What can be done to improve standards of EL Refs

**NY Hoop** · 06/09/2006, 3:03 PM

Originally Posted by R�iteoir

The ex-players thing has been tried in England - and it was a spectacular failure.

Steve Baines who had a 15 year career in the Football League was chosen as the player who would try this out - he was fast-tracked through the lower Leagues and found himself as a Football League referee in little over 5 years.

He lasted 2 seasons on the Football League before he was removed due to poor marks.

You've given one example. Just because it failed in a foreign league does it mean we have to say why bother?

KOH

**harpskid** · 06/09/2006, 3:21 PM

The ex-players becoming refs thing was tried in the local Leagues in Donegal and has also been fairly poor. The refs seem to have maintained the mentality of the player.

Probably has something to do with lack of proper training, which is a major problem imo

**R�iteoir** · 06/09/2006, 3:22 PM

That's the best known example - not the be all and end all...

For the life of me I cannot think of one single FIFA or top level referee anywhere in Europe who was an ex-player previously.

Not one

And you ask any players nowadays if they would consider taking up refereeing - 99.5% would say no straight off - becuase they know the amount hassle and abuse they would get.

**NY Hoop** · 06/09/2006, 3:25 PM

Originally Posted by R�iteoir

That's the best known example - not the be all and end all...

For the life of me I cannot think of one single FIFA or top level referee anywhere in Europe who was an ex-player previously.

Not one

And you ask any players nowadays if they would consider taking up refereeing - 99.5% would say no straight off - becuase they know the amount hassle and abuse they would get.

Agree but IMO it should be looked at. But only with proper training and make sure they are well compensated. It would only take one success and the recruitment would be made easier. Honestly can it get any worse?

KOH

**monzo** · 06/09/2006, 9:24 PM

Originally Posted by harpskid

There is though - refs are assessed at every game they officiate at. Kelly got a month's ban for that 'goal' and there have been other refs who have got similar bans for ****-ups in the past

Can they be punished for shocking performances?

Dave McKeon last year most definitely should have been.

I'm still angry to this day!

**tonydaly** · 09/09/2006, 9:29 AM

Originally Posted by robbiesdrogs

hot on the heels of last weeks "goal" in dalymount,we witnessed another shocking display of refereeing in united park against cork city.a penalty which i was told by somone with no interest in either team looked even more cast iron on tg4 than at the game.a couple of times he waited about ten seconds after a tackle to hear the crowds reaction before giving a free kick.yellow cards to one team for a tackle and not even a free when the same is done by the other team.

in fairness this seems an on going thin and its shocking that when everyone wants the league to improve the standards of refereeing are the worse anywhere.and before any cork fans think im being biased he was as bad to you as he was to us

I know what you are saying.It was a penalty but the ref got no help whatsoever from the muppet of a linesman who was about twenty yards away and dead in line with it. He had to have seen it. We had Corporal Clot Foley last Monday against Pats in Cork and he was truly awful. The ref last night also missed several hand balls for both teams. I was told that this ref was what the future of refereeing in Ireland was going to be. God help us.

**pete** · 09/09/2006, 9:51 AM

I think excellent decision by the referee in United Park. Defender dived in but O'Brien tried to trail his leg unsuccessfully and no contact made.

The linesman on the side opposite the camera was shocking. His positioning was terrible and caught behind the play far too often. He seemed to be in line with the most advanced forward as opposed to the 2nd last defender many times.

**tonydaly** · 09/09/2006, 10:45 AM

I believe you can't have a professional league without professional referees. A lot of the present Eircom League players have come up through the ranks,Under age,Minor,U21 etc until some of them make it to Eircom League standard. If the same were done for referees it would make a huge difference. Apprentice Referees like apprentice professional players. It would surely work. If need be import Referee Coaches/Teachers etc. Set up a Professional Referees School where students could take up refereeing as a career. It would have to be independant of any Referee Society or Union.
In the premiership in England you can't be a manager without reaching the Fifa "A" licence standard. Have something similar for Referees. "A" licence "B" licence etc. "A" standard licence to referee in the Premier Div and so on. Just a few ideas.

