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Thread: Stadium Updates (All Clubs)

  1. #6481
    Seasoned Pro oriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    Dropping stuff up to Oriel and low and behold the old place has had a coat of paint and actually looks very well. Had noticed a few cosmetic things from coverage of the Bohs friendly, mainly improved tidiness and a proper barrier seperating the rear of the Lilywhite Lounge/ Away Terrace from the terrace itself. Baby steps, but it was a very minimum want from fans. No more dead mice lying around...

    Pitch looked well too, properly brushed and maintained with the infill not so obvious or kicking up.
    I did notice on the stream the pitch looked 'greener' and smoother actually, maybe parts of the ground tidier too around the ground, a lick of paint can do wonders, especially the town side of the stand, seems to need painted every year.
    #DundalkFC - 5 titles in 6 years 2014-2019 / FAI CUP Winners 2020

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    International Prospect Martinho II's Avatar
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    Yet again Neil ORiordan had a great piece in the Sun today about the World Cup 2030 bidding war fiasco.
    Daire Doyles red and black army

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    Youth Team Kiki Balboa's Avatar
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    If im not mistaken, Horse racing get around €64 million in funding from the Government each year. This is mostly from taxes on betting, which is earmarked nearly exclusively for Animal racing. Two decades ago, the majority of betting was placed on horses and dogs, however, more recently higher and higher number of bets are placed on Football. This isnt reflected on where the funding from taxes on betting go to.

    I bring it up because there is increasing debate over the morality of animal racing in the country (think greyhounds on primetime/ the current situation of the Gordon Elliot photo). There is more and more backlash against it. I think this is realistically the most likely source of revenue for investments in facilities for domestic football.

    Of course there is strong lobbying from Horseracing and Betting companies, so it would need a hell of a lot of lobbying from football insitutions. A possibilty is doubling the betting tax from 1 percent to 2 percent, which would give an extra revenue of 50million. Even if football didnt get all that, an extra 10 million a year in facilities would do a wonder job, up and down the league. Emmet Malone did a piece on it below.

    Just to qualify, I dont bet on football or animal racing. Im fairly blasie on it all. Just see it as an opportunity.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soc...cake-1.3803786

  4. #6484
    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    This is a really interesting topic imo and I think its the only genuine possibility of getting a programme of ground developments going and properly funded. As mentioned previously the money invested in racing over 20 years is eyewatering. I dont think the betting companies would care where betting taxes go, they might have an issue with an increase in the tax but at its meagre level I doubt doubling (or up to say 5%?) would negatively effect business and could actually increase a market if more people were attending proper facilities at sporting events.
    There is controversy with the whole sponsorship in sport by betting companies and if it does have a correlated negative impact on society, its surprising that taxation is so low. It's not the same as sponsorship of tobacco related companies in the past and the current high rates of taxes to discourage use, alcohol companies and sports sponsorship is on the clock I think too. But gambling doesnt seem to be on the radar of government and probably should be and at the very minimum should be an industry that is used to generate funding - certainly sports like football would have a more positive impact on wider sections of society than horse racing bar the estimated 35k jobs created by that industry. There is much greater growth potential/job creation too in other sports with animal racing very well developed - further justification for reform of this particular taxation and funding. Proportionate to the respective sports is the way to go if a LoI fan as the current breakdown of betting trends would mean a significant share of the spoils, GAA would be in a hoop over that though with significantly less gambling on GAA but they generate a high level of their own revenue as it is and there are many worthy sports like athletics that badly need investment. Accessibility to participate in sport for those with disabilities needs huge work including basic infrastructure at facilities and should be pushed as a priority too.

    Its probably the most realistic prospect of getting money in to the game and we should badgering politicians about it especially as Kiki has suggested that horse racing is under the spotlight. We are easily decades behind other EU countries (even proportionately) on sporting infrastructure with the exception of GAA (not a criticism), below provinical level Rugby is severly lacking and we know where the issues are in LoI. While a couple of Olympic standard swimming facilities have opened in more recent years its still embarrassing, not a single indoor velodrome in a country where cycling has some pedigree, one Ice Skating rink (and one at DkIT that needs funding to reopen). The list is endless really - I hope there is an EU type directive on the number of amentities that encourage physical activity per head of population!

    I also thing that any potential future funding for LoI should be allocated to to clubs that require the greatest amount of work to bring their ground up to expected standards, away fans having to stand in the rain is just not on!!

