Avery John - Registration trouble
From the Irish Times:
Longford face nine-point deduction over John affair
By Emmet Malone
10/10/02: Longford Town face the possibility that they will be deducted nine points by the Eircom League's Board of Control this evening after it emerged that Avery John may not have been properly registered while playing his first three games for the club.
Trinidad and Tobago international John signed for the Flancare Park club in mid-September after a brief spell in England, where he had been refused a work permit to play for Colchester United, and made his debut against Cork City. Since then he has played against Bray Wanderers and Bohemians.
But it emerged last week that while the FAI had forwarded an international clearance certificate for the player to the association in England, so that the 27 year-old could sign for the second division club, a similar document had not been sent in the opposite direction when he returned to this country.
Longford chairman Jim Hanley contends that if there has been a problem then the club should not be penalised, as it is the league that is ultimately responsible.
"After all that happened last season," he says, "we put mechanisms in place to guard against precisely this sort of thing and we have faxes from the league listing the players who are eligible for various games and Avery is on the relevant lists."
The practice at the league, however, is to send out lists of registered players and in this case while nobody appears to dispute that the club registered John in good faith, the absence of an international clearance would make the defender ineligible to play for the club.
According to the rules it is the responsibility of the club to supply an international clearance if one is required. This is in part because the FAI's international department is not required to inform the league of any clearances that it has issued for players leaving the country and there is therefore no expectation that the organisation should be aware of whether a player needs a clearance or not.
Longford's member of the board, Donald Keogh, is expected to contend that because John was refused a work permit and never played a game for Colchester, the international clearance is an irrelevance. When registering the player Longford listed his previous club as having been Bohemians but the question on the form apparently relates to what club the player was last "associated" with and having attempted to sign for Colchester - it is unclear whether he actually signed forms - it appears that the English club should have been listed here. In any case it is reported that the league's chairman, Michael Hyland, has since contacted the English FA to establish whether the clearance certificate sent by the FAI could simply be cancelled retrospectively but it was the view of officials at Soho Square that it could not and that a new cert would indeed have to be issued.
The club's potential difficulties are compounded by the fact a separate league rule states in the event a player leaves the country, and a clearance is issued for him, he may not play again here for a minimum of eight weeks, a period that elapsed only yesterday.
In addition it is alleged that, upon discovering the discrepancy one of the league's administrators, Sharon Smith, phoned Longford manager Alan Matthews shortly before last week's game against Bohemians and informed him that John should not play.
Matthews denies getting the warning in time, claiming "I got a call from the league when I was in the dressing room and wasn't in a position to take the call". He concedes, however, that he answered the phone but maintains, "the call was breaking down and when I checked afterwards there was a message" (to the effect that John should not play).
It is expected that this evening's board meeting will consider the matter and take an initial decision on what action to take. But if its members feel that Longford have broken the rules then they are obliged to dock the club three points for each game in which the player has played illegally.
If Longford are docked nine points it would leave the club joint bottom, although whatever decision is taken today, it is almost certain to be appealed.
"If we've done wrong then we'll stand up and accept the fact but I hope that the people in the league are prepared to do the same if, as we believe, the mistake turns out to be theirs," concludes Hanley.
From the Irish Independent:
Longford 'have case to answer'
Thursday October 10th 2002
ANOTHER player registration row has struck the Eircom League.
This time it's Longford Town and defender Avery John who are in trouble with the League, who have called an emergency Board of Control meeting today to rule on whether the Trinidad and Tobago international played three Premier Division games this season without being properly registered.
If the claims are upheld than Longford could lose nine points and plummet from fourth to joint bottom. The League's basis for argument is that that John didn't receive international clearance to return to Ireland after he went on trial to Colchester in the summer.
But Longford Town manager Alan Matthews believes the club has nothing to be alarmed about.
"We signed Avery and registered him with the League as we would any player. The registration was accepted and I understand we have written confirmation from the League that Avery was eligible to play for us," he said.
"Avery was released by Bohs and went to Colchester where he played in a couple of trial games but never signed for them. On his return, he was a free agent and we signed him.
"The League informed us we couldn't play him because he had a suspension to serve but the first we knew there might be a problem was last week when the League wrote to us. It's a mess but we feel it will be sorted out in our favour."
A League source said: "Avery John needed international clearance to leave the League, which he got, and he needed clearance on his return, which he didn't get. Longford have a case to answer."
It's unclear whether John was eligible to play for Longford so soon on his return as the rules state a player must wait eight weeks before playing again if he goes to another jurisdiction.
Shamrock Rovers manager Liam Buckley has completed the signing of Trevor Molloy on a two-year contract. Molloy, who was a free agent after being released by Carlisle, won a league medal under Buckley at St Pat's ('98/'99).
Dundalk will start interviews for the manager's job next week. Caretaker boss Ollie Ralph is favourite to succeed Martin Murray.
Philip Quinn
very depressed...
I believed Pat's were the true champions... but hey
I believed the league was in for a turn in fortunes...
TV3, increased attendances, a clean slate to begin a new season...
Being so excited about this season and BANG...
It even seems like we have done nothing wrong...
Welcome to our part of the table. Seriously though, this seems to be a league fúck up. If they sent you a list of eligible players and he was on it, I don't see how you can lose points.
