QuoteThey don't use it for underage matches though do they?Originally Posted by oriel
Dundalk still have access to the grass pitch owned by a local school right behind YDC / away goal end, train on that for away games apart from Derry. However not owning one is not good.
#DundalkFC - First Irish club to win an away game in Europe (1963), first Irish club to win points in a group stage in Europe (2016).
They don't use it for underage matches though do they?
BetweenTheStripes.net - Home of Between the Stripes LOI podcast.
It is available for underage use if need be but its easier to use the main pitch. Just from the need to have the pitch lined, goals set up, that the surface is suitable for a match as opposed to training, walked for glass or dog sh1t, people to retrieve balls from the long grass or before local kids hanging around scarper with a match ball, not clasing with school use etc. It would take more people to be about than using Oriel itself, no floodlights (there were training lights) or even just street lighting at access points depending on the time of the year. I dont now if there are minimum standards for national underage venues but Hiney Park would bound to need some work if it was used for that purpose regularly im sure.
Hopefully some movement to be announced next few weeks by Dundalk.
https://www.dundalkfc.com/dundalk-fc...ate-june-2024/
Last edited by oriel; 14/06/2024 at 6:57 PM.
#DundalkFC - First Irish club to win an away game in Europe (1963), first Irish club to win points in a group stage in Europe (2016).
Great to hear, engaging with other sporting clubs definitely the way to go. I have to say though, having been in Oriel on Thursday, the basic standards around the place have really gone to **** again. The stand is absolutely filthy, advertising hoardings falling to pieces, the disaster of a new disabled section has become a real eyesore, just general untidyness around the place, surely someone should be enforcing these standards?
Filthy in what way just out of interest not being able to attend games currently muself, as in not swept after the previous weeks game, seating needing cleaning (rather than old weather worn look? Under the stand, corridors, bar toilets etc not cleaned properly? Its not the biggest job to do, as in general/maintanace caretaking of the stand as a whole, but maybe the stand was in use just prior to the Thursday matchnight. The wider ground needs fairly significant man hours to keep things reasonable so if there is a shortage of people I can see why it can become unkempt looking. It would take 3 people pretty flat out to do things like repairing advertisment hoarding, spraying weeds, pitch work, fixing advertising hoarding. In the past there was obviously Mickey Fox looking after the (grass) pitch and there was a CE scheme doing the bread and butter around the ground. There were volunteer tidy up days also. So itd be interesting to know whether there are people employed as groundskeeper, or is there very limited volunteer numbers.
The town end grassy knoll did look like it was left uncut for the bees. The new disabled area doesnt look used much at all from watching on TV to me so where do those who used to be pitch side go now? It doesnt strike me as a particularly good vantage point regardless of its aesthetic.
The YDC isnt such an old building that youd expect would need rewiring unless it was shoddily done in the 1st place but good to see fire regulations met to allow its use again. Installation of a bar wouldnt be a major expensive for the potential return if the licence isnt an issue - can the Lilywhite Lounge/McGuill licences extend to to YDC if opted for.
There were always areas around Oriel that were used for 'storage' that should be clear for safety reasons (behind away terrace abd Lilywhite Lounge) and may even have enough space for fan spots (even just face painting for kid, occasional bbq) like end of the shed, town end and around to the rear of the shed or heven forbid permanent toilet blocks like Town End terrace. forecourt of the YDC entrance has loads of space for prematch familay activities. Could all come under the remit of a facilities manager but would need staff too. Id have expected s CEO to be too busy dealing with the more business aspect of running the club.
We talk about improving facilities but maximising what is there is the startig point, and its takes appointing full time staff - though some may pay for themselves if it means additional income streams are possible. Like in the distant past there was pitchside advertisement for business who were out of business or hadnt paid up for the space for ages - maybe the gaps in the hoarding have to be filled?!
Nice ... If done
Impressive stuff from Sligo!
Does the licencing agreement stuff with other organisations mean that it will have an artificial pitch? (Maybe they already have?)
Also UEFA Regulations state that only Category 1 permits standing i.e. Cats. 2, 3 and 4 are required to be all-seater. Those Regs. date from 2018, and I know that a number of clubs with modern safe-standing facilities like eg Spurs and Dortmund have since been allowed standing, on (I think) a trial basis. I wonder are Sligo anticipating that assuming the trials are successful, then standing will be extended to higher (all?) categories, at least where modern design has been incorporated?
