Sean St. Ledger

[SwanVsDalton]

I'm far from being overwhelming negative. I'm pointing out that his club form is poor and has been for some time (which you agree with - who's the one ignoring the evidence?). If his week in, week out performances are poor, surely you accept that this does not bode well for his future performances at international level. There is a risk involved in playing a player that isn't performing at club level, all the more so when he plays at Championship level. He is a weak link.

By that measure the Irish side has about half-a-dozen weak links. This time last year we probably had about ten. But it's patently clear club form is not the be-all when it comes to playing for Ireland, which is what I'm pointing out (while AT THE SAME TIME taking into account his club form).

You would rather brand a player who's been generally excellent for us a 'weak link' - that's your lookout but it is overwhelming negative and OTT. Raise some points other than club form and maybe I'll come more on board.

Bar 1 season in the Championship, Dunne has played top flight football throughout his career and has 60-70 international caps to his name. He is currently first choice at a Premiership club.

In contrast, the doc is a patchy performer in lower tier English club football and is far from first choice in a struggling Leicester City team.

No real difference? I think that's open to debate, don't you?

Of course it's open for debate. But it would be more of a concern, and there would be a more pronounced difference between Sledge and Dunne, if Sean had yet to prove his ability at international level. He's proven himself to be fine centre back over 19 caps, with or without Dunne, in the Irish team. I have no idea how that concept is difficult to understand or how it doesn't affect your view on club form. My conclusion is St.Ledger ran over your dog.

My school days are long over son. But you'll find that the JoSH - Dunne partnership was broken up to accommodate the doc in the team which I strongly felt at the time was a mistake and still believe JoSh - Dunne is the stronger partnership. If you don't agree (which I suspect you don't ) - that's fine by me.

You've asserted Sledge is a weak link and said you'd prefer a different set-up. I merely asked why and you haven't bothered...

Likewise.

...yet you don't think your as yet unjustified comments are OTT? Quality stuff.

Look I'm not ignoring evidence but I think it's fair to say St.Ledger has been a creditable (often excellent) international standard centre half for us so far. Club form's a concern sure, but he's proven himself to be a top centre half so it's fair(er) to suggest his club form is the aberration here. You disagree - fine. But you're going to be called out as being OTT and overly negative if all you offer for calling him a 'weak link' is total speculation and guesswork.

[tetsujin1979]

My school days are long over son. But you'll find that the JoSH - Dunne partnership was broken up to accommodate the doc in the team which I strongly felt at the time was a mistake and still believe JoSh - Dunne is the stronger partnership. If you don't agree (which I suspect you don't ) - that's fine by me.

O'Shea - Dunne was broken up because St LEdger was an adequate (if not superior) replacement for O'Shea at centre half, and it meant O'Shea could be moved to right back, where we were struggling for cover at the time, following Finnan's retirement. Foley was still untested at senior level, and Kelly had just transferred to Birmingham when Trapattoni took over after a difficult final season with Spurs.
The argument was not which was the stronger centre half pairing (Dunne - St Ledger VS Dunne - O'Shea), it was what was the best overall defensive unit (Dunne - St Ledger - O'Shea VS Dunne - O'Shea - AN Other)

[ifk101]

O'Shea - Dunne was broken up because St LEdger was an adequate (if not superior) replacement for O'Shea at centre half, and it meant O'Shea could be moved to right back, where we were struggling for cover at the time, following Finnan's retirement. Foley was still untested at senior level, and Kelly had just transferred to Birmingham when Trapattoni took over after a difficult final season with Spurs.

Yes I realise JoSH moved to RB when the doc came into the team. Accommodating the doc resulted in two changes to the back four; the break-up of a strong centre half partnership and the positional change of JoSH at RB. Yes Foley at the time was untested at senior level but so was the doc. You're also limiting your RB options to a small handful of players and not considering the option of the doc at RB instead of breaking up the JoSH - Dunne partnership. I'd rather have our most experienced and merited defenders in the center, not to mention the height advantage both players have over the doc.

