Next Suporters' Meeting?

[gombean]

So, when's the next supporters' meeting going to be?

[gombean]

Now that all the distracting crap is out of the way, can we get on with the serious job of building up and organising the Supporters' Club!

At the last meeting, Ger Finnin said there would be a place for a supporters' rep on the board of the new club, but that person would have to be properly elected and be truly representive of supporters.

In other words, we really should have a reasonably sized organisation with a proper structure, constitution/rule book and open democratic elections.

We're a long way from that at the moment.
I would view the committee of volunteers that put themselves forward at the last meeting as a steering committee (to get things up and running), and that a proper AGM should be held as soon as it is feasible. This AGM should then elect a proper committee and a delegate to the club board.

If we want to buy shares in the new club, we may have to set up a co-op.
This would require a slightly higher level of organisation, and would bring with it more legal obligations regarding openness and accountability.

[4tothefloor]

.
We're a long way from that at the moment.
I would view the committee of volunteers that put themselves forward at the last meeting as a steering committee (to get things up and running), and that a proper AGM should be held as soon as it is feasible. This AGM should then elect a proper committee and a delegate to the club board.

Another AGM, for what? Do you think more will turn out for the next meeting? This was the second supporters meeting to take place in recent weeks. The first one was very poorly attended at the Corner Flag Bar. The last one, the attendance was ok, lots of notable absentees though. The way I see it, those who were interested were present the last night. And that included a man who drove all the way from Kerry and a few from West Limerick.....As far as I'm aware, the committee of volunteers are organising themselves and will form the proper committee this year. Anyone who wants in can still sit on the committee, but they don't need a meeting to volunteer themselves. The selection of the club rep is something that will have to be discussed, yes, as will fundraising etc.

[jebus]

The selection of the club rep is something that will have to be discussed, yes, as will fundraising etc.

Add someone to help me out with designing the new fanzine too. I've got the time and want to do it, but I need someone with more of a knowledge of Microsoft Office programs etc. than I do to give me a hand to get it up and running. Will need contributors throughout the season too, but initially if I could get a basic format for it together so I can work on it at home it would be great. Anyone with any knowledge fo this stuff could you pm me? cheers

[LFC in Exile]

Another AGM, for what? Do you think more will turn out for the next meeting? This was the second supporters meeting to take place in recent weeks. The first one was very poorly attended at the Corner Flag Bar. The last one, the attendance was ok, lots of notable absentees though. The way I see it, those who were interested were present the last night. And that included a man who drove all the way from Kerry and a few from West Limerick.....As far as I'm aware, the committee of volunteers are organising themselves and will form the proper committee this year. Anyone who wants in can still sit on the committee, but they don't need a meeting to volunteer themselves. The selection of the club rep is something that will have to be discussed, yes, as will fundraising etc.

I agree. The committee appointed at the last meeting are the committee IMO. That said Gombean is correct when he states that the club needs a constitution and proper structure. This could be put in place this year by the current committee with assistance. When the club was set up a few years ago by Gael, JohnD, SLK etc we did write a constitution which could be redrafted or present to the membership to agree. But the membership can only agree these things at meetings. And if peopel don't show for meetings they lose their voice on these issues. I speak as someone who was not at the last meeting.

[gombean]

Well, how seriously do you want to take this, lads?

The turnout at the last meeting was well below the potential of the Supporters' Club.
Some people I know decided going out on the p**s was more important that night because "there's nothing we can do until the licence is sorted", etc.
But others were stubborn in their opinion that the people running the Supporters' Club were a bunch of messers/idiots, and that going to any meeting run by them would be a waste of time.

All-in-all, I think the Supporters' Club needs to get its act together, and be seen to get its act together. And what goes on on this forum counts for little in the real world!

If the supporters are to buy shares in the club (something I think should be seriously considered), then we have to take the organisation of the Supporters' Club seriously. To have a voting seat on the board we would need to hold 100 shares, which would cost €25,000. This is not all that huge a sum of money, but it would still take a certain degree of organisation to raise it.

So, I think we need to start to build up the membership of the club and sort out some immediate targets (like the fanzine, our first away trip, etc).
We should be starting the membership drive BEFORE the season starts.
I'm not sure if the committee that volunteered itself at the last meeting has actually met yet.

[gael353]

Well, how seriously do you want to take this, lads?

The turnout at the last meeting was well below the potential of the Supporters' Club.
Some people I know decided going out on the p**s was more important that night because "there's nothing we can do until the licence is sorted", etc.
But others were stubborn in their opinion that the people running the Supporters' Club were a bunch of messers/idiots, and that going to any meeting run by them would be a waste of time.

All-in-all, I think the Supporters' Club needs to get its act together, and be seen to get its act together. And what goes on on this forum counts for little in the real world!

