QuoteI wish he would turn a corner and just keep walking to the next corner and the next one after that and not stop until he's back in Walsall where he belongs
Well, I actually think he IS taking it on the chin quite well. He doesnt need my sympathy..thats correct. And he is paid good money. He knows the score if the results dont come and so do I. (they are coming though...just...)Originally Posted by citizenerased
In terms of Stan's managerial skills let me have a go at being positive....
1) He has brought a lot of young players in in the early stages...Doyle,hunt,douglas,elliot,mcgeady,mcshane ,ireland,stokes. You cant say he isnt giving youth a chance.....
2) He learns from his mistakes. He corrected the Carsley mistake. He corrected the right wing Ireland mistake on saturday. It was a mistake to defend the team after San Marino and he corrected that this saturday by being more honest.
3) He is generally saying very little to the media which is sensible given that they rip everything to shreds...
4) He is developing a team that gives their best. I know in places they didnt - Cyprus,Holland, Chile.. But I disagree that they didnt try against Germany, Czech, San Marino or Wales. I can support a team that tries.
In terms of negative managerial style...
1) He has made some selection mistakes but in my opinion you can atleast see why he does it at some times.... like Finnan is better than O'Shea so his position at right is sacrificed to suit O'Shea... Carsley was left out for a younger player (he likes youth). The media thing was defensive after San Marino because he'll have thought the win was the win... But he has corrected these things.............
2) He isnt charismatic as a speaker............SO WHAT EXACTLY??
3) He's had some bad results. This is his biggest negative.... Chile, Holland, Cyprus and San Marino were bad........
But I want him to recover, so I'm trying to be positive....it really knocks things back to have to change a manager.... I'd rather he came through this.
Comparing him to Jack and Alex Ferguson seems daft, but I'm talking about early in their jobs. Jack was ridiculed back then. And Ferguson would have had the look of a walking disaster at that moment when he was about to be sacked. They came through those moments and I hope Stan does.
I wish he would turn a corner and just keep walking to the next corner and the next one after that and not stop until he's back in Walsall where he belongs
Last edited by Block G Raptor; 27/03/2007 at 9:47 AM.
i don't either but i'm sure the team do! badly worded by me above.
on charisma, if he can't open his mouth without him sounding like a moron when talking to the media does anyone really think he can talk in the dressing room without the players having a little giggle at his expense. name any good manager and i would safely think that they showed a bit of savvy when talking to the media. it is about general communication ability - stan don't got it
Do you not think the fact that Charlton and Ferguson had previously shown themselves to be good managers maybe have something to do with them getting a little bit more time to turn it around.
And your explaining of the O'Shea/Finnan thing makes you sound like Stan. Finnan plays right-back for his club and is one of the best right back in the English Premiership. O'Shea has played over 100 times for Man United at left back, but sure that Ferguson fella wouldn't know what he's doing would he.
The poor guy lacks in my opinion the three things that make a good manager.
- Charisma
- Conviction
- Communication
Clough had all three in buckets, Mourinho, Ferguson Wenger have it in their own unique styles.
The most knowledgable player in the world (and Stan has a lot of miles under his belt as a player) will never have succeed in management if they are lacking in these basic skills.
His tone and demeanour carry no authority. If he cant communicate with the media, how does he communicate and motivate the players. Make no mistake about it, our players need to be motivated. Its obvious Croke Park and the jersey isnt enough.
I take no pleasure in watching him fail in such a public humiliation. It reminds me of the Christians being fed to the lions. Who would have turned down the oppurtunity to become manager of his country?
Hes in a corner now and hes trying to fight back but its pitiful. I honestly dont think that the media have been grossly unfair and has been created by Stan himself. As a lifelong servant of Ireland Id like to say thanks for the memories Stan but if you could do one more thing for your country - be honest.
Who is this guy, Trapper Tony?
Just picked out a few managers roles on monster, the competencies are repeating themselves.
