be very much alone"
Not the point, as well you know.....sure China with its population should have at least 5 world cups by now
I'll ask again - do you honestly think Ireland should be consistently at the upper end of world football ? And can you name me any country with a population below 15m that is ?
Portugal, Czech Republic...and possibly Holland?Not the point, as well you know.....
I'll ask again - do you honestly think Ireland should be consistently at the upper end of world football ? And can you name me any country with a population below 15m that is ?
...and why can't we suggest Sweden? They have been performing consistently well for years now.
Last edited by Armando; 22/10/2007 at 2:14 PM.
Holland is over 16m+
Portugal has a population of just over 10m. However - it's only in the last 5 or so years that they've been at the higher levels of the footballing tree.
They've only qualified for 4 world cups (66, 86, 02, 06). Two of those have been in the last 5 years - meaning that up until 2000, the footballing power-house that is Norn Iron had been to more World Cups than them. Unlike the north, Portugal went out on the First rounds in both 1986 and 2002.
Portuguese football has therefore been far from consistently at the upper level in world football. They've had 2 strong periods - the mid 60's, with Eusebio, and their current period. Beyond that they've been distinctly average. Even with a population 2.5 times the sze of ours.
I've requoted you as you've added two new countries since my previous response.
Sweden have been nothing like a consistently high-flying performer in world football - that's why you can't give them as an example. They've only qualified for 2 World cups, and it took them even longer than the Republic to make their first (1994). Their recent results against NI also show their inconsistency. The Czechs haven't been around for that long in all fairness. Even if they did inherit much of the mantle of the previous Czechoslovakia team, it still took them 12 years to make their first World Cup (last year) - where they went out in the First Round.
World football did not begin in the last decade....
Last edited by dcfcsteve; 22/10/2007 at 2:31 PM.
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