NI support

[Not Brazil]

Except that ('Great')Britain geographically is England, Scotland & Wales!

Well, geographically I'm (Northern) Irish - I am also a "British Citizen", of the United Kingdom Of Great Britain & Northern Ireland.

Plenty of this stuff on the Passports row thread. No need to duplicate it here.

"My judging of the 'progress', is based entirely on talking to & knowing some of your fans"

Righty ho - you're an expert then!

[EalingGreen]

My judging of the 'progress', is based entirely on talking to & knowing some of your fans . As well as observation of the wider fanbase on a collective basis!

Whereas NotBrazil, David, myself, the City of Brussels, UEFA, FIFA, Police forces in Austria and Poland (inter alia) and others prefer to judge on the evidence of our own eyes.
Which reminds me, you never indicated exactly what "personal experience of the North" makes you unable to countenance visiting Windsor Park for a football match, when you might consider The Maze, and have recently visited Stormont for a cricket match.
I mean to say, if a former INLA man can emerge unscathed (and tolerably favourably impressed), I find it hard to imagine what could deter you. Allergic to Protestant grass*, maybe?


* - It's green, btw, even at Windsor...

[EalingGreen]

Except that ('Great')Britain geographically is England, Scotland & Wales!

And, geographically speaking, the "British Isles" take in the entire archipelago, including Dear Oul' Oireland.

Which proves, of course, exactly zilch. Any chance we could stick to football?

[EalingGreen]

The 'Brit.Isles' is an old colonial term.....though I would it mainly consists of 2 large islands, Britain and Ireland!

As for 'Whinger' Park, assuming I could get in again I'm not overly keen. Have also been invited by Linfield fans, but I'm in no great rush to return......it's even more of a kip than Lansdowne!

Your preoccupation (no pun intended) with geographical definitions and terminology baffles me, since it really has nothing to do with football in general, or this thread in particular.

And now it appears your reluctance to set foot in Windsor has nothing to do with your previously stated "personal experience of the North"; rather it may be more to do with comfort or facilities, or somesuch?

Make your mind up: are you one of "The Boys of the Old Brigade" or one of "The Prawn Sandwich Brigade"?

[David]

Geographically speaking, Great Britain merely refers to the largest island in the British Isles therefore it is correct to say that Northern Ireland is not part of Great Britain and hence the term the "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

[dcfcsteve]

So that means what exactly, a la their 'Brit' claim? Is it then now part of 'Little Britain'?! That would explain a lot!

'Britain' is a geographical place. 'British' is a concept of nationality. The 2 do not have to overlap perfectly - hence Falkland Islanders or people from the Isle of Man, for example, have UK/British nationality/citizenship, even though they are neithEr form nor part of Britain.

Plenty of other countries have similar situations. Hawaii is not part of North America, yet its people are called 'Americans' and have 'American (i.e. US)' passports. Likewise, Puerto Rico is not part of the United States of America, but it's citizens have US passports.

[EalingGreen]

So that means what exactly, a la their 'Brit' claim? Is it then now part of 'Little Britain'?! That would explain a lot!

FFS!

This thread is entitled "NI support". These days, only a tiny and unrepresentative minority of the NI support is interested in affirming their position on such petty and irrelevant considerations as the above.
I started posting on this thread in an attempt to provide a perspective from a regular fan, who has come to the view that as an NI fan, I am showing my support for eleven guys from my wee part of the world when they play football against eleven guys from another part of the world - nothing more, nothing less. As such, matches at Windsor (and away) offer a welcome opportunity to mix with people from diverse backgrounds for this one common purpose - and win, lose or draw it's mighty crack.
I had also hoped that the debate on this forum might give people an opportunity to learn more about each other, for my benefit as much as anyones. In particular, I had hoped that RDB (one of the most active contributors) might learn that we in the GAWA are not all obsessed with irrelevant political or religious matters. Sadly, it appears that I've not made much progress.
I, however, have learned something about RDB; namely, he's a small minded tithead, who isn't really interested in football in NI, or its supporters, other than as a pretext to bang on and on and on and on and on and on and on ad nauseum about petty little quarrels which the sane part of the rest of the world is trying to leave behind...

