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Thread: Advice on the Laws of the Game

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    Youth Team The Ref's Avatar
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    Foot.ie! Advice on the Laws of the Game

    If anyone would like advice on the laws of the game, I will answer them how I see them.

    I'm a referee myself with over twenty years experence, and like everybody else I have made some clangers , but every clanger I make, I learn something new, and hopefully I will never make the same mistake again.

    I will not get into slanging matches about referees and mistakes they may have made. Referees are only human and make mistakes (like players and managers alike) only they don't have a team to cover for them.

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    I'm going to sticky this for a while and see how it goes as its an important thread that might answer some of the questions that spring up here every season.

    Keep the questions civil and just about football.

    PS: Thanks Ref.
    Last edited by the 12 th man; 22/08/2006 at 7:58 AM.

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    hi ref,
    just 1 on the quick free kick, when a player wants to take it quick and he kicks the ball off an oponent who is in the way,a yellow card i thought but alot of junior football refs dont use it, is it ever brought to notice at meetings??
    well done btw i hope this thread will be of benefit to us all.

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    Youth Team The Ref's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigguy View Post
    hi ref,
    just 1 on the quick free kick, when a player wants to take it quick and he kicks the ball off an oponent who is in the way,a yellow card i thought but alot of junior football refs dont use it, is it ever brought to notice at meetings??
    well done btw i hope this thread will be of benefit to us all.
    Bigguy

    Two conditions must be met before a caution (yellow card) can be given:

    1. The referee must be happy to allow a quick free kick and;

    2. The player must be deliberately trying to stop a quick free kick.

    If the player who is not 10 yards away is there unintentionally (i.e. he is not deliberately attempting to stop the quick free kick) then no yellow card is to issue, in fact the referee can allow play to continue.

    If the player is attempting to stop the quick free kick then a yellow card should be shown.

    If the referee is not happy for the free kick to proceed e.g. a player is injured or referee is not in a good position, he is under no obligation to allow it. I personally allow quick free kicks as often as possible but what annoys me is the attacking team attempting to hit an opposition player who is not ten yards away to get him cautioned.

    I hope this clarifies this for you

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    Will the LDMC be bringing the refs up to speed on the offside rule. A ref at the weekend was lost. Ball played forward by player for team A, team A attacker offside, Team B defender tried to get head to ball but just grazes it, team A forward runs onto it, still offside from the initial pass. Ref deems him onside as team b defender touched it. Team B show amazing restraint after pathetic call.

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    First Team Goals4fun's Avatar
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    has the rule changed inrelation to offside. if a a ball is played through to a striker and another striker is walking back from an offside position and does not make an attempt to get involved what is the rule. The players in question were 20 yards apart and you could not mistake who the ball was played to and who was going for it. It was mid way inside the half so the keeper was not obstructed??? i expect that this should have been play on ?

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    Is that in relation to my post? If so, no your situation has nothing to do with mine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadend View Post
    Will the LDMC be bringing the refs up to speed on the offside rule. A ref at the weekend was lost. Ball played forward by player for team A, team A attacker offside, Team B defender tried to get head to ball but just grazes it, team A forward runs onto it, still offside from the initial pass. Ref deems him onside as team b defender touched it. Team B show amazing restraint after pathetic call.
    Hi Roadend

    The LDMC has no part to play in discussing rules of the game with referees, this is a matter for the referees society. But if clubs feel strongly they can write to the LDMC and we can bring their concerns to the Refs.

    I will let the expert answer your query on the offside rule, as i would probably just muddy the water
    Last edited by Old keeper; 21/08/2006 at 4:13 PM. Reason: grammar

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    Just one other question Old Keeper, he insisted on not giving the offside till the offending player touched the ball, or at least he said he was doing this after about 20 minutes. Its junior football without linesmen, surely this will just cause a lot more problems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadend View Post
    Just one other question Old Keeper, he insisted on not giving the offside till the offending player touched the ball, or at least he said he was doing this after about 20 minutes. Its junior football without linesmen, surely this will just cause a lot more problems.

