New Irish manager

**Stuttgart88** · 22/11/2007, 1:00 PM

One thing that stood out for me watching the underage teams in the last couple of years was the sheer number of "speculative" passes we play. Not necessarily hoofs but low % passes over a longish distance which, even if accurate, are hard to control. This was particularly apparent in the U19 game in Germany where we played a great first half, made a forced substitution bringing on the tall Cillian Sheridan and our game went to pot afterwards.

Croatia passed the ball well and usually short, held it well, brought people into the game & they took up good positions. All simple stuff really. We make a couple of passes and if an opening doesn't become available we'll play a speculative ball. Better teams will just play it around for another phase and wait for the opening.

Surely this isn't that difficult to teach?

**Wolfie** · 22/11/2007, 1:04 PM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Croatia passed the ball well and usually short, held it well, brought people into the game & they took up good positions. All simple stuff really. We make a couple of passes and if an opening doesn't become available we'll play a speculative ball. Better teams will just play it around for another phase and wait for the opening.

Surely this isn't that difficult to teach?

The distribution of the Croation back four was very accurate and composed. I couldn't help drawing comparisons between the assured manner in which the Croat defence fed the midfield to an image of McShane's painfully awkward presence on the ball.

**eirebhoy** · 22/11/2007, 1:21 PM

Originally Posted by jmurphyc

Technique is definitely the problem IMO. Whilst England have players who can accurately pass the ball, they don't really have anyone with any great vision. Beckham is a fantastic passer but IMO he hasn't got much vision.

Vision comes under intelligence though.

**jmurphyc** · 22/11/2007, 1:32 PM

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Vision comes under intelligence though.

Yes but what I'm saying is that it's no good being an amazing passer but having no vision, otherwise you won't be able to find holes in the opposition or be able to find others in space. You'd just end up passing it back and forth and not creating chances.

**eirebhoy** · 22/11/2007, 1:35 PM

Originally Posted by jmurphyc

Yes but what I'm saying is that it's no good being an amazing passer but having no vision

That's exactly my point.

**jmurphyc** · 22/11/2007, 1:40 PM

Ok must have misunderstood then.

**paul_oshea** · 22/11/2007, 1:51 PM

Yes but what I'm saying is that it's no good being an amazing passer but having no vision, otherwise you won't be able to find holes in the opposition or be able to find others in space. You'd just end up passing it back and forth and not creating chances.

And both are ye are only half right. If there is someone on the team who isnt on the "same level" then a player who has vision i.e. can make an opening or space with a pass then he is going to be hitting balls into open spaces with no one near it..... its 50/50, thats what i mentioned before about keane and reid being on the "same level"

And, whoever said beckham doesnt have vision hasn't a clue. That pass to crouch was perfect vision cos he picked exactly where he had to put the ball, knowning the direction crouch was running and hit it perfectly over the defender and into that hole. UNreal pass. I cant remember when I have seen as good a pass as that.

**jmurphyc** · 22/11/2007, 1:57 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

And, whoever said beckham doesnt have vision hasn't a clue. That pass to crouch was perfect vision cos he picked exactly where he had to put the ball, knowning the direction crouch was running and hit it perfectly over the defender and into that hole. UNreal pass. I cant remember when I have seen as good a pass as that.

That was me. Can't remember the Crouch pass, I was in another room when someone told me England has scored so only got to see the last bit of the replay. I haven't really watched much of Beckham in a good while, but he is obviously an amazing passer but from what I can remember he doesn't generally thread through balls that show great awareness of any kind, they're usually just incredibly accurate. He'd only occasionally play a ball that shows great vision. However, perhaps I've just forgotten how good he is in regards to this.

**Superhoops** · 22/11/2007, 2:06 PM

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

According to The Indo the FAI are still trying to finalise the panel of "kingmakers".....

They should appoint Brian Barwick if only to warn them off appointing that fraud Venables.

