Defeat could be blessing in disguise � Jeffrey

**A face** · 11/04/2006, 4:42 PM

Defeat could be blessing in disguise � Jeffrey

Linfield manager David Jeffrey hopes a rare defeat at the weekend has given his squad have received the necessary wake-up call ahead of their Setanta Sports Cup semi-final clash with Drogheda United on Tuesday night.

The Blues� 49-match unbeaten run came crashing to a halt at the hands of Lisburn Distillery on Saturday. But far from knocking the team�s confidence, Jeffrey feels the reverse could have given his players renewed focus ahead of the visit of the eircom League leaders to Windsor Park.

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**glentoranfan** · 12/04/2006, 10:34 AM

That's what I though too, but apparently not.

TBH, I am slightly surprised their winning run is over and then, getting put out of the Setanta Cup.

I fear we'll feel the backlash on Saturday...

As much as pains me to say, don't take anything from this Linfield team. They have been amazing all season long - they are at least a level or two above any Irish League team and on a par, if not better than Eircom league teams - and don't forget, they are all part-time (borrow Peter Thompson who is only full-time a few weeks ago)

**dcfcsteve** · 12/04/2006, 10:55 AM

Originally Posted by glentoranfan

That's what I though too, but apparently not.

TBH, I am slightly surprised their winning run is over and then, getting put out of the Setanta Cup.

I fear we'll feel the backlash on Saturday...

As much as pains me to say, don't take anything from this Linfield team. They have been amazing all season long - they are at least a level or two above any Irish League team and on a par, if not better than Eircom league teams - and don't forget, they are all part-time (borrow Peter Thompson who is only full-time a few weeks ago)

The Linfield team are good - but to be fair they would only be upper mid-table in the EL. Part-time has nothing to do with it - most EL teams are part-time, and even the ones at the upper end of the league have a mixture of pros and part-timers.

In the Setanta Cup Linfield played 5 games against EL opposition - winning one, drawing 3 and losing one. That's decent form - but certainly doesn't suggest they would be "better then Eircom League teams". On that evidence they'd have finished at best 5th out of 12th in our league last season.

This year's Setanta Cup has really exposed the gap between the IL and EL. It soon became clear that only one IL club was in with any realistic chance of doing well. All 4 EL clubs were in with a genuine chance of group progression until the end.

I do think that in any all-island League Linfield would do incredibly well - they have the fan base and resources to do so. But with over 85% of the teams they play in the IL not offering any serioous challenge to them, they don't have enough competition there to push them on at the moment.

**Not Brazil** · 12/04/2006, 11:09 AM

Linfield Football Club have publicly stated that they have no interest in joining any All Ireland league.

They do welcome and encourage the further develpment of the Setanta Cup.

**dcfcsteve** · 12/04/2006, 11:14 AM

Originally Posted by NOT BRAZIL

Linfield Football Club have publicly stated that they have no interest in joining any All Ireland league.

They do welcome and encourage the further develpment of the Setanta Cup.

Good for them.

I suspect strongly that without facing some serious competition on a more regular basis - be that in an all-island league, a greatly expanded Setanta Cup, some sort of British League, or an inter-galactic championship - the club will continue to struggle to develop much beyond where it is at the moment. A huge fish in a small pond.

And I bet that if an all-island league started tomorrow without Linfield, it wouldn't take long for that publically stated attitude to alter. If only 2 teams left the IL to join an AIL, the IL would disintegrate.

**pete** · 12/04/2006, 11:31 AM

Derry City are part-time & Linfield did not beat them (didn't lose either). Drogs & Shels are fulltime. Cork City have maybe 12-14 fulltime pros.

Linfield use the part-time excuse too often & i thought Fergusons commenst about "southern teams not respecting us..." was rubbish.

Its fair to say eL sides didn't know what to expect last year & didn't rate the IL. Linfield won in surprise victory. This season Linfield have improved & would be on a par with top eL sides although hard to know how they would cope with amkunt of travel Cork & Derry City need to do. Aside from Linfield it would seem that the other IL sides would struggle at the bottom end of the eL Premier.

**Schumi** · 12/04/2006, 12:16 PM

Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

In the Setanta Cup Linfield played 5 games against EL opposition - winning one, drawing 3 and losing one. That's decent form - but certainly doesn't suggest they would be "better then Eircom League teams". On that evidence they'd have finished at best 5th out of 12th in our league last season.

