Are we really THAT bad?

**OwlsFan** · 15/06/2006, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by Fergie's Son

Thank you for this. I have been trumpeting the virtues of Sheridan for some time now. A real classy player who should have played more games for Ireland!

One slight problem with Sheridan - he lacked pace and his defensive abiliities weren't great. Great passer of the ball, love him to bits for scoring the winner against Man U in the League Cup Final in 1991 (Wednesday's only trophy in 60 years), the goal in the home 1-3 defeat by Spain which ultimately proved so important but when I take off my blue and white blinkers I could always see he wasn't the finished article and Andy Townsend and Ronnie Whelan would always have got the nod ahead of him for Ireland. We had plenty of riches in midfield in those days and then Roy Keane came along as well so his number of opportunities for Ireland would always be limited.

The loss of Roy Keane is midfield is huge and almost impossible to replace. I am reasonably happy with us up front, outwide and at the back (just). We must find two central midfielders sooner rather than later othewise it's back to the bad old days I fear.

**el punter** · 15/06/2006, 1:16 PM

On the Sheridan debate:

He was a lovely footballer in an Ireland team that didn't pass through midfield. Suffered a little like Brady by being unsuited to a style of play that more labour-minded though less talented players such as Townsend revelled in.

Scored a cracking goal against Bolivia before we went to the US World Cup.

**Fergie's Son** · 15/06/2006, 3:09 PM

Sheridan pretty much forced his way into the Ireland team despite Charlton's dislike of that sort of player. Whelan was really out of the picture as a mainstay when Sheridan was reaching his peak. Coupled with a good tackling mdifielder Sheridan was deadly and really was worth his place in the team.

One problem I have with all of us looking back to teams of the past is that we neglect the fact that we have done well even with a weak team.

We need look no further than the 2002 WC. That team was fairly poor. Staunton and Harte as centre backs. Duff up front will Kilbane and Finnan on the wings. A mighty non-tackling midfield of Kinsella and Holland.

Yet we should have beaten Cameroon. Deserved our draw with Germany and were as good as Spain on the day.

So it can be done.

**concanta** · 15/06/2006, 4:34 PM

Very true. i believe our team now is as good as the team that performed at wc2002 - it definitely can be done - instill belief again and build a team spirit and if we are lucky with a couple of the young players coming through then we will be ok

**stojkovic** · 15/06/2006, 8:26 PM

Originally Posted by Fergie's Son

Sheridan pretty much forced his way into the Ireland team despite Charlton's dislike of that sort of player. Whelan was really out of the picture as a mainstay when Sheridan was reaching his peak. Coupled with a good tackling mdifielder Sheridan was deadly and really was worth his place in the team.

One problem I have with all of us looking back to teams of the past is that we neglect the fact that we have done well even with a weak team.

We need look no further than the 2002 WC. That team was fairly poor. Staunton and Harte as centre backs. Duff up front will Kilbane and Finnan on the wings. A mighty non-tackling midfield of Kinsella and Holland.

Yet we should have beaten Cameroon. Deserved our draw with Germany and were as good as Spain on the day.

So it can be done.

I think you will find that Sheridan only got his game in USA94 as a result of Quinn doing his cruciate. It forced Jack to play five across the middle and try and slow it down in the heat. I always liked Sheridan.

Harte played LEFT FULL in all four games at WC2002. Breen partnered Staunton. Finnan played RIGHT FULL in all games with Gary Kelly in front of him.

We'd have beaten Cameroon if McCarthy hadn't gambled on an injured unfit McAteer with Gary Kelly at full back leaving the (voted) best right full in premiership that season on the bench, Finnan. He rectified it at half time and salvaged a draw against a poor team.

**boysingreen** · 15/06/2006, 8:30 PM

Well we can forget African teams for a few years now anyway.

I firmly believe our Euro group is going to be very much up for grabs, and between ourselves, Czechs, the Germans, and the Slovaks, there's bound to be a lot of jockeying. There's no Brazil or Argentina in this group, none of us know what team of any of the 4 is going to show up. If we fail it'll most likely be our own fault, like the last campaign.

My main fear at this point in time is predictably Rosicky.

**el punter** · 15/06/2006, 8:43 PM

I think the one thing that really needs to change with Ireland is the 'good draw' syndrome. We pat ourselves on the backs for the shared points we pick up with brave performances around the qualifying groups. It's not good enough.