If the supporters are to buy shares in the club (something I think should be seriously considered), then we have to take the organisation of the Supporters' Club seriously. To have a voting seat on the board we would need to hold 100 shares, which would cost €25,000. This is not all that huge a sum of money, but it would still take a certain degree of organisation to raise it.

So, I think we need to start to build up the membership of the club and sort out some immediate targets (like the fanzine, our first away trip, etc).
We should be starting the membership drive BEFORE the season starts.

I'm not sure if the committee that volunteered itself at the last meeting has actually met yet.

I agree with what you say but also dont belittle what has been acheived by previous versions of the SC and the fact that a committee has now been elected and will start their work this week. Make sure your envolved when its up and going and rem owning seats on a board is one thing but everyday moneys to run the club will have to be raised as well so not all monies raised will go to buying shares (as most are already bought up). some of the stuff the club is doing will tie into what the SC is doing and whether the committee has met up or not is irrelivent at this point as the positions have yet to be agreed on but its nearly there.

[LFC in Exile]

The turnout at the last meeting was well below the potential of the Supporters' Club.
Some people I know decided going out on the p**s was more important that night because "there's nothing we can do until the licence is sorted", etc.
But others were stubborn in their opinion that the people running the Supporters' Club were a bunch of messers/idiots, and that going to any meeting run by them would be a waste of time.

All-in-all, I think the Supporters' Club needs to get its act together, and be seen to get its act together. And what goes on on this forum counts for little in the real world!

If the supporters are to buy shares in the club (something I think should be seriously considered), then we have to take the organisation of the Supporters' Club seriously. To have a voting seat on the board we would need to hold 100 shares, which would cost €25,000. This is not all that huge a sum of money, but it would still take a certain degree of organisation to raise it.

I think that is a really unfair attack on the individuals who have sat on the board of the SC in the past and who are putting themselves forward for the committee this year (I am in neither of those groups). Are you, or your friends who'd rather go on the p1ss, the ones to decide who are acceptable and who are not to sit on the committee? I think the ones that actaully go to meetings should be reepresented and nobody believes this forum is the extent of the L37 support.

I 100% agree that this years SC need to get organised (which is not just a job of the committee) and should organise away trips, fundraising, fanzines etc. Previously I agreed we need a constitution and an agreed structure. I think though that the SC should not be about raising 25k for a seat on the board - though this is something that can be debated at SC meetings. You say that 'some people' think that the SC are messers and idiots and the next breath is about people investing 25k in it? Lets build back the credibility you seem to think we've lost first of all.

By the way, this is the first time I have heard anything about the SC needing to buy representation on the L37 board. My understanding was that the SC would be respresented - but I heard nothing about investing to get that representation. Perhaps oldkeeper can clarify this. I do remember that the board of Limerick FC were offering places on the board for 25k alright.

IMO the current SC committee is capable of establishing a credible SC once again after last season's lull. IMO this means doing the regular SC activities well so that larger projects can be undertaken in subsequent years. Trying to raise 25k will take a lot of effort and other activities will suffer.

[4tothefloor]

By the way, this is the first time I have heard anything about the SC needing to buy representation on the L37 board. My understanding was that the SC would be respresented - but I heard nothing about investing to get that representation. Perhaps oldkeeper can clarify this. I do remember that the board of Limerick FC were offering places on the board for 25k alright.

IMO the current SC committee is capable of establishing a credible SC once again after last season's lull. IMO this means doing the regular SC activities well so that larger projects can be undertaken in subsequent years. Trying to raise 25k will take a lot of effort and other activities will suffer.

Just to answer your question LFC, the SC will have a non-voting rep on the board no matter what. Basically a voice and a presence, but no vote on issues.

Raising the 25k was mentioned at the last meeting as one of the future goals of the SC, as we got the impression that not all of the 25k blocks of shares have been bought up yet. I have no idea whether all shares have been issued or not, so can't really comment. It should certainly be considered as a goal to raise the 25k even if they are, so that the funds would be there to earn a seat and a vote on the board should the opportunity arise, i.e. proper representation. But that's easier said than done. There's a hell of a lot of fundraising and work in raising that amount of money, let alone money for the general running of the SC and contributions to the football club etc. We'd certainly need a bigger committee than we currently have. It's all grand saying the SC should get their act together, but the fact is we need bodies and people to put themselves forward. In other words stop talking, start actually going to the meetings, and get involved. The SC, or any SC for that matter, will not work or achieve major goals like the above if all the work is left to a few people while the rest just talk and whinge. So we expect to see those who are calling for SC meetings on here to not only turn up, but to also volunteer as well

Regarding the previous SC, last year was a disaster apart from one poster on here who worked despite of the SC. The previous seasons SC's were good, well run and it's a pity that some of them are not on board this year, even if it was just to sit on the general committee.

