Should I stay or should i go?

**FarBeag** · 01/12/2006, 11:25 PM

I came to the UK in 1990 with the intention at the time of returning to Ireland within three years. Employment in Ireland at the time was non existent unless of course you knew some high up suit at the top. Priest, Bishop TD, ya know what I mean.Unfortunatly this was not the case for myself and many others. To be honest, although I did not know what I was getting my-self into, for the first ten years it was the best time of my life. Everywhere you went there were Irish (bearing in mind at then time it was not fashionable to be a paddy) for obvious reasons, but the craic was great.Over that years since the rise of the Celtic Tiger more and more Irish people have left to go back home.
Now, no matter where you go in London there are very few places you hear an Irish accent.It appears like everyone Irish has left England.

My Point. I would love to go back home tomorrow but I would love to know how many heads are in the same situation as me fein. I am getting more homesick by the day but the decisions are out of my hands at present.

(1) Even though I am a Government employee and in a managerial position. I can come and go when I like, no questions asked.(would I get this privilege in Ireland?)
(2) I am on a very good wage with a brill pension when I reach 60 years. May not get it at home.
(3) If I went back to Ireland I would have to start at ground level again and at 36 I guess this is not an option.
(4) I can go to any football game I want to because I have easy access...
(5) I have better access to any country I want to go to and at a much cheaper rate.
(6) My wife and children are born over here and am having difficulty convincing my kids they are Irish, which is heart breaking for me.
(7) Cars are cheaper to buy,insuarance and tax etc etc
(8) English people are actually human and most of then are nice down to earth people.

(9) Used to have unlimited access to foot.ie until my boss caught me, so now i have to look over my shoulder constanty.

I still miss home. What should I do? Should I stay or should I go? Any agony aunts out there?

**drinkfeckarse** · 02/12/2006, 10:46 AM

Stay where you are man. It's not as if you're a million miles away. I've been in Scotland for 11 years now and left for the same reasons as yourself. I get home a couple of times a year, used to be more but I've a wife and child now.

I love my country but I am happy where I am and there can always be a happy medium.

You have a well paid job so just take more trips over. Take your kids to different parts of Ireland and get them more interested in Irish history by bringing them to some famous landmarks. There's nothing wrong with your kids feeling English...they were born there. My little boy is nearly 2 and is onto his 2nd Irish jersey. When he gets older I plan to show him as much of Ireland as I can (partly for my own interest). He'll be encouraged to support both Scotland and Ireland but if he chooses to feel more Scottish than Irish then that's fine. He'll just always know that he is half Irish and that it is something to be proud of.

There are pro's and cons for every situation but if you are relatively settled then I don't see the reason to uproot your kids because you want them to feel more Irish. Then you'd only be doing it for selfish reasons.

If you look at the things you have rather than what you don't have you'll probably find there are a million reasons to stay.

**S�C** · 02/12/2006, 12:59 PM

All your points could equally apply to Ireland tbh.

Having worked in both the British Civil Service and the Irish one in similar positions must say the Irish is by far the better option. More pay, less rigid, flexi-time. Some of the other posters here could tell you a lot more about the pensions etc

**onenilgameover** · 02/12/2006, 1:22 PM

Personnally from reading what you've written.... I'd stay.

**paul_oshea** · 02/12/2006, 1:39 PM

farbeag, you are missing nothing back in galway, its only a hole!!! having said that there are other good places like roscommon. i am not in the same situation as you, though point 6 and 8 would effect my decision to move home. I don't think I would let myself get into that situation. i know of a guy who moved over and he was english his wife was irish, he being english found it very difficult to adapt to irish life, but he said for his kids alone they would stick it another 1.5 years, that was 2.5 years ago and he is loving it now, he said his kicks absoloutely love it and its no more beckham or schoslie, its keane and o'connell etc.....

its hard to uproot your family unlike when you are single, the council at home is a cushy number, salary wise is nearly equivalent like for like i.e. 1:1 but sterling is way stronger.

Remember though you are only an hour from home at the end of the day, and living in enfield makes it a lot easier to get to the airport as well, having said that the one thing that always gets me is how much older my parents get, and smaller i think, everytime i go back, at that age 6 months seem to be a long time.

**Closed Account 2** · 03/12/2006, 10:02 AM

Looking at all those points in your list, I'd say you seem happy enough, and I'd advise you to stay... you can always take a view on it again a year or so down the line.

**pete** · 03/12/2006, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by FarBeag

(1) Even though I am a Government employee and in a managerial position. I can come and go when I like, no questions asked.(would I get this privilege in Ireland?)

Are not government jobs in all countries like that?

**Magicme** · 04/12/2006, 8:55 AM

If I was you, I would discuss it more with your family and look at the jobs over here. Maybe even go as far as to apply for one here and see what fate deals you from there. Are your parents still alive and well and living in Ireland? That would defo be a factor for me. Its like I dream of moving to France but I cant for another 9 yrs at least so would suggest that you take your time over the decision, check out jobs, where you cold live, schools for the kids etc and then follow your heart.

**rebs23** · 04/12/2006, 9:21 AM

Came back several years ago and it was the best decision I ever made. It took me a few years back home to realise it was a good decision though. (lots of hankering after London nightlife) Must admit I loved living in London, had some really good friends over there etc, etc but home is home.

Fortunately though I made that decision in my late 20's before kids and marriage and came back at the right time as the so called Celtic Tiger was kicking off. I had the energy to do things relocating, career, further education, change jobs, etc. Not so sure if at 36 I would have that same energy level.