Games must be won. Even away games against decent teams, we should be out there playing to take the win everytime. Leaving it late in the group needing home wins just doesnt work.

Attacking football - it's the way forward

**Stuttgart88** · 16/06/2006, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by el punter

I think the one thing that really needs to change with Ireland is the 'good draw' syndrome. We pat ourselves on the backs for the shared points we pick up with brave performances around the qualifying groups. It's not good enough.

Games must be won. Even away games against decent teams, we should be out there playing to take the win everytime. Leaving it late in the group needing home wins just doesnt work.

Attacking football - it's the way forward

Couldn't agree more. Whoever said in advance of Tel Aviv that a draw would be a good result was being defeatist. We can no longer expect to win most of our home games (look at the last group - 2 home points from FRA, ISR & SWISS) & we should look at EVERY game as an opportunity to pick up points.

However, given our current situation, i.e., rebuilding & trying to bring in younger & fringer players, I'd be happy after the first few games simply to be keeping up. I think we'll be a materially better side in 8-10 months.

**drinkfeckarse** · 16/06/2006, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by stojkovic

Finnan played RIGHT FULL in all games with Gary Kelly in front of him.

We'd have beaten Cameroon if McCarthy hadn't gambled on an injured unfit McAteer with Gary Kelly at full back leaving the (voted) best right full in premiership that season on the bench, Finnan. He rectified it at half time and salvaged a draw against a poor team.

I was sure Finnan came on and went to right midfield though....

**concanta** · 16/06/2006, 12:20 PM

Yes I could not agree more - we need to keep up with the pace early on.
I am not being defeatistic or playing our chances down but it wouldn't be the end of the world to draw the games with czechs and germans and win other 2 at the end of this year - I believe the team will be much stronger next year - I still thin kwe have a chance of shocking the Germans in September - that would be awesome to have a start like that

**OwlsFan** · 23/06/2006, 9:54 PM

Well, I wouldn't read too much into that. Both would have been disappointed not to come out of a group containing Sth Korea and Togo.

**The Legend** · 24/06/2006, 4:17 AM

Sheridan... a poor man's Matt Le Tissier... both skillfull but generally having a nap for 89 minutes

**DmanDmythDledge** · 24/06/2006, 11:04 AM

France will not make the quater finals but Switzerland will.

**eirebhoy** · 24/06/2006, 11:24 AM

Switzerland have been very impressive. I thought they were ok in the euros too but not many agreed. They dominated their game against England for the first hour but couldn't score and then lost a man. They drew with Croatia and were beating France up until the last 15 minutes. I underrated them in the last qualifiers and we have to admit now that they are a decent team.

**mypost** · 24/06/2006, 4:29 PM

Originally Posted by eirebhoy

Switzerland have been very impressive. They drew with Croatia and were beating France up until the last 15 minutes. I underrated them in the last qualifiers and we have to admit now that they are a decent team.

Actually, Switzerland were only drawing with France until late in the game. They never took the lead in either championship, until they beat the mighty Togo the other day. I can't think of a luckier team than Switzerland in Europe at the moment. They were very fortunate to make the finals, they got an easy group when they got there, have a relatively easy 2nd round draw, and are the only team in the finals, who have qualified for the next tournament already. Who will burst their bubble?

**eirebhoy** · 24/06/2006, 5:11 PM

Originally Posted by mypost

Actually, Switzerland were only drawing with France until late in the game.

Apologies, my memories fading.

**CollegeTillIDie** · 24/06/2006, 6:39 PM

Originally Posted by mypost

Actually, Switzerland were only drawing with France until late in the game. They never took the lead in either championship, until they beat the mighty Togo the other day. I can't think of a luckier team than Switzerland in Europe at the moment. They were very fortunate to make the finals, they got an easy group when they got there, have a relatively easy 2nd round draw, and are the only team in the finals, who have qualified for the next tournament already. Who will burst their bubble?

Switzerland are the only WORLD CUP team automatically qualified for EURO 2008. Austria are also automatically in those championships.

**mypost** · 25/06/2006, 5:04 AM

Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie

Switzerland are the only WORLD CUP team automatically qualified for EURO 2008.

You just couldn't resist, stating the obvious.

**osarusan** · 28/06/2006, 2:40 AM

Well I'm the one who started this thread and have to admit that after bloody terrible first game, the Swiss actually looked decent at times, especially defensively, and France are starting to look like they could win the thing on the sly!!