Dublin's big four have grounds for sharing
Intresting times.. Im in favour of a greenfield site for Shels and Bohs personally.Dublin's big four have grounds for sharing
Emmet Malone
On Soccer: This could be an eventful week for the FAI-backed scheme to get Dublin's four biggest clubs to ground-share. Shelbourne and Bohemians are set to meet, probably on Thursday, with a view to continue their negotiations some 24 hours after a group of St Patrick's Athletic supporters gather to discuss ways in which they might oppose the possible sale of Richmond Park.
A deal on the northside looks a distinct possibility in the not too distant future, with the pragmatists in both camps having apparently won the day. At Bohemians, there is said to be a realisation that the only serious options for the club are to allow Shelbourne in or to sell up and move to the suburbs. Long-time club secretary Gerry Cuffe feels while there is caution about any deal most of the club's members are primarily concerned with what is on offer. He believes, he says, a mutually beneficial arrangement can be reached.
ADVERTISEMENT
Rumour has it the terms discussed involve Shelbourne investing €3 million in the ground and paying €5 million to their neighbours. A new company would be established to take charge of the ground with each club owning 50 per cent and Bohemians members attending their recent AGM were given assurances that an unnamed Shelbourne director would have not have a prominent role in this new joint venture. But doubts have been expressed about the wisdom of the deal given it would generate neither the required cash to satisfactorily redevelop Dalymount nor to secure the future of Bohemians in the long term given the club lost €720,000 last year alone (Shelbourne officials are said to have conceded during talks with their Bohemians counterparts that their figure was some €220,000 higher).
The ground requires an enormous amount of work and even allowing for the substantial support that would be expected to flow from Government the two clubs might quickly work through their combined reserves if they were serious about building a high-quality stadium.
Estimates of the stadium's real estate value vary from €30 million to around twice that figure and there are some fans who argue that selling up and using the cash to establish a new stadium and training facilities in the suburbs makes more sense. The FAI and Government would look dimly on such a move as, it seems, would Shelbourne at this stage given they own a lease on Tolka Park rather the ground itself and cannot, therefore, hope to raise as much money by having the developers around.
The scenario across the city might be more complicated but there are striking similarities, with those in charge at St Patrick's Athletic said to be weighing up an offer of €26 million for Richmond Park. Club officials deny any specific offer has been made and insist there are binding agreements in place that would prevent the money leaving the club, but a sale looks to be the only way that those who have loaned substantial amounts of money will ever be repaid.
Things are more complicated because the club has never exactly owned Richmond Park which was always made up of several difference parcels of land, but a number of leases have been bought out of late and members of the Patrons Club were told in January that about 80 per cent of the property had now been consolidated with negotiations well under way to acquire the rest.
The fragmented nature of the old structure was always reassuring for fans who are suspicious about the sudden determination to assemble such a prime piece of real estate and are concerned about the intentions of Gerry Mulvey and his wife, Sharon, who own just over 50 per cent of the club after acquiring most of Tim O'Flaherty's stake as well as a number of smaller holdings such as that of former club administrator and PRO Gary Brannigan.
Mulvey, who has kept a low profile since first becoming involved with the club a couple of years back, made comfortably in excess of €10 million from a previous sale of land and taking sums paid for the 75,500 shares acquired in the club last year as a guide, he and his wife have spent around €635,000 on their stake in the club. Other shareholders include chairman Andy O'Callaghan with about 29 per cent and 14 others with much smaller stakes like Brian Kerr, Pat Dolan and Phil Mooney.
O'Callaghan has long signalled his willingness to discuss a move and preliminary talks have taken place about a ground-share with Shamrock Rovers - a move that is, once again, backed by the FAI and Government. The timing of any such move would appear to be poor from the point of view of Rovers, whose long overdue arrival in Tallaght will be more beneficial if they have the whole area to themselves, while supporters of St Patrick's fear they would end up being secondary tenants at the new stadium.
Given Rovers are effectively getting something for next to nothing here, they wouldn't appear to be in the strongest possible position to argue but there are other factors too with local GAA clubs still threatening legal action over the decision to exclude them from the stadium development and council officials having to weigh up whether their stated aim of developing a community soccer stadium will have any meaning if two clubs are playing up to 80 games a year there. Another possibility is a move by St Patrick's to a green-field site where, like Bohemians, those who favour the idea suggest they could not only build a stadium but also establish a high quality training facility and academy.
