Setanta Cup - The Verdict

**Lim till i die** · 27/03/2007, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by galwayhoop

if the tournament had increased potential viewing figures of wales and scotland then proportionally the increase in prize money would not be a great as you think. would the attendances be as bad as you think? i'm not sure. also i'm sure other sponsors would come on board if it were a multi-country event

Dig, Dig, Dig, Dig, Dig, Dig, Dig, Dig

**galwayhoop** · 27/03/2007, 11:58 AM

also the fact is that the teams outside the top two in scotland have very little chance of regular silverware at the moment so the incentive of winning a trophy would also add to their interest IMO

**DvB** · 27/03/2007, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by galwayhoop

also the fact is that the teams outside the top two in scotland have very little chance of regular silverware at the moment so the incentive of winning a trophy would also add to their interest IMO

True, cant remember Hibs or Hearts winning anything in recent memory!

Koh

**Dodge** · 27/03/2007, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by galwayhoop

if the tournament had increased potential viewing figures of wales and scotland then proportionally the increase in prize money would not be a great as you think. would the attendances be as bad as you think? i'm not sure. also i'm sure other sponsors would come on board if it were a multi-country event

Kilmarnock average about 4,000 for non Old Firm games. Goodness knows what they average on Monday nights against clubs they've never heard of.

There will be no other sponsors as the competition is run by the sponsor, if they pull out, there is no broadcastor, and without a broadcastor, there's no chance of a sponsor. Don't forget that from next season Setanta have English Premier League rights (and Conference!) to add to their Italian, French, German etc

Some people just need to get a dose of reality round here

**Dodge** · 27/03/2007, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by DvB

True, cant remember Hibs or Hearts winning anything in recent memory!

Koh

some Hibs fan you are...

Hibs won the league cup last week, and Heaarts won the Scottish cup last year

**WeAreRovers** · 27/03/2007, 12:15 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

some Hibs fan you are...

Hibs won the league cup last week, and Heaarts won the Scottish cup last year

I'm sure that was far easier than DvB imagined.

KOH

**Dodge** · 27/03/2007, 12:20 PM

Grrrrr

**DvB** · 27/03/2007, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by WeAreRovers

I'm sure that was far easier than DvB imagined.

KOH

**BohsPartisan** · 27/03/2007, 12:49 PM

Totally against inviting any clubs from other countries. It totally defeats the purpose. For me the idea of Setanta is that its an All-Ireland competition in the absence of an All-Ireland League.

**galwayhoop** · 27/03/2007, 1:21 PM

seriously lads the negativity on here is mind blowing. people don't even listen to suggestions without having the cons stacked up and ready to belt out!!

fair enough so, as per the title of the thread, setanta cup - the verdict?

obviously in yer eyes everything is rosey and perfect so leave well alone!

well, from my point of view, and i am a neutral (i.e. my team does not compete and i don't think we will for a good while anyway) i think for it's long-term survival it needs overhauling and expansion. i know many, many people who go to eL games and watch copious amounts on of sport on TV also but never, ever watch the setanta cup. viewing figures will inevitably drive the aganda and i suspect that they are not as high as setanta would have envisaged. and as pointed out above with their expanding repite�ir (sp?) the importance of the setanta cup will only diminish in setanta's eyes.

but fair enough lads, keep beating the no change drum, keep harping on about non-eL attending football fans being the scourge of the sport, keep bashing the GAA & IRFU (2 organisations who embrace change and development), keep the lot and forget about any change or improvements and, like the FAI, keep running the game into the ground!

**Dodge** · 27/03/2007, 1:42 PM

Originally Posted by galwayhoop

seriously lads the negativity on here is mind blowing. people don't even listen to suggestions without having the cons stacked up and ready to belt out!!

Post a realistic solution and see what response you get. Post up rubbish and I'll say its rubbish

obviously in yer eyes everything is rosey and perfect so leave well alone!

The point I'm making is that this is a competition run by a ****ing tv pcompany and no amount of internet ******ology will change their aims for it

viewing figures will inevitably drive the aganda and i suspect that they are not as high as setanta would have envisaged.

What makes you think that? Live Setanta games this year have all been tight and largely full of goals too.

but fair enough lads, keep beating the no change drum, keep harping on about non-eL attending football fans being the scourge of the sport, keep bashing the GAA & IRFU (2 organisations who embrace change and development), keep the lot and forget about any change or improvements and, like the FAI, keep running the game into the ground!

Go off on tangents much, do you? Forgetting about your laughable assertion that the GAA embraces change, **** off saying Irish football fans are anti change just because a few (mainly me...) posted out the flaws in your stupid, illogical, unworkable plan.

