Why are they "begging a ground"?Originally Posted by BohsFan
Are they not the resident Tolka Park club?
EDIT: just re-read your post properly
The only Irish club to win a European trophy.
Were the most sucessful club in Europe FACT. We would have made it to the group stages of the champions league if it werent for a bitter narrow minded Eircom League. We were hit like a train when we came back for the league games after Europe. Thats another thread.
Shels do have problems with supporters but we are making head way. If we just had a definte position regarding the stadium we would be laughing and enjoy a lot more support..
The northern teams are inferior and thats another FACT.
Uefa wouldnt be the problem, its the greedy power grubbing scum that run the FAI and IFA that want to keep their cushy jobs and expense accounts. They are the reason we have two leagues and national teams in the first place. As for Uefa setting a precedent Ireland is hardly like Celtic and Rangers wanting to play in England or that Atlantic league nonsense back in the 90s. Every other sport has one league and one national team, even so its quite possable we could have one all Ireland league and keep two seperate national teams, for a time at least, we can claim the AIL was a steppingstone, would of had an even better chance if the league hadnt decided to hand over its future to the most incompatent, crooked non-government body in the country. Besides it wouldnt be a precedent, it would be a league that split in two re-establishing itself (couple of IFA founders playing in eL and all), we could also throw in a load of nonsense about communities coming together and healing the divide blahdy blah and so on, they couldnt refuse it.
Despite what FIFA and the British Olympic council might wish a Great Britain team is not going to happen and thanks to devolution its further away then ever.
I wouldnt say Northern teams are inferior, the top teamsfrom either league would be a boost the the other. And hopefully an eL team will win the Setanta cup this time around.
Last edited by goattail; 02/03/2006 at 7:59 PM.
But still nothing to back up these "FACTS".
David, your search to facts to back up what is widely accepted by the media on this island and anyone with any knowledge of football is futile. People like your clubs manager ensure there are no "facts" because there will always be a nice little excuse to fall back on. These excuses range from "our players are tired" to "Derry City are a full time team" to "the ref was rubbish" and all of these are rubbish. I would rather City players had a packed schedule heading into the Setanta than be in pre-season and we are not full time and I know your manager really struggles to accept that one but trust me we aren't.
"The Derry fans were fantastic in both matches. They sang their hearts out all the time and created an even better atmosphere than the Cup Final. They were brilliant. - David Graham, Gretna striker
You had a good run 2 years ago. Get over it.
You would have made the group stages had you won all the qualifiers. You didn't and you didn't, there's no conspiracy.
The confusion over your stadium is only recent, what problems you have pre-date it.
The Setanta Cup will decide that. The IL is one nill up at the moment.
"Pleeze gov'nah ... has you got six'pince for a bottle o'gin .... thanks you sir, thanks you ... good day to ya sirs, good day" !!
The SFAI are the governing body for grassroots football in Ireland, not the FAI. Its success or the lack of is all down to them.
everything from (the soon to be former) residents of Tolka is like that -
The point that one of the Linfield posters here made is very valid. That is the whole summer soccer thing in an All_Ireland League context. Assuming all other obstacles are overcome, it will be impossible to play matches in the IFA jurisdiction during at least the month of July and possibly longer and I am open to correction on just how long that window might have to be.
I can back it up with facts though. The last two times an all Ireland competiton has been played we have won it yet people still say we are inferior. Last year we played Shelbourne (supposedly the best team by far anywhere on the island) at their home ground in the final and we beat them. How more comprehensive can it be yet some people are saying that it is not reflective. Yet if an EL club win it this year then that means all the best teams are in the EL. Forgive me for finding this logic baffling.
I would totally agree with this and have said a few times that overall EL is the stronger. However I feel the gap at the top of each division is minimal and pretty much on a par.
Im not going to reply to some of those idiotic posts but just to remind a few people we humilated Glens this year and what was the score line in the Champions League qualifers again ? Games that count that is.