**paul_oshea** · 22/11/2007, 2:08 PM

Originally Posted by jmurphyc

That was me. Can't remember the Crouch pass, I was in another room when someone told me England has scored so only got to see the last bit of the replay. I haven't really watched much of Beckham in a good while, but he is obviously an amazing passer but from what I can remember he doesn't generally thread through balls that show great awareness of any kind, they're usually just incredibly accurate. He'd only occasionally play a ball that shows great vision. However, perhaps I've just forgotten how good he is in regards to this.

I see what you are saying, and though correct to an extent, i think you are looking at it a bit one sided. His passess from one side to the other/over the top of defences is extremely accurate and that accuracy creates openings, players run on and in behind the defender. Its not just as simple as being extremely accurate, there is intelligence there, as he reads exactly where he has to hit it. YOu can be extremely accurate, but if you dont know where you want to hit it then it wont make the slight bit of difference i.e. it wont create openings and beckham can do this. We havent seen much of it lately but he can. His vision may not be as good as reids/on the same level but he certainly has it.

**jmurphyc** · 22/11/2007, 2:20 PM

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

I see what you are saying, and though correct to an extent, i think you are looking at it a bit one sided. His passess from one side to the other/over the top of defences is extremely accurate and that accuracy creates openings, players run on and in behind the defender. Its not just as simple as being extremely accurate, there is intelligence there, as he reads exactly where he has to hit it. YOu can be extremely accurate, but if you dont know where you want to hit it then it wont make the slight bit of difference i.e. it wont create openings and beckham can do this. We havent seen much of it lately but he can. His vision may not be as good as reids/on the same level but he certainly has it.

Yeah I pretty much agree with what you're saying. However, all I'm really trying to say is that whilst Beckham may have some vision, there are tons of players out there who have far more than them. For starters the 11 opposition players last night.

On another note just realised what thread this in. Didn't realise and sorry for completely bringing it off topic. Back to the new manager talk...

**soccerc** · 22/11/2007, 10:28 PM

Jewell out of the running.

New name for you - Pat Walker

**eirebhoy** · 22/11/2007, 10:38 PM

Really? Do you know much about him. Took me a while to find out he's manager of Orebro in Sweden.

**DmanDmythDledge** · 22/11/2007, 10:57 PM

One name that I don't think has been mentioned at all that I think would do a good job is Gordan Strachan. I'd obviously be surprised if he got the job/was interested but I found it a bit strange he hasn't been mentioned at all.

Also anyone see England's press conference this morning? The FAI could learn a thing or two from them.

**soccerc** · 22/11/2007, 11:02 PM

Giles now backing Venables with Jewell out of the race. Pat Walker has put his hat in the ring but could be too late

**ifk101** · 23/11/2007, 7:06 AM

Originally Posted by soccerc

Giles now backing Venables with Jewell out of the race. Pat Walker has put his hat in the ring but could be too late

Is that Pat Walker - our man in Sweden???

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Really? Do you know much about him. Took me a while to find out he's manager of Orebro in Sweden.

... "was" the manager.

**Stuttgart88** · 23/11/2007, 7:51 AM

Jewell out of running, down to Houllier & Venables I hear.

Pat Walker, now there's a name from leftfield. One of the guys on chatsoccer.eu is a big fan.

**ifk101** · 23/11/2007, 7:58 AM

If the FAI decided to appoint somebody to the U21 job as a stepping stone to the senior job, I think Patrick Walker would be a good choice for this job.

But as things currently stand he isn't what we are looking for.

**Stuttgart88** · 23/11/2007, 8:02 AM

If the media (Newstalk, Examiner, (non) Independent etc...) continue to either advocate or discuss Venables' candidacy surely they can also ask for opinions on people like Hodgson or Jol.

I hope to fcuk someone decent bumps into the FAI out in Durban.

It's time these "kingmakers" were announced asap.

**tetsujin1979** · 23/11/2007, 8:40 AM

Has anyone actually told the FAI that there's no way in hell the fans would support the appointment of Venables?
And even if someone did, would it make a difference?