[gombean]

I'm sorry if I hurt anyone's feelings, but there are cynics out there who hold the opinions I relayed in one of my earlier posts. I have never been involved with the SC before, but want to now. I see great potential for L37 and for the SC.
But I think something that needs to be sorted out is what is the role of the SC in the new club.

I believe the best thing the SC can do for L37 is build up its membership. A strong SC is vital in the building up of a large and consistent attendance at matches. This would bring increased gate receipts to the club, but probably of longer term greater significance to the business side of the club, it would strengthen its hand in its dealings with potential sponsors (for jersey, shorts, players, pitch hoardings, match, match ball, match programme...). And this does not just apply to home matches: strong travelling support would definitely impress potential jersey/shorts/socks sponsors (anywhere a logo can fit, I suppose).

If the SC is to help out in the financing of L37, buying some shares would be an obvious way to help. Then there is the possibility of taking up an advertising spot in the match programme and/or around the pitch, sponsoring a player (I believe this was done before), sponsoring a match ball or whatever. From a budgeting point of view, this would suit the club best as it would fit in to their financial planning. Also, it would mean the SC would receive its due credit for its fundraising. (This was one of the problems with some of the cynical/demoralised people I was trying to get to attend the last SC meeting. They felt that some previous donations of money towards the running of the club were taken for granted, and that the SC's enthusiasm for the team had been taken advantage of. I tend to agree with this point, but I think the structure of L37 largely safeguards against this possibility. These particular people thought the SC was naive in these dealings, but I hope everyone can learn from the past, from what was done right as well as what might have been done wrong.)

But all this and more will remain just the fantasies of those who are putting ideas forward unless we can build up the membership of the SC.
The season starts in just 4-and-a-half weeks (if the court case hasn't knocked it off schedule -- correct me if I'm wrong). I think the SC needs to go on a membership drive before our first match. Gael353 said it before (and he's absolutely right), that we should set up a stall at the Milk Market and maybe some other places (eg. Cruises Street, shopping centres, junior matches ).

So, I think the committee should meet asap, go through all this sort of stuff, set some targets, prioritise the tasks, organise the work and then get back to the general membership.
I believe gael353 has all the committee contact details from the last meeting, so I suppose it's up to you to call the meeting. BTW, I don't think it's necessary at this point to designate particular roles to individual committee members (the committee should take general collective responsibility for what it does or does not do), except for the specific responsibility of convening meetings (committee and general).

[LFC in Exile]

Gombean's post makes 100% sense. In fact his post brings to mind the original reasons and arguments for the SC set up when we were in the Pike. All of those ideas you set out are what a SC should be about - and I think after last year's debacle the SC should try to get these done.

I have reservations about the 25k and voting rights on the board - both from the perspective of SC independence and the effort that goes in to raising that sort of cash. That's just my opinion and these are issues to be decided by the club itself of course.

[Lim till i die]

I have reservations about the 25k and voting rights on the board - both from the perspective of SC independence and the effort that goes in to raising that sort of cash. That's just my opinion and these are issues to be decided by the club itself of course.

Exactly what the man said

I'd much rather have a strong well organised SC with money in the bank than a vote on the board. 25k for one vote lads. On a board of ten it's useless

[4tothefloor]

So, I think the committee should meet asap, go through all this sort of stuff, set some targets, prioritise the tasks, organise the work and then get back to the general membership.

So do you honestly think that a committee of 6/7 people, all holding their own positions as well, can carry out ALL this work? Who is going to carry the workload? I've said it already, if those ambitions are to be realised we need a bigger committee. I'll give you a small example - running the stalls in town/shopping centres/junior matches. Not everyone can volunteer to do this as some of us have jobs to do, like I run my own business for example. And I'm not the only one on the committee tied down with work. It's all well saying it, but unless we have bodies who are available to actually do this, it's just talk.

I'd much rather have a strong well organised SC with money in the bank than a vote on the board. 25k for one vote lads. On a board of ten it's useless

Well before we do anything we need the well organised SC. We've a bit to go before we achieve that yet, and as has already been mentioned, we need a club constitution put in place.

Regarding the 25k, it's not just a vote, it's a presence on the board and the ability to influence. As opposed to having to stand by helplessly as decisions are made that we are not happy about and can't influence. Anyway, that's a discussion for another meeting, we're a long way from 25k at the moment!

[Lim till i die]

Well before we do anything we need the well organised SC. We've a bit to go before we achieve that yet, and as has already been mentioned, we need a club constitution put in place.

Regarding the 25k, it's not just a vote, it's a presence on the board and the ability to influence. As opposed to having to stand by helplessly as decisions are made that we are not happy about and can't influence. Anyway, that's a discussion for another meeting, we're a long way from 25k at the moment!