To be a manager you...
...are responsible for the success of your team/dept/organisation
...are accountable for the failings of your team/dept/organisation
...must drive the team/dept forward and lead by example
...must identify shortcomings and rectify
To be a manager you must have...
...excellent communications and interpersonal skills
...demonstrated leadership and organisational skills
...a proven track record in previous managerial role(s)
...ability to encourage and motivate staff and maintain high morale
Resign, now!
sums it up Dawn Run
O'Shea hasn't played anytihng like 100 games at left full for united.O'Shea has played over 100 times for Man United at left back, but sure that Ferguson fella wouldn't know what he's doing would he.
You're opinions are your own... I'm just highlighting a change in stans attitude that I think is better than it was.
He's an easy target. Repeatedely highlighting his limits as a manager achieves what exactly?? Someone go off and print the criteria for a supporter there while your at it.
Cheering on the opposition? What's that sh!t about? Sitting at your keyboards spouting the gospel according to Dion Fanning. Too many sheep on this board!
Stan should never have got the job. That is clear. The rest of you are just tools of the tabloids and are playing firmly into the hand of those in the FAI that are playing the deflection game at the minute.
touchéhis only form of communication with the supporters is through the media. 30 seconds! is that all we are worth
An ignorant move by a desperate man. Cascarino pointed out he's trying to create some siege mentality that just never really existed. People want to back him but he just makes it so hard. He has a smug side to him that makes you just want to get sick
Thats the awful thing. I loved Stan as a player, always available, always gave 100%, played several positions to an excellent standard and was a WC captain. You wanted him to succeed but now I just want him to go before he does anymore damage to the team and his own reputation as a servant to Ireland. I'm not enjoying this one bit but I'm also not going to bury my head in the sand regarding his potential as a manager because there isn't any.
Craig -it was you who dragged up a Ferguson and Charlton comparison.
I merely took you to the cleaners on it.
...which gives him a convenient fig leaf for when it all goes tits up. meanwhile -others who probably deserve a call up but aren't fresh faces are left back at their clubs.1) He has brought a lot of young players in in the early stages...Doyle,hunt,douglas,elliot,mcgeady,mcshane ,ireland,stokes. You cant say he isnt giving youth a chance.....
.
If the guy learned from his mistakes there wouldn't have been a Cyprus, and if he learned from Cyprus then there wouldn't have been a San Marino. he learns jacksh1t.1)
2) He learns from his mistakes. He corrected the Carsley mistake. He corrected the right wing Ireland mistake on saturday. It was a mistake to defend the team after San Marino and he corrected that this saturday by being more honest..
He had to be dragged kicking and screaming on the Carsley issue.
As it happens I agree with keeping a healthy distance from the media, the print media in particular and the big letters print media especially. Do I think Stan is doing it strategically or spitefully (the latter being meat and potatoes to them)?!?! What do the rest of ye reckon?3) He is generally saying very little to the media which is sensible given that they rip everything to shreds....
I believe the team is trying, they're trying to play football while weighted down with a manager who evidently cannot manage and does not manage.4) He is developing a team that gives their best. I know in places they didnt - Cyprus,Holland, Chile.. But I disagree that they didnt try against Germany, Czech, San Marino or Wales. I can support a team that tries.
" I wish to God that someone would be able to block out the voices in my head for five minutes, the voices that scream, over and over again: "Why do they come to me to die?"
A supporter is not a job with set criteria of which your supposed to succeed in. A supporter does not get paid to watch this stuff, a supporter pays. As such a supporter is entitled to express his opinion of the product he's paid for.
If me seriously doubting Stans ability as a national coach means I'm a sheep then so be it. But going on what I've seen over the last 13 months or so I think I'm well within my rights to say I'm not happy with a kicking by Holland, a kicking by Cyprus, a defeat by Chile, a dreadful last minute victory over the mighty San Marino, and a poor and disjointed 1-0 win over a dreadful Wales side. The only positive was the Czech game which was not a good footballing performance but just gutsy, and the Czechs were clearly happy to come away with a point.