    Roadend,I think Old Keeper has suggested that "The Ref" is the person to answer your specific queries about the rules of the game so I'd suggest you stop directing your questions towards him (Old Keeper) and we'll await the Refs answer .
    Last edited by the 12 th man; 21/08/2006 at 4:52 PM.

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    First Team smellyfeet's Avatar
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    Swearing

    Quote Originally Posted by The Ref View Post
    If anyone would like advice on the laws of the game, I will answer them how I see them.
    .
    Ref.
    What is the rule on the above. There are some refs that stop games every couple of minuites cos players are swearing. Now i understand the fact that you can't go around the pitch using bad language but just say a player makes a mistake and say's B0llox or something like that. Is it in the rules that they are to be booked or what is the story....on telly players are constantly telling the ref to Fcuk off and nothing is done.
    If you're in the penalty area and don't know what to do with the ball, put it in the net and we'll discuss the options later

    FORM IS TEMPORARY, CLASS IS PERMANENT

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadend View Post
    Just one other question Old Keeper, he insisted on not giving the offside till the offending player touched the ball, or at least he said he was doing this after about 20 minutes. Its junior football without linesmen, surely this will just cause a lot more problems.
    Hi Roadend

    The ref will keep us all informed so I will wait for him too. but remember refs are not infallable and can make mistakes as well and like a keepers the mistakes are usually catastrophic. so while the rules can be explained the human factor is always there.

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    Youth Team The Ref's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadend View Post
    Will the LDMC be bringing the refs up to speed on the offside rule. A ref at the weekend was lost. Ball played forward by player for team A, team A attacker offside, Team B defender tried to get head to ball but just grazes it, team A forward runs onto it, still offside from the initial pass. Ref deems him onside as team b defender touched it. Team B show amazing restraint after pathetic call.
    The "new" offside rule (it changed for last season), is that no offence has taken place until the player in an offside position actually plays the ball (the act of just being there is not an offence). However if the last mans (usually the keeper) view is obstructed by a player in an offside position that player is deemed offside. From what you said the referee was right under the laws to allow play to continue, but in practice 99% of referees would have blown him up for offside.

    Just so you know, these laws and their interpretation are set by FIFA and they have caused uproar with referees up and down the country, unfortunately we only uphold the laws, we don't make them.

    Also may I reiterate what Old Keeper said "The LDMC has no part to play in discussing rules of the game with referees, this is a matter for the referees society. But if clubs feel strongly they can write to the LDMC and we can bring their concerns to the Refs." The FAI and the Referees Society are the competent authorities for keeping the referees up to date with the rules.
    Last edited by The Ref; 21/08/2006 at 8:08 PM. Reason: additional comment
    Smile........ it confuses people

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goals4fun View Post
    has the rule changed inrelation to offside. if a a ball is played through to a striker and another striker is walking back from an offside position and does not make an attempt to get involved what is the rule. The players in question were 20 yards apart and you could not mistake who the ball was played to and who was going for it. It was mid way inside the half so the keeper was not obstructed??? i expect that this should have been play on ?
    The "new" offside rule (it changed for last season), is that no offence has taken place until the player in an offside position actually plays the ball (the act of just being there is not an offence). If the player who was offside gains no advantage from being in that position then he is not offside.
    Smile........ it confuses people

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    Youth Team The Ref's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellyfeet View Post
    Ref.
    What is the rule on the above. There are some refs that stop games every couple of minuites cos players are swearing. Now i understand the fact that you can't go around the pitch using bad language but just say a player makes a mistake and say's B0llox or something like that. Is it in the rules that they are to be booked or what is the story....on telly players are constantly telling the ref to Fcuk off and nothing is done.
    There are two rules this can come under

    1. Discent - yellow card

    2. A player uses offensive or insulting or abusive language and/or gestures - straight red card (this was once foul and abusive lauguage)

    Its really a judgement call, I would agree that some referees get hot and bothered about this, I was at a game in Dublin last year and a player missed an open goal from 1yard and roared "ah B0ll0x" and the referee sent him off, technically he was right, but come on!

    The rule is if the if the referee deems it as disscent to one of his discision (or lack off) he may stop the game and caution the player.