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    International Prospect Martinho II's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    This is a really interesting topic imo and I think its the only genuine possibility of getting a programme of ground developments going and properly funded. As mentioned previously the money invested in racing over 20 years is eyewatering. I dont think the betting companies would care where betting taxes go, they might have an issue with an increase in the tax but at its meagre level I doubt doubling (or up to say 5%?) would negatively effect business and could actually increase a market if more people were attending proper facilities at sporting events.
    There is controversy with the whole sponsorship in sport by betting companies and if it does have a correlated negative impact on society, its surprising that taxation is so low. It's not the same as sponsorship of tobacco related companies in the past and the current high rates of taxes to discourage use, alcohol companies and sports sponsorship is on the clock I think too. But gambling doesnt seem to be on the radar of government and probably should be and at the very minimum should be an industry that is used to generate funding - certainly sports like football would have a more positive impact on wider sections of society than horse racing bar the estimated 35k jobs created by that industry. There is much greater growth potential/job creation too in other sports with animal racing very well developed - further justification for reform of this particular taxation and funding. Proportionate to the respective sports is the way to go if a LoI fan as the current breakdown of betting trends would mean a significant share of the spoils, GAA would be in a hoop over that though with significantly less gambling on GAA but they generate a high level of their own revenue as it is and there are many worthy sports like athletics that badly need investment. Accessibility to participate in sport for those with disabilities needs huge work including basic infrastructure at facilities and should be pushed as a priority too.

    Its probably the most realistic prospect of getting money in to the game and we should badgering politicians about it especially as Kiki has suggested that horse racing is under the spotlight. We are easily decades behind other EU countries (even proportionately) on sporting infrastructure with the exception of GAA (not a criticism), below provinical level Rugby is severly lacking and we know where the issues are in LoI. While a couple of Olympic standard swimming facilities have opened in more recent years its still embarrassing, not a single indoor velodrome in a country where cycling has some pedigree, one Ice Skating rink (and one at DkIT that needs funding to reopen). The list is endless really - I hope there is an EU type directive on the number of amentities that encourage physical activity per head of population!

    I also thing that any potential future funding for LoI should be allocated to to clubs that require the greatest amount of work to bring their ground up to expected standards, away fans having to stand in the rain is just not on!!
    Have to agree with you on this before we redeveloped our ground 20 yrs ago we had shelter the length of the pitch where Section O is based but when the stand was built the bus shelter was gone! I think there should be another stand over I stand imo!
    Daire Doyles red and black army

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    Is your whole ground in use? I thought there was a safety issue on one side?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucket View Post
    Is your whole ground in use? I thought there was a safety issue on one side?
    You only really become a League of Ireland club when part of your stadium gets restricted on safety grounds.

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  9. #6488
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bucket View Post
    Is your whole ground in use? I thought there was a safety issue on one side?
    I think they may have sorted that out recently. But it's not likely to be needed any time soon, Covid or no Covid.
    Yo no soy marinero. Soy capitan.

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    I think there is a big difference between Irish horse racing in Ireland and club football in Ireland.

    The former is considered amongst the finest in the world and always has been, it is a major revenue source for betting companies workdwide. The latter obviously exists in a different stratosphere.

  11. #6490
    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    Invest €1bn in an industry and ye'd hope that it would be pretty decent. True though, it isnt directly comparable but should horse racing continue to be subsidised by taxation its not generating, if at all. At minimum its a discussion that's needed. The majority of betting on football will be on the EPL but obviously they shouldnt benefit but the sport in this country could. It would be interesting, in an alternative history type way, to see how the FAI would have gotten on with a similar level of funding!?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nesta99 View Post
    It would be interesting, in an alternative history type way, to see how the FAI would have gotten on with a similar level of funding!?!
    I reckon Robbie Keane would’ve been given a 15 year contract on €100k a week and John Delaney's 50th birthday party would’ve taken place on the moon with travel subsidised for guests of course

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    For as wild as any 'predictions' could be I reckon the FAI would still have managed to have us shaking our heads in disbelief! Mypost (wherever he is these days) might even have had his direct route to games in his spaceship and Finn Harps would be in Stranrolar on schedule.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DCWA View Post
    I think there is a big difference between Irish horse racing in Ireland and club football in Ireland.

    The former is considered amongst the finest in the world and always has been, it is a major revenue source for betting companies workdwide. The latter obviously exists in a different stratosphere.
    Of course you are right. But changing the betting tax from 1 percent to 2 percent, would create a lot more revenue so that both animal racing can keep the same funding, and other sports can get much needed investment. Besides, Greyhound racing is heavily subsides by the Government and get 19.2 million euro. Nobody really cares too much about the dogs as opposed to the horses. That much money going into facilities would be huge.

    Money doesnt need to go into the clubs or the FAI themseleves but can be given to councils earmarked to help build and maintain multi-use stadiums (similar to Tallaght, which has been a massive success). There has been a massive lack of investment in stadiums in this country. Louth currently needs three (2 loi and 1 GAA). If football in this country could mobalise around some policy, it would have a much greater chance to fix this. (or maybe this is just my lockdown mind going crazy....)

  15. #6494
    Capped Player nigel-harps1954's Avatar
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    I do think the PCA and First Division clubs could have a part to play in it. Rather than just the FAI lobbying for a bigger slice of the betting levvies, the clubs, the various regional organisations, youth groups, schoolboys clubs, etc, should all be coming together and trying to force the hand of the government.