P.S. I had hoped to use the "sad" icon at the end of my post, but find myself frustrated by RDB even here, seeing as how he has already used up three icons in his own magnum opus quoted at the start of this post. Typical.

[David]

Look, I don't have a particular problem with you, or various Norn Iron fans of my acquaintance, generally.
The world has moved on;Maybe the vast majority forget their views at the match, but given the ones I know are 'moderates', their views(which they are perfectly entitled to)away from football......don't quite square that circle and present this same sunny view.
Not I would expect them to change so dramatically. Credit for the work that has been done, but there is a long long way to go, which will take years to conclude this process, IMO.

Why can you not differentiate between a person's political viewpoint and how they behave at a football game? I have my own political views but do not use a football match as a vehicle to air them, the two are completely separate yet you seem to continually want to put the two together.

[Not Brazil]

Why can you not differentiate between a person's political viewpoint and how they behave at a football game? I have my own political views but do not use a football match as a vehicle to air them, the two are completely separate yet you seem to continually want to put the two together.

Nail, head, hit David.

Please bear in mind that RDBloomfield hasn't been to a Northern Ireland game.

"Credit for the work that has been done, but there is a long long way to go, which will take years to conclude this process, IMO."

Correct. "Work In Progress".

Has anyone claimed any differently?

[Not Brazil]

RDBloomfield,

"Yer wrong & yer right......been to some.......& even supported them!"

Good for you - when was the last time you went to a Northern Ireland game?

"WIP is a good summary. Good luck with it for the future"

Thanks.

"As for being 'political', I've hardly met anyone who doesn't have a stance on Unionism/Nationalism from the North,let alone the rest of Ireland!"

Don't mean they have to bring their "politics" through the turnstiles with them.

Most nationalists support the ROI, most unionists support Northern Ireland.

I've no issues with that.

That's largely born out of the fact that most nationalists/republicans would rather there wasn't a Northern Ireland.

"In a Utopian world, sport & politics wouldn't overlap"

Agreed.

Interestingly, the largest sporting association on the island of Ireland is wedded to nationalist/republican political outlook.

"but this is the real world"

Yes - we live on an island whose people are extremely politically divided.

"So you have to set peoples' opinions in this context"

There's nothing wrong with having a "unionist" (ie. wishing Northern Ireland to remain part of the United Kingdom) opinion, is there?

I have no desire to express my "unionism" at football matches.

When I go to watch Northern Ireland, I ain't going to express anything other than support for footballers who come from this part of the world, playing against footballers from other parts of the world. It's as simple as that.

[Gather round]

At risk of turning this thread into a foot.ie Lisdoonvarna, I think my old chums RDB, EG and NB should meet up at a game. My birthday party at the Oberrhein stadion, Liechtenstein next March, maybe? Drinks on yours truly.

Or closer to home, since EG supports Sp*rs and RDB lives near Cashburden Grows, Arse***, what about the next North London derby? NB I think may be Chelsea, but RDB won't go there on principle. Or in practice, the way Leeds and their want-away striker are playing

[Not Brazil]

At risk of turning this thread into a foot.ie Lisdoonvarna, I think my old chums RDB, EG and NB should meet up at a game. My birthday party at the Oberrhein stadion, Liechtenstein next March, maybe? Drinks on yours truly.

I'll be there, and thanks very much for the invite.

[EalingGreen]

Finally, If those 2 gents really want to meet me, though at least one is based in N-E Ulster no(?).....suppose you could drag me down at a pinch to that pub you insist on going to in W.London?

I shall be in the Three Kings next Wednesday (6th) from around 7 pm - you'll know me, I'll have a drink in my hand...

[Not Brazil]

Secondly the Union Flag is flown at Windsor Park, on a flagpole beside the tunnel.

It does for Blues games, but not for Internationals.

Two official flags flew at the tunnel on Saturday - both FIFA related flags.

The Union Flag is not flown in any official capacity at Internationals in Windsor Park.