    If he feels it is more serious and is offensive or insulting he must stop the game and dismiss the player.

    He should never stop the game, give a free kick and not issue a card.

    Is this what you where looking for and does this help?
    Smile........ it confuses people

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    Biased against YOUR club pineapple stu's Avatar
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    I remember someone saying to me once that a certain amount of - non-directional - swearing shuld be let go as it's just the players' way of letting off steam. So the example you mention above should be ignored, but if a player aggressively said "Boll0x" after a penalty decision, that's dissent and should be booked.

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    Youth Team The Ref's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pineapple stu View Post
    I remember someone saying to me once that a certain amount of - non-directional - swearing shuld be let go as it's just the players' way of letting off steam. So the example you mention above should be ignored, but if a player aggressively said "Boll0x" after a penalty decision, that's dissent and should be booked.
    I agree, but some referees don't have that thick of skin. Even if a player shouts "Fcuk off ref" after a penalty decision I generally let it go, I've played a bit so I remember what its like. However if a player makes a run torward me then I will take action.
    Smile........ it confuses people

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    Youth Team The Ref's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old keeper View Post
    Hi Roadend

    The ref will keep us all informed so I will wait for him too. but remember refs are not infallable and can make mistakes as well and like a keepers the mistakes are usually catastrophic. so while the rules can be explained the human factor is always there.
    Thanks for the support Old Keeper.

    Everybody should remember that a referee acts as judge, jury and in the case of red cards Executioner. Of course we get it wrong on occasion and as Old Keeper said the results can be catastrophic. Another thing, if I'm having a bad game, I know it, 22 others on the pitch telling me doesn’t help.

    When you have a bad game, there’s no worse feeling in the world, even one error (that changes the course of the game) can sully your mood. In saying that there is no better feeling in the world when you perform well.

    I personally don't do it for the money, and contrary to popular belief most referees don't either. The match fee, which seems at first glance quite generous, is no reward for the stick that you put up with week in, week out. When players and managers appreciate you it makes it all worthwhile.

    I appreciate everyone taking the time to post their questions to the site and as I said in my introduction I will answer them as best I can. If I don’t explain something and you want clarification, just ask, I will endeavour to give you what your looking for, it is only through dialogue that we can all understand one another’s point of view.

    Just for the record, this has not been given the support of the FAI or the Referees Society (I have not sought it, nor do I intend to seek it).

    The life of a referee isn’t easy, but maybe this will give us all a better understanding (and a bit of fun along the way)

    Talk Soon

    The Ref
    Smile........ it confuses people

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ref View Post
    The FAI and the Referees Society are the competent authorities.....
    Paradox
    Last edited by soccerc; 22/08/2006 at 1:19 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roadend View Post
    Just one other question Old Keeper, he insisted on not giving the offside till the offending player touched the ball, or at least he said he was doing this after about 20 minutes. Its junior football without linesmen, surely this will just cause a lot more problems.
    There are two reasons that there are no referees assistants (linesmen) in Junior football

    1. A shortage of people "mad enough" to become referees

    2. Most Junior clubs resent having to pay match fees, never mind having to pay more for assistants.

    The number of referees has dwindled in recent times, old keeper could tell the number of active referees in Limerick (LDMC) (I don't know) and I'm pretty sure, that if he checked the names of referees five years ago, there would be few new names (maybe two or three). This is the same all over the country.

    A worrying aspect is the amount of verbal abuse vented toward the referee and in worst case seranio assaults, thankfully the latter is not prevelant but if the various leagues don't keep it in check it will become a real problem in five to ten years time.

    From what I can gather, the LDMC (which from reading through th threads is where the majority are from) is a progressive and well run league. Of course players, administrators and referees will have disagreements, but thats the nature of sport, if we all had the same opinion, life would be boring.

    A final word to Old Keeper - your web-site is great, one of the best in the country. Your league and Leinster Senior League have put a lot of effort and time into putting a quick and easy line of communication out to the public - keep up the good work.

    The Ref
    Last edited by the 12 th man; 22/08/2006 at 7:57 AM.
    Smile........ it confuses people

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