Anyhow, the Regs, which are hard to find on UEFA's site, are pretty detailed in a variety of areas - assuming this all goes through, Sligo will have eg the best floodlights in the country!
https://documents.uefa.com/viewer/bo...p3UGF3pXy9BvgA
From the article above:
With a capacity of 6,100, stadium facilities will include new grass based hybrid pitch, which will accommodate other sports and activities
Paaatrick's Agletic
Maybe the Sligo format could set a pattern for other clubs if they are successful and get funding to complete their stadium plans!
Let's hope they do as they are a very progressive club.
You have to hand it to Sligo. Despite being in a small unwealthy regional town with a static population, and with no other big poulation centres anywhere near them, they manage to defy the odds continuously. Drawing good crowds and adopting a self-help attitude towards their own development. They really are an example to the rest of the league.
Sligo's plans are ambitious moreso than impressive in a LoI context. Im not knocking things, just that what they are doing what should be the standard. Impressive would be managing to develop a Cat 4 stadium without being wasteful, a project done under budget and on time (not that common or easy in large scale or over long term). For years, and you will see it said at every opportunity in the Sligo application im sure, 'multi-use' has been key but been lacking in LoI funding applications beyond tokenism. Bang per buck and the complete opposite of how GAA applications were assessed would always have caught the attention in recent years. Duplication of facilities is no longer accepted unless absolutely justified, why the blocking of a DkIT facility at TD level for Dundalk FC, rugby, GAA was very wrong imo and would be done to completion by now (where is Louth's county ground that the DkIT project was scrapped for?). So 1st in is important and Id say Sligo are looking at a regional aspect to their development which could scupper a big ED Park revamp if it were in the works for example (and along with the Connaught Showgrounds in the vicinity), if they get the noses ahead it could see Harps being squeezed on plans for their new ground ticking all boxes for latter European rounds. Its relevant to Dundalk and Drogheda albeit you could justify significant developments for both clubs.
Timing is important from a public perspective and no better time than when Govt. are saying there will be a few billion € surplus posted prebudget. Its the time for all clubs, backed by the FAI, to require having facilities projects in the pipeline and active applications in by all - all as part of cohesive develpments that can be done incrementally by individual clubs and as part of an overall FAI strategy. The focus is needed on spectator facilities, disabilty access, and appropriate multisex accessibility to teams using the facilities( in that, for example, youth training can be combined until development pathways diverge, female officials etc), elite youths and high performance units incorporated, less of the conference facilities as everyone has them but maybe include childcare units where small kids can be left on match nights, allowing parents to to use a facility that couldnt otherwise and have those facilities open in general during the day - actual multi-use amenity. For good measure combine an application with a local school for PE area and kit, auxilliary pitch for use by the school, warm up/training for the club etc etc . These would be ticking boxes that the Dept of Sport love doing so much so a greater number of applications are passed with higher funding. Then we progress to secondary use facilities like training grounds, funding grassroots clubs that are within the FAI (pyramid) system. Even youth clubss enhance their lilihood of successful applications with a clear pathway for players to the senior game whether its at elite or recreational levels but fits in to national physical activity strategys.
Houses need to be in order, tax compiance, ownership, audited past grant use - Ive bashed the Finn Harps project plenty but why is there almost a couple of decades of delays, well usually its cause there are question marks over such issues. Tallaght the same, delays due to funding being ultimately behing witheld, the DoS dont just withhold grants that would put a previously grant funded facility in to use without good reason, say a construction company that isnt tax compliant being used or money going sideways in to other aspects of a club. Dare I say it, why the FAI need to be a big part of an overall hands on development strategy. We look at GAA funding in envy but tbh they get the basics right. HRI/BnaG do things together in almost everything. Maybe water based artificial surfaces could combine football and hockey facilities?
Anyways fair play to Sligo, mainly on their continued focus on facility development when so many others have failed to bother, failed to deliver or needed intervention to do so. But I think we should also be careful about being too impressed and be more demanding of our own clubs and sporting authorities - in that way Sligo are setting the bar.
Last edited by Nesta99; 04/07/2024 at 3:28 PM.
Quite.