    Facilities in the country could do with an overhaul from top to bottom. If there's an estimate of about 30-40% of betting in Ireland done on football, then 30-40% of the betting levy should go to football. Even a ringfenced €15m a year to improve facilities in Ireland would go a long way to helping the game along.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa View Post
    Of course you are right. But changing the betting tax from 1 percent to 2 percent, would create a lot more revenue so that both animal racing can keep the same funding, and other sports can get much needed investment. Besides, Greyhound racing is heavily subsides by the Government and get 19.2 million euro. Nobody really cares too much about the dogs as opposed to the horses. That much money going into facilities would be huge.

    Money doesnt need to go into the clubs or the FAI themseleves but can be given to councils earmarked to help build and maintain multi-use stadiums (similar to Tallaght, which has been a massive success)
    . There has been a massive lack of investment in stadiums in this country. Louth currently needs three (2 loi and 1 GAA). If football in this country could mobalise around some policy, it would have a much greater chance to fix this. (or maybe this is just my lockdown mind going crazy....)
    Tallaght has been a success, but I think we have to caution against assuming it can be done everywhere.

    A core part of the rationale and business case behind the council developing Tallaght Stadium has nothing to do with Shamrock Rovers. It's to enable it to be a venue for all sorts of things, including football involving other teams. That makes sense when you're building it in a capital city that contains 40% of the population of the entire state. But not in small areas like Wexford or Ballybofey, for example. So unless a compelling case can be made for multi-use stadia that more than pay for themselves on a going basis and just happen to include an LOI club as an anchor tenant within that, then councils shouldn't touch the idea with a barge pole.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    Tallaght has been a success, but I think we have to caution against assuming it can be done everywhere.

    A core part of the rationale and business case behind the council developing Tallaght Stadium has nothing to do with Shamrock Rovers. It's to enable it to be a venue for all sorts of things, including football involving other teams. That makes sense when you're building it in a capital city that contains 40% of the population of the entire state. But not in small areas like Wexford or Ballybofey, for example. So unless a compelling case can be made for multi-use stadia that more than pay for themselves on a going basis and just happen to include an LOI club as an anchor tenant within that, then councils shouldn't touch the idea with a barge pole.
    I dont think people do really as a one size fits all arrangement could lead to problems, waste of resources, white elephant projects and the like. But conversely, and I know not everyone would be in agreement, but Dundalk having a 12k capacity ground (up to 22k) for one sport and another of 10k a few miles apart doesnt make a whole lot of sense either. If some people could discard old enmities and some inventive design a facility could be maxmised. They way things could end up is with 2 budget projects that neither will sell-out except occasionally in a calender year. Pooled resources with municipal involvement could have seen an entire area rejuvenated in a larger overall development plan. The area that the new county ground is could have been a community hub and where its needed. The DFC fan in me though would prefer that some wealthy investors take over the club and redevelop Oriel and be a facility that generates money for DFC and no strings attached - 'realist' v wishlist stuff lol. Throw Drogheda in to the mix in terms of municipal involvement and it gets more complex again. Though the Lourdes Stadium is council owned already...

  18. #6497
    Youth Team Kiki Balboa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954 View Post
    I do think the PCA and First Division clubs could have a part to play in it. Rather than just the FAI lobbying for a bigger slice of the betting levvies, the clubs, the various regional organisations, youth groups, schoolboys clubs, etc, should all be coming together and trying to force the hand of the government.

    Facilities in the country could do with an overhaul from top to bottom. If there's an estimate of about 30-40% of betting in Ireland done on football, then 30-40% of the betting levy should go to football. Even a ringfenced €15m a year to improve facilities in Ireland would go a long way to helping the game along.
    You think the FAI read foot.ie ? How to get this wonder plan out there ....

  19. #6498
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    Quote Originally Posted by EatYerGreens View Post
    Tallaght has been a success, but I think we have to caution against assuming it can be done everywhere....
    We should identify as many potential situations like that as possible and put LoI clubs in as anchor tenants. It's a sustainable setup, which is more than can be said for most of us at the moment.
    Covid-negative, maybe; I haven't checked.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John83 View Post
    We should identify as many potential situations like that as possible and put LoI clubs in as anchor tenants. It's a sustainable setup, which is more than can be said for most of us at the moment.
    Is it a sustainable set up though ? Shamrock Rovers are only one part of the business rationale for Tallaght Stadium. What other sporting fixtures, entertainment events, conferences etc would be attracted to a stadium in Ballybofey, for example, to make a substantial council investment there pay for itself every year ? Because that's what's driven the expansion of Tallaght - if not from day one, then at least beyond it consisting solely of a single stand.

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    International Prospect Nesta99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiki Balboa View Post
    You think the FAI read foot.ie ? How to get this wonder plan out there ....
    Whatever about now, i wouldnt be surprised if Irish football fora were trawled through by JD. Maybe they still do but it would be to head off new ideas rather than looking for some. How to get plan/idea/change - through the clubs, then FAI lobbies and fans (including GAA) get at their politicians - GAA are good at this and will hunt down any sniff of funding from which we shout out for a share when the heavy lifting is done!

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