Bohs are in more trouble that we will ever be. We have won the title more recently that you have and Tolka is grand for the time being but we need to follow the shams example of making ourselfves more invovled in a local comunity.
As for an All ireland league. well we have more or less seen what the crowds would be like and the standard of play offered by the best of what NI can offer. Its not up to much and the northern ireland teams can benefit a lot more than us.
JR, I suggest you go to the Shels site where the most prominent poster such as Higgens etc. ALL accept that your days at Tolka are numbered. THIS IS THE REALITY, you can run around with your fingers in your ears but it's just making you look even more stupid.
Bohs are in a fairly decent position at the moment. We have our debts to a managable level and most of all own a five acres patch in the middle of Phibsboro. Your club has been selling its home from underneath itself for the past couple of years and your only realistic option lies in Dalymount. As you can imagine, the punters/members/owners down that way are not overly eager to assist an organisation that tried to publicly humiliate our club in both action, in the form of signing players, and in the form of well documented words from Ollie. As BohsFan said, your best option would be to speak very nicely to us and hope to God that the current 90% against letting Shels in to our home changes to the required 75% for. Unlikely I know, but you haven't much else.
JR, check out the respective away followings at last seasons Champions League qualifier, if you're going down the 'crowd' route .......
The only Irish club to win a European trophy.
Im at work and dont have the time to reply to all that nonsense. Your a bitter man bohsFan and your club isnt up to much Lux.
FORZA SHELS
Comparing crowds is more pointless bravado. Glens and Linfield have huge away followings because the furthest they have to travel is to Institute. You have the Belfast clubs and I include Distillery in this and then the ones like Larne, Bangor and Ards who are a stone throw away.
The only clubs who can shout about their away support on this island are clubs with a large distance to travel. Ourselves, Harps, Cork e.t.c have to travel to Dublin every few weeks which is a trek compared to a jaunt around the six counties. Critics of an AIL in the North often cite the long distances to away matches as a stumbling block so the commitment to travel away.
Comparing leagues, crowds, resources e.t.c is not what is needed. Clubs with potential and willingness to succeed in Europe need to start looking after themselves and cut out the deadwood who stunt the growth of football on our island. This is more of an issue to IL teams who ahve to face minnows every few weeks but it is certainly becoming an issue to us in the EL.
"The Derry fans were fantastic in both matches. They sang their hearts out all the time and created an even better atmosphere than the Cup Final. They were brilliant. - David Graham, Gretna striker
im laughing at that post anyway
The issue of "crowds" will be a major variable in the construction of any new A-IL because one of the current burning issues is the amount of empty terrace at any given ground north or south. Large away gates will always be welcomed by any club treasurer and make no mistake, Glens and Blues WILL travel in numbers. Surely the "deadwood", notwithstanding any progress on the pitch, are clubs who are racking up home crowds in the region of the low hundreds anyway?
I think any club who can regularly turn out 700 plus away following during the worst season on and off the pitch in living memory can certainly have "something to shout about", regardless of distance travelled.
The only Irish club to win a European trophy.
I would agree with this. In the event of an all Ireland League I still think the Blues and Glens will have a very substantial away support. For last year's Setanta final when Shelbourne were at home, Linfield near enough matched their support. We took in the region of 600 to Longford on a Monday night when tickets were restricted to certain groups of supporters and I would expect us to take between 700 and 1000 to Shels later this month on a Monday night and sell out our allocation against Derry City with many people left disappointed.
To keep up my cynicism of IL away support....the reason Blues and Glens take big support to these matches is because the Setanta cup and process of travelling to strange places is still a novelty. For further evidence of this check our own away support when we first came into the EL, although we still travel well the numbers in those days were amazing.
In an AIL this novelty will die and give it a few years and I would say you won't get this 700 crowd to Cork or Waterford.
"The Derry fans were fantastic in both matches. They sang their hearts out all the time and created an even better atmosphere than the Cup Final. They were brilliant. - David Graham, Gretna striker
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