**galwayhoop** · 27/03/2007, 1:59 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

Post a realistic solution and see what response you get. Post up rubbish and I'll say its rubbish

imo it is a worthy suggestion that clubs from both wales and scotland being included in a celtic style cup competition would benefit all leagues concerned

The point I'm making is that this is a competition run by a ****ing tv pcompany and no amount of internet ******ology will change their aims for it

ha, ha, what is that ****ology you are talking about then. you have been on this forum for 6 years and posted almost 7,500 times. you have achieved exactly what? i actually thought the point of a forum was to offer opinions and discuss things not to affect change. but with your 7,500 posts you surely know more than me and must have moved mountains at this stage

What makes you think that? Live Setanta games this year have all been tight and largely full of goals too.

the setanta games on TV may have been tight and full of goals but what are the viewing figures. i hear that curling is a fascinating sport but i don't watch it and it's not on TV because damn all people do! fact is that very few neutrals watch setanta cup games on TV and the quality/tightness/amount of goals doesn't seem to alter this. as setanta's coverage of overseas leagues grows the need for the setanta cup will deminish or dissappear unless there is a market (i'e' people) to watch it.

Go off on tangents much, do you? Forgetting about your laughable assertion that the GAA embraces change, **** off saying Irish football fans are anti change just because a few (mainly me...) posted out the flaws in your stupid, illogical, unworkable plan.

(change from a competition prespective / not talking idiolegy here) the GAA have adopted the 'back-door' in football and 'group system' in hurling to try and compensate the weaker provences and there is mutterings to incorporate the national league into the championship thereby reducing the importance of the provencial system. the IRFU have very succesifully developed the game to such a point that we are now one of the top nations in the world!

**jebus** · 27/03/2007, 2:16 PM

What are the viewing figures like for Setanta Cup games lads? I don't know any barstooler who would ever bother watching it, and I'd say its about 70/30 on here would watch it, so I can't imagine its doing all that well. Personally I don't think I've ever watched a Setanta Cup game, have no interest in having a competition for TV revenues sake.

**Dodge** · 27/03/2007, 2:18 PM

Originally Posted by jebus

What are the viewing figures like for Setanta Cup games lads? I don't know any barstooler who would ever bother watching it, and I'd say its about 70/30 on here would watch it, so I can't imagine its doing all that well. Personally I don't think I've ever watched a Setanta Cup game, have no interest in having a competition for TV revenues sake.

The reports Pats got from Setanta were they were happy with the viewers. There's little other football on MOndays

**jebus** · 27/03/2007, 2:28 PM

Originally Posted by Dodge

The reports Pats got from Setanta were they were happy with the viewers. There's little other football on MOndays

Whats happy though? If they are not putting up too much prize money they're likely to be happy enough with pretty small viewing figures. Don't Sky sometimes show English League matches on Monday nights?

**holidaysong** · 27/03/2007, 2:33 PM

The televised game last night was very entertaining. It is a worry though that Portadown and Dungannon were so easily beaten. It may only be a short time before these teams begin to play reserve sides in the Setanta Cup (as they may feel they can't win anyway), finish bottom of their group and still take their cheque at the end of the day allowing them to save their number one players for the IL. There may be calls to refix the 50-50 entrants to something more like 75-25 although I don't see how they would get this to be accepted by the IFA. I really can't see how this 4 and 4 format can last for much longer though unfortunately...

**dcfcsteve** · 27/03/2007, 2:39 PM

GalwayHoop,

We all went through this debate about 2 months ago.

The bottom line is that the Setanta Cup isn't even working as an Ireland-only contest at the moment. Crowds for it are poor in the north, no better than normal in the south, and as last night's results showed - there is already a huge imbalance in the competition as it is.

Rather than get tied-up in misty-eyed dreams of running way ahead of ourselves, the Setanta Cup needs to be made a success first within Ireland before anyone should even dream of expanding it.

Even if that stage was reached - the Welsh clubs would add zero and detract a lot form the competition. They're on a par with our first division sides in terms of average playing skills, facilities and crowds. The average Welsh Premier crowd this season is a whopping 283 ! I kid you not ! The biggest crowd they've had all year is 1,0007 ! The highest Welsh Premier crowd this year is therefore lower than our current First Division average this year. Just think about that !!!

So come back down to earth dude. The Setanta needs to be made a success in Ireland first before there would be any hope of anyone else wanting or needing to get involved in it.

**dcfcsteve** · 27/03/2007, 2:40 PM

Originally Posted by holidaysong

The televised game last night was very entertaining. It is a worry though that Portadown and Dungannon were so easily beaten. It may only be a short time before these teams begin to play reserve sides in the Setanta Cup (as they may feel they can't win anyway), finish bottom of their group and still take their cheque at the end of the day allowing them to save their number one players for the IL. There may be calls to refix the 50-50 entrants to something more like 75-25 although I don't see how they would get this to be accepted by the IFA. I really can't see how this 4 and 4 format can last for much longer though unfortunately...

It may be in the contracst for participation in the tournament that a team has to put out their best side.

If it isn't it should be, and if the above happened I imagine it would be.

**jebus** · 27/03/2007, 2:52 PM

Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

The biggest crowd they've had all year is 1,0007 !

No now, thats a fairly big crowd

**dcfcsteve** · 27/03/2007, 3:10 PM

Originally Posted by jebus

No now, thats a fairly big crowd

Not if it's the single biggest attendance all-year in a Premier league in a country with a population of 3 million !

Don't forget - the average attendance is only 283, and even that is up 5.7% on last season !!!