[SIZE=1]From the Irish Times[/SIZE]
National League Scene:
The financial difficulties afflicting most English Football League clubs in the wake of the ITV Digital collapse has inadvertently increased the backwash of Irish talent into the National League, fuelling debate on whether the game at the highest level here can, after all, offer a viable alternative for our fledgling professional footballers.
Young Irish players returning usually take some time to adjust to the fast and furious rigours of the National League. That's generally not been the case this season, however.
Many have flourished since arriving back in the summer, most notably at Cork City in the guise of John O'Flynn and George O'Callaghan. Damien Lynch at Bohemians, Barry Ferguson and Sean Dillon at Longford Town and UCD pair Alan Cawley and Hugh Davey have also resettled with relative ease.
Robert Doyle, who returned last year, has, given his chance at UCD, impressed to such an extent that he's broken into the Irish under-21 squad.
In an extension to the debate, Jason McGuinness of Bohemians and Shelbourne winger Wesley Houlihan, neither of whom has been away, have also been capped by Irish under-21 manager Don Givens this season, belying the notion that the game here can't nurture its young.
"My answer to that is a most definite yes," says former Irish international team manager Eoin Hand, the FAI's career guidance officer, to the question of whether the National League is a viable option to a career in the lower reaches of the English league.
"There are lads in England that I would actually encourage to come back and play in the National League. The standard of the game here is very good.
"There is much more money and thought going into it. It's much more professional now.
"The main thing young players coming home have to come to terms with is the fact they are coming from underage football into senior football. The transition is not that easy."
Smoothing a player's integration back into football here is the whole point of the REAP (Reinvention Education Appraisal Preparation) course set up through Hand at the FAI.
"It's an unfortunate thing to have to have there, but it's accepting that lads are coming back," said Hand of the initiative, a six-week course held pre-season catering for up to 15 players, that's one-third funded by the English PFA. "Ideally we'd like to get them before they go, but that's not going to happen with the lure of the game in England."
THE most illuminating difference our footballing diaspora has made on its return this season has been seen at Cork City where the team has been revitalised by prodigal talent who "didn't make it" in England. O'Flynn and O'Callaghan have won the first two player of the month awards as Liam Murphy's side have emerged again as real title contenders.
While many of the players returning have, after a settling in period, enhanced the senior game here, perhaps the surprising common denominator is that most of them have been greatly impressed by its standard.
"It's been a bit of a culture shock, really," says O'Callaghan, announced last week as the player of the month for August by the country's football writers. "I think it's a fantastic league. It's much tougher than I expected. I never realised how many good players there are in it," added the 23-year-old striker, home in his native Cork after seven years at Port Vale.
"I'm seeing players playing here and wonder why they are not playing at a higher level in England. The standard is similar to that you would find in the English Second Division.
"I believe that, the way the game is going in England, more and more young Irish players are going to come back home to make it an even better, stronger league.
"Players have nothing to fear by coming back because the standard is good.
"The only factor may be money. If there were better wages here then I don't think lads would go over in the first place."
Its highly unlikely the eL could ever compete in money terms. Probably a lot better off improving training & facilities, giving players first team football & a chance of playing in europe.Originally posted by oddboy
[SIZE=1]From the Irish Times[/SIZE]
National League Scene: "The only factor may be money. If there were better wages here then I don't think lads would go over in the first place."
The question, pete, is what type of money is George taking about?Originally posted by pete
Its highly unlikely the eL could ever compete in money terms. Probably a lot better off improving training & facilities, giving players first team football & a chance of playing in europe.
Wages of about €3,000 a week are not on, but what about €3,000 a month ?
Would the top eL players accept this as a wage?
If players accept this kind of money, circa €20,000 a month gets you a core squad of 6/7 fulltime players.
Can enough teams in the eL sustain this kind of wage bill?
Better players mean better performaces, better performances mean better attendances, so is it possible for the eL to arrive at a situation where there are 10 decent teams which attract crowds from 6,000 to 10,000 per game?
It can be seen that for what are called the "big" games City can certainly attract crowds of between 7,000 to 10,000.
Surely the only way to sustain these numbers is to play against genuinely competitive teams, which employ decent players of a high standard.
In the premier division, there are 5 games per week. This means attracting 50,000 people per week, for a 10K average.
Thats not a whole lot of people from 4,000,000.
I think it must be possible....
Can anyone ever see the eL is such a situation?...
yes, i can. the first thing is to look to countries like Israel and norway with populations similiar to ours.Originally posted by oddboy
In the premier division, there are 5 games per week. This means attracting 50,000 people per week, for a 10K average.
Thats not a whole lot of people from 4,000,000.
I think it must be possible....
Can anyone ever see the eL is such a situation?..
the only way the "general public" will believe irish football is of any standard is by 1. proper facilities and 2. progress in european competitions (at this stage there are teams from israel and norway in the champions league and 3 teams from Bosnia in the uefa cup). all this brings in money to their leagues. we should be looking to bring home more young irish players from the lower leagues in england and also look for talent among the "lesser" known countries like rovers and longford have done.
Originally posted by oddboy
If players accept this kind of money, circa €20,000 a month gets you a core squad of 6/7 fulltime players.
I think the idea of a few fulltime footballers & the rest part-time is a bad idea. IMO you either have a part-time or fulltuime squad.
A squad of 20 players by 1k a week = 1million wages per year.
I don't see why on average the Premier division can't get 5k average crowds a game which more or less payes for the wages above. Core support at most clubs can barely get to 2k at the moment though as theres too many sunshine supporters.
someone asked lennox at the supporters club meeting if he had plans to go fully pro, and he said that he saw it as a goal, but wanted the club itself to be fully professional before having a fully pro squad, i.e. having marketing coaching etc sorted out. i think thats a good ideaOriginally posted by pete
I think the idea of a few fulltime footballers & the rest part-time is a bad idea. IMO you either have a part-time or fulltuime squad.
I think we could compete wages wise if we got our act together, remember we're talking about the wages of individual players rather than the wage bill as a whole. The English need bigger squads as they play a lot more matches (49 minimum as opposed to 38 minimum) and have further to travel.
Yeah, but there doesn´t seem to be that kind of unity- some people at some clubs are more interested in personal vendettas and oneupmanship than success, particularly at one or two of the dublin clubs. Until people realise we have to get together to make things right, it won´t happen.Originally posted by TommyT
I think we could compete wages wise if we got our act together, remember we're talking about the wages of individual players rather than the wage bill as a whole.
of course it is
WE HAVE TO LEARN FROM ABROAD!
From World Soccer (October 2002)
"The turning point in the history of Maccabi Haifa came in 1992, when the club was taken over by the current president Yaakov Shahar.
Shahar, an importer of motor vehicles, set about introducing modern business practices to his newly acquired enterprise. He turned Maccabi into a model that all other Israeli clubs eventually copied."
From the champions league Maccabi can expect to earn at the least £2.5 million sterling.
Small country , the same as us.
ditto Norway.
NL clubs should be over there trying to learn from them.
Re: Re: re Wages
[QUOTE]
some people at some clubs are more interested in personal vendettas and oneupmanship than success, particularly at one or two of the dublin clubs
And as for these fans who are more interested in getting the manager out than winning things...
Nothin of the sort- if he wins so much the better, just saack him anywayOriginally posted by TommyT
And as for these fans who are more interested in getting the manager out than winning things...
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