"I seem to remember much the same sort of talk from Louis Kilcoyne when Rovers were leaving Milltown," observed one alarmed fan yesterday. "And I don't want us to become the new them."
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/spo...3SP1EMMET.html
© The Irish Times
Bohemians members attending their recent AGM were given assurances that an unnamed Shelbourne director would have not have a prominent role in this new joint ventureWonder who that is?
Interesting speculation on Shels losing more than Bohs last year, wonder who this came from.
Foot.ie's entire existence is predicated on the average idiot's inability to ignore other idiots
Shels lost nearly €1m last year?Bohemians... lost €720,000 last year alone (Shelbourne officials are said to have conceded during talks with their Bohemians counterparts that their figure was some €220,000 higher).
We're not arrogant, we're just better.
€5m and a new stand for a half share of Dalymount. They have got to be taking the P!ss.
Ive never been any good at maths
but could someone please explain to me
how Bohs can make a deal with Shels for 8 million
while they are sitting on a piece of land worth between
30 and 60 million
To the best of my knowledge as a member of Bohs, we haven't made a deal with Shels for €8m.Originally Posted by hoops1
I got no lips I got no bones where there
were eyes there's only space
According to the above article If and i know its a big IF true
A deal could be done between the clubs for 8million
5million to Bohs and 3 million put into the ground improvements.
For 50%. Now forgive me if im wrong but when I went
to school the half of 60million is 30 million.
No matter what way you look at it bohs are going to be shafted!
Possibly the FAI have made threats to Bohs that if they don't comply, they won't get voted into the Premier next season.
Bohs won't be shafted plain and simple. If this deal was to go ahead the board would need 75% of the members to pass it and that just is not going to happen. The above article is to push people into an agreement by making it look like its already been done. Pats will be the big beneficaries, a new stadium in Tallaght and €26m. Thats a nice choice to have.
If thats the case we can join Brendan Dillon's court action if UCD get thrown out. Good chance with him the FAI would lose.
More than welcome.
Wasn't it rumoured here and on the Bohs forum that Bohs mightn't make the cut? Or was that just random idle speculation? Must try and find the links.
At the rate of losing €1m a year it sounds like Shels will die if they can't get into Dalymount. That would put Bohs in a position of strength if you ask me.
They won't survive in Dalymount either at that rate of loss.
We're not arrogant, we're just better.
It'll give them a stay of execution though.
Don't see why. They still have to adjust their budgets to live frugally, which they show no sign of doing.
Isn't Shels' turnover only in the region of E2m a year? A 50% loss is mightily impressive.
It's all speculation though. I tend to take everything I read in the papers with a pinch of salt. Especially since the article didn't seem very well researched, there was no mention of the fact that this will almost certainly not get past the Bohs members or that 3 million will certainly not build the 20,000 seater stadium proposed.
Well, yes, that's true. There's an awful lot of agenda-driven reporting lately which bears absolutely no relevance to the facts. The eL Weekly debate on the new league format - which concentrated solely on the grounds issue - is another case in point. Also interesting to see Pat's progressing with what sounds like fairly substantial ground improvements even though they're all but moved into Tallaght according to some sources.
well I guess the Irish times doesnt know all the facts behind the story but its intresting all the same. Shels wont get THAT much money from selling up Tolka since they dont own it. Whatever money they do get of course will have to be split 50/50 with Bohs and the stadium should they decide to ground share.
Personally I think this is very unbalanced. Bohs do kind of lose out because they are sitting on a stadium which is worth €30+million. But if two clubs were to move to a green field site bohs would lose out as well because Shels wouldnt be able to match their €30million investment in a stadium, academy and training facilities.
The government wont be able to throw that much cash at this problem as the Bogballers will have a heart attack.
Precisely. The future of one Dublin's oldest football clubs is in the hands of a Kerryman, and it shows. Election can't come soon enough.
Talk of Bohs being excluded arbitrarily from the EL, or whatever follows it, is poppycock.
Any league that would contemplate doing that isn't worth being part of.
Last edited by BohDiddley; 14/03/2006 at 3:47 PM.
sorry to ask but why do st Pats and shels have to leave their grounds. If this has been asked before give me the benifit o the doubt only getting to grips with the EL. As for the figures that those clubs are talking about loosing each year. those figures are seriously scary.
Posting Permissions
Quote
Bookmarks