Shels could lose European place

**Poor Student** · 09/01/2007, 10:55 AM

Bert Kassies says this:
A licence is obligatory for clubs qualifying for UEFA club competitions in the 2004/05 season. A club which has qualified on the basis of sporting criteria but is not allowed to enter the competition because it has not obtained a licence, will be replaced by a club nominated by the national association on the basis of the rankings in the top domestic league championship (or by the runners-up of the domestic cup competition if the cup winners need to be replaced).

There's two precedents I can think of where clubs qualified on sporting criteria missed out on Europe, Slovenia 2003/04 season where 6th placed Primorje got into the UEFA and 7th placed Domzale got into the UEFA (this in a 12 team league) as only the champions Gorica and cup winners Maribor (3rd place) were able to secure a licence. I know Olimpija failed on the basis of money owed to players.

In 2004/05 no Kazakhstan club got a licence so none got into Europe.

**fbtn** · 09/01/2007, 11:29 AM

From the BBC Website
Shelbourne's Euro place in danger

Shelbourne's place in next season's Champions League is reported to be under threat because of the Dublin club's financial problems.

If the Shels lose the Uefa licence required to compete in Europe, their place could go to Derry City who were runners-up in the Eircom League.

In December Shelbourne's manager Pat Fenlon quit and moved to Derry City.

It is believed some Shelbourne players want to take the club to a tribunal in an attempt to become free agents.

Shelbourne pipped Derry to the Premier Division title on goal difference to clinch the place in the Champions League.

But the Tolka Park club have run up huge debts and could be forced revert to a part-time set-up.

By finishing runners-up, Derry City qualified for the Uefa Cup.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...sh/6242023.stm

**Dodge** · 09/01/2007, 11:56 AM

Derry gor europe by winning the cup, which ranks higher than runners up. Stoopid BBC

**Tazskool** · 09/01/2007, 12:27 PM

BBC Sport:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/foot...sh/6242023.stm
-----------

Shelbourne's place in next season's Champions League is reported to be under threat because of the Dublin club's financial problems.
If the Shels lose the Uefa licence required to compete in Europe, their place could go to Derry City who were runners-up in the Eircom League.

In December Shelbourne's manager Pat Fenlon quit and moved to Derry City.

It is believed some Shelbourne players want to take the club to a tribunal in an attempt to become free agents.

Shelbourne pipped Derry to the Premier Division title on goal difference to clinch the place in the Champions League.

But the Tolka Park club have run up huge debts and could be forced revert to a part-time set-up.

By finishing runners-up, Derry City qualified for the Uefa Cup
----------

**pineapple stu** · 09/01/2007, 12:31 PM

It's just two posts above you!!

**Tazskool** · 09/01/2007, 12:34 PM

lol.. ddint see it... blind as a bat and twice as stupid today ...sorry all..
(I had an "English" moment)

**John83** · 12/01/2007, 11:16 AM

From the BBC.

I haven't been following the Shels developments closely, so I'm sorry if this is already known. If that's the case, the mods can deal with this.

Does anyone know the criteria under which the licence is awarded? (I assume this is different to the FAI's UEFA licencing!) If Shels were to lose the European spot, it would cost them not only money, but the draw that their CL spot might have for some new players.

**centre mid** · 12/01/2007, 12:26 PM

isnt it up to the FA of each country to award the european spots, i remember were liverpool won the CL but only came 5th in the league that the english FA could have awarded them the place instead of everton

it seems plausable that the FAI could award the CL place to Derry but on what would this decision be based

**John83** · 12/01/2007, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by centre mid

it seems plausable that the FAI could award the CL place to Derry but on what would this decision be based

On the grounds that Shelbourne would not be allowed to take it up by UEFA.

**centre mid** · 12/01/2007, 12:38 PM

Fair enough

I didnt bother to read the link

**pineapple stu** · 12/01/2007, 12:57 PM

Already covered here.

**BohsPartisan** · 12/01/2007, 12:58 PM

Originally Posted by centre mid

isnt it up to the FA of each country to award the european spots, i remember were liverpool won the CL but only came 5th in the league that the english FA could have awarded them the place instead of everton

They couldn't have because it contradicted their own rules and Everton threatened a lawsuit over it. After that they changed the rules so the following year had Spurs finished 4th and Arsenal won the CL, Arsenal would have taken the place.
In Shels case however its a matter of licencing. If they don't pass the criteria for a UEFA licence they can't play in UEFA competitions.

**centre mid** · 12/01/2007, 1:12 PM

Yes but these competitions are invitational eg Uefa invite the English FA to submit 4 teams to the Cl, Its up to the FA to decide who goes forward, now 99 times out 100 its you league position that decides that which is fine, but i remeber one year in spain the Spanish FA promoted a team to the CL that failed to make it on league position

**pineapple stu** · 12/01/2007, 1:31 PM

Real Madrid, I think that was, who won the European Cup and finished outside the top four. The Spanish FA kicked Zaragoza out of the competition to fit Madrid. The English FA refused to kick Everton out, and so UEFA were pressurised into changing their own rules.

None of this has any bearing on the Shels case though, as in all cases, the clubs concerned had their UEFA licence.

**BohsPartisan** · 12/01/2007, 1:37 PM

Originally Posted by centre mid

Yes but these competitions are invitational eg Uefa invite the English FA to submit 4 teams to the Cl,

I know but the FA's own rules stated it had to be the top four. Since the Everton/Liverpool thing they have changed the rule.

**centre mid** · 12/01/2007, 1:51 PM

BP
were getting off track here i used england as an example, the point being that its the Countrys FA that make the rules

**higgins** · 12/01/2007, 1:57 PM

It's not the country FA that make the rules.

This has nothing to do with the FAI having the power to make a decision based on how Shels will get on in that competition.

The issue is that Shels will fail the licence unless they pay all backdated wages and tax by the deadline for a UEFA licence. If they fail then the place gets awarded elsewhere.

**John83** · 12/01/2007, 2:46 PM

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Already covered here.

Cheers. Could a mod please merge the threads? (Preferably with my more descriptive title!)

garyderry · 12/01/2007, 3:19 PM

Originally Posted by higgins

It's not the country FA that make the rules.

This has nothing to do with the FAI having the power to make a decision based on how Shels will get on in that competition.

The issue is that Shels will fail the licence unless they pay all backdated wages and tax by the deadline for a UEFA licence. If they fail then the place gets awarded elsewhere.

but if players win the right to leave becasue there contracts have been broken, then you cannot achieve a licience this season no matter what amount you have in a months time,

Probably a big reason why oily will fight tooth and nail to keep the players long enough to sell them at nomimal values, all it will take is one player winning his case