State of the Irish Game

**Gaz** · 05/06/2001, 4:23 PM

Look at Portugal - they're a country that has around the same population as Ireland, with just half our economy.

Why is it then that they are capable of developing the game in their country THAT much better than we can here?

Obviously, the FAI has to be held accountable, but does anyone ever see the LOI developing to the level that we'll have teams here that can rival the likes of Porto or Benfica? Until we have a solid grassroots system in place in the country - starting young, and running all the way through to a competitive professional league, we'll ALWAYS be nearly men. I'm sick of the old "we can't do it here because all the players feck off to England" excuse - isn't Spain or Italy tempting at all to the Portugese players?

Maybe the answer would be to scrap the LOI and start again. Start with a half dozen teams from around the country that the FAI can concentrate on building. Once those 6 teams are established professionally, then add one or two more teams the same way they do in America? Thoughts?

**Saint Ant** · 05/06/2001, 6:51 PM

We are probably one of the only countries in Europe in which the majority of soccer supporter's support a foreign team before their local teams.
Could you imagine going to a Portugal home game and seeing a large Barcelona or Juventus jersey being passed around the crowd?
The FAI do need to give the league (both divisions) some sort of exposure and stop taking whatever is being thrown at them when it comes to sponsorship.
Last season was the best example....teams had their best performance in Europe ever-Bohs,Shels and even UCD (unbeaten in their two games) and yet there was no big advertisement campaign, no official launch...no f**k all.
It's alright for us poor f**kers to drag people along to the game every week but it's annoying when the people who run the league do nothing but count down the seconds to the next ManUre or International game.

oooh I need a drink!!

EddieL · 06/06/2001, 10:58 PM

I reckon the various governments over the years should also be made accountable,year in and year out they're throwing money at the GAA.Not that I have anything against them,I love watching the hurling myself,but fair's fair.

**Gaz** · 13/06/2001, 7:51 PM

That's because, in all honesty, the FAI has never given us a product to really rival the quality of the Permiership. When you do look at Portugal, you have to think as well that the locals would be just as attracted to the Spanish league as we are to the Premiership.

Look at the MLS here in the States - only a few years old, but already making money (even though it isn't covered on any of the major TV stations), attracts crowds of 15,000 - 20,000 as well as some reasonably big name stars. Because the league started off knowing that it was going to have to invest in the league to start making money.

That's what the FAI have to do - they were able to more or less raise the cash for Stadium Ireland, or at least a fair wad of it. Plus they've gotten their payoff from the government for scrapping it, and joining up with the BertieBowl. The FAI NEEDS to start ploughing money into the Irish game. It's make or break time now.

**soccerhead** · 14/06/2001, 3:30 PM

The reason why the LOI hasnt progressed as much as we would have liked is because firstly:

1. Money, Lack of it, Wrongly dispersed.

Everybody nowadays simply define the reason for the poor state of The LOI with one word "money".

But what do they mean?

Look at Croke Park! prime example! the GAA have received Lotto money ang grants. The FAI have received grants and lotto money, but where does it go?

Theese Questions must be answered

**dahamsta** · 14/06/2001, 3:32 PM

*koff*

Back pocket.

*koff koff*

Anyone see the article in De Paper about corruption yesterday? Apparently Ireland is more corrupt than Chile. Who'd'a guessed it, huh?

adam

**soccerhead** · 14/06/2001, 4:23 PM

didnt see it. what paper?

**dahamsta** · 14/06/2001, 4:57 PM

De Paper. The Examiner, or the Irish Examiner, or whatever it's called this week...

adam

**sonofstan** · 13/04/2009, 5:55 PM

Originally Posted by Gaz

Look at Portugal - they're a country that has around the same population as Ireland, with just half our economy.

Portugal's population is around 10m - RoI c 4.3, Island of Ireland a bit under 6m. Bet the economic stat is a bit out by now as well...

**JC_GUFC** · 13/04/2009, 5:59 PM

Originally Posted by ThunderThighs

Also Portuguese football doesnt have Gaa to compete with aswell.

But it does have rink hockey!

**irishultra** · 13/04/2009, 7:17 PM

in norway people do support english teams first. accoring to a 'friend' of mine who supports werder bremen, if you asked 99 in every 100 who they support the answer would say liverpool, man utd, arsernal. however he informs me that norwegian football is put to the fore by the media.

i was watching eurogoals and the portuguese attendances didn't seem so good. i reckon they get a lot of barstoolers, but like in germany and england the barstoolers support the big portuguese teams(like germany-bayern munich/england-man utd)

**Rovers fan** · 14/04/2009, 1:41 AM

League structure number 349 from celtic tiger/thunderthighs

**endabob1** · 14/04/2009, 7:59 AM

I've been of the belief that the A league is a model the FAI shold be looking very closely at for some time.

http://foot.ie/forums/showthread.php?t=53479

The similarities between the competition from other sports and the media ignoring the local league is very clear.