Sligo is what I would call a "proper Football town". I'm not familiar with the history of Rovers themselves, but I do know that back in the beginning of the 20th century, the Fermanagh & Western FA's remit stretched as far as Sligo, beyond even:
(From the F&W's official history)
"The report of Annual General Meeting of the Fermanagh and Western District Football Association held in May 1907 reveals the origins of the current Divisional Association of the IFA. The Honorary Secretary, Mr J P Gillen, submitted his report which stated that the IFA had been approached with a view to extending the range of the local association to Sligo. The IFA had sanctioned the proposal and arranged a grant of the not inconsiderable sum of £50, with the proviso that the new association was to be absorbed in the North West Football Association. This was unanimously opposed, and a further proposal was made which was acceptable. Thus the Fermanagh and South Tyrone Association was, “in the third year of its existence, transformed into the Fermanagh and Western District Association, controlling the district from Fermanagh to Mayo, with two representatives on the Senior Council, and one on the Junior Council.” As part of their efforts to promote football in the west, the IFA honoured the district by selecting Enniskillen as the venue for the Irish Junior Cup Final of 1908.
While those early meetings were covered in the press, unfortunately no minute books survive from the period, so that records of the various competitions are incomplete. Teams from Sligo, Clones and Cavan were successful in those early days, but it is not clear if any competitive football was played during the Great War."
https://www.fermanaghandwestern.com/...page/10027715/
Two further notes on the above: 1. Afaik that £50 IFA grant to the F&W was specifically designed to help counter the growth of the GAA locally, which was doing well in the region at the time; and 2. Although Sligo was heavily garrisoned by the British Army in times of trouble, it was not a traditional "garrison town" like, say, Enniskillen. And I've read that the influence of the British Army in speading Football throughout Ireland has often been overstated. At least as important was the growth of the railways, with railway companies often promoting Football as a means of encouraging crowds to attend games on special excursion tickets etc. Indeed, games even between small regional clubs often drew surprisingly big crowds on occasion.
I wonder whether Football in Sligo experienced a bit of a hiatus around the time of Partition, but revived sufficiently (or maybe coalesced?) to allow for the formation of Rovers in 1928? At any rate, the game in Sligo must have benefited from being played in a railway town, then and now.
Footnote: Old friendships have been revived recently with a F&W Representative XI playing a Sligo Leitrim District XI in end-of-season friendlies in recent years:
https://www.fermanaghandwestern.com/...tail/10091007/
Sligo is what I would call a "proper Football town". Ealing Green quote.
What other current league clubs would you consider as proper football towns!
There are a a number of towns around the country where football was pretty much always the main sport (even if that doesn't mean the team there is currently any good btw). Think Dundalk, Sligo, Athlone, Cobh. Then places like Cork and Waterford where football was always strong, but only alongside oither codes. Probably Harps too.Sligo is what I would call a "proper Football town". Ealing Green quote.
What other current league clubs would you consider as proper football towns!
The one anomaly to both the garrison town and the railway town theory for football/LOI teams is Mullingar. It was a major British base, plus a key railway crossroads (both due to its central location). Yet somehow managed to never spawn an LOI team, despite football being fairly popular there.
By "proper" I mean has History and Tradition; and/or punches above its weight; and/or survives and thrives despite otherwise unfavourable circumstances (eg low population, competition from other sports, remote location etc), or supports a lot of teams, even if at the expense of diluting overall resources etc.Sligo is what I would call a "proper Football town". Ealing Green quote.
What other current league clubs would you consider as proper football towns!
I'm not familiar with a lot of LOI clubs, but I'd say Derry City, Finn Harps and Dundalk meet some or all of those criteria, for instance. And though not a town (obv), Dublin clearly "gets" football, in the same way eg as Belfast does. (Apologies to fans of other LOI clubs who I may be overlooking)
In NI I'd say eg Ballymena is (but nearby Antrim isn't); or Dungannon is (but Omagh isn't); Newry is (but am unsure about Warrenpoint?)
Last edited by EalingGreen; 05/07/2024 at 2:10 PM.
Yes, that's what I'm getting at.
Mullingar is interesting, hadn't thought of them.
Thanks for that.
'Desso' are a leading hybrid pitch installer, under the brand name 'Grassmaster', this short promo video from them shows how it works - basically a bloody great sewing machine!
https://youtu.be/1VNiArKmJ10
While this short Crystal Palace video from 8 years ago shows the preparation (drainage etc) which has to go on to prepare the site for the Desso installation:
https://youtu.be/VRXYYeoRfe0
Last edited by EalingGreen; 09/07/2024 at 2:32 PM.
Posting Permissions
Bookmarks