It seems to me you've already made the decision to stay but are having a bit of a crisis about settling down once and for all over there.

You probably know already but think about House price comparisons, location, coming to the end of an economic boom, jobs, traffic, poor public transport, relocating the kids to an Irish school, etc, etc

Best of luck whatever way it goes for you and not the easiest of decisions.

**Sideline** · 04/12/2006, 9:26 AM

I think the difference between the countries is getting less and less all the time. When it comes down to it its work and how far away from your family is the biggest factor. The way this country is going as regards immigration pub culture and community integration the bonds thayt linked people are disappearing rapidly.

**Macy** · 04/12/2006, 10:52 AM

The Irish Civil Service is running more and more open competitions as time goes on (as part of the modernisation of the pay deals), and the Public Service is already largely open and external competition. They're moving away from "entry grades", so you won't necessarily start from the bottom. County Councils very hard to get into without the right "connections". However, Semi States tend to have more flexibility when it comes to point of the relevant salary scale based on experience than the Civil Service.

On the pension, you'd still be on a defined benefit scheme. I'm not sure how it would work with you bringing a pension with you, but my initial reaction would be you'll get a similar deal. You'd have to really ask an expert in that though.

I've never experienced working in an office that you can come and go as you please, despite the impression given by some people I think the Irish Public Service is moving away from that (embargo on numbers, while an increase in work if nothing else). Most offer Flexi time which is a great.

Major downsides in my experience:
1) The lack of NHS/ the healthcare system. It really is a shock to the system to hand up �45 to see a doctor and then the same again for a script. The entire system is in a mess, and the solution appears to be privatisation. VHI isn't cheap either.
2) Cost of living. Even allowing for the exchange rate, a weekly shop is much, much cheaper in England.
3) Price of houses depending where you're thinking off and the budget you have. (Might be alright London to rural Ireland, but if Dublin Commuter belt then it's just crazy)
4) Travel - both by road or public transport. Well generally isn't much option but for road, on generally crap or inadequate roads at that too.

**Pauro 76** · 04/12/2006, 11:02 AM

personally id stay. Im finding myself enjoying England far more than i ever thought i would and if I moved back home, itd be a work decision rather than personal. Theres plenty of irish people in London, i dont feel as the population is decreasing. Id agree with Macy about the NHS. its great going to a doctor for free, rathen than pay the extornionate fare just for a check-up. The weather is far better here, as is the public transport (only just at times), and the cost of living even in London is manageable if you dont go too mad. Ireland is getting just too damn expensive for everything possible and i dont think ill ever move back to Dublin.

**pete** · 04/12/2006, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by Macy

On the pension, you'd still be on a defined benefit scheme. I'm not sure how it would work with you bringing a pension with you, but my initial reaction would be you'll get a similar deal. You'd have to really ask an expert in that though.

Transferring a contribution pension is a bit cleaner (i.e. you can see exactly what penson worth) but same principles apply to defined benefit. I believe you would have to get your current pension valued & then may have an option to transfer that to Ireland or leave it in the UK pension until it matures. AFAIK there is an Ireland-UK agreement on pension transfers so would be no tax to pay but I am no expert either.

**FarBeag** · 04/12/2006, 5:18 PM

Thanks for the advice lads and ladies. Have to agree that the NHS system is easies to access and much cheaper to use, but many of the Hospitals are closing and many are using second rate staff( more so nursing in particular) to what it used to. Facilities for Mental Health are atrocious although they are pumping a lot of cash into promoting each trust so as they will get credited with stars.

I love the fact that Stansted airport is only 20 minutes drive from me and getting flights cheaply to hundreds of destinations is a big plus.

Finding trustworthy child minders and baby sitters has always proved the most difficulty for us. My two sisters lived over here but went back home four years ago. Since then it�s been a case of luck. One thing about Ireland is that particularly in the country areas it�s much easier to bring up kids with easy access to family members. Good schools over here are also difficult to find and I have to travel 10 miles to the nearest catholic school which I had to apply four years prior to my kids getting in there. I also think the standard of education is much better.

My job is not easy but my manager is a top man. I guess if he left then my flexibility would change.

My main reasons to move back would be for the children�s sake and we predict that we may do so within the next two years but only time will tell.

**paul_oshea** · 04/12/2006, 6:35 PM

st ignatius isnt that far, but i spose if you are going for st anns i.e. a girl school its a bit further.

i agree wholeheartedly with your last two points, plus i honestly beleive there is less pressure and bullying in schools in the country at home than over here.

**jjppc** · 04/12/2006, 7:35 PM

[QUOTE=FarBeag;].It appears like everyone Irish has left England.
QUOTE]

Got to agree on that one. The school my kid attends has gone from two form intake to one recently. Also the London Standard had an article about different nationalities living in London the Irish born population has dramatically decreased over the last few years here, whereas most other nationalities had increased. Mind you it was still one of the largest overall.

**p�l-dcfc** · 05/12/2006, 4:05 AM

I've been in Manchester studying for the past 2 and a half years. Everytime I go back home I never want to come back here. Seriously can't wait to get out of this country once and for all.

Obviously I have nothing to tie me here being a student (except for my degree - which is so boring and I'll suited to me I consider quitting everyday). And in the summer I fell head over heels for a girl back home. A long distance relationship with someone I want to be with all the time is absolutely killing me.

Mind you, I've made a couple of lifelong friends here and will miss them, but not as much as I miss Derry. And the Brandywell, of course.