Since posting this I have noticed the attendances have dipped for the last season

**fionnsci** · 14/04/2009, 8:39 AM

Originally Posted by ThunderThighs

Im not sure if we should be comparing to Portugal,i'd probably say Scotland,Denmark,Norway or Sweden

So was that big, dramatic goodbye just for show then?

**dcfcsteve** · 14/04/2009, 3:42 PM

Originally Posted by endabob1

Since posting this I have noticed the attendances have dipped for the last season

So it's all your fault then...!?!?

**Macy** · 15/04/2009, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by Gaz

That's because, in all honesty, the FAI has never given us a product to really rival the quality of the Permiership. When you do look at Portugal, you have to think as well that the locals would be just as attracted to the Spanish league as we are to the Premiership.

The problem is with the complete system, or rather the lack of a complete system. Each section within the FAI works for their own aims rather than for Irish Football. You'd need a revolution in how the so called "nursery" clubs operate before it'd be worth doing anything drastic with the League of Ireland. Everything at underage level should be focussed on developing the players not on trophies or UK trials or UK link ups.

The players should then feed into their local League of Ireland team rather than be shipped out. The top quality players will still go, but not without plying their trade here first (a la Doyle or Hunt). Those not quite good enough will stay playing, rather than be lost to football at 18 when they don't get signed on as a pro, or will stay in the league rather than lower league/ non league in the UK through shame.

Messing with the number of clubs, or creating a franchise league will do nothing, certainly not on it's own. It'd only be a mechanism to kill the league if it was done in isolation. The bar stoolers would still be bar stoolers, making a few trips a year to the UK. They want the glory, as told by sky sports, not real live football you can believe in. The franchises will die because of lack of support and the old clubs would have no credibility left at all.

Lazy journalists (Matt Cooper - I'm looking in your direction especially) make comparisons with rugby, but imo it is only of limited use. The structure is useful because of the ultimate focus is on producing players for the National Team. From school boys, through clubs, to province and then the National Team. In football, the top school boy clubs focus is on honours and UK professionals.The provincial structure works in rugby because the provincial teams were always there above the clubs, and because there is no "tradition" of supporting foreign teams above our own as with football. There is also no inter country league for these teams to play football in, and even at that rugby can only really sustain 3 clubs at that level.

**Dodge** · 15/04/2009, 10:16 AM

8 years on, the same arguements exist...

**peadar1987** · 15/04/2009, 11:53 AM

The difference with rugby is that there was never an English league that coul offer wages 100 times higher than the Irish domestic league. Even with a franchise or provincial system, our best players would still be attracted across the water, when the top English clubs will pay a single player more than Bohemians pay their entire squad.

**Sheridan** · 15/04/2009, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by peadar1987

The difference with rugby is that there was never an English league that coul offer wages 100 times higher than the Irish domestic league. Even with a franchise or provincial system, our best players would still be attracted across the water, when the top English clubs will pay a single player more than Bohemians pay their entire squad.

The difference with rugby, or any other sport, is that they're NOT FOOTBALL. Jesus Christ, people.

**sonofstan** · 15/04/2009, 12:37 PM

we've been through this countless times and none of the 'reasons' amount to more than excuses: there's always a counter-example.
1) Other countries are as small as we are, are beside bigger ones with glamourous leagues and manage to have decent domestic leagues and occasional european success (Norway, Denmark)
2) The GAA factor - outside the UK, Italy and Spain, football does not actually monopolise the media the way it does here - ice hockey and basketball, to pick two examples, are hugely popular in northern and eastern countries. In terms of participation in football, i bet Ireland is near the top in European terms.
3) The Sky factor - the problem is not the availability of English football, but the response of the domestic game

The fault lies squarely with those in charge of the game here; not just the FAI but also - maybe mostly - the clubs. Two things; facilities, and long term planning need to be addressed. The problem goes back to the 70s/80s, and the ground lost then, but it can be made up. The first steps have to be clubs setting themselves rational targets, making themselves visible in their communities, putting money into grounds so that it doesn't feel like a trip down a wormhole going to a LoI game. Abusing the premiership fan, while it soothes and consoles us here in our little ghetto, is of no earthly use; we have to get him and his family interested and excited by his local club.

To that end, simply leaving things as they are is not enough - traditional teams shouldn't be tampered with; the Dublin United scenario is a non- starter: the 4 big Dublin sides, and the two Louth sides have identities and loyalties that shouldn't be thrown away. However, the FAI should consider putting some money into starting League teams in Kerry, Meath, Mayo, Tipp, and building structures to sustain them (the Wexford model, sort of) - in this way, you could build a 16 team premier league, and an A league with a decnt geographical spread and without punishing teams in the east of the country simply for having survived.

Facilites are key though: TC apart, (maybe Tallaght, haven't been there yet) there isn't one ground in the country I wouldn't be embarrassed bringing a neophyte to. Until this changes, nothing else will.