We're not arrogant, we're just better.
AHH FOR FECKS SAKES!
Goes without saying that the TOWN have the full support of all REAL football fans for fighting this ludicrous red tape gone mad bull.
who bloody cares if his ITC wasnt 100% sorted????????
up until last season no-one in Ireland ever heard of such a thing and to be quite honest we were better off....nobody died...john was a town player, games were played and points were won and lost...life goes on......same ol' FAI quick to enforce rules and actions that will destroy the league and any chance of its promotion but nowhere to be seen when it comes to promoting the league....face it people, Hyland and the FAI actually HATE the eircom league and will do anything to destroy it.
the Irony isn't lost on me, a pats fan, that it was ex shels coach matthews who was involved in this: conclusive proof that shelbourne were full of sh:te last season and that this sort of annomally can happen to anyone.....and if we're honest absolutely NO club was in full compliance with the registration letter of the law last season.......absolute fools the fai.
Best of luck Longford, You'll need it you're dealing with pure hypocritical scum who hate the league
BEFORE THE W@NKERS from the rules is rules brigade saddle up their old high horses I'd like to add that registration and administrative irregularities should be punished by means of fines, not by means of deduction of points another reasonable and fairminded suggestion would be that the offending player could be suspended for the amount of games he was improperly registered foe
I believe 100% that this is more equitable than any form of ludicrous and soul destroying "points dedudction.
i'm really p;ssed off about this rubbish
WWS, I'm not even gettin into the Real fans thing or even the red tape stuff... As was said, the League put in place mechanisms, we followed exactly what it said on the sheet and we're talking of a nine point deduction which could relegate us...
But IF we don't get deducted points, why the fcuk is it being publicised....
at pats have been asking all season........there are two versions of last seasons row and basically we received a substantial cash settlement to keep it under wraps.....so who in the FAI is spinning stories that are damaging to the league..what agenda are they working to? its not the first negative press that has been leaked as soon as it happened to journalists....someone in merrion square know what they are doing and unfortunately its killing the eircom league
Chrsist sake, and you were having such a good season;. Europe even looked good for you. Why oh why didnt ye learn your lesson from Last season? Ye made a silly mistake then as well.
Im not going to be hypocritical, ye should lose the points, after all, ye broke the rules, just like Pats did last season (except they did it twice, W@nkers). its just a pity, because this league needs more provincial clubs like Longford, and less dublin SCUM.
(if ye go down, that means that Jan 4th will be our last lingford trip for quite a while)
Anyway, even with a deduction, I reckon that Longford are better than UCD and Bray, and are good enough to stay up.
City til I die.
Too true. This is ridiculos that it should happen again, but those tools in the FAI really just dont give a toss.Originally posted by wws
someone in merrion square know what they are doing and unfortunately its killing the eircom league
If the Eircom League send a fax to confirm eligible players, then they are wrong. On the given evidence at this time, I'm worried that the Longford take the rap over more eL/FAI crap which may relegate us... If Longfords fault, then fine I have no problem..."After all that happened last season, we put mechanisms in place to guard against precisely this sort of thing and we have faxes from the league listing the players who are eligible for various games and Avery is on the relevant lists."
oh for fcuks sake. Not again
Don´t know what to say really. Looks like it not really Longfords fault, so dunno whether penalising them is fair. International clearance is FAI´s job, not theirs AFAIK, so they can´t be held responsible, after all he never played for colchester.
yet again, merrion square fcuk up
Everfything said though, I think that quote from Matthews about the call "breaking down" does look kinda dodgy, doesn´t it
Originally posted by GWA
if ye go down, that means that Jan 4th will be our last lingford trip for quite a while
Seriously though, after last seasons fiasco this is the last thing the league needs. It sounds to me like the FAI fcuked up, if they accepted his regestration the I think they should take the responsibility instead of trying to shift the blame.
If on the other hand Longford are at fault then sorry but they got to be punished, maybe a fine would suffice as I aint in favour of deducting points from teams.
The FAI shouldnt have let this arise, it looks like they will never learn!
Champions!
thats about the bare bones of it alright.Originally posted by COLM
It sounds to me like the FAI fcuked up, if they accepted his regestration the I think they should take the responsibility instead of trying to shift the blame.
If longford fckued up, then they´ll have to take the same punishment as city did, and pats did. It´s harsh and in my book unjust to deduct points, but thats what the rules (sorry wws, I know you hate that word
Stunned into submission.Anyone any idea when this whole fiasco will be sorted, this is not the build up we wanted prior to playing the Drogs at NO2 Park. Even with the nine points deducted id still back us to get out of trouble, but i pray it doesnt come to that. What a mess.....
'Fascists dress in black and go round telling people what to do, where as priests.....'
Well about the international clearance bit, remember a few seasons back when derek Coughlan was at Luton on trial. When he returned he couldnt play for City for 2 odd months due to some rule. same deal with Molloy and Shels at the moment. Dont know if its the same here, but if it is the case the Longford have fooked up big time
Sfunny really, I really hope town dont get docked the points, yet i spent the whole of last season hoping Pats scum would be docked or even relegated. Its all where your priorities are i guess!!!!!!!!
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