Those five games were against the first, third and fifth teams in the EL at the moment so logically, you'd expect that they'd do better against the lower teams and probably finish in the top three. I've no doubt that Linfield would be in contention for at least a European place in the current EL.

**Not Brazil** · 12/04/2006, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

Good for them.

I suspect strongly that without facing some serious competition on a more regular basis - be that in an all-island league, a greatly expanded Setanta Cup, some sort of British League, or an inter-galactic championship - the club will continue to struggle to develop much beyond where it is at the moment. A huge fish in a small pond.

Erm...that's why Linfield Football Club welcome and encourage the further development of the Setanta Cup competition.

We don't do too badly against the other big boys on the island at the minute, as it happens.

**dcfcsteve** · 12/04/2006, 3:54 PM

Originally Posted by Schumi

Those five games were against the first, third and fifth teams in the EL at the moment so logically, you'd expect that they'd do better against the lower teams and probably finish in the top three. I've no doubt that Linfield would be in contention for at least a European place in the current EL.

Hang on - you're unlikely to finish in the Top 3 of a league unless you're taking serious points (i.e. wins) against the teams in the Top 5. Beating the same lower teams that everyone else around you in the league beats does not push you to the top of a table.

Teams in the top half of the current EL table have only played 4 or 5 games in the league so far (4 for Derry and Shels) so current positions can't be used for any sort of realistic comparison (sorry UCD....

)

It is extremley likely that the Top 6 of the final EL table this year will contain Drogheda, Derry, Shels and Cork. Arguably even the Top 4 will be comprised of those teams in some order. Linfield only managed 1 win in 5 attempts against 3 of those teams - and given how Cork disposed of Drogheda twice in their Setanta group, and what we all know of Cork as a team, I strongly suspect that Linfield would struggle to take any points off them either.

Moot though it all is - they might therefore realistically be in contention for UEFA via the FAI Cup if they were in the EL, or an Inter-Toto slot if they finished 4th and the Cup winners finished above them. But no higher. I believe that they would be at best 5th (4th at an absolute stretch) if they were in the current EL. All we have to go-on in this is the Setanta Cup, and I believe the results support my theory here.

**dcfcsteve** · 12/04/2006, 4:00 PM

Originally Posted by NOT BRAZIL

Erm...that's why Linfield Football Club welcome and encourage the further development of the Setanta Cup competition.

But for as long as Setanta and European competition remain sidelines for you, you'll struggle in the Setanta. You've got a good team that needs regular higher level competition in order to become even better. unfortunately the Irish League can't offer you this, and a few weeks of Setanta and Europe every year won't either.

Unless you're suggesting a parallel league - Setanta running almost alongside the IL ?

Originally Posted by NOT BRAZIL

We don't do too badly against the other big boys on the island at the minute, as it happens.

You call 1 win in 5 attempts "not doing too badly"......?

**Schumi** · 12/04/2006, 4:05 PM

I could be wrong but did Derry not manage 1 win in 4 attempts against IL teams in the Setanta? The same argument would have you finishing third or so in the IL.

**CollegeTillIDie** · 12/04/2006, 4:11 PM

dcfc steve

All Linfield would have to do is play defensively against Cork City to cause them to drop points. They don't seem to be able to cope with teams playing defensively against them and all the toys come out of the pram when it happens

**wws** · 12/04/2006, 4:11 PM

not involved in setanta, as an unbiased neutral I would say Linfield's participation in the last two seasons has clearly raised standards on the island as a whole, the eircom league is far too incestuous and needed a good competitive outsider to shake it up.

Drogs are jamming a series of narrow 1-0's in all competitions lately - think they'll fall off at the first sign of pressure

**dcfcsteve** · 12/04/2006, 4:22 PM

Originally Posted by Schumi

I could be wrong but did Derry not manage 1 win in 4 attempts against IL teams in the Setanta? The same argument would have you finishing third or so in the IL.

True. Though we're not the ones bigging ourselves up, or being bigged-up, in relation to how we'd do in the IL. We're not even the best in the EL, and we know it.

A 25% success rate is still better than Linfield's 20% one though