I don't think it's so much Stan turning a corner as maybe a few players getting together on the side and saying "Jaysus lads, the Gaffer hasn't a clue, we're goin to have to work out our own tactics."
A bit like when you were playing Under 12s Gaelic and the manager never bothered to turn up and you had to get one of your supporters to pick the team and he said "ah, just play where yiz usually play".
Somethin like that.
Herd-ild orr Pressss!
There's a fine line between criticism and insults, and the tone of the posts are in keeping with the papers almost to within the day of print.. That's why they're sheep.
Some people have even taken to turning on Mick Burn FFS as if he's the root cause. They turn on Stan for doing the very thing they turned on Brian Kerr for not doing.
I also seriously doubt the mans ability as a coach. I just don't see the point of post after post of his limits at this stage. Spare me the Walsall tea boy shpeel or the sarcastic Gaffer
I'm seeing a change is all.... And a win+performance tomorrow will turn this whole thing round.
Does ANYONE back him?
I don't agree and you insinuating that most people on here are sheep and can't think for themselves which is wrong and ironically enough a personal insult.There's a fine line between criticism and insults, and the tone of the posts are in keeping with the papers almost to within the day of print.. That's why they're sheep.
Some people have even taken to turning on Mick Burn FFS as if he's the root cause. They turn on Stan for doing the very thing they turned on Brian Kerr for not doing.
I also seriously doubt the mans ability as a coach. I just don't see the point of post after post of his limits at this stage. Spare me the Walsall tea boy shpeel or the sarcastic Gaffer
I'm seeing a change is all.... And a win+performance tomorrow will turn this whole thing round.
The press are merely reflecting our views. You'll always get a few that lash out the personal insults but thats life and they're usually a minority. But like I said plenty of times most of the reporting from the decent papers has been fair and I haven't seen a lot of personal abuse in here just a lot of people disillusioned with what they're seeing and rightly so.
I don't really understand what you want, is it for people to have gotten over San Marino, Wales and Cyprus and to now be stupidly positive about Stan despite the evidence? Most people have convictions and stick by them.
I should have said the tone of SOME of the posts...
I don't think most people here are sheep. But there's no escaping the fact that there are a number that are. The clowns having a pop at Mick Byrne is an example...
Those around stan, within the FAI and even former players and colleagues reckon Irish fans expectations are too high and that we haven't got the squad we've had in decades past. I think it's a huge disservice to the irish fan. We're painfully aware we have'nt got the players we've had in the past but the question we're asking now is the same one we asked when stan was appointed last year "Is a man with no experience the right man to get the best out of a limited bunch of players?".
Now as things stand there's an astute level of deflection going on within the FAI citing poor feeling amongst the supporters down to media manipulation. Now baring this in mind take a look at the majority of posts over the last two or three weeks here and get back to me and tell me some of them don't give credence to what John Delaney, Kevin Moran, Ronnie Whelan has said about Irish fans.
I think they do. The whole debate has gone from the fact that Stan should never have been appointed in the first place to picking away at the man, repeatedly, post after post after post, insults and so on. All very English tabloid.
Mick Byrne is a tool, people are entitled to have a go at him.
Have you ever gone to him with an injury? He is useless.
What other physio in world football is as well known as him? They normally just sit there and do thier job
The one or two you know the name of are brilliant at what they do and not just some sort of publicity seeking clown
Champions 2010
Champions 2011
Dick Brush 1 Sligo 0
Bohs are going bust.
Yeh course they do, like I said there'll always be a minority and likewise there's one or two (definitely one) that think Stan can turn all this around. Most of us are still entitled to post what we feel and that what we feel happens to be reflected in the press is probably because that's the way things are. I'm not going to be stupidly positive for the sake of it though and if the press have the same sentiments its hardly my fault.
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