It is an excellent idea. Problem is, it's exactly what was just tried. People don't care, despite what they say. They're happier, like pete, having a pop when it doesn't work rather than making it work.
Ye are very touchy. Humour free zone
Half the posts here were jokes but only mine was commented on
Alan Hunter speaks for Ireland International football supporters not LOI supporters.
Reading the NLSA meeting minutes & seems to be very concerned with International tickets which seems different than the LOI.
You, Philo and some Rovers fan made stupid jokes; only Philo's was ignored. Don't see where you can claim victimisation there.
I don't know where you're getting "very" concerned from.
The NLSA was born out of the ticketing issues before the Israel game. The FAI were happy to look on us as the liaison between them and the various clubs who got tickets for the games. Therefore, they were mentioned a bit - more than we wanted, to be honest - and it was something the FAI came back to often enough. One common comment was effectively that the Ireland tickets would be under threat unless we came within the Family of Football. We didn't particularly want to discuss them - we were happy to agree something going forward and draw a line under them - but the FAI continued to bring them up in this sort of way.
I just looked through the minutes & tickets seemed to dominate the topics.Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Tickets cannot be removed no more than FAI can remove tickets from any other block booker. Each club operates as individual block booker & removing tickets would be a breach of contract.
The NLSA needs a cause to unite LOI supporters but I don't see any in the horizon.
And thats fair enough, it had to start somewhere but when it was being formally organised into a supporters group there were other issues raised.
But when meeting with the FAI, there should be a specific amount of time alocated to that topic, then move onto the other issues. Meetings shouldn't be lead by the FAI, other topics issues should be raised as well.The FAI were happy to look on us as the liaison between them and the various clubs who got tickets for the games. Therefore, they were mentioned a bit - more than we wanted, to be honest - and it was something the FAI came back to often enough.
Again, fair enough, there was cause for concern but it shouldn't have been the sole purpose of meetings. Any meeting, with no matter what group, all parties go to the table with a setting of pre-determined objectives, a mandate from its members.One common comment was effectively that the Ireland tickets would be under threat unless we came within the Family of Football.
Nail them down to a time, say 15-20 mins, and move on to next issue if they cant sort it out in that time, agreeing to re-address it in the next meeting. It the FAI, they organise the tickets and should have an idea of what they want to do with them, fans obviously will differ on what they want, you compromise and find a middle ground and go with that. Next topic.We didn't particularly want to discuss them - we were happy to agree something going forward and draw a line under them - but the FAI continued to bring them up in this sort of way.
The FAI shouldn't take a whole meeting to establish that, that could be conveyed in four minutes (if they know what they are talking about) and the fans group shouldn't be lead down that path for an entire meeting(s) either.
Jebus wept, there is enough wrong with the league to be able to find something to for the 'raison d'etre' ...... i know i listed at least 10 buring issues at the time.The NLSA needs a cause to unite LOI supporters but I don't see any in the horizon.
One of which was the new tv deal that was going to be agreed on within 1.5 years (been and gone now) ........ one and a half years, and fans had an opportunity to have an input there and now that chance is gone, until the next time ..... leaving plenty of time to organise a mandate for fans and present the case to the powers that be. Do people want an hour long highlights programme on a Sunday evening at 8.00? ..... there, thats the first thing to unite fans.
The FAI love this, lead the lads up the garden path and leave it wither away and run out of steam.
Enough people have gripes over various things within this league, the group should colate it and present it and ask for a return on it. It should be a lobby group, no tickets, no waves flags for them at games where LOI players are continually overlooked, no fines handed out to clubs to silence people, just a collective of fans standing up and demanding the FAI to consider the needs and wants of the biggest group of stakeholders in Irish football.
Thats what the group should be. Have a membership, as a means of organising and raising funds but try and address the concerns of ALL LOI fans. I am NOT suggesting to try and represent all fans, you wont get everyone on board but as fans there is nothing wrong with lobbying for change on issue that incidently effect all fans. As soon as its gets some results (or when complacent fans have a necessity to join the group) then more people will come on board.
There was far too much made of "we can only represent our members", ballox to that, you drive on with what you have and the issues that need to be addressed and if people dont like it tell them burst. Its not like they'll be up in arms because they are sitting on their holes and someone else is doing something. Why should you care about a nameless unidentifiable fan who isn't a member?
Repeatedly saying no one has interest in the group, when there has not been a concerted effort to request expressions of interest in the group is not gonna cut it i'm sorry. You cannot wheel that one out and expect it to hold up the argument. PRO and secretary should be continually highlighting the groups existence, even have a dedicated person assigned to it. How many match programmes did the NLSA appear in? How can you say no one is interested when no one has had a chance to declare/express lack of interest (by express it i mean you hear nothing back)
The club reps in the NLSA, how many times were they asked were there people at their individual clubs interested in it and what were their concerns and in the same times frame, how many times were the reps asked about ticket issues (take up, money, collecting them, etc. .... numerous times i'm guessing)
Were club reps even asked to try and promote the NLSA within their clubs?
Noel Mooney is looking after the league promotion, nd clubs promotions officers. He works for the FAI. While he might be a fan, he is not best placed to represent fans. Fans themselves should be doing it and not relying on anyone else to do it for them.
Last edited by A face; 10/05/2007 at 1:20 AM.
The SFAI are the governing body for grassroots football in Ireland, not the FAI. Its success or the lack of is all down to them.