**Fair_play_boy** · 09/09/2006, 3:56 PM

Originally Posted by Block G Raptor

one way to inprove the standard is to sack the lot of them and employ a couple of dozen blind people to officiate. they'd be guaranteed to see more than most refs in the league

**TommyT** · 09/09/2006, 6:44 PM

Why not set the age of retirement a couple of years highr than in England and use their oldies ?

**iceman** · 09/09/2006, 7:54 PM

Originally Posted by pete

Defender dived in but O'Brien tried to trail his leg unsuccessfully and no contact made.

Pete , I think if you look at the TG4 footage you will come to a different conclusion , the defender went in with both feet , missed Fabio with his left and hacked him down with his right , its as clear as anything. Another refereeing c*ck-up.

**bigmac** · 11/09/2006, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by pete

I think excellent decision by the referee in United Park. Defender dived in but O'Brien tried to trail his leg unsuccessfully and no contact made.

Did you see any of the footage on TG4 at all? I thought it was the most cast-iron penalty I've seen turned down in a long time. Every time I saw it afterwards I was only more and more convinced. There was plenty of contact - wasn't even a questionable brush - he really caught O'Brien's leg and was nowhere near the ball.

EDIT: Can the yellow card for diving be rescinded afterwards? It's a definite situation where the referee should come out and say he's looked at the incident on TV and either defend his decision or hold his hand up and recommend rescinding the card in his report.

**BohsFans** · 11/09/2006, 5:27 PM

Longford boss blasts ref

September 5, 2006

Longford Town manager Alan Mathews has hit out at the performance of referee Dave McKeon during Sunday’s eircom League Premier Division defeat at the hands of Sligo Rovers.

The midlanders fell to a 2-0 loss at home to the Bit O’Red, both goals coming from long-range strikes by in-form Rovers star Harpal Singh.

But Mathews feels his side were harshly treated by refereeing decisions.

He told the Irish Sun: “The goals, while they were two great strikes, were assisted by dubious refereeing decisions.

“It’s not the first time we’ve found him wanting down here and that’s what’s most disappointing. I just hope he’s made accountable.”

------------------------------------------------------

nice fine for Matthews on its way

**micls** · 11/09/2006, 5:45 PM

Originally Posted by bigmac

EDIT: Can the yellow card for diving be rescinded afterwards? It's a definite situation where the referee should come out and say he's looked at the incident on TV and either defend his decision or hold his hand up and recommend rescinding the card in his report.

At the time i thought the card was for mouthing off and laying his hands on the ref rather than diving....could be wrong though

**Peadar** · 12/09/2006, 8:48 AM

Originally Posted by bigmac

I thought it was the most cast-iron penalty I've seen turned down in a long time.

There's only one camera angle where you can actually see the incident clearly and it shows the dive.
It's about time drogs were denied after all the dodgy decisions they got against Bohs this year.

O'Brien was booked for mouthing off, surely???

Speaking of which, I've seen a few games in the Premiership this season and the refs are clamping down bigtime on players who mouth off.
Glad to see it.

**bigmac** · 12/09/2006, 9:42 AM

Originally Posted by Peadar

There's only one camera angle where you can actually see the incident clearly and it shows the dive.
It's about time drogs were denied after all the dodgy decisions they got against Bohs this year.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one Peadar. Any other non-Drogs or Cork see the match out there?
Wasn't sure what the booking was for but if it's for mouthing off then no problem with it.

**Peadar** · 12/09/2006, 9:55 AM

Originally Posted by bigmac

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one Peadar.

I stood up for Stokes in the Cup against Longball, when he gave the penalty and sent off Mick. He made a call and that's what you want from a ref. Rico very famously lost the plot after that game.

What I would say about Stokes though, is that he does tend to stop the game quite a bit but for the most part, he's a good ref.

**fitzknows** · 12/09/2006, 10:32 AM

Anyone know how much a league of Ireland ref gets paid per game?

**harpskid** · 12/09/2006, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by fitzknows

Anyone know how much a league of Ireland ref gets paid per game?

Depends on their travel etc.

**OneRedArmy** · 12/09/2006, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by fitzknows

Anyone know how much a league of Ireland ref gets paid per game?

Depends on the size of Shels tax bill at the time*.

*this was intended as a joke and in no way indicates that Shelbourne are engaged in paying off referees or officials or in any way engaged in criminal activity, other than those that club officials have already been convicted for.