25k will buy us exactly half the influence of the schoolboys

Agree with the points about organising the SC it's just as is usual with comittees you'll always find far more people to moan and bitch then you ever will to lend a hand

[gombean]

Originally Posted by gombean
So, I think the committee should meet asap, go through all this sort of stuff, set some targets, prioritise the tasks, organise the work and then get back to the general membership.

So do you honestly think that a committee of 6/7 people, all holding their own positions as well, can carry out ALL this work? Who is going to carry the workload? I've said it already, if those ambitions are to be realised we need a bigger committee. I'll give you a small example - running the stalls in town/shopping centres/junior matches. Not everyone can volunteer to do this as some of us have jobs to do, like I run my own business for example. And I'm not the only one on the committee tied down with work. It's all well saying it, but unless we have bodies who are available to actually do this, it's just talk.

Precisely!
The main function of the committee is to organise the work. This is not necessarily the same as doing it (I know, the theory is all well and good, but what about the reality!). The people with the skills, experience and ideas should be on the committee, even if they can't commit to implementing the ideas (this is where collective responsibility is supposed to come in). And people who want to help out should be involved, even if they don't want to commit to being on the committee.

Really, we need to build an atmosphere where people want to get involved in the work of the SC. Then the job of the committee (and the SC as a whole) gets easier: more hands make the work lighter, etc...

[4tothefloor]

Precisely!
The main function of the committee is to organise the work. This is not necessarily the same as doing it (I know, the theory is all well and good, but what about the reality!). The people with the skills, experience and ideas should be on the committee, even if they can't commit to implementing the ideas (this is where collective responsibility is supposed to come in). And people who want to help out should be involved, even if they don't want to commit to being on the committee.

Really, we need to build an atmosphere where people want to get involved in the work of the SC. Then the job of the committee (and the SC as a whole) gets easier: more hands make the work lighter, etc...

If only it was that easy....love your enthusiasm though

[A face]

Precisely!
The main function of the committee is to organise the work. This is not necessarily the same as doing it (I know, the theory is all well and good, but what about the reality!). The people with the skills, experience and ideas should be on the committee, even if they can't commit to implementing the ideas (this is where collective responsibility is supposed to come in). And people who want to help out should be involved, even if they don't want to commit to being on the committee.

I disagree with some of that gombean, the chairman should organise the work and people in the other positions should carry out their specific role. The people on the committee should be very active imo. You can always put a sub committee together if there is something out of the norm. And you can elect people into shadow positions i.e. chairman and vice chairman, secretary and shadow secretary, PRO and shadow PRO. If people are tied for time and wont always make a meeting then shadow positions are a great idea because there is someone there to fill in.

But just back to your point, the chairman should organise and access, everyone else should be 'working round the clock'

[gombean]

I disagree with some of that gombean, the chairman should organise the work and people in the other positions should carry out their specific role. The people on the committee should be very active imo. You can always put a sub committee together if there is something out of the norm. And you can elect people into shadow positions i.e. chairman and vice chairman, secretary and shadow secretary, PRO and shadow PRO. If people are tied for time and wont always make a meeting then shadow positions are a great idea because there is someone there to fill in.

But just back to your point, the chairman should organise and access, everyone else should be 'working round the clock'

The structure you outline is similar to what would be used in a private company, where the owner or managing director gives out the orders and everyone else does what they're told. IMO, that's no way to run a Supporters' Club!

A Supporters' Club is just a group of people who have come together for one common purpose: to enhance their mutual enjoyment of their team's football. All members are equal, the only differences being the skills, experience and amount of free time different people have.
So, I think a more democratic, accountable and open structure would be more appropriate. After all, there are no paid positions involved. Joining a Supporters' Club is not the same as buying a service from some commercial company.

[A face]

The structure you outline is similar to what would be used in a private company, where the owner or managing director gives out the orders and everyone else does what they're told. IMO, that's no way to run a Supporters' Club!

A Supporters' Club is just a group of people who have come together for one common purpose: to enhance their mutual enjoyment of their team's football. All members are equal, the only differences being the skills, experience and amount of free time different people have.
So, I think a more democratic, accountable and open structure would be more appropriate. After all, there are no paid positions involved. Joining a Supporters' Club is not the same as buying a service from some commercial company.

Just to let you know, CCOSC is run that way and its been a very successful committee. This is compared to the last committee which didn't work quite so well without the shadow positions (not for the lack of trying i might add). All positions will all be elected at the AGM next Friday, including the shadow positions.

If there was one failing in this years committee, then it was the ordinary committee members weren't active enough (there were five) if that had been the case then there would have been twelve active members all working together.

The structure you outline is similar to what would be used in a private company, where the owner or managing director gives out the orders and everyone else does what they're told. IMO, that's no way to run a Supporters' Club!

This was most certainly not the case this year. All members are given equal platform to voice their opinion, suggest ideas, carry out activities, whatever. It was be no means down to one person. It was fully democratic, accountable and most definitely was an open structure.