...yet you don't think your as yet unjustified comments are OTT? Quality stuff.

My comments are justified as they are founded on the doc's poor club form which you agree with.

The dog's still alive btw.

[SwanVsDalton]

I'd rather have our most experienced and merited defenders in the center, not to mention the height advantage both players have over the doc.

What club games would lead to you selecting O'Shea at centre half? It's you who's entered into this reductionist thinking after all...

My comments are justified as they are founded on the doc's poor club form which you agree with.

I don't know how to explain it any more plainly for you but your comments about St.Ledger being a weak link in the Ireland team are not justified by his club form. It just isn't that simple no matter how matter how much you try and reduce it.

[the doc]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBaSb...ayer_embedded#!

The doc was caught out badly there.

Taking delight in a player making a mistake, so you can sadly try and justify your claims!

Get a life you sad fecker!

[paul_oshea]

Sean didn't like you showing that video ifk101.

[the doc]

Sean didn't like you showing that video ifk101.

Can someone please change the record?

Did you know that Llamas are bigger than Frogs?

[paul_oshea]

Their eyes expand under duress too.

Sorry Doc, I mean Sean.

[CraftyToePoke]

Dropped again today, Mills back in the side. Chambers captains Forest with Moloney also starting.

[paul_oshea]

I was sure i saw him at the end

[CraftyToePoke]

I was sure i saw him at the end

What does that mean Paul? What does that mean? Are you saying Ol' CTP is now incapable of regurgitating even the most basic of information?

[paul_oshea]

Saw him coming off the field at the end of play

[the doc]

Dropped again today, Mills back in the side. Chambers captains Forest with Moloney also starting.

Relax Crafty ToeRag!

All part of Svens rotation system! Sven said he would keep rotating the squad/team throughout the season.

Sven likes to try different things!

[CraftyToePoke]

Relax Crafty ToeRag!

All part of Svens rotation system! Sven said he would keep rotating the squad/team throughout the season.

Sven likes to try different things!

As for Leicester, maybe it was implied to St Ledger that he would start, when he signed and that someone hasnt kept their word.Think St Ledger will be looking to move if he isnt playing 1st team football in the next few weeks as he wont let anything affect his International career

Wasn't a rotation system last week was it Doc ! ha ha, love it, brilliant.

Anyway, I reckon drop Bamba and play you (I mean Sean) and Mills in the week and that would sort it.

[CraftyToePoke]

Saw him coming off the field at the end of play

I would then have to say, what you saw, was not what you thought you saw, if you see.

[ifk101]

I don't know how to explain it any more plainly for you but your comments about St.Ledger being a weak link in the Ireland team are not justified by his club form. It just isn't that simple no matter how matter how much you try and reduce it.

I beg to differ.

Taking delight in a player making a mistake, so you can sadly try and justify your claims!

Get a life you sad fecker!

What was it again you had to say about McShane, O'Dea and Alex Bruce to name but a few?

[tetsujin1979]

as part of his recent charity work Sean was in Dublin yesterday for Champion Sports and 3's Go Green promotion where you can trade in your old Ireland jersey for €20 off the new one, and was interviewed on NewsTalk last night.
The interview is online on the listen back service here: http://media.newstalk.ie/listenback
Scroll down to Off The Ball -> Wednesday 24th August -> Part 1 and the interview starts just after the 25 minute mark

[Stuttgart88]

Good move by 3. They must hate seeing so many old eircom jerseys still being worn!

[CraftyToePoke]

Not involved at all tonight not even making the bench at present, I may have missed an injury to him though, anyone? His club kept their third consecutive clean sheet tonight, all achieved against sides in the top six and two away from home so he has work to do by the looks of it. Its a concern with the games coming up that he has played so little football this season.

[Kingdom]

He had a stinker in their second game of the season, after Mills had a stinker in the first. Eriksson seems to have given Mills the nod (not surprising after paying 5m for him).

It always surprises me when players like Legder and O'Dea do quite well at the international level, then stagnate at club level.