[-lamb-]

There is no such thing as a NI flag. The flag you refer to is the flag of the now defunct NI Parliament and was confirmed to have no status by the British Government in 1973.

cry me a(nother) river............
as you keep saying...and keep getting told to tell uefa/fifa etc about how outraged you feel by it since that is the flag THEY (and every other sensible person) use to represent Northern Ireland.
http://www.uefa.com/footballEurope/c...=63/index.html
http://www.uefa.com/competitions/EUR...=63/index.html
http://www.fifa.com/en/organisation/...ountrycode=NIR

i take it you're busy today as this seems a straight c'n'p of repeated posts you've made elsewhere.
(a bit like most people's posts in here to be honest - slag northern ireland or try to point score against them/it, berate all associated with the place as bigots or, alternatively, defend against said staid accusations by pointing out that the majority are just blind personal opinion without much factual bearing)

[Mr_Parker]

cry me a(nother) river............
as you keep saying...and keep getting told to tell uefa/fifa etc about how outraged you feel by it since that is the flag THEY (and every other sensible person) use to represent Northern Ireland.
http://www.uefa.com/footballEurope/c...=63/index.html
http://www.uefa.com/competitions/EUR...=63/index.html
http://www.fifa.com/en/organisation/...ountrycode=NIR

i take it you're busy today as this seems a straight c'n'p of repeated posts you've made elsewhere.
(a bit like most people's posts in here to be honest - slag northern ireland or try to point score against them/it, berate all associated with the place as bigots or, alternatively, defend against said staid accusations by pointing out that the majority are just blind personal opinion without much factual bearing)

Ask the IFA why they haven't informed Fifa/Uefa why they have not correct Fifa & Uefa's error on which flag they use. I have and have yet to get a straight answer in fact some of the answers I have got it in the past only confirmed the 'time warp' (could use a few other expressions at this point) some of them are in.

As for slagging Northern Ireland, you only have to read ILF or OWC over the last couple of days to see that NI fans have been quite capable of doing that for themselves.

[-lamb-]

the slagging remark wasn't specifically at you, it was at the c'n'p style posts in general that a lot of people seem to have sitting about ready to post. i know this isn't strictly true, but thats the image thats conjured.
which flag would you suggest northern ireland use btw?
if you can find me a flag thats specifically a northern ireland flag other than the one used then maybe i'll consider backing you in your quest. would you REALLY want the union flag? technically you are probably correct but in real everyday terms the flag commonly used is the one that represents northern ireland. if you want a new one, thats fits your penchant for "officialdom", may i suggest lobbying your political representatives instead of stirring on a football forum.

the slagging you are referring to involves a performance from a football team, the slagging i am referring to involves blanket calling of all northern ireland fans as sectarian bigots (something i personally find extremely offensive and bigoted in itself) and the place in its existence. thats a massive difference. i'm sure you know yourself this is untrue. it would be nice, if i am right, that that opinion was also expressed instead of picking up on a technicality.

[dcfcsteve]

which flag would you suggest northern ireland use btw? if you can find me a flag thats specifically a northern ireland flag other than the one used then maybe i'll consider backing you in your quest.

I suspect this one meets your brief, for example :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Proposed_NI_Flag.png

And it also cunningly includes elements of both traditions to a balanced degree.

[-lamb-]

no necessarily my brief steve, but maybe mr.p's.
i've seen it before. wouldn't bother me if that was my national flag. its basically the old ulster flag with elements of the current (non official, for mr.p) northern ireland flag, correct?

[Mr_Parker]

which flag would you suggest northern ireland use btw?
if you can find me a flag thats specifically a northern ireland flag other than the one used then maybe i'll consider backing you in your quest. would you REALLY want the union flag? technically you are probably correct but in real everyday terms the flag commonly used is the one that represents northern ireland. if you want a new one, thats fits your penchant for "officialdom", may i suggest lobbying your political representatives instead of stirring on a football forum.

No need to stir anything. The stance of the IFA on the subject (Uefa/Fifa websites) leaves themselves wide open. Yes I believe the Union flag would be the correct one therefore no need for me to lobby any politicos. I will just keep lobbying the football representatives and force them out of their little 'comfort zone.'
BTW you do recall the IFA jumping to the tune of the politicians, Gregory Campbell if I recall correctly, when in error Fifa website in error listed the Irish language and some other bits and bobs on their website a few tears back but were content to allow the error of the flag remain despite this being pointed out to them and which the conveniently ignored.