National Anthem

[David]

I alike every other el fan will keep "patriotic" songs well away until Ireland matches. Glentoran fans who from the most part come from the loyalist areas of East Belfast feel absolutely no need to be "patriotic" at domestic games but I'm sure they are still proud of their identity. What place has GSTQ or RB got in domestic matches?

As I have stated numerous times, I would prefer that they were not sung. However, these people are doing no wrong in singing patriotic songs. You simply want to force your belief that they should not be sung at football matches on others and that is what I mean about intolerance. Non football songs are sang at games everywhere.

[David]

Good thing its not up to you so...

I dont give a f*ck who sings what,it's only a song,if your gonna be sensitive enough to be offended by a song,then you deserve to be!!

I used to care about things like that but i realised it not worth it,not over a song anyway!

I am not the one being offended here, it is your fellow supporters.

[David]

David, you cannot equate the (wrong) decision to play the Irish anthem before the Setanta final with Linfield singing GSTQ and Rule Britannia. I imagine the anthem was played to add to the sense of occasion, for all that it was clearly an ill-judged decision.
The issue of Linfield fans going to Tolka and singing Rule Britannia is a totally different matter. I've no problem accepting you as British, so why should the only British fans that would even think about singing that have to hail from Northern Ireland? Rule Britannia is a triumphalist song that was sung at Tolka and other places purely for reasons to do with provocation. The more you wave the flag, the more you emphasise insecurities regarding your identity.

Yet again I would prefer to do without these songs. Yet again it is not up to you and me. Just because you and I would prefer these songs not to be sung does not make these people sectarian bigots. It is a free country and as long as there is nothing offensive in the songs they sing then that is up to them. I repeat, please do not try and force your beliefs on others.

[David]

What the f uck are you talking about David ??? You're seriously losing the plot here.

Derry City fans have a long tradition of not singing sectarian songs. End of story.

A small number of people wearing Cliftonville regalia somehow got tickets for our section of the Oval during our Setanta game against the Glens there. I have no idea of what particular songs they sang, but they were made unwelcome by the Derry fans around them. They then proceeded to start fights with the same Derry fans at the end of the game. This has been well-documented on both the Derry City forum and ILF.

Ironically, the very few problems I have ever been aware of in the 20 years we've been back in business have all involved Cliftonville fans - either against our fans with their Shamrock Rover buddys, mixing in with our fans to try to abuse other teams, or in the case of the Glens game - both mixing in with our fans and then causing trouble against them. Even in the EL it seems we can't escape the sh!t that goes on in theg Irish league....

Perhaps we should have just chanted songs like "if you hate the f*cking Fenians clap your hands...", like the best fans in Ireland...

Take yer head out of yer arse with your petty "reported" accusations. Nobody buys them here fella.......

Notice I did say the word reportedly when mentioning the Oval. You said it was Cliftonville, Cliftonville denied this.

If you go back on the Derry City forum to after your game at Windsor you will see my praise for the Derry fans, you were a different class. However at the Brandywell when we played there your supporters were not immume to a few sectarian shouts and songs yourselves. My whole point here is yes by all means fight and condemn sectarianism and I will be one of the loudest to back you but you not agreeing with a song does not make it sectarian and does not make those singing it sectarian bigots.

[CollegeTillIDie]

I have always held the view that clubs from the Irish League are every bit as Irish as clubs down south regardless of the political views of their supporters. By being located on this island it makes you of Ireland and from Ireland.
It is also because they are members of the " Irish League" which is administered under the auspices of the " IFA" and they play in the " Irish Football Association Cup" too. Therefore for the record, Linfield are more Irish than Celtic or Hibernian or any other "foreign" clubs with a slightly Irish hue to their origins. And if Linfield played Rangers I'd want Linfield to win.
If Glentoran played Hibernian I'd want the Glens to win , and if Cliftonville played Celtic , I'd want the Belfast side to win too.

I was rooting for Northern Ireland in both 1982 and 1986 World Cups and would like to see them rise through the rankings. My mother and grandmother were Belfast born on her side of the family, and My grandfather was from Armagh. So I am eligible to play for the Wee North into the bargain.

[Paddy Ramone]

GSTQ mentioning the Scots isn't exactly inclusive, is it? but I'd be a hypocrite if found this offensive, especially as the Scots haven't exactly done much to break the union in the last 400 years.

There was the risings of 1715 and 1745. The 45 was financed and led by the Irish! And the Scots managed to beat the English and gain their independence at the Battle of Bannockburn in 1314. Somehing we took 700 years to do and only partly!

[lopez]

There was the risings of 1715 and 1745. The 45 was financed and led by the Irish!

A rising doesn't necessarily mean a movement to gain independence. Both these events were known as the 'Jacobite' risings whose purposes were to put a British - but Catholic King - on the British throne instead of the Germans that still rule today. Quite where Scottish independence comes into this logic I don't know although the pretender Charles might have had visions of moving the capital to Edingburgh and renaming the country. The area he reigned would have stayed the same had he succeeded.

And the Scots managed to beat the English and gain their independence at the Battle of Bannockburn in 1314. Somehing we took 700 years to do and only partly!

Well I did say 'in the last 400 years'. And unlike the 1801 Act of Union, the move has had greater support during that time. Where was the Scottish 'Repeal the Union' campaign let alone the 'blood sacrifice' or 'armed struggle'. Even the 'demand' for a Scottish parliament - which was voted for by only 50% who could be ar*ed to come out and vote back in the seventies - was hardly something that brought people out on the streets every week. Face it, the place should rename itself North Britain to comemorate 400 years of the Act next year.

[Paddy Ramone]

A rising doesn't necessarily mean a movement to gain independence. Both these events were known as the 'Jacobite' risings whose purposes were to put a British - but Catholic King - on the British throne instead of the Germans that still rule today. Quite where Scottish independence comes into this logic I don't know although the pretender Charles might have had visions of moving the capital to Edingburgh and renaming the country. The area he reigned would have stayed the same had he succeeded.

The Jacobites supported seperate parliaments for the Ireland, Scotland and England. The clans arose to support Charles Stuart to preserve their Gaelic way of life. The defeat at Culloden in 46 was a much defeat for the Irish as their Gaelic cousins in Scotland. The Irish poets of the 18th century were devoted to the Stuarts descendents of an Irish High King Fergus. He was financed by a descendant of the Wild Geese Antoine Walsh.

Face it, the place should rename itself North Britain to comemorate 400 years of the Act next year.

A small correction, the act of union of parliaments was in 1707. It was the crowns that were unifed in 1603 when James VI of Scotland inherited the English throne after his childless cousin Elizabeth died.

On the subject of anthems, A Gille Mear an Irish song about Bonnie Prince Charlie was considered as national anthem for the newly independent Irish state. It would be a good choice as replacement for the present one since the Bonnie Prince's mother was a descendant of John Sobieski a Polish Natonal Hero, given our large Polish population today in Modern Ireland.