I simply don't buy the whole defeatest 'but no-one was interested' idea.
Firstly - all such organisations depend upon a small number of people to do the vast majority of the work. Trade Unions, campaign groups, local branches of political parties - they're all the same. Expecting or depending upon a mad rush of people to get involved would have been naive.
Secondly - many who would look to get involved with such a body would want to see what it's all about, what it does, and have it achieve something first. Groups like this have no divine right to expect support/membership. So just mopeing about a lack of involvement becomes a bigger impediment than that lack of involvement itself.
Finally - just look at the amount of publicity afforded to Alan Hunter. One man, on his own. So how the hell can EL fans not manage to do the same - regardless of how many of them are involved......?
There were enough people involved in the NLSA to just get on with things, and there was a clear strategy for the organisation, with a list of specific objectives to achieve. For whatever reason - and I genuinely don't know what they were - momentum was lost very early on. I'm not sure it's strictly fair to blame everyone outside dof the NLSA for this lack of momentum, when as Alan Hunter has shown - with a bit of leadership, a tiny number of interested and capable people could've pushed the whole thing along.
Cue the personal attacks on me for raising these issues, rather than attempts to actually address the points raised.....
Face, your points on the tickets, while I can see where they're coming from, are erroneous. We made it clear to the FAI that we wanted to get the tickets sorted as soon as possible (i.e. sent out to people with no messing) and get on with other stuff. If they keep bringing them up in meetings, there's not a huge amount we can do. Unfortunately, it takes two to tango, so if the FAI are going to continue bringing them up, we have to just get it over with.
A look at the NLSA website will see proposals on the TV highlights, the league format (which was sent around to anyone who got in touch with us to register interest, including you, and received very positive feedback), a response to the Genesis Report as requested by us, suggestions on Licencing, suggestions on the new league name (as posted on here for feedback) and other items. Again, the bottom line is that we had absolutely no power in the greater scheme of things, and so there was nothing stopping the FAI from ignoring us completely, which they did.
The issue of programmes was mentioned earlier - we had a half page in every Ireland programme for 18 months and hardly got a single reply from those. There were threads here announcing a general meeting - about 15 people turned up. We'd gotten contacts for every Supporters' Club involved in the tickets and tried to fill in as many gaps as possible, and e-mailed them about it, and yet still only got 15 people turning up. We sent out membership forms to all those Supporters' Clubs, and only two sent them back; the rest didn't even acknowledge them. That covers your query about club reps promoting it within their club. People on here are happier to bitch about what didn't happen than do anything. Those incidents, for me, were a declared lack of interest, which you denied happened.
Ultimately too, the FAI had no real interest, and that's a major factor. There was no point us sitting in a room with the FAI making suggestions knowing they were going to be ignored.
It's all very easy to sit and whine about how nothing was done or what have you. Feel free, by all means, to give it another try. I've no bother with that. I do recall a thread there a couple of months ago - I believe dcfcsteve and you, face, were the instigators - asking for PM support to build such an organisation. What happened to that, may I ask? Would you rather I criticise you ovr the fact that ultimately, yez did nothing about it, or would you rather I empathise with you over it?
Edit - here's the thread I mentioned. Reminds me of the PFJ in The Life of Brian. Suggestions and radical words but nothing actually done. At least the NLSA got a bit further than that and gave it a shot. I don't really think those who didn't try and so failed have a good starting point to be complaining about those who at least tried, but still failed.
Last edited by pineapple stu; 10/05/2007 at 12:59 PM.
Short memory PS - despite beign based in London, I was one of the core people involved in getting the NLSA off the ground in the first place. So don't try and paint me out as some sort of whinger who doesn't actually do anything....
I'm based in London. That means there is very little I can personally do on a going basis. I did try to facilitate a meeting back in February of this year for about 10 people who got in touch with me off the back of that thread you've just sneered at, but the fact I'm based in London meant I could only give it one shot. I'm happy to give you the list of people interested back then if you want to get in touch with them to arrange to all meet up. As you're Dublin based you'll have a lot more flexibility in this than I do, so no reason why you couldn't make it happen.....
So can we read form your note that yourself and the rest of the NLSA have effectively given up now ?Do you not accept the point that there's stuff that can still be worked on - regardless of how many get involved ? Or is Alan Hunter after all genuinely the head of a powerful organisation with thousands of members ? If he could get the media spotlight onto issues on his own, why couldn't the NLSA...?
Last edited by dcfcsteve; 10/05/2007 at 1:14 PM.
Wanted to bump this back-up the thread list again, as I don't believe we got to the bottom of it all.
- Is there an NLSA AGM this year, or is the group now effectively/officially disbanded ?
- Is anyone still liaising with the FAI over tickets ?
Here is a suggestion for raising the NLSA's profile and raisin funds for campaigns.
Start a NLSA forum, like this place actually, and take the money that Dahamsta makes from ads and use them for the association.
Simple.
There is an NLSA forum.
I don't think money is the core problem/issue to be honest.
If anyone wants to take on the running of it, obviously, feel free and the best of luck with it.
If the FAI f*ck around with the tickets again, they know we have them over a legal barrel so they'll get told where to go fairly soon by the same people who told them where to go last time.
At a guess, Dahamsta probably makes enough off of those ads each year to pay for the running costs of this site and (if he's lucky) buy a ham sandwich.
You can't spell failure without FAI
with free moderation i would be most suprised if this isnt a lucrative site. fair play to him.
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